Preview Round 22, 2023: St.Kilda v Richmond - Marvel Stadium, Sunday 13th August, 3:20PM AEST *MADDIE'S MATCH*

[Dard Ball Get]

Cotchin retires. Meaning he’ll have 36 & 3 this weekend

 

[phantom13]

I love to know what they've got out of this year. Despite their tag line of 'a year of exploration', there hasn't been that much exploring happening.

My worry is with the style of football we've been playing and how uninspiring it is to watch. Especially compared to so many other up and coming teams. If we continue to play such a dour way, it's hard to see us taking the step forward next year alongside all these attacking teams. I think that's why throwing away out start of the season for a 2nd year in a row is such a sour note. We have so many players whose natural attributes and strengths would thrive with a fast, attacking style yet this 'exploration' we are on is having us play the opposite way.

Yeh, im not a natural optimist (especially with the saints) but i guess maybe its a "build from defence" style like what Melbourne did and to that end our defensive 50 has been our best line all year.

I bang on about it a bit but the Dyl and Friends Pod with Damien Hardwick he talks about shifting his coaching mentality away from "fixing deficiencies" to "exploiting strengths" and the specific example is how Kane Lambert being a naturally good defensive mid meant that letting him do that meant Dusty could be Dusty and stick to his natural ability as an attacking mid. If theyve done some sort of an assesment to hone in on strengths and weaknesses then maybe that will help. It would also be "exploratory" without it appearing so from the outside.

I said when we appointed Ross that this year almost becomes a rite off because hes gotta have some time to implement his plan so actual ladder result this year doesnt concern me in the slightest. The on field and lack of consistent application and plan does concern me.

Im not as down as some but i do really struggle to see how some can be so optimistic outside of blind faith.

 

[beside the seaside]

Young =/= bad. Who did we get rid of last year that was producing more than these guys?

Well Hannebery retired didn't he and he produced way more than Phillipou. And Ryder retired too who was about ten times the player Hammer is.

 

[moirae42]

Still don't have enough players that can execute.
Lyon's gameplans always need the effort and execution.
Generally, we have the effort.

Next year could be an almighty shit show.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Yep win this, lead Geelong for 90% fo the game and lose it in the last 5 minutes.
Then head to Brisbane and get jumped early. Putting the game and season to bed by halftime

There will be 6.16 in there as well

 

[Tommy Wigs]

I think you’re all overreacting a bit. Most of us were expecting a 10-14 finish to the season at the start of the year and with the injury list we started with we’ve completely blown that expectation out of the water.

It’s been quite a successful season considering it’s the first year under a new coach, heaps of young talent have had games put into them (Hammer, Pou, Windhager, Owens, NWM) and we still have the fate of finals in our hands with three games to go.

I know most would say it hasn’t been as explorative as Ross made it out to be, but to be playing this many young and different players is definitely explorative for RTBs standards. He’ll have learnt plenty about this list off this season and I wouldn’t be surprised to see 3 or 4 senior players moved on at the trade period.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

I’m not sure I could have dreamt the year that NWM, Owens and Hammer (if I could even imagine a person) have had.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

I love to know what they've got out of this year. Despite their tag line of 'a year of exploration', there hasn't been that much exploring happening.

My worry is with the style of football we've been playing and how uninspiring it is to watch. Especially compared to so many other up and coming teams. If we continue to play such a dour way, it's hard to see us taking the step forward next year alongside all these attacking teams. I think that's why throwing away out start of the season for a 2nd year in a row is such a sour note. We have so many players whose natural attributes and strengths would thrive with a fast, attacking style yet this 'exploration' we are on is having us play the opposite way.

I refreshed my mind by looking at the Ladder this morning. The Dogs are super fabuloustasticapparentky. Saints are awful and should rebuild.

Both 11 wins.

I think it’s only so negative because we’ve done it in this order. Wit ha million injuries.

 

[George]

I’m not across this board as much as you obviously but apart from the kids in the team (Pou, Owens) I don’t see that much positivity or excuses haha this place is pretty miserable most of the time. There’s a couple of prominent posters who back up the club but that’s about it. Generally Saints supporters are beaten down and devoid of hope with good reason.

It was everywhere on mainstream media too. Just stupid stuff.

 

[Saint Shags]

Cotchin retires. Meaning he’ll have 36 & 3 this weekend

At least it will put us out of our misery once and for all.

 

[phantom13]

Well Hannebery retired didn't he and he produced way more than Phillipou. And Ryder retired too who was about ten times the player Hammer is.

Hanners... thats bold

 

[Tommy Wigs]

There's no way Caminiti is an upgrade on what we had last year in Membrey and Hayes. That's a huge downgrade. Phillipou looks like an exciting prospect but his output has been pretty poor, understandable for a first year player but he is hardly an upgrade at this stage.

Owens has been outstanding.

I think Philippou’s season is significantly under valued. I know what you mean here and agree that he’s not been better than, say, a senior / uninjured body from previous years. But he does some super clean things that bely something like a 14 possie game. Hands on deck and vision in tight … great hands in the air for a mid … goal sense. Think he can be generational.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Cotchin retires. Meaning he’ll have 36 & 3 this weekend

Again

 

[puppy_dog7]

Cotchin retires. Meaning he’ll have 36 & 3 this weekend

Was just about to say this!

****ing Cotchin!

Couldn’t announce it next week!

So now we have to deal with his 300th and his retirement.

 

[George]

Well Hannebery retired didn't he and he produced way more than Phillipou. And Ryder retired too who was about ten times the player Hammer is.

Hannebery last year producing more than Pou this year? Lmao come on

 

[George]

Cotchin retires. Meaning he’ll have 36 & 3 this weekend

Disposals and goals or eye gouges and hits behind play?

 

[g_TRAIN]

LOL had to laugh when I saw Trent was retiring against us.

 

[Saintbloke]

I think Philippou’s season is significantly under valued. I know what you mean here and agree that he’s not been better than, say, a senior / uninjured body from previous years. But he does some super clean things that bely something like a 14 possie game. Hands on deck and vision in tight … great hands in the air for a mid … goal sense. Think he can be generational.

The young guys have done ok, but I don't think have been that effective- but will be in the next couple of seasons..Pou and Caminiti, both got found out a bit against Carlton and let guys run off them too easily when they don't have the ball, and I'm sure Lyon would point out the importance second efforts..then again there were a few experienced players who didn't show much interest they lost possession.

 

[True Believer]

I think that what a lot of this particular discussion overlooks is the inconsistency of youth. As has been pointed out, injury has meant that youth has carried us to a larger degree than would be ideal. And young players tend to be far more variable in performance than senior players. Then injury interruptions to key senior players have further contributed to the inconsistency (Steele, Howard, Ross). There is a point where you reach critical mass, and the number of injuries genuinely affects your ability to give players with niggles a week off, or kids who simply need a break a week off. There is a volume of injuries you can carry with minimal impact to output, and then you reach a tipping point.

We were already a team with dramatic variations in performance, probably as a reflection of the list quality. Then we've exacerbated that by adding more youth. Yes, they're exciting and talented youth, but they're youth all the same, and by nature will initially give more variation in output than seasoned veterans. The only upside is the games we are putting into those very promising kids now - we get the reward for that later.

I think young players tiring later in a season is a very real problem, albeit minor, but the variation is almost entirely because we have been so dependent on youth IMO. Our forward line, certainly the key positions in it, have basically been kids all year! Even when we have had senior KPF's come in, it has been for a few weeks, then they have been gone again. About the only real benefit derived from that would have been a chance for the kids to get a bit of a breather from having to lead and carry the forward line!

Caminiti has spent a fair chunk of this season as our number 1 key forward. This is a 19 year old kid, with no AFL preseason, who is 6'5" and weighs what, 90kg's? I am 6' tall and I weigh 89kg (and a concession here, I weight train 5 or 6 times a week). He has been physically smashed for months by blokes with at least 10kg's on him, often more, and it will take a toll at this stage of the season. That's not an excuse, just the reality. He may well come out and blitz this week, but expect greater variation in output, including next year as well.

 

[phantom13]

Disposals and goals or eye gouges and hits behind play?

At the risk of doing another Selwood debate, i ****ing love Cotch, i used to talk with a mate about finals Cotch, he just used to go to another level with white line fever and try to kill blokes to win the footy.

Would love even one of our guys to have his kind of pure tenacity and desperation.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Disposals and goals or eye gouges and hits behind play?

It’s actually Brooke’s handbag and Covid breaches tally

 

[George]

At the risk of doing another Selwood debate, i ******* love Cotch, i used to talk with a mate about finals Cotch, he just used to go to another level with white line fever and try to kill blokes to win the footy.

Would love even one of our guys to have his kind of pure tenacity and desperation.

He's a little rodent

 

[BucketsandBanger]

Tigers' triple-flag skipper to call it quits at season's end

Trent Cotchin will retire at the end of the 2023 season, drawing the curtain on one of the great Richmond careers

www.afl.com.au

lol of course he announces it against us, as I said earlier this is basically the last stand for a group of generational champions for the Tigers, they will be absolutely desperate. We have been pretty unlucky this year with games against, Cotchin's 300th and last stand.

 

[BucketsandBanger]

It was everywhere on mainstream media too. Just stupid stuff.

Pretty sure it all came from Buckley watching our pre-season game against Essendon played in gale force winds at Moorabbin and declaring us bottom 4 cause he didn't like the skills on show. The media are like sheep and a narrative will pick up steam from there.

 

[SteeleSaints]

We should get Membrey, Ross and possibly others back this week. That will help but will it be enough to get some momentum for the last 2 games.

My take on the final 3 games, is we beat Richmond and lose to Geelong & Brisbane - meaning we miss the finals.

Things gelled early when the kids were full of energy but its a long season and our form has seriously dropped away. It is unfortunate but not the end of the world given our list weaknesses. There is little point in making the finals if we wont be competitive.

 

[Klaatu]

Tigers' triple-flag skipper to call it quits at season's end

Trent Cotchin will retire at the end of the 2023 season, drawing the curtain on one of the great Richmond careers

www.afl.com.au

lol of course he announces it against us, as I said earlier this is basically the last stand for a group of generational champions for the Tigers, they will be absolutely desperate. We have been pretty unlucky this year with games against, Cotchin's 300th and last stand.

His last game isn't against us it's the end of their season, same with Isaac Smith