Shaun Burgoyne- what's he REALLY worth?

[collingwill]

For some reason i dont think Hawthorn will manage to get this deal done now with Essendons aquistion of pick 16.

We now hold picks 10, 16, 26, 42 and a fifth selection.

Port Adelaide are interested in Jay Nash whos homesick, and Leroy Jetta may be up for trade whos worth a second shot at 21 years of age.

I wonder if Hawthorn will do the deal.

I think 9 + 41 is fair personally for S. Burygone but only because his form has dropped off and his knee.

Pick 9 and Dowler is a very, very, very good deal for Port. Dowler a good young player, good kicking technique + accurate and provides a young forward for the power. Their silly not to take it and just reafirms that they are unrelastic come the trade period and that Mark Williams has allowed his emotions to get the better of the clubs best interests.

Lewis on his own is better than S.Burygone if we are comparing their ages, and Lewis has future development.

So it will ether be 9 + 41, or 9 + 25 or 9 + Dowler in the end I think and it will happen on Thursday, im predicting.

I think Essendon should offer 10, 42 and Nash. But couldnt care less what the power thought of my offer, they should just accept Hawthorns deal because its better and accept that unfortunately things dont always work out when players come out of contract, I for one am greateful lovett looked after us.

id be very surprised if pick 9 was even on the table for burgoyne TBH, i guess we"ll see.

 

[Brother Noompsi]

id be very surprised if pick 9 was even on the table for burgoyne TBH, i guess we"ll see.

You'd be suprised...I suggest you go read the quotes from Rhode and Williams about Pick 9 and the player we have offered up.

 

[collingwill]

You'd be suprised...I suggest you go read the quotes from Rhode and Williams about Pick 9 and the player we have offered up.

how do you tell when a coach is talking shit in trade week ?

his lips are moving. oldy but a goody.

surely if pick 9 was offered port would take it in a flash.

considering the interest the hawks have aparantly shown in jolly.

 

[Brother Noompsi]

how do you tell when a coach is talking shit in trade week ?

his lips are moving. oldy but a goody.

surely if pick 9 was offered port would take it in a flash.

considering the interest the hawks have aparantly shown in jolly.

Interesting concept.......i suppose all 3( Pelchen Rhode and Williams) have sat around and decided together that they will tell the exact same porkies to the public.

pick 9 not enough/offered, borderline player unsatisfactory/satisfactory....geez they did well.

 

[collingwill]

I'd suggest you have a look at the players taken at pick 9 over the past 10 years or so. Then think whether you'd take an average player out of that list + Dowler for Leon.

Davis would have similar worth to Burgoyne at the moment, no doubt. Slightly different kinds of player, but without the injury concerns i'd have them about even.

I think you're massively overrating pick 9 if you don't think Leon Davis is worth pick 9. Pick 9 is basically going to give you equal chances of drafting a superstar, a solid player, or a dud. Could be anything, could be nothing. Leon Davis is a matchwinner and an established star of the game. The only way Collingwood would ever trade Leon for pick 9 is if their premiership window is shut and they need to rebuild.

ok, lets talk about the tarrant deal, pick 8 and medhurst for tarrant, remember medhurst was stuffed at that point and possibly would"ve been delisted if we didnt take him, so we sold tarrant for pick 8 and the equivilent to a 3rd round draft pick, and we didnt have to trade tarrant, he simply stated that he wouldnt mind moving to WA and if we wanted to trade him he"d be in it, WC were interested as well which meant we got a good price for him, tarrant was probably in the top 6 lead up half forwards at the time we traded (possibly in the top 4), do you honestly believe that burgoyne holds similar currency than tarrant ? an out of form onballer with a dodgy knee ? come on please, im not saying it definantly wont happen but if they offer pick 9 for burgoyne they are showing very little regard for there future IMO.

 

[Macca19]

is he also a lazy underachiever, who spends plenty of time injured, and suffers from eratic form?

I personally dont think Burgoyne is lazy, nor do I think he has underachieved all that much. His 07 was awesome - just as good as his 06, his 08 very good as well. He was a key to a flag in 04. His underachievement is overstated.

to be fair, you or I wouldn't know how close he is to AA. but he isn't a champion, and no one said he was. so what's your point caller?

I dont think Burgoyne is a champion, my point was that stating BnFs and AAs doesnt mean much as there are plenty of excellent players who havent achieved either.

What are the parallels with sewell? feel free to outline the laziness, the injury, the fading in and out of games, the age... etc.

Sewells only 15 months or so younger than Burgoyne. The parallel is the lack of awards that he has won. 1 BnF, no AA.

he's had 1 disappointing year in 6, so he's had 5 years at or about who he is. what about those 5 years, with very few accolades, is it that paints him as a champion?

Ive never called him a champion.

well I am going to argue that it isn't a myth, and I am going to point out that large numbers of your own supporters who say it, the number of media commentators who have highlighted it, and the absolute stagnation of him as a player in the 2 -3 years.

What stagnation? He almost made AA in 07 and was probably better in 07 than in 06. Despite his supposedly poor 08, he still averaged over 20 disposals and a goal a game and finished high in the BnF (was leading up to his suspension). His form is there, people just decide not to recognise it.

I am also going to point out that he seems to spend a lot more time, winning clearances in the F50, than he does in the centre square - as the stats clearly show.

Of course. It seems our entire gameplan for the past 4 years has been to hit the boundary in the forward line so Lade & Burgoyne can weave their clearance magic.

 

[hfc70]

For some reason i dont think Hawthorn will manage to get this deal done now with Essendons aquistion of pick 16, thats if the Bombers are seriously interested wanting to pay over the odds, although i hope not.

We now hold picks 10, 16, 26, 42 and a fifth selection.

Port Adelaide are interested in Jay Nash whos homesick, and Leroy Jetta may be up for trade whos worth a second shot at 21 years of age.

I wonder if Hawthorn will do the deal.

I think 9 + 41 is fair personally for S. Burygone but only because his form has dropped off and his knee.

Pick 9 and Dowler is a very, very, very good deal for Port. Dowler a good young player, good kicking technique + accurate and provides a young forward for the power. Their silly not to take it and just reafirms that they are unrelastic come the trade period and that Mark Williams has allowed his emotions to get the better of the clubs best interests.

Lewis on his own is better than S.Burygone if we are comparing their ages, and Lewis has future development.

So it will ether be 9 + 41, or 9 + 25 or 9 + Dowler in the end I think and it will happen on Thursday, im predicting.

I think Essendon should offer 10, 42 and Nash. But couldnt care less what the power thought of my offer, they should just accept Hawthorns deal because its better and accept that unfortunately things dont always work out when players come out of contract, I for one am greateful lovett looked after us.

Mate, have you been living in a cave all week. The Hawks picked up Josh Gibson (ex North Player) for Pick 25 & 41

 

[moistie]

There is a lot of crap on this thread though.

Pick 9 + Birchall would be a pretty fair deal. Theres a lot of overrating of Birchall going on in this thread. Hes no superstar. Just because hes good value and consistently gets decent DT scores doesnt make him a superstar.

Birchall is off the table. Sure, he's not a superstar but he's a damn fine player.

He's a good runner, reads the play well and can kick the ball very accurately over very large distances. His only major knock is he's suspect in the air. He turns 22 next season and has shown durability, having already played 84 games. He's got another 8 to 10 years ahead of him, which could easily make him a 250+ game player.

Sorry Port, the asking price for pick 9 and Birchall is too steep.

Hes worth pick 9 and something extra. Not Lewis extra. But something extra.

Certainly not the extra price that Port are asking.

 

[collingwill]

Mate, have you been living in a cave all week. The Hawks picked up Josh Gibson (ex North Player) for Pick 25 & 41

you"d think if they were super keen on burgoyne they would"ve kept those picks possibly, do the hawks really need burgoyne ?

 

[Hawk Sale]

Burgoyne would be a good aquisition but by no means is he essential and definitely not worth pick 9 and definitely not with a player of the caliber of the ones mentioned.. 27yr old recent history of knee injuries ?Who are Williams and PA trying to kid ? If we gave up #9 ,we wouldn't have another pick until #60 or something and despite what the experts are saying ,there are still some very good young players in this draft.Given our current needs the only player/s that would be worth our pick 9 ATM would be the likes of Brown from Collingwood (not Leigh) Merret from Brisbane or Lake from the doggies should they become available.An outside mid with speed would be good but we could quite easily pick one up who would be good enough to play in 2010 with pick 9 in this draft.Lets face it Burgoyne is no Chris Judd.

 

[collingwill]

Burgoyne would be a good aquisition but by no means is he essential and definitely not worth pick 9 and definitely not with a player of the caliber of the ones mentioned.. 27yr old recent history of knee injuries ?Who are Williams and PA trying to kid ? If we gave up #9 ,we wouldn't have another pick until #60 or something and despite what the experts are saying ,there are still some very good young players in this draft.Given our current needs the only player/s that would be worth our pick 9 ATM would be the likes of Brown from Collingwood (not Leigh) Merret from Brisbane or Lake from the doggies should they become available.An outside mid with speed would be good but we could quite easily pick one up who would be good enough to play in 2010 with pick 9 in this draft.Lets face it Burgoyne is no Chris Judd.

he's better than judd, just ask mark williams.

 

[Spadge]

Burgoyne would be a good aquisition but by no means is he essential and definitely not worth pick 9 and definitely not with a player of the caliber of the ones mentioned..

i think we'll all find out tomorrow that Shaun Burgoyne is worth Pick 9 and more

 

[23cmonShane!]

Pick 9 and Campbell Brown just thrown up on perth radio. Brown said to be devastated!!!!

 

[twentydollarnote]

Hes worth pick 10-13 in a normal draft. If its true a deal will be done tomorrow then port will win.

 

[hawks_time]

Pick 9 + Brown is paying WAY over the odds. Port fans argue Burgoyne was AA in 06 well Browny was AA in 07.

 

[El_Scorcho]

I'd agree that Pick 9 + Brown would be over the odds.

Dowler is the one I want and I think he's a fair trade.

 

[Messenger]

Pick 9 and Campbell Brown just thrown up on perth radio. Brown said to be devastated!!!!

Brad Hardie is the source. Take that as you will.

A few weeks ago he was adamant Burgoyne was going to Geelong.

 

[Spadge]

IF this is true then i think it will be more than 9+brown
perhaps port throwing a 2nd or 3rd rounder at hawthorn as part of the deal

 

[gohawks4]

IF this is true then i think it will be more than 9+brown
perhaps port throwing a 2nd or 3rd rounder at hawthorn as part of the deal

Browny will not be traded!!! It's rubbish. Would destroy the fabric of our club. Unless of course he wanted to leave...

 

[VolgaBoatman]

Also on PR it was mentioned that Campbell Brown still has 1 year to go on his contract - and that he doesn't have to go if he doesn't want to.

 

[Nik_Kershaw]

This would be bad karma for the Hawks, Brown is a heart and soul guy, you can't trade that away, it doesn't work. Worth way more to them then to any other team.

 

[hawks0808]

IF this is true then i think it will be more than 9+brown
perhaps port throwing a 2nd or 3rd rounder at hawthorn as part of the deal

Dreaming!, Browny would be on the list of untouchables, heart and soul of our club, we wouldnt want him to leave and he doesnt want to leave. That wont be happening!!!

 

[chaddles]

I will go take a big dump on Pelchens door step if we trade Campbell Brown. There is no way that we can get rid of this guy - he can play back and forward and bleeds brown and gold.

Would be disappointed if Williams goes to Port as he is a great 3rd option - and would be confused if Mark Williams is coached by Mark Williams

 

[worthy]

What's he really worth?

He didn't feature in many peoples best 50.

Lovett went for pick 16
McLean went for pick 11

Burgoyne for pick 9 is very close to fair.

Burgoyne for pick 9 and one of McGlynn, Tuck, Morton, Moss is a win for Port.

Anything more is ridiculous.

Trading Campbell Brown? Even if it were a win for us like:
9 + Brown for Burgoyne and Carlisle

It would still feel like a loss, you simply don't trade passionate players like Brown, it's just not the done thing.

 

[krusden]

Browny will not be traded!!! It's rubbish. Would destroy the fabric of our club. Unless of course he wanted to leave...

http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,26176676-12428,00.html

fabric or not its being reported he may well be if he wants to go!