Coach Lions - Has the Fagan era already peaked?

[catscratchfever]

‘Nuff said.

 

[3KZ is Football]

Sadly Fagan has backed too many players for too long, expecting them to “find form” in the senior side, while playing others out of position and not giving players like Prior, Robertson, Ah Chee, Mathieson and Lester a fair run. His obsession with ‘Brutus Beefcake’ defenders has cost us in defence this year, because neither Adams or Payne play accountable football, too often flying from behind and making little defensive impact. Sides have got our defence worked out and they are finding ways to negate our advantage in intercept marking and unfortunately Fagan has put all his eggs into that basket. As a consequence, we are doing poorly when the ball is on the deck and players, Adams in particular look lost. Simply put we need more grunt in defence, but Fagan just hasn’t worked this out yet it seems. Just look at the ranking of our defenders in what I see as a crucial defensive metric, contested possession.

BRISBANE LIONS CONTESTED POSSESSION CAREER RANKINGS USING AFL COMPETITION DATA

R. Lester - ELITE
B. Starcevich - ABOVE AVERAGE
H. Andrews - ABOVE AVERAGE
J. Payne - AVERAGE
D. Rich - AVERAGE
N. Answerth - BELOW AVERAGE
D. Gardiner - BELOW AVERAGE
M. Adams - BELOW AVERAGE

Of these defenders Answerth, Adams and Gardiner (when fit) are walk up starts for a game irrespective of form, but they are unreliable when it comes to contested ball.
There is not an appropriate spread of skills. Andrews is elite and we all love Starcevich because he has a red hot go, but for some bizzare reason Lester can’t get a regular game? Ryan Lester

35

Ryan Lester

Age

32

Ht

192cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.9

4star

K

7.9

3star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.9

4star

T

2.7

4star

MG

170.4

3star

D

10.3

3star

K

5.8

2star

HB

4.5

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

1.5

2star

MG

140.7

3star

D

12.6

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

5.8

4star

M

3.8

4star

T

0.6

3star

, the player ranked as ELITE by AFL standards in one in one contests and contested possession can’t find a place in our shaky defence? It really is poor coaching from Fagan and our backline coach Murray Davis.

Finally, Fagan also needs to get back to the coach’s box. He’s not one of the boys. He needs some distance and objectivity.

 

[Dazb86]

Gotta love fans from Vic sides who say 2020 was our chance to win it because the finals were in Queensland, but no, playing the Grand Final at the MCG every year isn't a massive leg up for them - how dare you!

We were way too young and inexperienced in 2020 to win it. IMO, last year was the first year that our window was wide open. Unfortunately, it looks like the end is coming quickly for Zorko (and to a lesser extent Rich) so we might not have too long to strike while he's around...of course, we could still win it this year, but on current form you wouldn't back us.

I'm hopeful that Berry and Rayner are better for the run this year coming off injuries and can step up alongside McCluggage and Bailey to take over in the middle. Hopefully Ashcroft can make a big impact as well, if he decides to join us. A rejuvenated midfield would allow us to have Zorko spending more time up forward and possibly even being rested throughout the season.

If we can't get it done this year, or more realistically, in 2023, then perhaps we'll be looking at a missed window. Not yet though, not by a long shot.

Hey Richy you have tiny little T rex arms

 

[Daniel_Rich]

Hey Richy you have tiny little T rex arms

True fact.

 

[Warhorse]

Sadly Fagan has backed too many players for too long, expecting them to “find form” in the senior side, while playing others out of position and not giving players like Prior, Robertson, Ah Chee, Mathieson and Lester a fair run. His obsession with ‘Brutus Beefcake’ defenders has cost us in defence this year, because neither Adams or Payne play accountable football, too often flying from behind and making little defensive impact. Sides have got our defence worked out and they are finding ways to negate our advantage in intercept marking and unfortunately Fagan has put all his eggs into that basket. As a consequence, we are doing poorly when the ball is on the deck and players, Adams in particular look lost. Simply put we need more grunt in defence, but Fagan just hasn’t worked this out yet it seems. Just look at the ranking of our defenders in what I see as a crucial defensive metric, contested possession.

BRISBANE LIONS CONTESTED POSSESSION CAREER RANKINGS USING AFL COMPETITION DATA

R. Lester - ELITE
B. Starcevich - ABOVE AVERAGE
H. Andrews - ABOVE AVERAGE
J. Payne - AVERAGE
D. Rich - AVERAGE
N. Answerth - BELOW AVERAGE
D. Gardiner - BELOW AVERAGE
M. Adams - BELOW AVERAGE

Of these defenders Answerth, Adams and Gardiner (when fit) are walk up starts for a game irrespective of form, but they are unreliable when it comes to contested ball.
There is not an appropriate spread of skills. Andrews is elite and we all love Starcevich because he has a red hot go, but for some bizzare reason Lester can’t get a regular game? Ryan Lester, the player ranked as ELITE by AFL standards in one in one contests and contested possession can’t find a place in our shaky defence? It really is poor coaching from Fagan and our backline coach Murray Davis.

Finally, Fagan also needs to get back to the coach’s box. He’s not one of the boys. He needs some distance and objectivity.

Defence would look a lot better if you were not getting smashed in the midfield

 

[SSSSSS]

Need another contested ball winner to give Neale a chop out and let the Clugg go back to playing on the wing. Mitchell and Crouch would be cheap options in the silly season.

Midfield is paperthin and Brisbane always suffer in the pointy end as their soft underbelly gets exposed.

 

[M Malice]

Need another contested ball winner to give Neale a chop out and let the Clugg go back to playing on the wing. Mitchell and Crouch would be cheap options in the silly season.

Midfield is paperthin and Brisbane always suffer in the pointy end as their soft underbelly gets exposed.

Jacob Hopper please.

 

[SSSSSS]

Jacob Hopper please.

Hopper would be a good option but would cost an arm and a leg. Will need to keep points for Ashcroft.

A Hopper/Mitchell/Crouch and Ashcroft next season would be a good addition to the midfield rotations.

 

[Tom14]

Sadly Fagan has backed too many players for too long, expecting them to “find form” in the senior side, while playing others out of position and not giving players like Prior, Robertson, Ah Chee, Mathieson and Lester a fair run. His obsession with ‘Brutus Beefcake’ defenders has cost us in defence this year, because neither Adams or Payne play accountable football, too often flying from behind and making little defensive impact. Sides have got our defence worked out and they are finding ways to negate our advantage in intercept marking and unfortunately Fagan has put all his eggs into that basket. As a consequence, we are doing poorly when the ball is on the deck and players, Adams in particular look lost. Simply put we need more grunt in defence, but Fagan just hasn’t worked this out yet it seems. Just look at the ranking of our defenders in what I see as a crucial defensive metric, contested possession.

BRISBANE LIONS CONTESTED POSSESSION CAREER RANKINGS USING AFL COMPETITION DATA

R. Lester - ELITE
B. Starcevich - ABOVE AVERAGE
H. Andrews - ABOVE AVERAGE
J. Payne - AVERAGE
D. Rich - AVERAGE
N. Answerth - BELOW AVERAGE
D. Gardiner - BELOW AVERAGE
M. Adams - BELOW AVERAGE

Of these defenders Answerth, Adams and Gardiner (when fit) are walk up starts for a game irrespective of form, but they are unreliable when it comes to contested ball.
There is not an appropriate spread of skills. Andrews is elite and we all love Starcevich because he has a red hot go, but for some bizzare reason Lester can’t get a regular game? Ryan Lester, the player ranked as ELITE by AFL standards in one in one contests and contested possession can’t find a place in our shaky defence? It really is poor coaching from Fagan and our backline coach Murray Davis.

Finally, Fagan also needs to get back to the coach’s box. He’s not one of the boys. He needs some distance and objectivity.

Lester played like 3-4 years in midfield when we were utterly dreadful. Of course his contested posession numbers are higher than the others.

 

[scoman]

Hopper would be a good option but would cost an arm and a leg. Will need to keep points for Ashcroft.

A Hopper/Mitchell/Crouch and Ashcroft next season would be a good addition to the midfield rotations.

Still have a full suite of next years picks available as well as a likely extra second rounder this year (possible McStay compo). I'm sure we could get it done if he wanted to come.

 

[3KZ is Football]

Lester played like 3-4 years in midfield when we were utterly dreadful. Of course his contested posession numbers are higher than the others.

When?

 

[3KZ is Football]

Lester played like 3-4 years in midfield when we were utterly dreadful. Of course his contested posession numbers are higher than the others.

Ok - guess what? Ryan Lester has played two games this year, not in the Midfield and he is ELITE for one one and contested possession this year. Our leading player THIS YEAR and over his career.

 

[KissKiss]

Lester was shown to be elite at contested possessions several years ago but I think even he said he didnt like playing that role. Not sure he has the fitness to play full time mid these days

 

[3KZ is Football]

Lester was shown to be elite at contested possessions several years ago but I think even he said he didnt like playing that role. Not sure he has the fitness to play full time mid these days

Wouldn’t put him anywhere near the midfield, but we need him in defence precisely because he is elite one on one and in the contest in a defence where 3 of our regulars are below average in that vital metric. If defenders aren’t winning contests we are in trouble and as has been demonstrated this year, sides have worked out how to overcome our intercept marking defence.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

The COVID outs are a reasonable excuse, but by the same token, not sure their much lauded 'depth' was ever as impressive as most thought.

And their finals record under Fagan is not really flash

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Pressure starting to get the better of old man Fages.

Reportedly had a physical confrontation with journo after the loss against the bottom 4 Bombers over the weekend.

Culture

Roger Merrett cleaned Mike Sheahan's clock at a pub in South Africa during the Lions off season tour there back in 1998 or 99 cause Rog took exception to what Iron Mike wrote about him in the Hun

 

[Ceehook]

You have to work with what you have and Fagan is doing more than OK

Reckon they might be just two players off a GF spot

A power forward like Hawkins , Dixon , Lynch etc would be a help

The very top sides are very deep in their midfield and reckon the addition of a bid bodied mid Pendlebury , Petracca, Oliver , Bontempeilli but even one just of the quality of those guys would do

 

[My Tilly]

Jacob Hopper please.

Josh Dunkley be a good option. Bit slow but is a contested bull about to hit his prime.

 

[WillHayward]

11 straight losses at the MCG

 

[Duskfire]

I can't believe there is now a good possibility that brisbane miss out on top 4.

 

[King Tenz]

Another choke

lmao, your quick. Don't like the Lions much do ya?

 

[scoman]

lmao, your quick. Don't like the Lions much do ya?

He doesn't. But he isn't wrong unfortunately.

 

[iBeng]

Yeah I think we peaked last few years and we'll be sliding down a bit now. It's a shame.

 

[almuz]

They need to do a mini re-build - insanity is having this core of players and expecting a grand final each year

 

[XhazzafootyX]

Sack Fagan and get clarkson