List Mgmt. Trade and F/A - Part 3

[jonbe54]

Do you think those frank conversations were being had with him in 20 & 21? Also do you think the previous coaching group knew how to best utilise him? My feel is that they were leaving him to his own devices too much essentially because he’d delivered on his potential and not helping to develop the next layer (leadership and stoppage craft). This isn’t to pot Buckley and co, but rather to highlight how McRae and co can help him improve.

FWIW I have no idea on the next in line for captaincy. I’ve always promoted Crisp because he seems to engage with everyone on the list, is very giving (look at him hosting Poulter and Briskey), is clearly an important member of the best 22 and is reliable in the sense that he fronts up every week. I also can’t see either of Grundy or Moore coming into the captaincy from outside the current leadership group. It’s odds on to be Adams, but he just strikes me as a budget Selwood and his body seems too fragile. A left field option Pendles stays on and Quaynor comes into the leadership group along with Moore and Grundy with the next captain to come from that group in 2023?

This McRae connection is where my hopes for him centre -

I remember a raw kid in his first handful of games about to come off the bench as Mumford was coming off the ground . . . Mumford tried to monster him and without so much as a blink Grundy put him flat on his Rssss.

What happened to that kid????

He had it all and then some at the beginning, but the player that remains - not so much in stats, but in attitude - is barely a shell of the young behemoth on the verge of greatness.

Sometimes we here IT from everyone for years . . . but for some they need to hear it from the right person before it sinks in.

Fingers crossed Fly is the right person for Grundy.

 

[snagbreac]

To quote Gaben from a few pages back when that troll referenced an “el cheapo” option. Tardrew is an el crappo option! I love his effort at that level, but f’ed if I know how he won the B&F ahead of Wilson and he’d make Madgen look a star.

Yeah, right, thanks for the troll praise. Thing about BF is that people here don't like it if you go against the general consensus. Like, sure I've suggested some strange stuff but ignorance and arrogance got Collingwood in its mess. I'm not asking you to agree with me but I'm not trying to troll. Anything I post is because I think it would be good to discuss or think we should. Some of you should also be careful about how you treat players like Madgen, Sier and Cox. Those guys aren't top five best and fairest finishers but they're trying their best and constant criticism from their own fans isn't doing their mental health any favours.

 

[Sea fog]

Moore as captain I'm ambivalent about as he strikes me as more a private than group person.

Grundy is another matter, as a player he has been underperforming for 2 seasons and the coaching group really need to get it through his head that he needs to invest in the group and that football isn't just something he will do until he wants to move on.

Yep I agree with these points, Moore looks to be someone not connected with the group and likewise Grundy and Grundy at times on the field seems disconnected with his players as well if you take into account the way he and the mids do not link.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

The average AFL wage is in the vicinity of $350k and both are moving for opportunity so it’s unlikely that their base will be anything less than $300k pa, IMO.

FWIW I hope you’re in the ball park because if we’re attracting guys that are going to come in and get senior minutes at that price that’s the biggest win the clubs ever had at the trade table. Massive value!

As you would be aware, averages are created by the outliers, and players like Buddy, Jezza Cameron and Treloar would push the average up.

I think the median would be comfortably lower than the average, so it’s entirely possible we’re putting up $250-$300 pa for these guys.

 

[unplugged]

Everyone gets so defensive whenever someone suggests trading Sidebottom.

Yes he has played some good footy in 2018/2019, but he dogged the boys in 2020 and has been a bit of a yo-yo this year.

If the Suns came and offered to trade us pick 19 or Fiorini/Sharp and/or offered to take his whole wage (unlikely) you'd be silly not to look at it.

We need to make some shrewd moves, otherwise if our draftees don't come on quickly we'll be treading water down the bottom for a few years yet.

 

[jonbe54]

Yep I agree with these points, Moore looks to be someone not connected with the group and likewise Grundy and Grundy at times on the field seems disconnected with his players as well if you take into account the way he and the mids do not link.

Lots of hard work for the coaching group ahead I foresee.

 

[snagbreac]

As you would be aware, averages are created by the outliers, and players like Buddy, Jezza Cameron and Treloar would push the average up.

I think the median would be comfortably lower than the average, so it’s entirely possible we’re putting up $250-$300 pa for these guys.

This is why I wish the AFL stats omitted those outliers. Isn't a new draftee only on about 100k, less if they're a rookie?

 

[manicpie]

This is why I wish the AFL stats omitted those outliers. Isn't a new draftee only on about 100k, less if they're a rookie?

Base salary for a rookie is $80k, they can earn more than that though through match payments etc

 

[Piestration]

This is the funniest post i’ve ever read

I don't find it funny because there is some truth to it.

 

[well left]

Everyone gets so defensive whenever someone suggests trading Sidebottom.

Yes he has played some good footy in 2018/2019, but he dogged the boys in 2020 and has been a bit of a yo-yo this year.

If the Suns came and offered to trade us pick 19 or Fiorini/Sharp and/or offered to take his whole wage (unlikely) you'd be silly not to look at it.

We need to make some shrewd moves, otherwise if our draftees don't come on quickly we'll be treading water down the bottom for a few years yet.

I’ve been largely against trading Sidey but did my revised best 22 for next year in another thread and I now think if he’s open to it then it should be considered.

I included Daicos, Lipinski, Stengle and Kreuger in that 22 but didn’t have spots for Poulter, McInnes, Bianco or WHE.

With Crisp, Adams, Maynard, Moore, DeGoey and Grundy still being supported by Pendles, Howe, Rough and Elliott we still have plenty of experience.

Im more open to it than I thought I would be. Who takes him though is the catch? Off the top of my head Suns could use experience, Port might think they are one good mid away and Essendon might want some experience to take the next step.


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[Piestration]

I'm so much more depressed at the state of our list - or at least our 2021 performance - after seeing Sidebottom come 5th in the B&F.

If he wasn't such a "heart and soul" player I'd be trying to use him in a trade to get a ~25 year old inside mid from elsewhere...

Haven't worked out who just yet though...

Sidebottom is coming to the end of his career and tbh should be getting pushed out of the top 5 with younger hungrier team mates. More disapointing is Grundy who is in his prime and played most of the games this year.

 

[Everybody Panic]

Everyone gets so defensive whenever someone suggests trading Sidebottom.

Yes he has played some good footy in 2018/2019, but he dogged the boys in 2020 and has been a bit of a yo-yo this year.

If the Suns came and offered to trade us pick 19 or Fiorini/Sharp and/or offered to take his whole wage (unlikely) you'd be silly not to look at it.

We need to make some shrewd moves, otherwise if our draftees don't come on quickly we'll be treading water down the bottom for a few years yet.

He has played great to elite footy from 2010 to 2019, not just 2 years. How exactly did he "dog the boys" last year?

 

[ClaytonM]

Steele hasn’t been all for one and one for all for some time. Clubs in contention pay overs for players like him, we could get a second round pick which can equate to a lot!

Clarkson did it at hawthorn, if it’s good for him it’s good for us.

‘None of the Hodge, Lewis and Mitchell trades included a second round pick or even close to it, and all have better credentials than Sidey.

You would be lucky to get anything inside 50 for him unless a club came for him which I doubt will happen. You are dreaming if you think proactively trading out Sidey gets you anything but junk change.

 

[Silky23]

He has played great to elite footy from 2010 to 2019, not just 2 years. How exactly did he "dog the boys" last year?

Broke lockdown rules and missed a month of football? Where have you been?

 

[Quicky]

Yep said exactly the same thing myself, if Van Rooyen or Bazzo are there by the time the Suns pick 22 (will be 24-25 after bid matches) comes around then we pull the trigger now with a draft day trade for our future 2nd and get them in.

Key forwards or key backs?

 

[ClaytonM]

Everyone gets so defensive whenever someone suggests trading Sidebottom.

Yes he has played some good footy in 2018/2019, but he dogged the boys in 2020 and has been a bit of a yo-yo this year.

If the Suns came and offered to trade us pick 19 or Fiorini/Sharp and/or offered to take his whole wage (unlikely) you'd be silly not to look at it.

We need to make some shrewd moves, otherwise if our draftees don't come on quickly we'll be treading water down the bottom for a few years yet.

There is a difference between trading him when a club comes asking and shopping him around as an old used car.

The first is shrewd, the second stupid.

 

[Quicky]

I’ve been largely against trading Sidey but did my revised best 22 for next year in another thread and I now think if he’s open to it then it should be considered.

I included Daicos, Lipinski, Stengle and Kreuger in that 22 but didn’t have spots for Poulter, McInnes, Bianco or WHE.

With Crisp, Adams, Maynard, Moore, DeGoey and Grundy still being supported by Pendles, Howe, Rough and Elliott we still have plenty of experience.

Im more open to it than I thought I would be. Who takes him though is the catch? Off the top of my head Suns could use experience, Port might think they are one good mid away and Essendon might want some experience to take the next step.


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I feel like we'd be hearing some rumours about it, if it were realistically on the cards.

 

[partypie]

Key forwards or key backs?

I don't mind using our future second on a key back personally if that's the way say Van Rooyen ends up going, although both he and Bazzo have flashed some ability as a KPF as well.

 

[jonbe54]

There is a difference between trading him when a club comes asking and shopping him around as an old used car.

The first is shrewd, the second stupid.

Besides being stupid it's a sht way to treat a loyal servant and reinforces the bad impression of last year.

He may end his career in the magoos but if he wants it they will be our magoos.

 

[TradeDraft]

 

[Quicky]

I don't mind using our future second on a key back personally if that's the way say Van Rooyen ends up going, although both he and Bazzo have flashed some ability as a KPF as well.

Do you reckon they've got scope to make the back to forward switch like Naughton or Bruce have at AFL level?

 

[Jen2310]

Swans got a good deal there given they didn’t want to keep him anyway


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[HFF]

The compensation is a joke.
Second rounds for Chol and Hewett.....laughable

 

[LarryKinn]

Swans got a good deal there given they didn’t want to keep him anyway


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wouldn't it be the same as Chol at Suns ? - Money + age

 

[Everybody Panic]

Broke lockdown rules and missed a month of football? Where have you been?

Didn't he do that having a drink with a player who had just got injured? Guarantee the players would be laughing about it. You never had a mate have an embarrassing stuff up? If he wants to go, all for it, but you don't build culture by pushing out your club legends.