Autopsy Rd 7 vs North. Terrible loss, poor skills, never in it.

[IMTOPS]

It’s going to be Groundhog Day on BF whilst Bolton is head coach. It’s clear the age profile is not ideal, but that cannot he used an excuse.

Bolton cannot structure a team properly. Too top heavy, and not enough grunt in the midfield. I find some of the fake positivity in here tiresome; Bolton is akin to Leppitsch, when fagan comes in, things improve markedly. A competent coach will reap immediate improvement; I keep saying it but how many losses will it take? Bolton is making this club Fitzroy on field; this year is quickly becoming a write off - close losses cannot he used to justify the “journey”. The lack of innovation from the coaches box year after year is now expected; How Kennedy isn’t playing astounds me; he was recruited to share the load with Cripps; and why would Setterfield be sent back to the 2’s after suspension?? Pickett is a loss for Carlton in a structural sense; and I’m tired of VFL top up players, forget a mid season recruit. Carlton has to be active in trade period, now is the time to bring in senior talent. Coniglio has to be offered 1m+ a year; Jordan gallucci is ideal for Carlton; add docherty to the equation and that makes a big difference with a new head coach. Key position players need space; Curnow, McKay and McGovern need to be in different spaces to make the best of their assets; I actually think this list is looking good, the ingredients are there, but tough decisions must be made re. Bolton.. unfortunately I’m resigned to him remaining, and therefore a very good senior assistant much be brought on board, who in effect will direct the style of play. Neil Craig was a loss to the club; and why Carlton never replaced him with someone of similar standing is bizarre.

 

[TheBlueCampaigner]

If the Crows were prepared to drop Gibbs, surely us dropping Murph to make a statement has to be a possibility.

I’d be happy with this. Not up to it lately, and Setters or Kennedy are better options right now IMO.


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[La Dispute]

Im pretty happy with the gibbs trade and also the Tuohy trade. You cant get them all right!

Even with both those players in our team today we dont win.

The intent of the trades was fine, the end result seems pretty average.

LOB should be looking like a very decent prospect, being a top 10 Pick with 20 games under his belt, but he looks average.

Kennedy I like, but now isn’t necessary.

Marchbank has talent, but is also now surplus and has some serious deficiencies.

We’re lucky we’ve got some big hits in McKay, Curnow, Fisher and Walsh (keeping in mind these are mostly first round picks) or realistically the rebuild looks like a genuine mess.

 

[Talrahir]

I didn’t see the actual collision - what happened to Jones?

It was actually a head clash, to his left eye socket in the air that may have immediately caused unconsciousness. He then fell to the ground limp, hitting his head on the ground again on, what appeared to be, the hard outside strip of the oval. On the stretcher, he appeared to have tape around his left eye socket which I'm guessing may hint at some damage to the facial tissue but, also possibly, either his eye socket or his cheekbone. On top of that, there is obviously going to be some fairly nasty concussion involved.

Please note, that i am not a doctor and am only reporting on what i saw, and what i think it looks like. We should have some feedback soon on scans.

He'll be out for weeks, but more importantly, above all else I just hope he's ok, that its not more serious, and that he recovers well.

 

[CFC18]

Bolton downplaying the loss by talking up the season in his presser. FMD we've won one game and yet to play any of the top teams.

 

[Gethelred]

Soapy this is true and I think everyone would agree. My concern is how much longer can we rely on Kruzer..he is an absolute champion but his body just doesnt seem to hold up..Also Simmo may only have next year left and whilst Mcgovenr is a valuable senior player he also seems to be another that is injury prone...Not sure how Doc will go either...Murphy is clearly not showing much at all.

I think that the issue stems less from Kruezer being an absolute gun and more to do with our clearance setups requiring the taps to be halved in order for us to even break even, let alone dominate.

We're small around the ball at the moment, and the only way that is fixed is age or trading someone in, neither of which can be done right now. What we need, then, is to shape our setup to lose the taps and to negate our opponents, get their ball first and to beat them there constantly. That is how we can plan for a future without Kruezer, as much as it hurts. If we cannot win the taps, we simply cannot be as poor as we were today.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

The problem for so many of you is this.
You analyse how the game makes you feel. And post stupid things because of it.
Try and analyse the actual situation.
I would say that anyone that thought we would be a chance in this match with all those outs
With an opponent licking its wounds. At that ground.
Needs their head read.

Thats the actual reality. I cant quite work out how so many suppporters expect more than 5 or 6 wins this year.
But we got another game into the kids. Debuted another. Fought back in the last. Forget the result. It is irelevant.
Its 50 to 70 games these players need. And three good preseasons.

Dafuq? So you think expecting more than 5 or 6 wins is silly yet condemn those that expected better against last place. 5 or 6 wins have to come from somewhere and I suggest what you're perceiving stems from frustration that we've lost 3 we should've won and been belted by a battler. Doesn't exactly promote confidence we can reach the 5 to 6 win mark.

I believe we will. I don't know who our victims will be.

 

[HereComesJuddy]

Wtf?
You don’t need experience to display effort, courage and pride.
Plowman having a laugh at half time, great ****** example and leadership for the young players.
If you can excuse any one bloody dam thing from today then you have morphed into this pathetic culture we have cultivated at this s club for far too long.

Effort, courage and pride still doesnt fix the problem. We were always going to lose this game

 

[Arr0w]

As young as we were I can't believe some people are so accepting of being belted at this stage of the rebuild. The losing culture has spread to the supporters.

There's virtually no excuse for that level of performance (first 3 quarters mostly).

Heat will come on Bolton and rightly so. Everybody around us in similar positions has gone past us.

Which teams have gone past us?

 

[Mondyboy]

People saying we should look at the senior players who didn’t put up their hand? Who are they? Or do we just mean Murphy?


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[OnceWeWereKings]

I didn't see the game as I was taking in Avengers End Game. What went wrong today? Injuries? Lack of effort? Outplayed?

Don’t want to be a spoiler but Carlton die in the end.

 

[blue healer]

Which player in that age bracket would you still have on our list?

It is our recruitment from the pre-SOS era that is responsible for the gap and there is a good reason none of them are still with us. In about 3-4 years that will be our largest age group.

The current strategy is okay, it is paying the price for the previous efforts.

Not a matter of who I would have kept, having said that a couple of mature bodies like Lamb and Kerridge wouldn't have gone astray replacing our outs today.

More about our failure to bring in replacements in that age group despite, even the club, telling us that we would be looking to bring in mature hard bodies for the last two years. I know it's not easy and I know some attempt has been made but simple fact is we haven't done it.

Other clubs have had some success bringing in mature players from the secondary leagues, we've tried it twice, I think, despite us having a greater need than others. Only one (Gibbons) remains (and yes I know he is 23 but the point stands).

Lot of posters here shooting bullets at Bolton but I'm more concerned about the tools he's been given than whether he can use them at this point.

 

[gardiner stand]

Why are we the only club, that should be past these type of losses?

Are we alone in losing by 10 goals?

Who’s gives a flying about other clubs? How is that relevant? What are you saying? It’s ok to be shit because others are shit too?
You know what mate you can take it lying down but I’m not....that was a shitful, pathetic,shameful embarrassing,careless effort. No******* balls is what I saw and I’ll point the finger starting with a former captain of the club on good money that won’t put his head over the ******* ball. DISGUSTING!

 

[gardiner stand]

dont know about publicly but club needs to talk to him about it..

Why not?

 

[Derrrrs]

been reading these boards for years just without the urge to post but thought i would throw my thoughts out there as much for my own mental health as anything else. Boy was today disappointing...if not altogether unexpected. I thought we would struggle today given our outs, however what i did expect was the playing group to show effort and commitment for the entire game. It honestly looked like we were playing 2 short on the ground in the first quarter. North just had players loose at the back of every stoppage and killed us with their overlap run. It was disappointing that our mids couldn't recognise that and make adjustments at the stoppages. I think this was where we really missed Simpson and Newman as well, our structures were all out of whack and we got smashed on the outside with North just hitting targets forward of centre with ease. Thomas being off the ground for an extended period after that head clash certainly didnt help either.

Im hoping its a mental thing with a young side but it seems like whenever we play a side we are expected to beat (i know given our outs- north were favs) that we do not turn up with the right mindset, then when we come up against teams we are given no shot against we'll come out and take it right to them. It results in an "honourable loss" however does nothing for us in the scheme of things in regards to the ladder or developing a winning culture. I have no doubt next week we will get within 4-5 goals of Collingwood and everyone will be saying if we played like that last week we would have smashed North.

To get a little off track for a moment, at the time i was nervous about our pick swap with the crows however applauded the club for basically backing in the playing list and saying starting from now we are climbing up this ladder. Certainly the injuries haven't helped this year, and the dropped games have been a killer (GC/hawks) but geeze it looks like it could turn out to be an all time blunder. I know draft picks don't guarantee player quality and the club loved Stocker also. Final note on that- I live in Adelaide and have a bunch of fanatical Crow supporter mates so im probably affected by this more then others haha.

I just wanted to jot down my thoughts on the majority of our playing list player by player quickly to complete my self venting session

1. Silvagni- Just needs to stay in the team for the rest of the year. Looks like he's moving better and covering more ground then ever. Still makes mistakes but i think he'll turn into a bloody handy player for us with his versatility. Also cannot fault his 100% effort every game.
2. Dow- Just keep playing him. Yes his skill level is poor at the moment but he works hard, puts his head over the footy and will only gain confidence the more he plays. I love hearing about the extra work he's gonna be putting in with Cripps and Diesel. Also one thing about him which i think is a great sign for the future is that every match he'll hit the scoreboard. This year he's kicking more points then goals but the fact he is consistently getting shots on goals already- to me reads he'll develop into a good goal kicking mid.
3. Murphy- great servant of the club and ill always love him as a result but he's almost a liability at the moment. He cant tackle anymore and players get past him with ease. The thing he always had going for him was skill level and unfortuantely thats fallen away sharply as well. It must be demoralizing for the younger players to see Murph refuse to put his body on the line. If I was Bolton and wanted to make a statement it would be to drop him and show that no one is bigger then the club and if you're not performing you're not playing.
4. O'brian- exceeded expectations last year but given how he's playing this year its almost like starting the match a player short. He seems to get a few touches late in games because of his fitness but at the start of games when the heat is on he's a bit of a deer in headlights. Still got high hopes for him just think a spell in the 2's could be good for him.
5. SPS- Quite game today but have loved his year to date and the synergy he's forming with Cripps.
6. Simmo- just need his leadership and help with defensive structures out there as much as anything. Pound for pound most courageous player ive had the pleasure of watching, however it is evident he's coming to an end.
7. Kennedy- Being in SA don't get to watch any VFL so cant comment too much about his year to date. Had high hopes for him but starting to struggle to see where he fits into our side when we have a full playing list to choose from.
8. Kreuzer. If Cripps is our most important player, then this bloke is clear 2nd. 4 goal better side with him in it and injuries can get stuffed for taking away such a large chunk of his career.
9. Cripps <3 You just know if he has a quiet start to the game he'll work his way into it and be our bog in the 2nd half. Love everything about the bloke and cannot wait to see him lift up our next premiership cup.
10. H. Great start to the year, couldn't get near it today. People were questioning if Charlie had gotten a bit ahead of himself at the start of the year but this is the guy i probably worry about in that regard. Got so much talent but i reckon the coaching staff have to keep being hard on him to make sure he doesn't read into his own hype. Also need to find a way (somehow, don't know how) that he can play permanent fwd but without Levi in the side to take that 2nd ruck chop out role.
11. Mcgovern. impacting games in 5 minute patches but clearly not fit enough and don't think we'll see what he can really offer till probably next year onwards.
12. TDK. The great white hope for our ruck division and hope he can get healthy and keep developing.
13. Stocker. Solid debut i thought, hard at it and had a few good moments. Exactly what we need in regards to silky skills.
14. Jones. Hope he's okay. Another player like Simmo you just know will run back with the flight every single time. Had a great start to the year however wasn't his best today. Worst thing that can happen to him is for his direct opponent to kick an early goal because i think he can lose confidence quicker than anyone on our list.
15. Doc. Star. Cannot wait for him to come back into the side and get back into his quarterback type role. just see so much Luke Hodge about how he orchestrates and sets up play from behind the ball and hope the injuries haven't taken away any of his agility or mobility.
16. Lang. Cant say much about him apart from saying when we got him off Geelong i thought he would be a bloody handy player for us however hasn't shown anything thats really impressed me since he's been at Carlton.
18. Walsh. Star. Quite game by his standards today and was still one of our best and had the 4th most disposals for us. Needs to tidy up his disposal a bit but thats just nit picking about the most impressive 1st year draftee i can recall seeing. Anyone saying Rozee has had a better year then him so far has lost the plot. (note- Rozee is also a star though)
19. Schumacher. Cant say too much with my limited VFL viewing
20. Plowman. He's gone backwards this year alarmingly so. Unsure why because he was good last year and i thought heading into this year it looked like with his physique his mobility and agility had improved which would only help him go to the next level.
21. Garlett. Worth taking the punt drafting him but it hasn't paid off. Don't think he's up to it.
22. Marchbank. Another one i was high on when he came to the club and thought he showed a bit early on at Carlton but so far this year he hasnt looked anywhere near it as far as im concerned. Just seems to run around like a headless chook. He's missed a fair bit of footy though so prepared to cut him a bit of slack.
23. Weiters. Be top 3-5 in our BnF at the moment, has his mojo back it seems. If he could gain 1 more yard of pace id be prepared to say he'll be the best defender in the comp within 3 years. Think as we get better collectively itll only enhance his impact on games and the outside AFL public will be able to fully appreciate his footy IQ and intercept abilty as well as kicking skills.
24. Newman. Been solid for us, makes some skill errors but is one of the limited amount of players on our list that can rack up uncontested disposals which we badly need.
25. Fisher. Thought he was one of our best today and seems to be getting his groove back after a slowish start to the year. If Cripps and Walsh are Carlton supporters most universally loved players then his kid is my number 3. Destined to be a star as far as i'm concerned.
26. Macreadie. Reports through the VFL have been promising. I think he'll end up being a player thats too good to be playing in the 2's however struggle to see how he fits into our backline.
27/34. Ill lump these two together. Bloody hell they have both struggled this year when given the opportunity. You can almost guarantee the opposition ruckman will be top3 most influential players on the ground when 1 of these 2 is our main ruckman.
28. Cunningham. Love him anywhere around our fwd 50 and think he's one of the few on our list that has a natural goal sense. Would like to see him able to get a few more possies on the outside when he has those stints in the midfield because i think sometimes he drifts out of games for too long.
29. Polson. good VFL player, just doesnt get his hands on it enough to forge out a long AFL career
30. Charlie. tough start to the year, but i think the injury niggles haven't helped. Needs a few games to get back into it properly but he's a star and will be for years to come.
31. Willo- great to see him back in today after so long. Just needs to get his body right and he'll be one of our back flankers/wing for the next 8 years. Love his hardness and his absolute weapon of a leg.
32. Fasolo. Thought he was going to be a really handy pickup for us, the injury hasnt helped but not exactly setting the world on fire in the VFL now that hes back. Struggle to see him having an impact for us at all this year.
33. Pickett. destined to be a 'what if' player. Just don't think he wants it bad enough and as a result think he'll be out of the system within 2 years.
35. Ed. PLAY HIM IN THE MIDDLE. jesus. If you had a young midfield and your best player was getting smashed every stoppage while also having atleast one star midfielder from the opposition running amok nearly every week, do you think it would be a good idea to play a giant ball of muscle, who also happens to be the best endurance runner at the club and to top it off has also shown his ability as a top AFL tagger in the midfield? I mean i do.....but im not an AFL coach so what would i know.
36. Kerr. Seems like solid depth as a key position player .
37. Bsos. Seems to have exceeded expectations so far this year which is a promising sign for the future.
38. Finbar- cant comment really just havent seen enough
39. Thomas. Bravo mate, exceptional year so far. Would be top5 in our BnF so far, never shirks a contest, has tidied up his disposal. Deserves another year based on current form and the plaudits he's been getting a little of in the general media of late.
41. Levi. Solid depth but honestly provides little. The biggest positive i can find when he plays is that it keeps H up fwd and not having to go into the ruck.
42. Lebois. Seems like he always injured but also have heard little to any reports from the VFL watchers that he's remotely close to getting an AFL game
43. Setters. loved what i saw of him in the JLT. had a few quite games in the AFL side before his suspension but i think any games he was getting at the start of the year was a bonus considering his injury last year. Cant wait to see him really break out next year after a full preseason. Could be the gem that completes our long term midfield.
44/46 Owies and Cottrell. Haven't seen much of either, so just have to back the clubs judgement on them. Essentially a free hit if they dont turn out.
45. Goddard. Depth

Sorry for the long write up guys and girls (don't think i've written so much since school exams) but if one good thing came out of it, its that it helped me process todays result. Normally i would just read the autopsy thread and get angrier and angrier haha. My last opinion is this- yes todays result sucks. Im pissed off and frustrated that results haven't been going our way, don't think we should just cop as supporters that the side is young and these things happen to young sides. Because what we lacked today more than anything i think was effort. But it will turn. After years of pain, this side will become a bloody force because there is too much talent in this squad for it not too. And when it does how bloody sweet will it be after all this time to watch us win premiership number 17. Go baggers.

 

[TheHeatleyStand]

Can't all be done at once but it does need to be addressed this year. Losing Kruezer Newman McGovern & Simpson (on top of Docherty) all at once really hurt.

Kreuzer and McGovern have a history of injuries
Simpson is turning 35/6 what do you expect if you're still relying on him
Newman?

really?

 

[Arr0w]

Who’s gives a flying about other clubs? How is that relevant? What are you saying? It’s ok to be **** because others are **** too?
You know what mate you can take it lying down but I’m not....that was a shitful, pathetic,shameful embarrassing,careless effort. No******* balls is what I saw and I’ll point the finger starting with a former captain of the club on good money that won’t put his head over the ******* ball. DISGUSTING!

I guess supporters from other clubs that have copped a belting, this year would feel the same

 

[Talrahir]

Probably our youngest side we ever put on the field. Certainly in my time
We had NO players between 24-28 today
North had NINE
That is almost insurmountable in today's game

The young talent is there but it needs help



thanks jabba

Thanks Soapy. I knew we went in young but that's a pretty serious point. I guess the reality is that the selection committee realized this when they put the team in. I admit, though, that i was excited about the selection of Willo and Stocker before the match.

 

[gotheJUDD]

 

[GenYBlue]

There aren't really any words.

I'll go with disappointing.

Really thought at minimum the boys would have a real crack every game this season and previous rounds had suggested so.

We'll see how they respond next week, maybe this was just an aberration.

 

[Mondyboy]

spot on..what a goose...as a player,and a person

Yeah I noticed this as well. Was reacting to something Daisy said. Doesn’t look good.


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[Blue and Blue]

You make some good points but that was still significantly below what we should consider acceptable. They are not quality opposition.

If we fall into 2-3 more of those 2018 performances Bolton won't survive and I think our ability to attract good talent from other clubs will be greatly reduced

I aren't saying I like it. I just am resigned to it. Change the coach. What will that do? Nothing in my view. Zero.
Another coach still has the same situation. What's he gonna do...shout a lot and everything is fixed? Of course not.
If someone can mount an alternative to this hard rebuild and the pain of it I am all ears.
I remember Malthouse was to be the answer. We know how that went.
Unfortunately it's going to be halfway through next season before there is a genuine coachable team with enough games and strength and understanding of each other.
And there will be other days like this before then.

 

[El Topo]

Andy Maher did well to hold his tongue at half time

 

[slashin_velvet]

If you think Walls is not valid then you’re going to get a rude shock my friend. He ain’t there to pat Bolton on the back he’s there because of the massive investment the club has put into drafting and trading and rebuilding the list. Mark my words if he’s of the mind that Bolton and his coaches aren’t up to the task at hand then Bolton is s dead man walking.

Enlighten me. The guy hasn't been involved in the modern game in any significant capacity. He's been living in the south of France away from the game. At the start of last year he said West Coast would win the spoon....he's irrelevant.

 

[Gethelred]

Who’s gives a flying about other clubs? How is that relevant? What are you saying? It’s ok to be **** because others are **** too?
You know what mate you can take it lying down but I’m not....that was a shitful, pathetic,shameful embarrassing,careless effort. No******* balls is what I saw and I’ll point the finger starting with a former captain of the club on good money that won’t put his head over the ******* ball. DISGUSTING!

You done?