Scape Goat The Cam Guthrie Echo Chamber

[Cataholic]

Someone who can gain more than -4 meters I guess.

That throws the door wide open, hey?

 

[Spazz Cat]

The Bont's in good form,not to many going to beat him one out.

Yeah it was bloody harsh. Over the top actually. I was just hoping he'd win it. Was in a good position early.

 

[Down at K Park]

Someone who can gain more than -4 meters I guess.

So anyone on our list. I’ll bet even fort could provide positive metres gained playing out of the goalsquare.

 

[Landgraft]

Parfitt is well and truly ready (was just 'rested') as are Parsons and S. Selwood.

Not sure I buy that Parfitt was just rested, personally. Parsons and Scoot sure - but the original point was about Parf, Chook and Menegola.

For whatever it's worth, AFL player ratings had 10 players worse for us than he was on the night. My opinion of him as an okay but kinda meh player didn't really get challenged either.

 

[feelinfeline]

Not sure I buy that Parfitt was just rested, personally. Parsons and Scoot sure - but the original point was about Parf, Chook and Menegola.

For whatever it's worth, AFL player ratings had 10 players worse for us than he was on the night. My opinion of him as an okay but kinda meh player didn't really get challenged either.

Are you suggesting they lied about resting Parfitt? You're the first person that I've read to suggest that.

If he was injured late, why not say so, as they generally do? What have they got to hide?

AFL player ratings don't group players according to where they play. Surely you'd agree that 12 disposals for a midfielder isn't great, although it seems Guthrie's minutes played were down this week.

 

[Landgraft]

Are you suggesting they lied about resting Parfitt? You're the first person that I've read to suggest that.

If he was injured late, why not say so, as they generally do? What have they got to hide?

AFL player ratings don't group players according to where they play. Surely you'd agree that 12 disposals for a midfielder isn't great, although it seems Guthrie's minutes played were down this week.

Maybe he wasn't injured, but rested so soon after the bye? He was either dropped or sore, at a minimum.

And if we were drilling down on mids then Duncan would definitely be the one I'd look at. Hope the club puts him through remedial handballing during the week.

 

[Micksy]

Never thought I'd see the term "goat" applied to Cam Guthrie, but here we are.

 

[feelinfeline]

Maybe he wasn't injured, but rested so soon after the bye? He was either dropped or sore, at a minimum.

And if we were drilling down on mids then Duncan would definitely be the one I'd look at. Hope the club puts him through remedial handballing during the week.

My guess is they made a late decision to include Rohan and had to leave someone out in his place. Perhaps it's true, as some have suggested, that Rohan's daughter was ill and they weren't sure whether he would be able to play. When he said yes, someone had to go and it was Parfitt. So, yes, you could call that 'dropped'.

Parfitt hasn't been great, but to me not bad enough to be dropped. His pressure is excellent but not always his disposal, and sometimes he tries to do too much and gets caught. I think they wanted to give Fogarty another game so they decided that Parfitt could sit out a week, even though we had a bye two weeks ago.

Duncan's disposal was terrible last night and his form in pressure games (including the final last year) is a worry. But he's had a great year until the last few weeks (had been talked about as an All-Australian candidate). And at least he got a bit of the ball.

 

[Larry Donohue]

I didn't think Guthrie could reach a new level of lame, I was wrong. Wow! His average meters gained for the season is just as horrendous. Completely useless as a mid, inside and out.

How, just HOW can a club carry a player with such a negative mindset? A player so completely out of the game, unwilling to compete at anywhere near the level required? Guthrie is just treading water, has been for so long now. What does the club do? Benches him, his TOG% is dropping all the time.

This is pathetic from the club. A 150 game senior player is not being challenged to perform, clearly. The club calls him a 'quite achiever', cause that's all they can say. Nothing else adds up. The club needs to grow a pair and get serious about the opportunity this team has to win a premiership in 2019, as others have said, we're not winning dick with any reliance on Guthrie in the middle. Cut the BS. He's completely inconsequential to anything going on out there.

Of the players not in the team this week, these are the midfielders (or makeshift midfielders) I'd have in before Guthrie every week this year
Constable
Parfitt
Menegola
Cockatoo on one leg
Narkle
Scott Selwood
Simpson
Jones
Any player that will give of themselves for 100 minutes each week
Sick to death of his lack of effort (especially when complete effort is required)
Am not quite sure how so many on this site cannot see his lack of effort, fear of pain, mistake riddled games.
Will not win a final again this year if we are relying on Cam to put in when it counts
Truly hope Cockatoo gets up for finals and Menegola is right in the next couple of weeks

Team to win finals

Stewart Blicavs O'Connor
Kolo Taylor Henry
Duncan Kelly Selwood
Cockatoo Hawkins Dahlhaus
Ablett Ratagolea Menegola
Stanley Dangerfield Parfitt
Atkins Clark Miers Tuohy/Bews
EM Tuohy/Bews Fogarty S.Selwood Constable
Not considered Guthrie, Parsons, Fort
Those who could be considered positionally if required Henderson Buzza, Smith, Narkle,
Simpson, Zuthrie Jones I'm not sure where they fit

 

[Vdubs]

Maybe he wasn't injured, but rested so soon after the bye? He was either dropped or sore, at a minimum.

And if we were drilling down on mids then Duncan would definitely be the one I'd look at. Hope the club puts him through remedial handballing during the week.

DNP VFL. End of issue?

 

[Landgraft]

DNP VFL. End of issue?

He couldn't play VFL, he was still in the AFL squad when the game finished...

 

[Vdubs]

Of the players not in the team this week, these are the midfielders (or makeshift midfielders) I'd have in before Guthrie every week this year
Constable
Parfitt
Menegola
Cockatoo on one leg
Narkle
Scott Selwood
Simpson
Jones
Any player that will give of themselves for 100 minutes each week
Sick to death of his lack of effort (especially when complete effort is required)
Am not quite sure how so many on this site cannot see his lack of effort, fear of pain, mistake riddled games.
Will not win a final again this year if we are relying on Cam to put in when it counts
Truly hope Cockatoo gets up for finals and Menegola is right in the next couple of weeks

Team to win finals

Stewart Blicavs O'Connor
Kolo Taylor Henry
Duncan Kelly Selwood
Cockatoo Hawkins Dahlhaus
Ablett Ratagolea Menegola
Stanley Dangerfield Parfitt
Atkins Clark Miers Tuohy/Bews
EM Tuohy/Bews Fogarty S.Selwood Constable
Not considered Guthrie, Parsons, Fort
Those who could be considered positionally if required Henderson Buzza, Smith, Narkle,
Simpson, Zuthrie Jones I'm not sure where they fit

Cockatoo and Menegola are the BIG ????'s.

 

[Vdubs]

He couldn't play VFL, he was still in the AFL squad when the game finished...

He was named as rested, managed, why the conspiracy theory?

 

[Landgraft]

He was named as rested, managed, why the conspiracy theory?

It's not really a conspiracy theory to note that he was pretty clearly either dropped or (at a minimum) sore. Otherwise he would have played, and he only just had a week off. Didn't return anywhere near his better form either.

 

[Vdubs]

It's not really a conspiracy theory to note that he was pretty clearly either dropped or (at a minimum) sore. Otherwise he would have played, and he only just had a week off. Didn't return anywhere near his better form either.

He looked tired. That could be an injury- they're all carrying stuff now. We are in a decent position to manage many of our sore boys, whilst we own #1 or #2.

 

[Landgraft]

He looked tired. That could be an injury- they're all carrying stuff now. We are in a decent position to manage many of our sore boys, whilst we own #1 or #2.

And to tenuously tie it back to the threads main premise - Parfitt is infinitely more likely to end up in the VFL than Guthrie is.

Think he might actually end up playing there this week, but we'll see. And considering he's a big part of me signing up for BF in the first place it gives me no joy to think about him getting dropped like that...

 

[Warhorse]

Someone with zero possessions would have a better meters gained than guthrie

 

[Vdubs]

Someone with zero possessions would have a better meters gained than guthrie

How is that metres gained determined? Sounds impossible. Do you think he'll be dropped when CS reads about negative metres gained? Desperate..

 

[OddYears]

Someone with zero possessions would have a better meters gained than guthrie

Haha very good

 

[Cataholic]

How is that metres gained determined? Sounds impossible. Do you think he'll be dropped when CS reads about negative metres gained? Desperate..

Metres gained is the distance between taking the ball and disposing of it, with a 'gain' if it's in the direction of the goal square.

I think.

 

[Vdubs]

Metres gained is the distance between taking the ball and disposing of it, with a 'gain' if it's in the direction of the goal square.

I think.

What does the Guthrie situation really mean?
Would somebody be watching that game have any idea he ended up with that figure?
Could you even try to get that result?
I don't get it tbh.

 

[Cataholic]

What does the Guthrie situation really mean?
Would somebody be watching that game have any idea he ended up with that figure?
Could you even try to get that result?
I don't get it tbh.

I assume they have a number of statasticians collate the info??

In this instance, it means Guthrie's nett running result was 4 metres towards the opposition's goal square.

 

[Vdubs]

I assume they have a number of statasticians collate the info??

In this instance, it means Guthrie's nett running result was 4 metres towards the opposition's goal square.

Does it reflect that as a link player, he had to go backwards with many of his possessions?
If so, that is not necessarily damaging.

 

[Cataholic]

Does it reflect that as a link player, he had to go backwards with many of his possessions?
If so, that is not necessarily damaging.

It means the differential between him running forwards (+) and running backwards (-)........so yes, he ran backwards four metres more for the game than he did running forwards.

Now, it seems - to my casual observation over time - that this is indicative of his 'running pattern' as often as not. He takes the ball heading towards goal, but often turns sideways or backwards to pass it off. Just an impression.

 

[PatrickBateman]

It means the differential between him running forwards (+) and running backwards (-)........so yes, he ran backwards four metres more for the game than he did running forwards.

I think you'll find metres gained includes possession via kick and handball also (run and carry too).

So yes, this paints Guthrie in an even poorer light. His average metres gained is appalling too, the worst of all the mids by a stretch. I posted this a while back.

Does it reflect that as a link player, he had to go backwards with many of his possessions?

Is Guthrie a 'link player' is he? Even more reason for him to be gaining some positive ground, no? I thought his strength was running, carry, pace, etc? Stats say it's his weakness.

I'd go so far to say - No AFL player in the 10 or so years since metres gained has been measured has ever had 12 or more possessions and netted a negative result (maybe a forward, not a mid or defender). Cam, we salute you!