Opinion Sydney Swans Academy and Rebuild

[RUNVS]

Only the mills, heeney, ugle haven, rioli types who were destined for the afl anyway are unfair. You cant complain about pick 30+ types who have been passed almost twice already anyway.

The only unfair thing with those types was the stupid stacking of 10 pick 70+ to get points to equal a high pick, but that loophole is dead and even the discount will be too. But that's not a Sydney specific thing.

Neither Heeney or Mills were destined for the AFL. Heeney was amazing at every sport he tried and he could easily be an NRL or Soccer player right now if not for the Academy.

 

[Back One Out]

Richmond got two home finals including one home Grand Final they didn't earn in 2017. That's unfair.

Not true

The MCG has been the venue of choice for Victorian finals since 1897 when the league was founded.

Richmond are an MCG tenant, but Geelong also play some of their home games at the ground too, which makes them a co-tenant.

The MCG was not Richmond's "home ground" for Week 1 of the 2017 finals. It was a neutral venue. Unlike Crows home finals at the Adelaide Oval, Richmond and Geelong fans both had equal access to tickets and fans from both clubs made plenty of noise when they shouted "BALL!" for the umpires.

 

[J_Moore]

F/S is such a red herring. 257 players have played for West Coast. Talent pool is the draft aged sons of players. Since the club has been around long enough to have actual father sons (i.e. not 'this guy played 250 games in the WAFL and probably would've played for WC if they existed in 1975') we've had 3. Geelong had a good run in the early to mid 2000s. Why aren't they finding Abletts and Hawkins and Scarletts every other year?

Yeah they’re not a major issue compared to the academies, but the bidding rules need to be consistent.

 

[Scotland]

People talk about those bad picks, but the only reason they are bad picks is because the Swans traded out one good pick for 2 or so worse picks that have more points. We still needed to use the good pick though, it just got disguised as two bad picks.

The only reason bidding teams trade out 'good' picks is to double dip. GWS traded around in circles to draft Lachie Ash at pick 4 then get Tom Green at 10 for later picks.

I remember back in the 2000s when there were first round priority picks for being shit. We got Judd and Sampi, Hawthorn got Roughead and Franklin, Richmond took Tambling, Freo traded theirs for magic beans. Etc.

By the time those rules were gone and we were shit again we took Andrew Gaff at pick 4 as Gold Coast had the first 3 picks. Would've been awesome to take Gaff and know that Conca or Cripps or Darling or any other WA player would also be hours at a discount. Likewise would've been nice the following year when we were top 4 to take Steve Coniglio at pick 2.

 

[Scotland]

Yeah they’re not a major issue compared to the academies, but the bidding rules need to be consistent.

They also apply to the Northern state clubs. Jono Brown, Tom Mitchell etc. didn't fall out of the sky.

 

[losty199]

Gulden and Campbell have both been in Swans system for 6 years Just like Mills and Heeney they have talent and knowledge to have a massive impact early on which draws massive attention wait 2 years rest talent in draft to catch up before getting pitch forks out.

 

[Kozzie_Magic]

The Swans definitely need it.

Without an Academy continually giving them access to elite talent for low picks and artificially propping them up they would be perennial cellar dwellers and their supporters would disappear faster than Milli Vanilli's music career.

 

[Scotland]

Why are people talking about Richmond's finals opponents in 2017?

Richmond were lucky with how their cards fell finishing 3rd, but when they finished 1st in 2018 they got Hawthorn (MCG tenant) and Collingwood (MCG tenant). We finished second and got two Melbourne teams that had to travel to WA.

Anyway it has nothing to do with academies.

 

[1990crow]

They shouldn’t have access to top 30 picks unrestricted. Same as the rest of the competitions academies.
It’s a leg up.

 

[J_Moore]

They also apply to the Northern state clubs. Jono Brown, Tom Mitchell etc. didn't fall out of the sky.

fine for Sydney/Lions, less so for GC/GWS.

but yea, a more minor issue. The bidding system needs to be refined, and is. The existence of the academies, though, less so.

 

[Scotland]

Round 1: live pick
Round 2: discount
Round 3 onward: free hit

Would anyone really care if clubs were adding academy/NGA/FS players not picked in the first 36 for free?

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Yer nah sorry i felt disgust when i heard on Trade Radio that it would be a fantastic thing for the King brothers to play for Saints actually encouraging Simon Lethlean to make a offer to him ASAP.

Northern clubs need equalization measures this is one of them, Richmond pillaged Gold Coast to no qualms or quarrels.

Competition is still far to Vic oriented just been through a Geelong dynasty followed by a Hawthorn and now a Richmond one.

 

[Scotland]

fine for Sydney/Lions, less so for GC/GWS.

but yea, a more minor issue. The bidding system needs to be refined, and is. The existence of the academies, though, less so.

Given the establishment concessions and the fact that GC/GWS were able to sign free agents before they had any players eligible for free agency I'm low on sympathy there. WC, Freo, Adelaide, Port all had initial F/S rules in place. We had 3 picks in 15 years, Freo had 1. Port got Brett Ebert but not Brad, Adelaide missed out on Bryce Gibbs when the rules changed.

 

[Slingshot Footy]

The Swans definitely need it.

Without an Academy continually giving them access to elite talent for low picks and artificially propping them up they would be perennial cellar dwellers and their supporters would disappear faster than Milli Vanilli's music career.

Yep, just totally ignore our astute drafting in the later rounds and rookie draft from the last decade. But love the evidence based dressing down of the Swans, keep it going.

 

[theyellowsash]

Neither Heeney or Mills were destined for the AFL. Heeney was amazing at every sport he tried and he could easily be an NRL or Soccer player right now if not for the Academy.

Like any number of top picks. Who should have had deledio given he was a top cricket junior?

 

[RUNVS]

Like any number of top picks. Who should have had deledio given he was a top cricket junior?

Difference is that in the heartland states AFL has a good chance of winning the battle for those talented juniors who are good at a lot of sports. In Sydney previously the AFL would be like a 70 year old man with a missing leg up against the NRL in a battle for those talented players. Now the old man has been given a knife so he at least stands a chance.

 

[Scotland]

Yep, just totally ignore our astute drafting in the later rounds and rookie draft from the last decade. But love the evidence based dressing down of the Swans, keep it going.

If your drafting is so good why you need preferential access to players who would otherwise go in the first round?

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

If your drafting is so good why you need preferential access to players who would otherwise go in the first round?

Would you be ok if Logan and Warner requested trades back to WA? after 2 years.

 

[Scotland]

Would you be ok if Logan and Warner requested trades back to WA? after 2 years.

OK?

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

OK?

Cause thats the real prospect Northern clubs face every year with top draft picks from Victoria.

You benefitted greatly from Brisbane go home factor and nabbed a A grade mid in Kelly due to genuine home sickness.

 

[TheBigLeftBoot]

Why is Errol Gulden being discussed in the same boat as others? He was a second round pick and very gettable IMO.

Here's a question. If GWS didn't match a bid for Jeremy Cameron

5

Jeremy Cameron

Age

31

Ht

196cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.5

3star

K

9.0

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

5.4

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

2.6

5star

D

10.0

3star

K

7.1

3star

HB

2.9

2star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

G

1.9

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

2.4

4star

G

2.0

5star

and Geelong bid on Errol Gulden at pick 23 would he be wearing the hoops or would Sydney match anyway and cop the deficit?

 

[Scotland]

Cause thats the real prospect Northern clubs face every year with top draft picks from Victoria.

You benefitted greatly from Brisbane go home factor and nabbed a A grade mid in Kelly due to genuine home sickness.

Would you prefer WA clubs had preferential access to WA players so Brisbane and Geelong couldn't draft them?

If the issue is player retention why is the focus on getting local kids at a discount and non local kids?

 

[SM]

Sure it's already been said but Gulden amongst others would be lost to the game without the Academy so surely they're a good thing. Agree that the bidding process should be refined though, but still think the club that puts the resources and time into developing a player should have first rights to them.

 

[TheMase]

Why is Errol Gulden being discussed in the same boat as others? He was a second round pick and very gettable IMO.

Here's a question. If GWS didn't match a bid for Jeremy Cameron

5

Jeremy Cameron

Age

31

Ht

196cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.5

3star

K

9.0

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

5.4

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

2.6

5star

D

10.0

3star

K

7.1

3star

HB

2.9

2star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

G

1.9

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

2.4

4star

G

2.0

5star

and Geelong bid on Errol Gulden at pick 23 would he be wearing the hoops or would Sydney match anyway and cop the deficit?

Would have taken the deficit.

 

[SM]

Why is Errol Gulden being discussed in the same boat as others? He was a second round pick and very gettable IMO.

Here's a question. If GWS didn't match a bid for Jeremy Cameron and Geelong bid on Errol Gulden at pick 23 would he be wearing the hoops or would Sydney match anyway and cop the deficit?

We would have matched I suspect.