Analysis 2017 List Management Discussion

[TheKing101]

http://m.afl.com.au/news/2016-12-12/contract-crunch-giants-face-challenge-to-resign-fantastic-five

 

[BlueGum]

Exactly, he's just dismissing comments out of hand, as though calling someone a role player, or elite, etc. means they are forever typecast to that.

Or he really hates the theatre, who knows. Pretty sure the players are there to be entertainers, and the whole business model falls away without that.


Nothing I said disagrees with that.

Jimmie, hope you don't mind. I followed your CFC teamboard link. That's a nifty tool for selecting teams, playing around with structures etc.

Oh yeah, and I agree. Role players can be really valuable, freeing up the guns to be creative, ply their tricks etc. They are the stepladders for the elite.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Short answer: Maybe.


Long answer: Maybe. I guess we'll find out in 8-10 months.

 

[ferrisb]

When free agent: hells yeah
Before then: hells no

 

[Azul]

Was a diehard Carlton supporter growing up and is rumoured to be dating a relative of the silvagni's.

Nepotism.

 

[TheCoach16]

If Shiel and Fyfe wanted to come and play for us, I can't think of a single reason we'd say no...

 

[Soapy V]

So would I .
The kid is an absolute jet, and would love him at Carlton.

Imagine adding another 5-6 young guns next year plus Josh Kelly & Peter Wright. That's a rebuild

 

[TheKing101]

If Shiel and Fyfe wanted to come and play for us, I can't think of a single reason we'd say no...

The rebuild would be very much fast tracked if it were to occur. Just worried about trying to bring in senior players too early into the rebuild and getting stuck around the middle of the ladder again.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Jimmie, hope you don't mind. I followed your CFC teamboard link. That's a nifty tool for selecting teams, playing around with structures etc.

Oh yeah, and I agree. Role players can be really valuable, freeing up the guns to be creative, ply their tricks etc. They are the stepladders for the elite.

Good spot - and nice work, Jimmae, should be spruiking this one for selection threads next season!

Reckon we may be looking at something like this for Round 1:



SPS gets a run on the back of a professional first pre-season. The other draftees probably need a bit more time and some VFL exposure to earn their spot.
Backline settles in for the year, minus Byrne. Sheehan gets a crack if fit.
Midfield goes with the talented options, plus a vote of confidence for Cuningham and Phillips to stake their claim.
Young forward line, but no first year players. Rowe and Weiters to rotate on occasion.

 

[ferrisb]

Shiel would cost an arm and a leg to trade for (as would Fyfe if Freo matched).

Something along the lines of the Treloar deal. Out two first rounders, in player plus 2nd round pick.

Roughly trading 2 x SPS for Shiel and a Zac Fisher equiv.

I see draft picks (even 1st rounders) as highly speculative, so IMHO it's not the worst deal.

But given where our list is, I'd choose to roll the dice and stack more young talent than bring in young-mid aged talent.

 

[TheKing101]

Shiel would cost an arm and a leg to trade for (as would Fyfe if Freo matched).

Something along the lines of the Treloar deal. Out two first rounders, in player plus 2nd round pick.

Roughly trading 2 x SPS for Shiel and a Zac Fisher equiv.

I see draft picks (even 1st rounders) as highly speculative, so IMHO it's not the worst deal.

But given where our list is, I'd choose to roll the dice and stack more young talent than bring in young-mid aged talent.

I agree. I want to see more young talent come through the door without having to sacrifice high end draft picks. As much as I would love to get Shiel, I would only want him for no more than a first, second and a casboult/Thomas but I don't believe GWS would be happy with that. Will be interesting to see what happens either way.

 

[La Dispute]

Shiel would be valued similar to Treloar - 2 first round draft picks, one from this year and a future 1st rounder. He's worth that, but it might be a bit premature bringing him in this early. We've still got to stockpile some talent, and relinquishing a few early selections does compromise our planning; even if we are obtaining an A-grader.

If we were to trade for him, it'd be ideal getting a few selections coming back our way, so we can continue transitioning players in and out.

 

[F_therest]

Collingwood overpaid for treloar...it is not the standard.

Yes he's a star and arguably worth what they paid, but before that the typical going price for a star was a 1St rounder, 2Nd rounder and a fringe player.

Think Dangerfield and beams in recent times.

I'd definitely trade that kind of deal for shiel...not so sure about 2 x 1sts.

Given how good sos seems to be at the trade table, I reckon he could make it happen so we don't pay 2 first rounders.

 

[TheKing101]

Collingwood overpaid for treloar...it is not the standard.

Yes he's a star and arguably worth what they paid, but before that the typical going price for a star was a 1St rounder, 2Nd rounder and a fringe player.

Think Dangerfield and beams in recent times.

I'd definitely trade that kind of deal for shiel...not so sure about 2 x 1sts.

Given how good sos seems to be at the trade table, I reckon he could make it happen so we don't pay 2 first rounders.

I would be happy giving up a first and a second as well as a fringe senior player.

 

[blueboy25]

Dylan Shiel is out of contract at the end of the coming season. Was a diehard Carlton supporter growing up and is rumoured to be dating a relative of the silvagni's. Could he possibly end up at Carlton given our history with GWS and the fact a lot of his mates may already be at Carlton? If this happens where does it leave us in terms of also acquiring Fyfe.

Isn't it Mark Williams daughter he was dating?

 

[TheKing101]

Isn't it Mark Williams daughter he was dating?

Yeah that is also what i heard. The Silvagni thing could just be a rumour made up by Carlton hopefuls to create a bit of fire. Unless of course Mark Williams has some relation to the Silvagni's

 

[HARKER]

Shiel for 2018's first and a bit more? Absolutely.

I'd sooner Dylan at our club than Fyfe, even though he would cost picks but not nearly as much money.

 

[bmaurizio]

Fyfe will be a free agent and Sheils will be uncontracted so if either nominates us as prefered destination it all becomes very interesting.
We have plenty of felxibility and will make a move by the sounds of the murmurs.
If we let Gibbs go (pick10 to15)plus 2018 Ist rounder we have the bait too.
We'll also bring in a young gun via 2017 draft, probabley end bottom 5, so O'Brien or Garner could be a reality.
Go Baggers

 

[Big Sim is Back]

Shiel for 2018's first and a bit more? Absolutely.

I'd sooner Dylan at our club than Fyfe, even though he would cost picks but not nearly as much money.

Me too. Not sold on Fyfe for more than a million a year. Thats back into Messia mania for mine.

 

[HARKER]

Shiel would be perfect for us, cost less by way of TPP, is younger and at least for now, less injury prone and beaten-up.

Fyfe would be terrific and I may be wrong here.........but I feel Shiel would be the better fit all round.

 

[Coops93]

There are parallels between Treloar and Shiel. But imo Shiel is better than Treloar. Better runner, more physical and a better kick.

I would almost prefer him to Fyfe at this point, given Fyfe's fitness questions and that we have a similar player to him in Cripps. Shiel would provide a better foil than Fyfe

 

[TheKing101]

Shiel would be perfect for us, cost less by way of TPP, is younger and at least for now, less injury prone and beaten-up.

Fyfe would be terrific and I may be wrong here.........but I feel Shiel would be the better fit all around.

I agree. Would take Shiel over Fyfe, fits the team much better and i feel he could go close to being another Judd. He is his own player though of course

 

[ShanDog]

Take both Fyfe and Shield as free agents. I wouldn't bother spending picks on them in the next year or two. After that is when we are serious - we'll have set ourselves up for sustained periods in the top 8 if we have drafted right.

 

[HBF]

Isn't it Mark Williams daughter he was dating?

This is what I thought as well.
Never heard the Silvagni connection before.

 

[HBF]

Shiel for 2018's first and a bit more? Absolutely.

I'd sooner Dylan at our club than Fyfe, even though he would cost picks but not nearly as much money.

What happens with Ben Silvagni for that year? At this stage its reported he'll go in the 1st round.