Preview Round 11, 2024: Melbourne v St.Kilda - MCG - Sunday 26th May, 3.20pm AEST

[Hubnester]

Game Day - Round 11, 2024: Melbourne v St.Kilda - MCG - Sunday 26th May, 3.20pm AEST

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/round-11-2024-melbourne-v-st-kilda.1381837/

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Teflon]

Lots of talk lately re our woes is it coaching ? Lack of talent? (probably bit of both is the beige reality) that said I thought N Buckley said it nicely this week on Fox when asked what the results might be if Fly swapped with Lyon…his thoughts were….Lyon would go considerably better with Pies and Fly considerably worse coaching Saints….think he might think our list is a little bit shit

 

[The Punter]

Listening to Joey suggest Higgins to get a run through the midfield, makes me think.. is wilson being pigeonholed as a wing? could we give him a run through the midfield? He's strong and quick, can run all day, good decision maker and a penetrating kick.. why not give him a run?

Obviously Owens comes up too

And the other one D King mentioned is Nas, not sure it'd be worth it moving him from the backline but I do like the principle that we need to get our best players around the ball. I think with opportunity we could unearth some inside mids.

Garcia, Owens, Wilson, Higgins, Nas, Henry, joshy hecking battle..

Love to see steele start up forward or something, just to give us a different look. Ross and jones to play at sandy

We've got some good players, let's try some things out

I think this is the right sentiment, but you know what we haven't really tried this season? Having our best inside mid fit and playing inside.

In other words, let's see how we go with Brad Crouch in the guts this week before trying players unproven as inside mids, especially against Oliver, Petracca, Viney and Gawn.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Saints could be done for tanking after last weeks selection.

Interchange Bench:
Collard , Phillipou, Sharman, Bonner.

You mainly want to rotate your mids so they can keep going at high intensity. We used way less rotations compared to Fremantle.

Pou needs more time in the 2's. Collard needs a lot more time in the 2s.
Sharmon is not needed as a rotation off the bench.
Idk, why we selected Hastie ahead of McLennan, who can play as a lockdown small defender and has been very clean , very accountable, and also good on the rebound at Sandringham.

Dow was very disappointing , basically played an outsiders game. Ross will give a more honest performance.

Higgins our most important scoring player. Straight in.

Wilkie Howard Webster.
W-M Battle Sinclair.
Wood Ross Hill
King, Garcia, Hayes
Higgins, Caminiti, Owens.

R: Marshall, Steele, Wilson

Bench :Windhager, Crouch, Bonner, Clark.

Sub ( Byrnes ).

Byrnes did nothing on the weekend to deserve a recall , i doubt we will see much of him again with our injury list getting shorter

 

[sauce_head]

Not much Butler love here. Nobody after his speed and potential line breaking? Will at least try and get in front of the ball and also tackle.

 

[The Punter]

Not much Butler love here. Nobody after his speed and potential line breaking? Will at least try and get in front of the ball and also tackle.

2020 or 2023 Butler walks back in, but he does seem the kind who needs a few weeks under his belt at least before he is at his best.

But it's no accident the Butler's two best seasons at the club are the two seasons we made finals in the last decade. He's very important when playing at his best.

I think he needs weeks at Sandy.

 

[Saintbloke]

Byrnes did nothing on the weekend to deserve a recall , i doubt we will see much of him again with our injury list getting shorter

Disappointed in Ryan, seems to have lost confidence and he a better player than what he has showed us at Sandy in the last couple of weeks...maybe he has been Rossed.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Byrnes did nothing on the weekend to deserve a recall , i doubt we will see much of him again with our injury list getting shorter

Or Bachelor's opinion.
--------------
Ryan got stuck out on the wing a little bit in terms of possessions, but he brought his weapon in his running, didn’t stop all game. His attitude was great, as it always is. It was good to see him get a bit of inside-mid time at the end of the game.
----------------
You could argue that a heap of players did nothing to deserve staying in the team.
Byrnes is a solid option for midfield rotations. Its dumb to have a heap of non-mids on the bench.

 

[gringo2011]

Disappointed in Ryan, seems to have lost confidence and he a better player than what he has showed us at Sandy in the last couple of weeks...maybe he has been Rossed.

Playing out on a wing which isn’t as easy in the VFL.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Playing out on a wing which isn’t as easy in the VFL.

Why is that ?

 

[SaintsSeptember]

We've had Higgins out of the forward line for 3 weeks. He has 13 goals in 7 games, kicked 4 against the Pies. He is probably best crumber in the team right now based on experience rather than potential.

Our forwards are static, marking as poor as they ever have, making every possession in the F50 contested. Our inside 50 to score ratio is the worst in the league. We need forwards who can find space and kick goals, who can present and mark. Jack Higgins can do all this.

He's likely to come back into the team this week, into a team that is only in front of the Hawks, Tigers and Roos for goals scored. We need goals, Saints fans. We need players who can kick goals within goal kicking distance of the goal. Go and watch the Saints v Bombers 2023 replay, amongst others we could name.

Please cease this Send Jack Higgins To Rescue The Midfield talk immediately. That's Brad Crouch's and possibly Hunter Clark's job.

Hunter will come in and be decapitated by a Melbourne player ( a fan marking his head in the third row.).

Melbourne player will get 2 weeks, because he is really sorry, is a good bloke at the pub , and has only been reported a few times before.

 

[The_Steadier]

Okay. They do count, which is why he has 4 goal assists instead of 2. You're basing his entire season off of 2 kicks inside 50?

I already told you, score involvements are the best measure for an attacking half back. This is a list of players from his position

View attachment 1996163
Are you impressed by that?

Funny how you're accusing me of ignoring stats. I noticed you failed to mention this one?
View attachment 1996170

Oh, and maybe this one too:
View attachment 1996171

I feel like bonner would be leading the league for unforced error/turnover directly resulting in a goal.

That would be acceptable if he was a weapon at setting up our goals- but he isn't.

Worst of both worlds- not setting up our goals and directly costing us ones too.

 

[gringo2011]

Why is that ?

Don't know, wings never get huge numbers in the VFL. Probably because the game is naturally more of a chaos ball game and the ball tends to be sent forward with as few possession chains as possible to avoid turn over.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Or Bachelor's opinion.
--------------
Ryan got stuck out on the wing a little bit in terms of possessions, but he brought his weapon in his running, didn’t stop all game. His attitude was great, as it always is. It was good to see him get a bit of inside-mid time at the end of the game.
----------------
You could argue that a heap of players did nothing to deserve staying in the team.
Byrnes is a solid option for midfield rotations. Its dumb to have a heap of non-mids on the bench.

Well is sure isn't his kicking that's his weapon , if you're happy with a bloke playing on the wing just being able to run that fine , but that's not going to help us improve.

 

[gringo2011]

I went back and looked at our first couple of weeks stats. Steele was flying. Crouch was restricted but still adding about 5 clearances a week. We had Geelong beaten before that controversial Danger free kick where he tripped over one of our players and kicked a goal.

We knocked of Collingwood with Max King

12

Max King

Age

24

Ht

202cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.3

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

2.6

2star

M

2.7

3star

T

0.7

3star

G

1.4

5star

D

7.3

2star

K

4.7

2star

HB

2.6

2star

M

2.7

3star

T

0.7

1star

G

1.4

5star

D

8.0

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

2.8

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

0.6

3star

G

1.4

5star

flying. 3 goals straight and 15 touches against them (4.1 from Higgins). 17 disposals and 2.4 to go along with 94 AF points making King our 4th most effective player against the Cats.

Lost Crouch, Henry and Wood against the Pies and never really resettled. Then without Snags and Butler and Seb Ross dropping away hard we really just lost our competitiveness. Players like Henry and Wood haven't recaptured their early form from the lay off too.

 

[gringo2011]

Well is sure isn't his kicking that's his weapon , if you're happy with a bloke playing on the wing just being able to run that fine , buts that's not going to help us improve.

I know he groped your nads or something but you need a few depth soldiers in every side. Mark Hutchings was a premiership player. GWS when their list was at it's best had to import guys like DeBoer because they were all icing and no cake.

 

[Nutsngum]

I went back and looked at our first couple of weeks stats. Steele was flying. Crouch was restricted but still adding about 5 clearances a week. We had Geelong beaten before that controversial Danger free kick where he tripped over one of our players and kicked a goal.

We knocked of Collingwood with Max King flying. 3 goals straight and 15 touches against them (4.1 from Higgins). 17 disposals and 2.4 to go along with 94 AF points making King our 4th most effective player against the Cats.

Lost Crouch, Henry and Wood against the Pies and never really resettled. Then without Snags and Butler and Seb Ross dropping away hard we really just lost our competitiveness. Players like Henry and Wood haven't recaptured their early form from the lay off too.

Crouch was dropped after round 1 though and then went for his knee cleanup after half a game in the VFL.

 

[The Punter]

Crouch was dropped after round 1 though and then went for his knee cleanup after half a game in the VFL.

And hobbled Crouch still had 5 clearances v Geelong in 63% time on ground.

I think we'd be sitting pretty well at the moment with 10 fit and in-form games from Brad Crouch and Dan Butler.

 

[CaptainRisky]

I know he groped your nads or something but you need a few depth soldiers in every side. Mark Hutchings was a premiership player. GWS when their list was at it's best had to import guys like DeBoer because they were all icing and no cake.

Of course you need depth , and now we have players back from injury he is only depth , not starting 22 , its not that hard to understand I wouldn't have thought.

 

[gringo2011]

And hobbled Crouch still had 5 clearances v Geelong in 63% time on ground.

I think we'd be sitting pretty well at the moment with 10 fit and in-form games from Brad Crouch and Dan Butler.

Definitely have had an unsettled forward line with Higgins, King and Butler missing and the midfield decimated. I think we probably win a minimum one more match with a full list but even as a minimum our game style has suffered more than anything else.

 

[SG34]

Crouch
Was still getting plenty of the ball. Disposal not great, but dependable.
Plays over 80% game time
Ross
Started last year so well and played steadily through ‘23 with a few noticeable dips at the end.
Plays significantly less game time than Crouch. Like 70%
Was steady in a few games this year. Our three wins featured 20+ possession games from him
Butler
Should not have played in the final.
Three ankle operations now.
Ｗho knows now? Those ankle jobs are degenerative injuries. I am scared and not banking on much. But I love him as a player.
Wood
Hasn’t been as impactful since shoulder went early last year.

We are a very confusing and concerning mob to watch aren’t we? And yet we possess all these new exciting players who are faltering. It’s frustrating!!

 

[phantom13]

Don't know, wings never get huge numbers in the VFL. Probably because the game is naturally more of a chaos ball game and the ball tends to be sent forward with as few possession chains as possible to avoid turn over.

AFL wingers hold space and usually work really hard defensively for transition.

VFL players dont have the same vision and skill execution to know they are there and look for them.

Wing at AFL is pretty tough, somedays its just not your day. At VFL its even tougher

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Yes, I remember the same promise was made to old mate Dean Kent too.

Maybe worth a look but I'm, also not sold on his field kicking.,

Or his tank

 

[Fehring]

I went back and looked at our first couple of weeks stats. Steele was flying. Crouch was restricted but still adding about 5 clearances a week. We had Geelong beaten before that controversial Danger free kick where he tripped over one of our players and kicked a goal.

We knocked of Collingwood with Max King flying. 3 goals straight and 15 touches against them (4.1 from Higgins). 17 disposals and 2.4 to go along with 94 AF points making King our 4th most effective player against the Cats.

Lost Crouch, Henry and Wood against the Pies and never really resettled. Then without Snags and Butler and Seb Ross dropping away hard we really just lost our competitiveness. Players like Henry and Wood haven't recaptured their early form from the lay off too.

The toll from the Collingwood game was catastrophic and changed the course of our season. We were already carrying a lot of injured players at that point, and we have less depth than last year. So those three broke the camel's back (i think the three were actually Heny Wood and Windy (susp.)).

 

[Dr Spaceman]

The toll from the Collingwood game was catastrophic and changed the course of our season. We were already carrying a lot of injured players at that point, and we have less depth than last year. So those three broke the camel's back (i think the three were actually Heny Wood and Windy (susp.)).

Think it was King getting suspended (block in the last minute) with Windy suspension being in the Bombers game.

Unbelievably Henry’s injury also being in the last minute or so (and only detected after the game)

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Well is sure isn't his kicking that's his weapon , if you're happy with a bloke playing on the wing just being able to run that fine , buts that's not going to help us improve.

I'm happy with a bloke with a decent tank, who can at least get the ball at AFL level, rotating off the bench so that ALL our midfielders can play with more intensity.