Analysis The Rebuild Of Essendon And North Melbourne And Their Future Prospects

[boncer34]

What rebuild have Essendon done?
That's a rhetorical question by the way, because they haven't done a rebuild.
All of they've done, is take their normal draft picks, which in recent years have been used to acquire players like Saad, Smith, Stringer and Shiel, combined them the picks they received for Saad, Daniher and Fantasia, and taken them to the draft instead of trading them. That's not a rebuild. That's standard list management.
They still rely heavily on their older players, and without looking at the actual numbers, I'd hazard a guess that they probably still have about 80% of the players that they recruited for their last flag tilt only a couple of year ago.
They went from 8th in 2019, to 13th in 2020 and now look like finishing around 8th-10th this year.
Dropping 5 spots on the ladder and taking your picks to the draft isn't a rebuild. It is pure fantasy to suggest otherwise.

Since our last final vs most recent game, ages at the time the game was played

Out: Ambrose (28), Bellchambers (30), Brown (29), Fantasia (24), Ham (20), Hooker (30), Hurley (29), Langford (22), McDonald-Tipungwuti McKenna (23), McKernan (29), Saad (25)

In: Clarke (22), Cutler (26), Draper (22), Durham (20), Guelfi (24), Hind (26), Perkins (19), Ridley (22), Smith (28), Stewart (27), Waterman (24), Wright (24)

Removed 6 blokes 28+ and in their place is 1 who every Essendon fan would say is borderline best 22.

In the wings we have Tippa, Cox, Jones and Langford as the 4 next immediate ins 3 of which <25.

But yeah, haven't put any youth into the side. It's all old guys.

 

[Halftimehero]

What rebuild have Essendon done?
That's a rhetorical question by the way, because they haven't done a rebuild.
All of they've done, is take their normal draft picks, which in recent years have been used to acquire players like Saad, Smith, Stringer and Shiel, combined them the picks they received for Saad, Daniher and Fantasia, and taken them to the draft instead of trading them. That's not a rebuild. That's standard list management.
They still rely heavily on their older players, and without looking at the actual numbers, I'd hazard a guess that they probably still have about 80% of the players that they recruited for their last flag tilt only a couple of year ago.
They went from 8th in 2019, to 13th in 2020 and now look like finishing around 8th-10th this year.
Dropping 5 spots on the ladder and taking your picks to the draft isn't a rebuild. It is pure fantasy to suggest otherwise.

Absolute nonsense we are reliant on our older players.

Our top 5 players this season in my opinion would be Merrett, Parish, Stringer, Ridley and Laverde, all bar one of them is 25 and under.

Shiel and Heppell have spent many games on the sidelines and Hooker is now out of the team, as is Tippa.

We’ve had 7 debutants, and our ruckman has played 20 matches.

To say we are reliant on older players is just lazy and an ill informed shot at trying to downplay the rise of Essendon in such a short period.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

OK I agree with that but LDU's potential isn't my point. I'm only mentioning age to compare the longevity of their respective careers. My point is that the original post I quoted doesn't really have any basis because I doubt Parish and Merrett fall off a cliff in 3 years, which is what needs to happen for North's midfield to be significantly better than Essendon's.

There's a reason why Parish is a brownlow contender and a likely AA starter.
I really rate Tarryn Thomas (even more than both Simpkin and LDU), but again that's guessing. Sometimes it works out (eg. no one would have had Parish as one of the best mids in the comp). Sometimes it doesn't.

Saying North's midfield will be significantly better than Essendon's in 3 years doesn't have any basis when you consider the age demographic of both sides. If Parish, Merrett and McGrath were 29, then I'd understand. But they're all at the beginning of their prime. Even Stringer will only be 30 in 3 years, which is still within his prime for his position.

I never said that Norths midfield will be better than Essendon's in 3 years. That must have been someone else.

 

[Yoda_]

It's funny that 90% of the time a rivalry between North and Essendon is brought up on this site, it is by Essendon fans denying it. Still gets brought up a hell of a lot by the Essendon players and Sheeds too.

But no, clearly no such thing exists from EFC's side.

Most don't credit the rivalry because we treat it like any other game.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

At the same age Merrett had won a B&F, named AA, finished 4th in the coaches votes and had seasons of 15 and 19 Brownlow votes.

You are correct that stats tell all kind of lies, they aren't even remotely close.

Would be a fair effort for Simpkin to do that in the worst team in the league.

 

[Ambrosia]

All of that is great and a positive sign, but again, nothing to do with a rebuild.
Great signs from the debutants and young kids, but development can stall. Players can get 2nd or 3rd year blues.
So they're basically just back to where they were two seasons ago, off the back of a few players having career years. Great if it's sustained, but jury is still out.

Disagree that replacing 9 best 22 players is nothing like a rebuild.

For sure Essendon hasn’t done any of the hard work yet as the jump from mid table to upper part of the ladder is a hard one but we’ve successfully transitioned key players into retirement and now are reliant on zero players without 4 years of footy left imo.

 

[Yoda_]

All of that is great and a positive sign, but again, nothing to do with a rebuild.
Great signs from the debutants and young kids, but development can stall. Players can get 2nd or 3rd year blues.
So they're basically just back to where they were two seasons ago, off the back of a few players having career years. Great if it's sustained, but jury is still out.

This is lazy, and blatant trolling.

All good to discredit players for stalling in there development but to seriously think (and could assume you would hope) a number of them don't come on, that's delusional territory.

After all, we fielded the youngest side of any 18 AFL clubs on the weekend (24 years, 0 months, GWS - 24 years, 7 months was second, Hawthorn 24 years, 10 months third).

On top of that, we still have a number of guys who improve that marginally on that average still to come back into the best 22 (Langford, Caldwell, Reid will be best 22 next year).

 

[boncer34]

Would be a fair effort for Simpkin to do that in the worst team in the league.

Merretts 19 came in 2016 for what it's worth.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

It's funny that 90% of the time a rivalry between North and Essendon is brought up on this site, it is by Essendon fans denying it. Still gets brought up a hell of a lot by the Essendon players and Sheeds too.

But no, clearly no such thing exists from EFC's side.

And yes, we did win some obscene percentage of our games between the 2001 QF drubbing and the 2016 WADA suspensions, from memory it was 14-3 North's way in those years, including the 2014 EF comeback.

You fail to mention we have 4 x as many premierships as you do. So yeah, keep remembering the bits of history you want I guess.

And no , there is no rivalry here, Your club frankly doesn't deserve one with us. You are just like any other club.

 

[Handsome.B.Wonderful]

Most don't credit the rivalry because we treat it like any other game.

I guess I’m rehashing my previous post when I say…..what are you doing differently to prepare for other games? It’s amazing to me that you feel more attached to a rivalry because of a club win/loss vs a rival 50 years ago or because of a fight between Richie Van Den Berg and…..Adam McPhee?

Don’t get me wrong, I love playing Essendon but the reason is that I’ll see my neighbours and my old school mates at the game.

The thought that I’m in a frenzy all week and then steaming into a game in 2021 because “Shanky” Perkins disrespected our coaches wife at a game in 1951 is laughable to me.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Merretts 19 came in 2016 for what it's worth.

We'll have to see how Simpkin goes in those awards once the season is completed. Simpkin was 2nd in our B&F last season and is probably odds on to win it this year, not that I rate B&F's particularly highly in the context of comparing players throughout the league.

Out of the accolades you listed, the coaches votes is the most impressive. Would be a good effort for Simpkin to get near that this season.

 

[Petrify]

What rebuild have Essendon done?
That's a rhetorical question by the way, because they haven't done a rebuild.
All of they've done, is take their normal draft picks, which in recent years have been used to acquire players like Saad, Smith, Stringer and Shiel, combined them the picks they received for Saad, Daniher and Fantasia, and taken them to the draft instead of trading them. That's not a rebuild. That's standard list management.
They still rely heavily on their older players, and without looking at the actual numbers, I'd hazard a guess that they probably still have about 80% of the players that they recruited for their last flag tilt only a couple of year ago.
They went from 8th in 2019, to 13th in 2020 and now look like finishing around 8th-10th this year.
Dropping 5 spots on the ladder and taking your picks to the draft isn't a rebuild. It is pure fantasy to suggest otherwise.

Lmfao saying that Essendon heavily rely on their older players just tells me you don't watch Essendon at all.

Also as for a rebuild: This year we have literally changed our entire backline makeup except Ridley, we have changed our entire forward line makeup except for Stringer and Tippa. Our midfield is similar except we now have Parish playing there properly and Draper.

Ignoring all the players we lost at the end of the year - if changing the way an entire team looks and operates, and playing the second youngest team for almost the entire year (behind Gold Coast) isn't a rebuild, what the **** is?

Although I don't know why I'm listening to a Carlton supporter talking about rebuilds when you haven't successfully done one despite "bottoming out" like 5 times

 

[Bojan KantKick]

You fail to mention we have 4 x as many premierships as you do. So yeah, keep remembering the bits of history you want I guess.

And no , there is no rivalry here, Your club frankly doesn't deserve one with us. You are just like any other club.

You'd be lucky to have seen 4 of them champ. If you want to compare black and white TV premierships I'm sure there is a Carlton or Collingwood thread for you to troll. This thread is about future prospects.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Lmfao saying that Essendon heavily rely on their older players just tells me you don't watch Essendon at all.

Also as for a rebuild: This year we have literally changed our entire backline makeup except Ridley, we have changed our entire forward line makeup except for Stringer and Tippa. Our midfield is similar except we now have Parish playing there properly and Draper.

Ignoring all the players we lost at the end of the year - if changing the way an entire team looks and operates, and playing the second youngest team for almost the entire year (behind Gold Coast) isn't a rebuild, what the fu** is?

Although I don't know why I'm listening to a Carlton supporter talking about rebuilds when you haven't successfully done one despite "bottoming out" like 5 times

This

 

[blitzer]

Its fair to argue that Essendon haven't done a rebuild. In hindsight you'd probably call it a refresh rather than rebuild. It happens sometimes.
Port Adelaide was similar when it looked like they were heading down the ladder after being mid level for a while and they ended up picking up Butters, Rozee and Duursma in the one draft. But it wasn't just those players that improved the side. Their senior players improved as well. Essendon is more similar to that because guys like Parish, Laverde, Langford, Redman even Heppell (now over his injuries) are just playing much better footy than they were previously. Plus a few recruits like Hind and Wright have been very handy. Essendon's best players may end up including Cox, Perkins and Jones but we aren't relying on them to get wins in the next year or two.

North obviously committed to a full rebuild by getting rid of pretty much all their senior players outside of Cunnington, Ziebell, Hall and Tarrant (just going off memory could have missed some players). There's no way for North's road to success not to be a long one because they don't have a senior core to support a strong finals push right now.

 

[Yoda_]

I guess I’m rehashing my previous post when I say…..what are you doing differently to prepare for other games? It’s amazing to me that you feel more attached to a rivalry because of a club win/loss vs a rival 50 years ago or because of a fight between Richie Van Den Berg and…..Adam McPhee?

Don’t get me wrong, I love playing Essendon but the reason is that I’ll see my neighbours and my old school mates at the game.

The thought that I’m in a frenzy all week and then steaming into a game in 2021 because “Shanky” Perkins disrespected our coaches wife at a game in 1951 is laughable to me.

what are you on about. I don't really care about winning or losing against North Melbourne. They are just another football club.

When our teams meet, your board goes into a meltdown, a frenzy if you wish. I don't know why but it happens, every. single. time.

 

[Milanista28]

Rebuild refresh it doesn't matter, we got better in 2021 and we want to get better in 2022.

 

[Ambrosia]

Discussion about the legitimacy of a rivalry is a egregious waste of time, which is saying something as posting on a footy forum isn’t exactly a constructive use of time to begin with.

West Coast is one of the teams I love to beat most and I view them as a bitter rival to Essendon do the fact many Eagles and Essendon fans don’t share my opinion devalue it anyway or reduce my enjoyment from beating those guys at all?

 

[Halftimehero]

Apart from giving it to a couple of the biggest **** wits on Bigfooty, I couldn’t care any more or any less about beating North Melbourne than any other team.

 

[Bjchan13]

The term 'rebuild' has never really made sense to me. It can't be properly defined in a list management sense. There is no start and finish date. Carlton claiming to start a rebuild in 2015 is the perfect example of this. Id say every club is constantly 'managing' their list year on year by default. Every club makes changes to the playing list every single year. Sometimes through trading, sometimes through drafting. The day a club delists all 44 players in one off season and replaces them with new players i think we can call it a rebuild.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

You'd be lucky to have seen 4 of them champ. If you want to compare black and white TV premierships I'm sure there is a Carlton or Collingwood thread for you to troll. This thread is about future prospects.

oh so now its about future, when history doesn't suit you?, you decided to delve into it before I did.

l

o

l

guess what, your future looks about as shit as your past.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

oh so now its about future, when history doesn't suit you?, you decided to delve into it before I did.

l

o

l

guess what, your future looks about as sh*t as your past.

Check the thread title champ. I haven't discussed the history of the two clubs nor do I think it is particularly relevant to the two clubs future prospects.

 

[Psicosis]

oh so now its about future, when history doesn't suit you?, you decided to delve into it before I did.

l

o

l

guess what, your future looks about as sh*t as your past.

Ive seen some pathetic content on this forum, but comparing past premierships (when said poster likely wasn’t alive for most of them), is right up there.

Straight in the bin.

 

[B4Bear]

If North had won their last seven against (arguably) their biggest rival, it would be referenced in virtually every single thread on this website.

We’ve hardly been world beaters ourselves in that time period mentioned in my original post but the facts are there. Apart from the Tippa winner in the final minute (in a close contest), it’s been dismal.

Bordering on Dean (sorry, Dani) Laidley’s record against Sheedy territory.

Ooh what a ****ing hero you are.
Bet you were the kid who pulled the wings off flys to make them a walk.

 

[Macca18]

Ooh what a ******* hero you are.
Bet you were the kid who pulled the wings off flys to make them a walk.

The name of North's coach during that period was Dean Laidley. It's now Dani Laidley.

What's the issue?