List Mgmt. 2016 Free Agency/Trades/Draft thread Part 2

[dylan123]

At the moment, Cameron is mostly forward pressure. I'd be curious to see if someone can bring that, and more scoring and game involvement.

Milera? Menzel?

Do feel that Cameron would really want to step it up next season as he really can't stay active in games long enough at the moment.

Still living off potential which is fine in his second season where he's played a lot of games but as of next year, the pass mark has to rise otherwise he's at risk of being nothing more than a player that just applies a lot of pressure but little else which isn't enough.

 

[Vhaluus]

We are playing Cameron in the wrong position. We're trying to force him into the forward line because without him we have no tackle pressure in there.

Throw him on a flank, either in defense or the midfield and watch him tear a game up.

Rest of our forward line needs to work harder defensively to compensate.

 

[Mego Red]

We are playing Cameron in the wrong position. We're trying to force him into the forward line because without him we have no tackle pressure in there.

Throw him on a flank, either in defense or the midfield and watch him tear a game up.

Rest of our forward line needs to work harder defensively to compensate.

Hmmm. Don't see where the position is for him if defense or midfield and I worry about his disposal under pressure.

Maybe replaces Brown?

 

[Bicks]

Any trade chances on these lists??

One thing Bernie is better at than Pick 23...

http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne.../who-led-the-league-in-turnovers-this-season/

Dustin Martin could well make a charge for the Brownlow Medal.


But one thing might be holding him back.

For he leads the league in turnovers this season.

It might not be the biggest surprise, seeing as he sits second in the league for kicks and plays in a side that has often struggled to move the ball.

But it's not the most flattering fact either.

Who leads the league in turnovers?
1. Dustin Martin (Richmond) - 141
2. Jasper Pittard (Port Adelaide) - 136
3. Stephen Hill (Fremantle) - 128
4. Lachie Neale (Fremantle) - 123
5. Bernie Vince (Melbourne) - 122
6. Jake Lloyd (Sydney) - 119
6. Jack Steven (St Kilda) - 119
6. Ollie Wines (Port Adelaide) - 119
9. Dan Hannebery (Sydney) - 117
10. Heath Shaw (GWS) - 114

Who leads for your club?
Adelaide: Brodie Smith - 103
Brisbane: Pearce Hanley - 97
Carlton: Sam Docherty - 110
Collingwood: Adam Treloar - 97
Essendon: Zach Merrett - 103
Fremantle: Stephen Hill - 128
Geelong: Patrick Dangerfield - 108
Gold Coast: Aaron Hall - 94
GWS: Heath Shaw - 114
Hawthorn: Jordan Lewis - 97
Melbourne: Bernie Vince - 122
North Melbourne: Jack Ziebell - 99
Port Adelaide: Jasper Pittard - 136
Richmond: Dustin Martin - 141
St Kilda: Jack Steven - 119
Sydney: Jake Lloyd - 119
West Coast: Andrew Gaff - 111
Western Bulldogs: Lachie Hunter - 112

 

[1990crow]

Any trade chances on these lists??

One thing Bernie is better at than Pick 23...

http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne.../who-led-the-league-in-turnovers-this-season/

Dustin Martin could well make a charge for the Brownlow Medal.


But one thing might be holding him back.

For he leads the league in turnovers this season.

It might not be the biggest surprise, seeing as he sits second in the league for kicks and plays in a side that has often struggled to move the ball.

But it's not the most flattering fact either.

Who leads the league in turnovers?
1. Dustin Martin (Richmond) - 141
2. Jasper Pittard (Port Adelaide) - 136
3. Stephen Hill (Fremantle) - 128
4. Lachie Neale (Fremantle) - 123
5. Bernie Vince (Melbourne) - 122
6. Jake Lloyd (Sydney) - 119
6. Jack Steven (St Kilda) - 119
6. Ollie Wines (Port Adelaide) - 119
9. Dan Hannebery (Sydney) - 117
10. Heath Shaw (GWS) - 114

Who leads for your club?
Adelaide: Brodie Smith - 103
Brisbane: Pearce Hanley - 97
Carlton: Sam Docherty - 110
Collingwood: Adam Treloar - 97
Essendon: Zach Merrett - 103
Fremantle: Stephen Hill - 128
Geelong: Patrick Dangerfield - 108
Gold Coast: Aaron Hall - 94
GWS: Heath Shaw - 114
Hawthorn: Jordan Lewis - 97
Melbourne: Bernie Vince - 122
North Melbourne: Jack Ziebell - 99
Port Adelaide: Jasper Pittard - 136
Richmond: Dustin Martin - 141
St Kilda: Jack Steven - 119
Sydney: Jake Lloyd - 119
West Coast: Andrew Gaff - 111
Western Bulldogs: Lachie Hunter - 112

Lol Clangerfield. Also Pittard..

 

[Sam_Malone]

We are playing Cameron in the wrong position. We're trying to force him into the forward line because without him we have no tackle pressure in there.

Throw him on a flank, either in defense or the midfield and watch him tear a game up.

Rest of our forward line needs to work harder defensively to compensate.

Even when you say something constructively and positive towards a player; you still end it with an insult towards them.

 

[SA_Stazza]

Cutler will certainly be quality. Paperone has had injury issues but has a lot of talent. Lester was third in their 2016 B&F after ten rounds. Skinner was a first round talent and AIS kid who had an injury in his draft year. Bell is a fantastic physical presence - A+ athlete - who needs to play within his limitations. Green and Bewick are underrated, because they've played in a shit system. Both would be legit pieces of successful teams.

But whatever - easy to disregard players who you haven't seen, I guess.

You seem to be forgetting we're debating who are currently (not hypothetically) C graders on their list..........

Cutler has talent, yes. I was hesitant to lump him into the C grader category given his previous performances (when he can get on the park - which isn't often). He is borderline B grade, which I've previously stated since my initial post. I would have him as a C+.

Paparone... When was his last decent year? 2014? Please. He's kicked 13 goals in the last four years playing predominantly as a forward... Hipwood has kicked almost as many (11) in just his first year in only 10 games....

Lester was 3rd in Brisbane's BnF after 10 rounds.. Just repeat that to yourself and have a long hard think about it...

Skinner was first round talent and AIS kid, yes, but is he anything more than a current C grader? No.

Bell is a fantastic physical presence.. You make me laugh! Even Jono Brown publicly berated him for not using his frame and physicality nearly enough. Looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane. He'd be a half decent player if he had even the slightest amount of determination and aggression. Is he anything more than a current C grader, absolutely not. There are plenty of A+ athletes running around in the system with mediocre pure football talent. It does not automatically elevate them into the upper echelons of league talent.

Bewick is almost 27, Green 24. Both are serial under-performers, not underrated. Neither have ever averaged more than 13 touches a game over their entire careers, and they've played more than 170 games between them. Combined, this year they mustered a grand total of 25 games in arguably the worst side in the comp... Neither are better than C grade, on any club's list.

I've seen plenty of their footy, I also lived in Brisbane. Never assume, it makes you look stupid.

 

[Roo Lives Again]

We are playing Cameron in the wrong position. We're trying to force him into the forward line because without him we have no tackle pressure in there.

Throw him on a flank, either in defense or the midfield and watch him tear a game up.

Rest of our forward line needs to work harder defensively to compensate.

He's in the forward line to play a defensive role and perform pressure acts to keep the ball in our forward line as well as being a speedy link man.

 

[lincsPJ]

So by a system that looks purely at numbers rather than the game itself?

Seems that way. You asked, I answered.

 

[kenny the crow]

I was thinking if we are not going to play CEY next year because we've signed Thompson for another year could we package up our 1st rounder and CEY and try and improve our draft position down to say 7-10?

 

[Vhaluus]

Even when you say something constructively and positive towards a player; you still end it with an insult towards them.

How is that insulting? If you're one of your leading tacklers in the forward line of course the rest of the forwards would have to step up to cover that gap.

It wouldn't be any more insulting than saying 'Well Jenkins is out this week so the rest of our forward line will have to step up and kick more goals to compensate' since he's our leading goal kicker.

 

[Sam_Malone]

How is that insulting? If you're one of your leading tacklers in the forward line of course the rest of the forwards would have to step up to cover that gap.

It wouldn't be any more insulting than saying 'Well Jenkins is out this week so the rest of our forward line will have to step up and kick more goals to compensate' since he's our leading goal kicker.

Only you would say that.

 

[Vhaluus]

Only you would say that.

Way to ignore 90% of my post and then avoid actually trying to justify the shit you spew as usual.

 

[Sam_Malone]

Way to ignore 90% of my post and then avoid actually trying to justify the shit you spew as usual.

You do know, he does more than just tackle as a small forward and he does hold his own in the forward line but you're jibe is implying he doesn't do anything but tackle.

 

[Vhaluus]

You do know, he does more than just tackle as a small forward and he does hold his own in the forward line but you're jibe is implying he doesn't do anything but tackle.

The entire reason people are criticizing him is because he ISN'T holding his own in the forward line in any area except tackling.

He has done some great things, but not consistently enough.

But you have such a hate boner from me that you apparently ignored that fact.

 

[Sam_Malone]

The entire reason people are criticizing him is because he ISN'T holding his own in the forward line in any area except tackling.

He has done some great things, but not consistently enough.

But you have such a hate boner from me that you apparently ignored that fact.

Ha ha ha someone has salty tears today.

 

[King Elvis]

Player like Laird, Cheney, Lever, Brown also rotate through HBF but they play nothing like wingman. Just because you might line up at HBF it doesn't mean your role is the same to every other HBF out there.

Laird does.

Cheney not so much.

Brown/Lever play as more classic HBFs; their defense is more important than the drive and attack they can provide - which is a bonus.

Laird is that good that he can do both.

Smith's priority is the offensive side of his game. He might line at at HBF frequently, but he plays as an attacking winger - which in today's modern game, is basically the same as the running QB HBF role.

What's Mackay's role at HBF?

 

[King Elvis]

You do know, he does more than just tackle as a small forward and he does hold his own in the forward line but you're jibe is implying he doesn't do anything but tackle.

I really don't see how you could get that from his post?

Any trade chances on these lists??

One thing Bernie is better at than Pick 23...

http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne.../who-led-the-league-in-turnovers-this-season/

Dustin Martin could well make a charge for the Brownlow Medal.


But one thing might be holding him back.

For he leads the league in turnovers this season.

It might not be the biggest surprise, seeing as he sits second in the league for kicks and plays in a side that has often struggled to move the ball.

But it's not the most flattering fact either.

Who leads the league in turnovers?
1. Dustin Martin (Richmond) - 141
2. Jasper Pittard (Port Adelaide) - 136
3. Stephen Hill (Fremantle) - 128
4. Lachie Neale (Fremantle) - 123
5. Bernie Vince (Melbourne) - 122
6. Jake Lloyd (Sydney) - 119
6. Jack Steven (St Kilda) - 119
6. Ollie Wines (Port Adelaide) - 119
9. Dan Hannebery (Sydney) - 117
10. Heath Shaw (GWS) - 114

Who leads for your club?
Adelaide: Brodie Smith - 103
Brisbane: Pearce Hanley - 97
Carlton: Sam Docherty - 110
Collingwood: Adam Treloar - 97
Essendon: Zach Merrett - 103
Fremantle: Stephen Hill - 128
Geelong: Patrick Dangerfield - 108
Gold Coast: Aaron Hall - 94
GWS: Heath Shaw - 114
Hawthorn: Jordan Lewis - 97
Melbourne: Bernie Vince - 122
North Melbourne: Jack Ziebell - 99
Port Adelaide: Jasper Pittard - 136
Richmond: Dustin Martin - 141
St Kilda: Jack Steven - 119
Sydney: Jake Lloyd - 119
West Coast: Andrew Gaff - 111
Western Bulldogs: Lachie Hunter - 112

Unsurprisingly, the players who;

1) Get a truckload of the footy.
2) Actually try and attack and be damaging with it.

Are the ones with the highest numbers there.

Easy way to avoid that list - don't get too much of it, or, if you do, take the easy option (frequently the sideways twenty meter kick which kills your sides attacking fluidity).

 

[spenze]

We are playing Cameron in the wrong position. We're trying to force him into the forward line because without him we have no tackle pressure in there.

Throw him on a flank, either in defense or the midfield and watch him tear a game up.

Rest of our forward line needs to work harder defensively to compensate.

Yep, we look to have got Menzel creating pressure acts and he is far more damaging than Charlie on the scoreboard. Charlie in the D50 could be a godsend, tough, fast, can tackle and break the lines coming out of defense.

If Menzel works hard up forward, then you have him, Betts and Gov chasing hard, which will leave Mr 5 years to learn how to pressure over the pre season, if he chased as hard as he does running back to the forward 50 he'd have 10 run down tackles a game

 

[Sam_Malone]

I really don't see how you could get that from his post?

Are you happy with how Charles Cameron is going?

 

[Bicks]

Skinner was first round talent and AIS kid, yes, but is he anything more than a current C grader? No.

Bit tough on Skinner there, did a knee in his final ytear of U18's and just getting over that and ready to go and does another ACL......I think we can safely say the jury is still well and truly out on him!

 

[King Elvis]

Are you happy with how Charles Cameron is going?

Not thrilled - needs to do more, but I'd keep the faith for another week, and, as I said, put him in positions where he's in the middle of the action.

 

[Bicks]

I really don't see how you could get that from his post?



Unsurprisingly, the players who;

1) Get a truckload of the footy.
2) Actually try and attack and be damaging with it.

Are the ones with the highest numbers there.

Easy way to avoid that list - don't get too much of it, or, if you do, take the easy option (frequently the sideways twenty meter kick which kills your sides attacking fluidity).

You don't think averaging around 7 a game is a little extreme?

 

[Deaneus!]

I would absolutely having a look at Hartlett.. Maybe a fresh start with us could do him good. He has been talked up by laidley after he left the power as the most naturally talented player on there list. For what ever reason he hasn't reached the level at Port hopefully he could with us. I would give our first and cey in exchange for Hartlett and a 2nd round pick back from the power

The first thing I would do is make him play a season in the SANFL and say his fitness isn't up to scratch

 

[Sam_Malone]

Not thrilled - needs to do more, but I'd keep the faith for another week, and, as I said, put him in positions where he's in the middle of the action.

Half forward / forward pocket can be a footballers graveyard.

Look ar Eddie against West Coast - basically didn't touch it for 3/4.

I wouldn't have minded if Pyke chucked him onto the ball against West Coast when things were not going to plan but IMO he does more than just tackle as was getting implied earlier and isn't a candidate to be dropped.