AFL Toast RND 5: Gather Round And Get A Load of This

[Nicholas61]

Maybe after hearing it for the last 6 years and watching the young blokes trying to do their bit the penny has dropped for a few who may be actually thinking it may go pear shaped for them if they do not work it out. New coach comes in and starts preaching the same things (pressure / defend better ) and those who have not been on board would have to start thinking about it. Even more so when it comes from an experienced coach.
Scott has done well to find a basic style plan to fit where the players are at whereas Truck clearly did not take into account the capability of the players being able to implement the complex defensive plan he wanted to run . Probably also helps having more development coaches and small forward who have improved our inside 50 pressure by 1000%.

I do wonder if our guys had a bit of over analysis paralysis going on previously - some seemed to go backward because they couldn't trust and second guessed themselves. A simplified game plan no doubt helps with this as well as clear non verbose communication.

 

[VelvetSledge]

Just got home. Going to watch the replay now and I can’t wait to enjoy this all with you when I’m done

This is sensational

 

[citizen-erased]

I personally think it's too low.

We showed our class letting the saints have their night a few weeks ago
Carlton failed to see this last year and the universe punished them accordingly
Our reward will be 17

Lid off
Stand by Brad!

 

[Vander18]

Maybe after hearing it for the last 6 years and watching the young blokes trying to do their bit the penny has dropped for a few who may be actually thinking it may go pear shaped for them if they do not work it out. New coach comes in and starts preaching the same things (pressure / defend better ) and those who have not been on board would have to start thinking about it. Even more so when it comes from an experienced coach.
Scott has done well to find a basic style plan to fit where the players are at whereas Truck clearly did not take into account the capability of the players being able to implement the complex defensive plan he wanted to run . Probably also helps having more development coaches and small forward who have improved our inside 50 pressure by 1000%.

All true enough….I wouldn’t dismiss the idea that Scott is also a more effective leader either though. Physicality and general desperation seem to be up on previous years as well - seems like he has a lot of buy-in. Maybe it’s him, maybe it’s right place/right time. We will see.

I do think the increase in development coaches is having a noticeable impact - ball handling and hand balling skills have been deplorable for years. We have not looked this clean and quick by hand for….I can’t even remember how long. Probably also helps with getting the zone working.

 

[The House]

Maybe after hearing it for the last 6 years and watching the young blokes trying to do their bit the penny has dropped for a few who may be actually thinking it may go pear shaped for them if they do not work it out. New coach comes in and starts preaching the same things (pressure / defend better ) and those who have not been on board would have to start thinking about it. Even more so when it comes from an experienced coach.
Scott has done well to find a basic style plan to fit where the players are at whereas Truck clearly did not take into account the capability of the players being able to implement the complex defensive plan he wanted to run . Probably also helps having more development coaches and small forward who have improved our inside 50 pressure by 1000%.

Also, demanding a standard, rather than asking for it then rewarding those who constantly breach it with more and more senior games - if we're talking recent years (i.e. the Worsfold/Truck years) many who were not living up to even the most basic of afl standards have gone in the last two years...it certainly helps set the standard when you're not rewarding blokes like Gleeson, Devon Smith, Cutler, Dylan Clarke, McKenna, Zaharakis, Francis, Ham, etc. at the selection table (and letting the last line of defence have to deal with the consequences of their errors and/or laziness week after week).

There looks to be a clear shift in the expectations since Scott arrived, and more importantly, a willingness to demand players adhere to them if they want to play in his side. It's obviously only a small sample size, but thus far the effort, structure and system looks to be a lot more sustainable than our occasional bursts of form under Woosha and Truck (such as the all or nothing, run and gun footy leading up to sneaking into the 8 in 2021).

 

[Albertross]

The last 2 games, Hepp has been more than serviceable. Fantastic to see!

The one game we lost, a 5 goal fwd playing in defence and only the one ruck.

Hopefully Brad has seen the light and won't let that happen again, otherwise...delist (otherwise known as sack his ass).

 

[ant555]

All true enough….I wouldn’t dismiss the idea that Scott is also a more effective leader either though. Physicality and general desperation seem to be up on previous years as well - seems like he has a lot of buy-in. Maybe it’s him, maybe it’s right place/right time. We will see.

I do think the increase in development coaches is having a noticeable impact - ball handling and hand balling skills have been deplorable for years. We have not looked this clean and quick by hand for….I can’t even remember how long. Probably also helps with getting the zone working.

Agree. The thing that got Truck in the end was as a coach he could not sell the plan and lead the players for whatever reason. Complex game plan and not the personal ability to teach it as the head coach. To lead the players as such . It was his job to come up with a plan to fit the playing group and have the ability to bring them on board with it.
Scott has had a look at the list. He has obviously looked at what we did in 2021 that worked well and has built something around that to work with as there are still a lot of similar things in how we move the footy forward.
Along with the extra staff and a couple of important playing personal coming on board or being back from injury Scott has experience. He has an idea of what he did not do well the first time around and he has also had the advantage of being able to watch the game very closely from within the AFL in the last 3 years and speak to coaches that have done well as far as football matters go.
Personally I think Truck ended up being the wrong coach at the wrong time. He did not have the experience needed and he made a fatal mistake of trying to step too far forward in game plan when the pressure for results was on after exceeding expectations in 2021. His defensive game plan did not suit what was on the list and he got burnt. The players still liked him but they did not buy his game plan.
I do not buy that he was a clueless coach with no game plan. The fact is he did wind the game plan back and we started to show some signs of improvement but it was too late and the Collingwood loss killed off the season. But in saying that most coaches are reasonably smart and have good footy ideas. They all fail because they can not sell it to the playing group or have made a plan that does not fit the list profile.

 

[citizen-erased]

The last 2 games, Hepp has been more than serviceable. Fantastic to see!

The one game we lost, a 5 goal fwd playing in defence and only the one ruck.

Hopefully Brad has seen the light and won't let that happen again, otherwise...delist (otherwise known as sack his ass).

Tinkered, didn't work, went back to what did

Flip, Jones, stringer, Langford until 2mp is back, then I'd drop Jones for Wright if his form is the same.

Has to be a question on why heppell needed dropping to get back in form, but hes been solid since. Still think replaceable but I leave that decision to the coaches

 

[ant555]

Also, demanding a standard, rather than asking for it then rewarding those who constantly breach it with more and more senior games - if we're talking recent years (i.e. the Worsfold/Truck years) many who were not living up to even the most basic of afl standards have gone in the last two years...it certainly helps set the standard when you're not rewarding blokes like Gleeson, Devon Smith, Cutler, Dylan Clarke, McKenna, Zaharakis, Francis, Ham, etc. at the selection table (and letting the last line of defence have to deal with the consequences of their errors and/or laziness week after week).

There looks to be a clear shift in the expectations since Scott arrived, and more importantly, a willingness to demand players adhere to them if they want to play in his side. It's obviously only a small sample size, but thus far the effort, structure and system looks to be a lot more sustainable than our occasional bursts of form under Woosha and Truck (such as the all or nothing, run and gun footy leading up to sneaking into the 8 in 2021).

In fairness last year there was not a lot of selection pressure in some spots for a lot of the season. We had no AFL listed players playing VFL midfield to put pressure on. We had no small forwards. Previous years had some interesting selections but last year Truck had an empty pantry a lot of weeks. Has not been the case this year as much.

 

[BOMBERBLITZ]

Best game in a number of years!

 

[citizen-erased]

In fairness last year there was not a lot of selection pressure in some spots for a lot of the season. We had no AFL listed players playing midfield to put pressure on. We had no small forwards. Previous years had some interesting selections but last year Truck had an empty pantry a lot of weeks. Has not been the case this year as much.

Last year it was a decision of Ham v keeping players not performing

This year you have Hobbs, hind and mass trying to get in
Reid, cox, Wright, tsatas etc in the wings
And guelfi and tippa when theyre ready

 

[Happyskeret]

Agree. The thing that got Truck in the end was as a coach he could not sell the plan and lead the players for whatever reason. Complex game plan and not the personal ability to teach it as the head coach. To lead the players as such . It was his job to come up with a plan to fit the playing group and have the ability to bring them on board with it.
Scott has had a look at the list. He has obviously looked at what we did in 2021 that worked well and has built something around that to work with as there are still a lot of similar things in how we move the footy forward.
Along with the extra staff and a couple of important playing personal coming on board or being back from injury Scott has experience. He has an idea of what he did not do well the first time around and he has also had the advantage of being able to watch the game very closely from within the AFL in the last 3 years and speak to coaches that have done well as far as football matters go.
Personally I think Truck ended up being the wrong coach at the wrong time. He did not have the experience needed and he made a fatal mistake of trying to step too far forward in game plan when the pressure for results was on after exceeding expectations in 2021. His defensive game plan did not suit what was on the list and he got burnt. The players still liked him but they did not buy his game plan.
I do not buy that he was a clueless coach with no game plan. The fact is he did wind the game plan back and we started to show some signs of improvement but it was too late and the Collingwood loss killed off the season. But in saying that most coaches are reasonably smart and have good footy ideas. They all fail because they can not sell it to the playing group or have made a plan that does not fit the list profile.

I don’t think Truck is clueless but I do think it was a pretty big oversight for him not to understand the limitations of our playing list in regards to the gameplan he was trying to implement.

 

[The House]

In fairness last year there was not a lot of selection pressure in some spots for a lot of the season. We had no AFL listed players playing VFL midfield to put pressure on. We had no small forwards. Previous years had some interesting selections but last year Truck had an empty pantry a lot of weeks. Has not been the case this year as much.

I'd argue that basically every one of those guys were not only rewarded with several games when there were often at least some other options available, but even worse, rewarded with contracts (and security) beyond what their output dictated.

I'm not saying Woosha and Truck were clueless btw -- I'm saying both failed awfully at ensuring standards were met.

Almost every player interview I've heard this year, as well as the internal report, clearly suggests that we weren't working hard enough/weren't fit enough under Truck, and that the standards were far higher this pre-season for example...

 

[ant555]

I'd argue that basically every one of those guys were not only rewarded with several games when there were often at least some other options available, but even worse, rewarded with contracts (and security) beyond what their output dictated.

I'm not saying Woosha and Truck were clueless btw -- I'm saying both failed awfully at ensuring standards were met.
Almost every interview I've heard this year, as well as the internal report, clearly suggests that we weren't working hard enough/weren't fit enough under Truck, and that the standards were far higher this pre-season for example...

was only commenting on last year

 

[Vander18]

Agree. The thing that got Truck in the end was as a coach he could not sell the plan and lead the players for whatever reason. Complex game plan and not the personal ability to teach it as the head coach. To lead the players as such . It was his job to come up with a plan to fit the playing group and have the ability to bring them on board with it.
Scott has had a look at the list. He has obviously looked at what we did in 2021 that worked well and has built something around that to work with as there are still a lot of similar things in how we move the footy forward.
Along with the extra staff and a couple of important playing personal coming on board or being back from injury Scott has experience. He has an idea of what he did not do well the first time around and he has also had the advantage of being able to watch the game very closely from within the AFL in the last 3 years and speak to coaches that have done well as far as football matters go.
Personally I think Truck ended up being the wrong coach at the wrong time. He did not have the experience needed and he made a fatal mistake of trying to step too far forward in game plan when the pressure for results was on after exceeding expectations in 2021. His defensive game plan did not suit what was on the list and he got burnt. The players still liked him but they did not buy his game plan.
I do not buy that he was a clueless coach with no game plan. The fact is he did wind the game plan back and we started to show some signs of improvement but it was too late and the Collingwood loss killed off the season. But in saying that most coaches are reasonably smart and have good footy ideas. They all fail because they can not sell it to the playing group or have made a plan that does not fit the list profile.

Your last paragraph….that’s the difference between a good head coach and a good assistant.

It’s NOT the same job and I think it’s really interesting that the industry has moved away from the idea that head coaching experience at a lower level isn’t vital anymore.

I think it’s a mistake - there is obviously some correlation between the two roles but it’s far from absolute.

 

[ant555]

Your last paragraph….that’s the difference between a good head coach and a good assistant.

It’s NOT the same job and I think it’s really interesting that the industry has moved away from the idea that head coaching experience at a lower level isn’t vital anymore.

I think it’s a mistake - there is obviously some correlation between the two roles but it’s far from absolute.

Or not enough experience to know how to do it. Some coaches will never take the step but I do wonder how many would take the next step if they had spent more time in the system like McRae and in a few different clubs. Truck hardly got good teaching when he got to us to learn under a coach who had pretty much checked out because of outside influence telling him who he had to have in his leadership group and who he could have on his coaching panel.

 

[The House]

was only commenting on last year

I don't think there's much doubt that Truck failed at ensuring his standards were met last year...he demanded a blue collar team, he got an unfit and at times lazy team...again, the players have talked about how much higher the standards were this pre-season compared to the year before, and I'd argue to the eye test, we're looking a lot fitter and able to work over four quarters than we have for a long, long time --- even 2021 we'd often win off the back of 45 minutes of explosive footy. This looks a lot more sustainable to me (even though there's still a long way to go to reach the standards of the genuine contenders in this league).

 

[Vander18]

Or not enough experience to know how to do it. Some coaches will never take the step but I do wonder how many would take the next step if they had spent more time in the system like McRae and in a few different clubs. Truck hardly got good teaching when he got to us to learn under a coach who had pretty much checked out because of outside influence telling him who he had to have in his leadership group and who he could have on his coaching panel.

It’s a massive job.

I look at some of the “sexy” assistants that seem to be in the frame for every gig and listen to them…..with some you can just tell they aren’t ready.

Handling the playing group is hard enough….throw in media, coteries, supporters. It requires enormous life experience and industry experience I think. I think clubs still underestimate the role at times.

 

[Happyskeret]

When I watch Brad coach he seems to have a grasp on what’s right and what’s not. Like he fixes small problems before they become big problems. Watching Truck and Woosha they would like back the system for a quarter before they would react which was often to late to salvage anything.

 

[ant555]

I don't think there's much doubt that Truck failed at ensuring his standards were met last year...he demanded a blue collar team, he got an unfit and at times lazy team...again, the players have talked about how much higher the standards were this pre-season compared to the year before, and I'd argue to the eye test, we're looking a lot fitter and able to work over four quarters than we have for a long, long time --- even 2021 we'd often win off the back of 45 minutes of explosive footy. This looks a lot more sustainable to me (even though there's still a long way to go to reach the standards of the genuine contenders in this league).

Does not change the fact there was no selection pressure. Truck failed for sure but he was not gifting games last year. Have a look at the VFL results from early last year. We had no one pushing for selection due to injury and those who where playing where simply not good enough and worse than the blokes in the AFL side. In fact we had to bring in some new VFL players from about round 4 to replace some of the VFL players who had no idea. The seconds where getting belted by 50 plus points every week. Compare that with this year where you have Hobbs getting 30 possessions. Hind 41 possessions. Voss kicking goals. When your best performing AFL listed player is Ham then you are in a bit of trouble.
I am not arguing what we are doing now does not look better. I was simply stating that last year one issue was lack of selection pressure due to at least one or two midfielders being injured every week and no small forwards who could make an impact.
As for the eye test. You always look fitter when you play a better team defense as you do not spend as much time chasing the footy in the other direction.
Scott is doing a great job. Truck failed as a coach but there where also a few factors outside of his control that did not help his cause and Scott is reaping some benefit from the club going over the soft cap and giving him the extra development coaches to go along with the smart plan he has in place.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

That was the best team performance since the mid naughties.

 

[danzan22]

Are we… not s**t?

We're not not shit.....i think, i wasnt prepared for this tonight!

 

[Stopher]

So, Collingwood winning 129-88 over the Saints would put Essendon top of the ladder and make the Anzac Day clash 1 v 2.

Not that I'm counting or anything...

 

[Lore]

When I watch Brad coach he seems to have a grasp on what’s right and what’s not. Like he fixes small problems before they become big problems. Watching Truck and Woosha they would like back the system for a quarter before they would react which was often to late to salvage anything.

This

 

[Old Campaigner]

When does the replay go up on the AFL site?