List Mgmt. List Management 2022

[Arr0w]

No disagreement from me in regards to your list and is a reason why I believe we draft the best player available at the next draft and don't draft a player based off need.

I would never draft based on needs anyway, although there are always 3-4 player of differing types that are ranked at a similar level

 

[The Return of the Paf]

No disagreement from me in regards to your list and is a reason why I believe we draft the best player available at the next draft and don't draft a player based off need.

I wouldn't mind if went best available with most picks. About the only players we can't use are slow midfielders.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

It's a cut throat industry... Fan favourites and hope a player will make it, doesn't cut it at the top...

We still have so many unknowns on our list...

The 16 players below or 38% of our list, are either unknowns or haven't taken their chances when given (either through injury or ability or both)...
Dow, O'Brien, Fogarty, Carroll, Stocker, Kemp, Martin, Marchbank, Parks, Cuningham, Philp, Honey, Durdin, McDonald, Hayes, Setterfield...

All need to either take the next step in the next 2-12 months or will get the chop...

So with that said, how do we as a club get to the next level if nearly half our list we either can't trust or think that they have reached their ceiling? Sure we can take best available this draft and hope to see them come of age in 2 or 3 years, but that is 1 player and then the likes of Saad, Cripps and Doc are all 30 and above.

It's an interesting time coming if we don't play finals this year because im sure the club would be wondering what gets us to the next level already.

 

[thebluenewdeal]

So with that said, how do we as a club get to the next level if nearly half our list we either can't trust or think that they have reached their ceiling? Sure we can take best available this draft and hope to see them come of age in 2 or 3 years, but that is 1 player and then the likes of Saad, Cripps and Doc are all 30 and above.

It's an interesting time coming if we don't play finals this year because im sure the club would be wondering what gets us to the next level already.

Need to cut the dead weight on our list and replace them with blue collar workers. We’ve got the superstars and we’ve got enough young talent to carry us through but there’s some high draft picks on the list that we have gotten from other clubs that are just not getting it done. Would much rather us back in our drafted players or some blue collar players that we target.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Motlop, Durdin, Honey and even Cottrell and LOB are the young group who we need to improve and hopefully add another string to their bow. Honey and Durdin especially look as if they may be able to play higher up the ground and hopefully give abit of run that we need playing as high HF’s.
Those small forwards and wings are the guys we have to either back in or improve on. The rest of the positions we have enough cattle for the coaching group to work with (ignoring injuries) Imo

 

[DangerousD]

It's a cut throat industry... Fan favourites and hope a player will make it, doesn't cut it at the top...

We still have so many unknowns on our list...

The 16 players below or 38% of our list, are either unknowns or haven't taken their chances when given (either through injury or ability or both)...
Dow, O'Brien, Fogarty, Carroll, Stocker, Kemp, Martin, Marchbank, Parks, Cuningham, Philp, Honey, Durdin, McDonald, Hayes, Setterfield...

All need to either take the next step in the next 2-12 months or will get the chop...

Theres. Otho g wrong with the list but it’s important that some of those players are in years 2-3 with others in 7+, there’s a big difference.

 

[DangerousD]

I think when assessing potential targets next year we need to consider other teams list/draft needs. The Lions this year have two father sons they want to add to the list, the number 1 ranked player and another ranked 15th or so in the latest draft rankings, they will need to trade out quite a few to get the points required to add these guys.

The Eagles will probably need to improve their draft hand considering their position and have quite a few older types that may be off interest.

Hawthorn it seems tried last year to push a few out and still have some players that would be a great fit for us.

The Giants supposedly have yet another salary cap squeeze with a few expected to leave.

GC also mentioned today in the news that Flanders and Fiorini were attracting interest.

Now that we have a really good core of players id love for us to be aggressive at the draft, trade out players who don’t fit Voss’ game style or plans, trade future picks and target an older player thats cheap that’s fits a need.

Im also surprised not many have mentioned Darcy Gardiner

27

Darcy Gardiner

Age

29

Ht

192cm

Wt

91kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.6

3star

K

7.4

3star

HB

5.2

4star

M

4.1

4star

T

2.1

4star

MG

196.1

3star

D

10.7

3star

K

7.9

3star

HB

2.9

2star

M

3.7

4star

T

2.1

3star

MG

196.1

3star

D

10.2

3star

K

6.0

3star

HB

4.2

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.8

4star

as a FA option, fills a need, what’s the knock on him and the lack of interest?

 

[Jimmae]

I’ll firstly preface what I’m about to say by saying we are really missing George Hewett at the moment so we look a bit weaker than normal in the contest with him out.

IMO of those you’ve listed Stocker is the obvious one with the fire in his belly for a contest and a good kick to go into the midfield and play that role but he will need to develop a tank over the pre season before that is even a remote possibility.

Jack maybe able to to pinch hit in the middle from time to time when we are struggling to get going but his kicking skills aren’t good enough for it to be a permanent move.

Also I see Kemp as a utility who will play here, there and everywhere over his career so I doubt he ever settles in the middle although again like Sos I expect we’ll see him in there from time to time.

The other 3 I doubt are good enough to get anywhere near the level of an elite AFL midfielder status.

Strange take on Jack, who is arguably one of the best field kicks in the team.

His issue is the same as Stocker: consistent acceleration off the mark, and endurance for a full-time midfield role. Also strange that you would scratch an inside midfielder option off on the basis of elite vs average/above average kicking...

Kemp and Dow are the two I believe can reach elite status, with Carroll as a dark horse and Setterfield capable of reaching the tier below.

Setterfield is out there holding things together as an outside mid in this wonky game plan, and getting zero credit for the progress he's made within the season.

 

[DirtyLeeds]

I think it's worthy of discussion as whether we have a surplus of any particular player type/position and whether we could/should consider trading out these types to bring in some speed for instance.
According to some far more knowledgeable members of this place, are the likes of Dow, Stocker, LOB, Martin, TDK, Williams, Setterfield, Plowman tradable ? Would there be interest? Do we go higher into the list, MacKay(?), McGov(?), JSOS(?). There is an argument for selling high and maximising the deals, there's also the counter argument that we have these pieces of the puzzle in place...

 

[No1Suspect]

We need the next Chris Yarran and Jeffy G. Those 2 players would complete our team i recon...... anyone in this draft even remotely similar??

 

[HereComesJuddy]

I’ll firstly preface what I’m about to say by saying we are really missing George Hewett at the moment so we look a bit weaker than normal in the contest with him out.

IMO of those you’ve listed Stocker is the obvious one with the fire in his belly for a contest and a good kick to go into the midfield and play that role but he will need to develop a tank over the pre season before that is even a remote possibility.

Jack maybe able to to pinch hit in the middle from time to time when we are struggling to get going but his kicking skills aren’t good enough for it to be a permanent move.

Also I see Kemp as a utility who will play here, there and everywhere over his career so I doubt he ever settles in the middle although again like Sos I expect we’ll see him in there from time to time.

The other 3 I doubt are good enough to get anywhere near the level of an elite AFL midfielder status.

Doubtful Stocker is on our list in 2023

 

[Beyond Blue]

Strange take on Jack, who is arguably one of the best field kicks in the team.

His issue is the same as Stocker: consistent acceleration off the mark, and endurance for a full-time midfield role. Also strange that you would scratch an inside midfielder option off on the basis of elite vs average/above average kicking...

Kemp and Dow are the two I believe can reach elite status, with Carroll as a dark horse and Setterfield capable of reaching the tier below.

Setterfield is out there holding things together as an outside mid in this wonky game plan, and getting zero credit for the progress he's made within the season.

We’ll have to agree to disagree as I don’t think Sos is a good kick and I don’t see Kemp, Dow or Carroll reaching elite midfielder levels.

 

[Beyond Blue]

Doubtful Stocker is on our list in 2023

What makes you say that?

 

[HereComesJuddy]

What makes you say that?

Unfortunately plenty.
What makes you think he will?

 

[Beyond Blue]

Unfortunately plenty.
What makes you think he will?

There was an ITK posting from a few weeks back saying he’s re-signed with the club for next season and beyond.

What’s the “plenty” of info you have that he won’t be at the club?

 

[Justnetime]

Nothng has changed. We need to find a winger and a key position defender for our current window. The small forwards will develop organically in Motlop, Durdin and Honey. Owies to hold fort As best he can.

Repeatedly people make the mistake on our current wingers quality based on easy games vs hard games. We need one winger that can play well vs top 4 sides regularly. Not show up versus weak sides in a downhill skiiing win Set up by our str players.

Havent researched it but suspect the same mistake is made with rating Plowman.

 

[Percy2257]

I think when assessing potential targets next year we need to consider other teams list/draft needs. The Lions this year have two father sons they want to add to the list, the number 1 ranked player and another ranked 15th or so in the latest draft rankings, they will need to trade out quite a few to get the points required to add these guys.

The Eagles will probably need to improve their draft hand considering their position and have quite a few older types that may be off interest.

Hawthorn it seems tried last year to push a few out and still have some players that would be a great fit for us.

The Giants supposedly have yet another salary cap squeeze with a few expected to leave.

GC also mentioned today in the news that Flanders and Fiorini were attracting interest.

Now that we have a really good core of players id love for us to be aggressive at the draft, trade out players who don’t fit Voss’ game style or plans, trade future picks and target an older player thats cheap that’s fits a need.

Im also surprised not many have mentioned Darcy Gardiner as a FA option, fills a need, what’s the knock on him and the lack of interest?

Bring back Liam Jones!

 

[HereComesJuddy]

There was an ITK posting from a few weeks back saying he’s re-signed with the club for next season and beyond.

What’s the “plenty” of info you have that he won’t be at the club?

Oh really? There's no contract signed off for Stocker just so you know

 

[Ash24]

There was an ITK posting from a few weeks back saying he’s re-signed with the club for next season and beyond.

What’s the “plenty” of info you have that he won’t be at the club?

Just found an article in the HS from earlier this say saying we're looking to secure a new deal for him, but I've got to say I'm now having doubts about his future at Carlton.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/news/afl-preseason-news-keep-up-to-date-with-all-the-latest-updates/news-story/1867f40ba4149a6cf16a63299a4b4bb8

 

[FRUMPY]

Wonder what he is worth?

Young, played AFL level, still learning he's craft...
You'd imaging he hasn't lost much value, guess it would be less than the value other clubs would have drafted him at.....

 

[Aphrodite]

Nothng has changed. We need to find a winger and a key position defender for our current window. The small forwards will develop organically in Motlop, Durdin and Honey. Owies to hold fort As best he can.

Repeatedly people make the mistake on our current wingers quality based on easy games vs hard games. We need one winger that can play well vs top 4 sides regularly. Not show up versus weak sides in a downhill skiiing win Set up by our str players.

Havent researched it but suspect the same mistake is made with rating Plowman.

There it is again & has become very tiresome.

Enough of your repetitive negative agenda towards Plowman.

 

[The Return of the Paf]

Yup, we need a serious list over haul yet, remove the less durables, perennially off the park types, enough, also unprofessional, uncommitted , disgruntled too, enough pampering.
Curely Jr. & Vossy, need few years to get it right , we need to get a move on, Harry & Charlie won’t last forever.

Maybe more than a few, how old is too old?

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Stocker is a funny one. Not best 22 and we still have Boyd and Williams out. We also with the potential to play a slightly taller backline considering how mobile all of Kemp, Gov and Marchbank are.
I hope to hell we don’t lose him but I could see why the club would be playing hardball with him

 

[gab213]

I agree...
Not sure how we get it either...

We have cherry picked players Cerra, Williams, McGovern and Martin, on long contracts, on huge money...
Who haven't came close to expectations so far...
Who look to have, now hampered our ability to trade for further players of need...

Unless we can alleviate some of these big dollar contracts on our list, the only way forward is probably the draft...

We may have over paid (premiership list style) on a list that hasn't even made the 8...

I don't know, there's no evidence at all that our players are on 'huge money' or that they are being overpaid, in fact, everything I hear indicates that it isn't the case. I hear more that contracts are heavily front loaded which isn't a bad thing. The rest I believe is just media driven nonsense. I don't think that we have hampered ourselves at all.

 

[Beyond Blue]

Oh really? There's no contract signed off for Stocker just so you know

Ok fair enough. Is there anything else you’ve heard or read to suggest he’s gone?