Rumour Bluemour Discussion XXXV - 'Loopy' Season has begun

[The Old Dark Navy's]

You'd think he'll be fine. I'd be getting plenty of assessments made though. Not an injury to make presumptions with.

I don't think there are any assumptions being made here. Studies have been done. The science is there.

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

Walsh is not a better player than Petracca, and he'd tell you that himself if you asked.



He would comfortably be a top 5 player at Carlton.

He's a Norm Smith medalist, 4 x AA, 2 times BnF player, and 1 x leading goalscorer at the Dees.

He'd be our second-best player after Cripps. And that's no diss to Curnow or Weitering.

Do people watch Melbourne games at all? He's an out and out gun. Comparing him to Walsh is blue tinted goggles at their finest.

I still think Paddy McCartin is better.

There. I said it.

 

[Malifice]

It would increase the odds of blowing up our premiership window and setting us back another couple of decades

Christian Petracca is a better player than Harry McKay.

Ask any neutral. Google any 'top 50 players in the AFL' list.

I love Harry, but if Im picking a side as a neutral, and can only have one of them, Im taking Petracca.

Especially if I already have Curnow and Cripps in the side.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

That’s a big call…

Go big or go home Doc!

 

[BringFevBack2021]

Sydney comfortably won the minor premiership this year, with Joel Amartey kicking a total of 39 goals.

I couldn't even tell you who the Pies KPF even is, and they won the flag last year.

Virtually every premier for the past 20+ years has had a powerful goal kicking mid/ HFF.

Bont, Trac, Daicos, Judd, Dusty, Danger etc

All of the above either won the Norm Smith (3 times for Dusty), or were runners up in the voting.

Yeah exactly, obviously you need someone to make a contest but you don’t necessarily need two Coleman medalists down there right?

 

[Beyond Blue]

Absolutely hate this Petracca chat. Ruinous for two clubs. Would be the most Carlton-branded mistake since we knifed Ratts for Mick Madhouse.

Agreed. I’d almost say it’s a real test of the clubs resolve to see if it is still plagued with the impulses of the past or if it has grown up and decided to be a bit more sensible.

 

[Dramoth]

That's not bitter, he was honest and relayed two lessons learned....the professional suicide was about cutting the list so deeply

I would have said professional suicide was keeping Barker as a coach.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I still think Paddy McCartin is better.

There. I said it.

I watched that draft in person. Paddy knew he wasn't the best player in it. He still took the 10k though. Greedy bastard.

 

[Sam The Doc]

Christian Petracca is a better player than Harry McKay.

Ask any neutral. Google any 'top 50 players in the AFL' list.

I love Harry, but if Im picking a side as a neutral, and can only have one of them, Im taking Petracca.

Especially if I already have Curnow and Cripps in the side.

Agreed if we are talking coaching a fantasy footy team, hell of a lot more to consider within the club than who’s better overall in the league

 

[Stamos]

Christian Petracca is a better player than Harry McKay.

Ask any neutral. Google any 'top 50 players in the AFL' list.

I love Harry, but if Im picking a side as a neutral, and can only have one of them, Im taking Petracca.

Especially if I already have Curnow and Cripps in the side.

Leaving aside Petracca being 2 years older and suffering a traumatic injury that he has yet to recover from, and playing a position that is much easier to find a gun, they’re not kids lined up against the wall.
Or footy cards.

You’re talking about turfing out a player who has committed to the club till 2030, and taken less money to do so.
That’s not the path to success.

Sure the Filth did it with Grundy.
But, he was a ruckman, not a forward. And they overpaid, he didn’t take unders.

 

[Sam The Doc]

Go big or go home Doc!

We’ve made some big shithouse calls over the past 20 years. We’ve well and truly gone home alright

 

[JustOneTime]

If we lose a gun forward, then we still have one, plus Kemp, plus Moir. Fairly dynamic and quick forward line I think. Add.Jack Silvagni to the group as well. Plus O'Keeffe looks to have the stuff to be a genuine ruck/forward.

We have two successful forwards because they are foils for each other. Charlie has started well previously on his own but got ground down when continuing on his own. And let's not forget Mckay allows us to play 1 ruck and have more speed/run in games.

It destroy clubs integrity too if they even considered it.

Petracca is pointless based on roles we need to fill. We fill one hole and open another.

We need to find a way to do the Judd effect. Get an elite layer in and everyone drops a level in terms of opponent. We gain over 4/5 levels in that way.

So, with my realistic hat on, the biggest improvement Carlton can get is by adding a second key defender. This profits 2-3 other positions. It fixes the lockdown role and helps Weitering become more of a Rance. It allows Kemp to play fwd third tall or 4th tall back.

Kemp would be potentially very successful if opposition defenders committed extra people to Mckay and Charlie contests ...why? Because Kemps one ELITE trait is being left to have a free run and jump/mark.

Mcgovern is our designated interceptor and version of Lever. But in this second half of the year he hasnt done any real intercepting. Enter Haynes who is a current diet coke version of Stewart but will be leagues better than McGovern. Leaves Mcgovern to focus on his opponent and metres gained kicking.

The roll on effect of these is much more realistic than Petracca.

 

[Dramoth]

How is Ryan better than Cowan?
Cowan is a significantly ahead of Ryan, be surprised if we pursue him.

Moo with another preseason will be one of our best defenders next year. I expect to see Doc putting a lot of mentoring hours into his development to become a leader off the half back line. Get in Aleer to play centre half back and our defence woudl be humming

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

I watched that draft in person. Paddy knew he wasn't the best player in it. He still took the 10k though. Greedy bastard.

Agree!

I was waiting for Kanye to jump on stage and interrupt him.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Ours are great.

Jesse has been great this year, as a 29 year old. Let’s see if he can do it consistently.

Hogan does have a higher goal average than Harry. I think we are swayed by Hogan's rough time at Freo a bit there.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Oh without even a second thought.

I get the fan base attached to players, especially someone like Harry who’s overcome mental demons to reach the level he has this season.

but you can’t tell me a player like Trac isn’t more of a game changer than H.

He’s an elite midfielder who kicked 13.12 in 13 games in a down year…

he kicked 4 against us, so 9 goals in 12 games....

 

[AT97]

Same Here. And Sam McClure, a 'supposed' Carlton Supporter (any relation to Mark?) , he has a chance to tone it down and keep control of the narrative here, but it seems he's more interested in being the No.1 newsbreaker and burning the club along the way. https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl...lock-his-potential-trade-20240826-p5k5e6.html

Try he article says that there was friction with some of his team mates. Can anyone tell me what the issues are and why teams mates are annoyed with him?

 

[Dramoth]

if we got pick 26 for an injury prone player like Martin we should take it and run like hell….

View attachment 2088773

If the rumour of Freo chasing Owies, I reckon Owies and Martin for pick 26 and their future 3rd rounder.

 

[Opium]

We'd want to be very very confident on TDK signing long term before ever entertaining a trade involving Harry.

Tracc is a superstar, but we already struggle to play all our mids when they are all fit.

It doesn't help address any of our key areas of concern, it creates a new one though. It is also +200k to our already bulging salary cap, and its very likely that we'd have to give up a bit more than just Harry.

Also, unless Harry has actually expressed a desire to leave, pushing out a well liked, contracted player, that is a key member of the 2015 premiership pact core could be diabolical for culture.

Well said and I agree

 

[Sam The Doc]

If the rumour of Freo chasing Owies, I reckon Owies and Martin for pick 26 and their future 3rd rounder.

Martin.. would we even get anything anymore…

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

We have two successful forwards because they are foils for each other. Charlie has started well previously on his own but got ground down when continuing on his own. And let's not forget Mckay allows us to play 1 ruck and have more speed/run in games.

It destroy clubs integrity too if they even considered it.

Petracca is pointless based on roles we need to fill. We fill one hole and open another.

We need to find a way to do the Judd effect. Get an elite layer in and everyone drops a level in terms of opponent. We gain over 4/5 levels in that way.

So, with my realistic hat on, the biggest improvement Carlton can get is by adding a second key defender. This profits 2-3 other positions. It fixes the lockdown role and helps Weitering become more of a Rance. It allows Kemp to play fwd third tall or 4th tall back.

Kemp would be potentially very successful if opposition defenders committed extra people to Mckay and Charlie contests ...why? Because Kemps one ELITE trait is being left to have a free run and jump/mark.

Mcgovern is our designated interceptor and version of Lever. But in this second half of the year he hasnt done any real intercepting. Enter Haynes who is a current diet coke version of Stewart but will be leagues better than McGovern. Leaves Mcgovern to focus on his opponent and metres gained kicking.

The roll on effect of these is much more realistic than Petracca.

This doesn't fix the glaring issue we have in our midfield, especially at centre bounces.

Up until fairly recently, Harry and Charlie kept tripping over each other. They've only just learned to spread. You are talking like Charlie would be the only forward without Harry. We can provide other options.

Kemp isn't going to be trying to leap over Harry or Charlie. He won't be allowed to. As third forward, he'd have to lead wide like JSOS and often go unrewarded.

 

[BlueTongue]

Christian Petracca is a better player than Harry McKay.

Ask any neutral. Google any 'top 50 players in the AFL' list.

I love Harry, but if Im picking a side as a neutral, and can only have one of them, Im taking Petracca.

Especially if I already have Curnow and Cripps in the side.

Trac leading up to his injury was IMHO better than anyone in our side, even Crippa.
However, that doesn't mean we need him. It's about team balance. We don't need another Mid/Forward as much as we need a KPD. We get Trac, theres no $$ for a KPD.
I'm not against getting Trac, I just don't think trading McKay to get him would be good for the team or club.
Besides, who says Handing Harry over for Trac is a must.
If we said 'No' and sat back, eventually, Melbourne are going to have to do a deal of some sort to get him out of there, because keeping him there against his will, and against the other players wishes, would not be a good thing for them.

 

[Malifice]

Yeah exactly, obviously you need someone to make a contest but you don’t necessarily need two Coleman medalists down there right?

I get Curnow is a risk (with his knee).

The thing is, Petracca contributes the same score (goals + assists) as Harry does, and as we've seen over the past quarter of a century of Grand Finals, Key Forwards don't win flags (or Norm Smiths), powerful goal kicking mids/ HFF do.

As a sport we overvalue KPF's. You want a marking target, but when that's all you have it becomes all too easy for oppo clubs to predict who you're kicking to.

It's why we've actually looked better in recent weeks up forward without Curnow and McKay. We drastically reduced the times we bombed it in hoping one of them would mark it.

We're currently over reliant on the pair, and it makes it easy to defend against us.

It wont happen, but I'd do the trade if it was an option.

 

[AT97]

If Petracca was to come and harry was to stay and I’d suggest we would kiss TDK goodbye as there would be much left for his payday.

 

[SolGoodman]

he kicked 4 against us, so 9 goals in 12 games....

5*

You could look at it like that, or you could see it as he almost single handily got his team over the line against a side that was in decent form at the time.

There’s no underselling that he’s one of the few genuine superstars of the comp.