Opinion Matthew Nicks: Adelaide's Coach (Part 2) - Full Support of the Board

[1970crow]

So, Thommo isn’t a great example of your theory.

Yes he is. His extension was one of pity, they knew he was done and still played him to the end as an opening bounce mid. Sloane will be the same this year. Whether he gets a pity extension is yet to be seen, but there's no doubt that in the coaches minds, he's a much needed player next year.

 

[conVINCEd]

Yes he is. His extension was one of pity, they knew he was done and still played him to the end as an opening bounce mid. Sloane will be the same this year. Whether he gets a pity extension is yet to be seen, but there's no doubt that in the coaches minds, he's a much needed player next year.

You said yourself that Thompson only played one game in the last year of his contract.

So he wasn’t played to the end as an opening bounce mid.

I agree he shouldn’t have got a contract for 2017, just like Sloane should now be retired.

 

[Sanders]

Great answer. Once again we get a taste of your incredible insight and value add to a discussion


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Lol. It was a question to you, about your bizarre claim - which you ducked

 

[Mr MysteryGuest]

We went 3-3 with Crouch and Dawson later in the year, beating Port, Gold Coast and West Coast. Far too early to say it was elite

3 losses under a goal. our clearance differential improved a fair bit, and if you removed sloane completely it probably improve even more.

 

[rabidcrow]

Does a "very very clear plan" include moving Dawson from defense to the midfield mid season and bringing back Crouch after not playing him for a year?

Dawson was a fortunate accident. Not quite mid season - more like desperation in round 3 after dropping the first two games and not wanting the year to drift away. Great leadership by him - and it worked that well they stuck with it


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[mick500]

We have a history of getting ahead of ourselves. If we can keep that mindset from creeping in over the off season and stay hungry and tighten the screws a bit defensively I see us being competitive in finals against anyone. Finishing top 4 is obviously key.

 

[adelaidecrows]

We have a history of getting ahead of ourselves. If we can keep that mindset from creeping in over the off season and stay hungry and tighten the screws a bit defensively I see us being competitive in finals against anyone. Finishing top 4 is obviously key.

I think we need to remember we have a different culture at west lakes now. The previous culture of accepting mediocrity should have been broken with the rebuild and turnover of the majority of coaching staff. So the only people getting ahead would be the supporter group.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I think we need to remember we have a different culture at west lakes now. The previous culture of accepting mediocrity should have been broken with the rebuild and turnover of the majority of coaching staff. So the only people getting ahead would be the supporter group.

There's expectation this year.

Good performances the last few years have been pleasant surprises.

Different sort of pressure this year. All the noise, fitness results, promising 2023 games against top four clubs etc leans towards a finals appearance this year.

Will we cope with that expectation? We're still pretty young across the best 22.

Entering an untested area of Nicks' reign.

 

[adelaidecrows]

There's expectation this year.

Good performances the last few years have been pleasant surprises.

Different sort of pressure this year. All the noise, fitness results, promising 2023 games against top four clubs etc leans towards a finals appearance this year.

Will we cope with that expectation? We're still pretty young across the best 22.

Entering an untested area of Nicks' reign.

Expectation from the supporter group is not wrong. Its a reflection on the previous year. No one is expecting top 4 but expecting finals should be not a surprise. If it is the club has a monumental issue still.

 

[mick500]

No one is expecting top 4 but expecting finals

I'm not ruling top 4 out. No reason we can't get there imo. Collingwood led for 30 seconds when they beat us by a point, then we should have had a shot after the siren to win the second game against them in Melbourne. Add in the non goal that cost us finals that was a goal and we could have had a very different season.

Defensively is where we need to tighten up imo and I think we got some good youngsters that should only improve. Add in the first gws game where we led by about 30 points early in the season and we dropped that game, along with the 2nd match up against them as well , was disappointing. Not putting those gws efforts in line with the Collingwood and the non goal category, but they were games that we should have atleast split.

Beating port twice was a strong showing as well. We didn't just beat them the 2nd time, we destroyed them. I see only upside. Our result for how well we played last year didn't reflect our potential imho. I have hope for this year that we could improve out of sight.

 

[cleanhands]

Expectation from the supporter group is not wrong. Its a reflection on the previous year. No one is expecting top 4 but expecting finals should be not a surprise. If it is the club has a monumental issue still.

I am

 

[Multiballz]

I think we need to remember we have a different culture at west lakes now. The previous culture of accepting mediocrity should have been broken with the rebuild and turnover of the majority of coaching staff. So the only people getting ahead would be the supporter group.

At best, weve produced mediocre results since the rebuild. We have been accepting of them up until this point.

All weve seen is a shift from complete and utter cluster-$%#& back to mediocre. What proof is there that we still arent quite comfortable with mediocre?
This really wont have been tested until this comming season.

 

[rabidcrow]

Lol. It was a question to you, about your bizarre claim - which you ducked

Sorry - what?

That’s not a question with any substance. What did I duck?


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[rabidcrow]

No, no one’s asked for them to be playing full time mid straight away. But they’ve been shunted to the half forward line with minimal minutes in the midfield.

Were you one who argued with me that Pedlar couldn’t cope with any centre bounce attendances this year? Because there were a few right up until he started to and showed what he could do.

Interesting that Pedlar said it was great for him to just be able to focus on being a forward this year after all the interruptions from his first two years. Although I assume he is just saying that to cover the coaches mistakes? How often these stories come out after a season and put context on events

In terms of your first point - they have been shunted to half forward. Where would you play them when they aren’t playing midfield?

They have had good stretches of time in the middle. First 9 weeks for Soligo, first 7 for Rachele , Pedlar from around round 10-16

They all got a decent go - and the balance of time playing forward/wing

I struggle to see what you don’t understand?

If you were the development coach what would you do differently?




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[rabidcrow]

Isn’t that the point? You adopted a false, circular standpoint (that poor results must have been caused by poor list quality); and you’ve tried to retrofit all performance and narrative within that framework

A rigid, dogmatic justification based on a flawed premise

By that logic, no results or outcomes could ever be less than expected; because expected automatically scales to whatever outcome is realised

Rubbish.

The work of Reid and Hamish in the last two years (end of 21 and 22) have had a huge impact on our list quality, plus injury improvement. We didn’t have Rankine,Dawson,Rachele, Max on our list. Pedlar,Hinge and Milera were all injured and some of our picks were very slow to get going - Jones and Fog particularly and we had the spectacular improvement of Murray

The list - and more importantly the best 22 - has changed enormously since the end of 2021 (including availability of injured players) and looks completely different as a result


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[bonehilda]

 

[John Who]

At best, weve produced mediocre results since the rebuild. We have been accepting of them up until this point.

All weve seen is a shift from complete and utter cluster-$%#& back to mediocre. What proof is there that we still arent quite comfortable with mediocre?
This really wont have been tested until this comming season.

It’s really a matter of perspectives. If we look purely at ladder positions, then 14th to 10th does seem like a mediocre step up. If we see it as the bottom-5 team (2022) becoming a significant threat to the top-4 teams in the following season (2023), that’s a pretty big deal IMO.

I do agree with you, that this season is likely to define us either as a mediocre team with some good patches, or a team who’s fed up with the tag of “mediocre”.

 

[Golumless]

It's a reasonable argument, though I'd be very comfortable with us extending Nicks at this point.

 

[FR0GGY]

Fireman Cornes...

Is right, is also right about the weight thing.

 

[Samcro24]

It's a reasonable argument, though I'd be very comfortable with us extending Nicks at this point.

That’s dumb

 

[baldandbroke]

If you, like me, have been trying to watch some replays in the off season … you work out pretty quickly that we haven’t beaten much in the last few years.

I don’t highly rate Paer as an outfit (look at their finals performances), a good win against Brisbane last year, then it’s a heap of also ran teams or ok teams playing horribly.

Some of our best games were close losses.

I like the trajectory- I like the culture change, but talk is cheap.

No need to resign Nicks early based on the wins we have had so far, or the potential.

We need to see it hit the ground, and I think we are primed to do that in 2024 … but until we do, what’s the advantage of going early?

 

[adelaidecrows]

It's a reasonable argument, though I'd be very comfortable with us extending Nicks at this point.

I would wait until the bye. This coming season is Nicks first opportunity to demonstrate his coaching ability with a squad that not only should make finals but should push top 4. An audition if you will, to see if he has genuinely developed his skills as a coach in a way that maximises our rebuild and can take us into the post rebuild era. As of right now, I am not convinced he has shown us enough and without doubt the club feels the same way otherwise they would have signed him.

The decision for me shouldn't be a two year extension, I think it should be a 3 or 4 year extension because thats what we'd offer a new coach heading up a squad looking to play finals. If we turn around and offer him a new contract as of now for a two year extension, we rob ourselves of that ability to adequately plan. If by waiting until mid year sees us 10-2, and we have to offer Nicks an extra $100k per season upon his worth now, so be it. I'd be more than comfortable offer in market rates for Nicks if he proves he can do it. At the same time though, if by waiting until mid year sees us 7-5, we lost easily to the top teams, At least we can take that into account and plan accordingly.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I would wait until the bye. This coming season is Nicks first opportunity to demonstrate his coaching ability with a squad that not only should make finals but should push top 4. An audition if you will, to see if he has genuinely developed his skills as a coach in a way that maximises our rebuild and can take us into the post rebuild era. As of right now, I am not convinced he has shown us enough and without doubt the club feels the same way otherwise they would have signed him.

The decision for me shouldn't be a two year extension, I think it should be a 3 or 4 year extension because thats what we'd offer a new coach heading up a squad looking to play finals. If we turn around and offer him a new contract as of now for a two year extension, we rob ourselves of that ability to adequately plan. If by waiting until mid year sees us 10-2, and we have to offer Nicks an extra $100k per season upon his worth now, so be it. I'd be more than comfortable offer in market rates for Nicks if he proves he can do it. At the same time though, if by waiting until mid year sees us 7-5, we lost easily to the top teams, At least we can take that into account and plan accordingly.

All good, if you believe holding off doesn't impact the Club .....or have other Clubs planning a raid

Yes, I know ....the argument is, who would pinch a Coach that hasn't played finals yet .....that's a biased club POV and naive
And so changing the coach will disrupt the Clubs premiership push ....new Coach, new gameplan inevitably .....just slows us down another year

If people haven't seen enough already ....then they are the only one's in the footy industry who aren't impressed

I seem to remember St Kilda taking a similar POV with Ross Lyon .....in the bag, he ain't going anywhere .....next minute Ross is at FREO, shocking the Saints
Ross was more likely to win a flag staying at the SAINTS .....but as a career coach he chose surity of tenure

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Are there any other senior coaches who have been raided/poached having never made finals?

 

[FullyBigKPro]

Nicks would want to make finals this year as a bare minimum or he will be very very nervous