List Mgmt. 2019 Trade Thread

[plugger66]

Marshall ruck forward instead of Bruce.

Goldy main ruck for the next 2-3 years.

You always say no pint having 3 talls unless they are good.

King, Marshall, Members sounds good to me.

Answered.

Bruce members and max sound better because Marshall is where he should be and that’s ruckkng

 

[pebblesofsand]

I think Mowman probably hit the nail above.. Bruce, albeit reluctantly, would most likely be on the trade table.

Unless he is happy to be a role player, involving potential stints in the vfl..

Possibly include Membrey - much better trade value than Bruce - may struggle next year because Jack Mayo looks like a star.

Parker Steele Hannebery

Mayo Bruce Billings

Lonie King/Marshall Gresham

Marshall/Goldy Ross Steven

 

[Mikka84]

I think we lose Marshall development as potentially one of the best rucks in the afl. We lose contested marking of Bruce. We actually gain nothing apart the 5 minutes marshall usually rests.

 

[plugger66]

Possibly include Membrey - much better trade value than Bruce - may struggle next year because Jack Mayo looks like a star.

Parker Steele Hannebery

Mayo Bruce Billings

Lonie King/Marshall Gresham

Marshall/Goldy Ross Steven

Mayo. Seriously. Wowee

 

[Mikka84]

Possibly include Membrey - much better trade value than Bruce - may struggle next year because Jack Mayo looks like a star.

Parker Steele Hannebery

Mayo Bruce Billings

Lonie King/Marshall Gresham

Marshall/Goldy Ross Steven

Mayo has played one vfl game and did ok.. Not sure we can classify him a star just yet.. although I love your enthusiasm.

Members is critical to the structure.. we don't really have a replacement for what he offers as that 3rd tall. Bruce being the key target we do have options though.. I actually don't want to trade Bruce btw.. just not sure i'm comfortable with him playing vfl.. I have no idea of his trade value either - doubt we'd get anything that would make it worthwhile.

 

[Mikka84]

Mayo. Seriously. Wowee

He put a bit on that statement.

 

[VDS66]

But that does mean that Marshall probably stalls in development. It might give him a bit of guidance but actually slow his progress. If I was him I'd look around if Goldy comes on board. He's going to be a third tall forward and if King comes in he might be playing a season or two at Sandy until Goldy retires.

Depends where the club see him playing.

Kid has massive upside.

Don't see the problem having him up forward for a couple of years then taking over as first ruck

A lot of this is just spit balling and killing time until we lose our next game and migrate to the Richo thread for further hostilities.

I like thinking laterally and don't like pigeon holing players into set positions.

Reality is that Paddy is 99.9% finished. Battle settled as a CHB. Jake to replace Brown.

Bruce? Have defended him but inconsistent.

Then again anyone would struggle with our inside 50 entries.

If the club sees an alternative use for Roma, then I can see the logic behind getting Goldy.

Would be mad to trade Roma.

 

[VDS66]

Bruce members and max sound better because Marshall is where he should be and that’s ruckkng

You wanted an answer, you got one.

 

[VDS66]

It just doesn't make sense that we need some prime mids but the one area where we are excelling in and have actually found an elite potential player, we are meddling with it. We need a cheap back up ruck but not a Rolls Royce ruck who will actually be and to leave out of the side but having him as first ruck means Marshall plays forward where we are already going to have to find a spot for King soon. How many tall forwards can we carry?

I think the question is how many GOOD tall forwards can we carry?

 

[VDS66]

I think we lose Marshall development as potentially one of the best rucks in the afl. We lose contested marking of Bruce. We actually gain nothing apart the 5 minutes marshall usually rests.

It cuts both ways. He can spend a few years developing his forward work as well then take over as ruck..

Would potentially be better than Gawn and the other bloke.

 

[plugger66]

I think the question is how many GOOD tall forwards can we carry?

The thing is if we get goldy we aren’t going to know if marshall is a good tall forward. If he isn’t it’s to late then. We know Bruce is close to good if not good. Imagine if we trade him and Marshall is going out to be average. Sad.

 

[VDS66]

The thing is if we get goldy we aren’t going to know if marshall is a good tall forward. If he isn’t it’s to late then. We know Bruce is close to good if not good. Imagine if we trade him and Marshall is going out to be average. Sad.

Marshall will be a gun wherever he plays.

 

[bird_man]

Possibly include Membrey - much better trade value than Bruce - may struggle next year because Jack Mayo looks like a star.

Parker Steele Hannebery

Mayo Bruce Billings

Lonie King/Marshall Gresham

Marshall/Goldy Ross Steven

Lol. A kid that was playing WAFL reserves a couple of weeks ago and kicked one goal for Sandy looks a star. I hope you're right but that's a big call.

 

[Enclosed_Animal]

Interesting few pages talking about Goldy. What I find interesting is all the back and forth about how specific players will or wont fit into our forward structure.

Considering our current forward structure is completely and utterly dysfunctional, I am more than happy to bin what we have and experiment with something new. I genuinely don't understand the determination to persist with moving player x or y in or out of our current setup, when what we have is clearly below AFL standard.

Moving forward I personally want Billings and Gresh up around the ball. And Battle looks a 10 year defender so why f**k that up. Paddy sadly I will leave out of this convo.

That leaves Membery as the ONLY forward lock we have. Everything else is up for grabs as far as I am concerned.

Personally I have no problem with any of Winx, Bruce, Mayo, Kent, Long, Young and / or Parker doing stints in the VFL over the next 12/24 months. They are all either inexperienced kids or players who have produced recent AFL form that renders them droppable.

Hell our gameplan is already based around hitting 9 irons into the forwardline all day long. So if we want to play around with 2x200cm+ forwards (Winx and Marshall) and play another ruckman (Goldy) then why not? Its not as though our inside 50 efficiency could possibly get any worse!

Most importantly, Goldy would cost nothing in terms of picks. Plus Marshall, while excellent around the ground / winning clearances, is a very average ruckman (we played the 'ruckman that cant ruck' game with McEvoy for years). So it wont hurt Marshall to have someone like Goldy to school him for a year or 2 on how to actually ruck (because our current ruck coach seems about as useful as our current goal-kicking coach).

For me all options are on the table. Marshall does a knee next week, then a basketballer with a handful of VFL games is our ruckman next week. Bruce breaks his leg then we don't have another tall forward option with any AFL experience or more than 4 games VFL experience (outside of Sam Rowe FFS). Anyone thinking Goldy doesn't make our list stronger (and at a cost of only $$) is getting waaay ahead of themselves. Lets also not forget Marshall is OOC. What if the Hawks make him an offer and he walks?

I have no idea if we will get Goldy or not. But I don't understand why we wouldn't seriously consider the option (in fact I think we are negligent if we don't consider all options at this stage). Especially since we have absolutely no idea what will or wont work around Winx in terms of a forward setup. He is a complete unknown, and we haven't had a player like him to experiment with since Kozy won a rising star and CHB. Plus one team with 2 ruckman just won the flag, while another just schooled us by 12 goals. Would it work? I have no idea. Nobody can know that. But I see no harm in trying something different ...

 

[luca77]

Jack Mayo looks like a star.

I sense a new GOAT in town. About bloody time too.

 

[Hayes4PM]

If we can get Goldstein as our #2 ruck/part-time coach next year I think it’s great. If we’re getting him to be our #1 ruck I do not rate that move at all.

At. All.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Interesting few pages talking about Goldy. What I find interesting is all the back and forth about how specific players will or wont fit into our forward structure.

Considering our current forward structure is completely and utterly dysfunctional, I am more than happy to bin what we have and experiment with something new. I genuinely don't understand the determination to persist with moving player x or y in or out of our current setup, when what we have is clearly below AFL standard.

Moving forward I personally want Billings and Gresh up around the ball. And Battle looks a 10 year defender so why f**k that up. Paddy sadly I will leave out of this convo.

That leaves Membery as the ONLY forward lock we have. Everything else is up for grabs as far as I am concerned.

Personally I have no problem with any of Winx, Bruce, Mayo, Kent, Long, Young and / or Parker doing stints in the VFL over the next 12/24 months. They are all either inexperienced kids or players who have produced recent AFL form that renders them droppable.

Hell our gameplan is already based around hitting 9 irons into the forwardline all day long. So if we want to play around with 2x200cm+ forwards (Winx and Marshall) and play another ruckman (Goldy) then why not? Its not as though our inside 50 efficiency could possibly get any worse!

Most importantly, Goldy would cost nothing in terms of picks. Plus Marshall, while excellent around the ground / winning clearances, is a very average ruckman (we played the 'ruckman that cant ruck' game with McEvoy for years). So it wont hurt Marshall to have someone like Goldy to school him for a year or 2 on how to actually ruck (because our current ruck coach seems about as useful as our current goal-kicking coach).

For me all options are on the table. Marshall does a knee next week, then a basketballer with a handful of VFL games is our ruckman next week. Bruce breaks his leg then we don't have another tall forward option with any AFL experience or more than 4 games VFL experience (outside of Sam Rowe FFS). Anyone thinking Goldy doesn't make our list stronger (and at a cost of only $$) is getting waaay ahead of themselves. Lets also not forget Marshall is OOC. What if the Hawks make him an offer and he walks?

I have no idea if we will get Goldy or not. But I don't understand why we wouldn't seriously consider the option (in fact I think we are negligent if we don't consider all options at this stage). Especially since we have absolutely no idea what will or wont work around Winx in terms of a forward setup. He is a complete unknown, and we haven't had a player like him to experiment with since Kozy won a rising star and CHB. Plus one team with 2 ruckman just won the flag, while another just schooled us by 12 goals. Would it work? I have no idea. Nobody can know that. But I see no harm in trying something different ...

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Currently Membrey is 17th in the AFL for goals per game.
Including Wells, and Preuss who only played a game or 2 each ahead of him.

Only Collingwood, Eagles, GWS, Essendon and Geelong have 2 ahead of him.

Only GWS and Eagles have two marking forwards ahead of him.

So unless someone wants to suggest we are better at supply to the forward line than all those teams, he'd be a walk up start for most sides.
If we are lucky enough to get two players who are more effective than him, I'm going to be really happy , but i don't expect it.

If he ends up playing like a third tall, he won't attract anything like the defender he's getting now. ( Since they will all be doubling up trying to stop King ).

If King ends up being half what we expect , playing a three tall's forward line, with King attracting the best defenders, Bruce and Membrey can only improve.
If we go for 2, i don't think Membrey will be the one dropped.

GWS : Cameron and Finlayson
Collingwood : DeGoey Membrey would get a gig.
Cats : Hawkins and Ablett. Membrey might get a gig ahead of Rowan , he kicks more goals.
North : Brown. Membrey would get a gig.
West Coast : Kennedy and Darling. Would need to beat Darling for the spot.
Tigers : Lynch. Not sure if they'd go a third tall if Reiwoldt was fit.
Melbourne : Preuss . ( 2 games ). Walk up start.
Essendon : Fantasia . Walk up start.
Gold Coast : Sexton. Walk up start .
Fremantle : Matera . Probably
Sydney : Franklin. Probably
Crows : Betts. Probably
Lions: No-one outscores Membrey
Hawks : No-one outscores Membrey.
Blues : No-one outscores Membrey.
Bulldogs. Nope
Port . Nope.

Its Bruce who is struggling at only 1.2 goals per game ( Same as Crows Tom Lynch and Josh Jenkins ) who could lose his spot to Marshall if it turned out that way.

 

[Mikka84]

The thing is if we get goldy we aren’t going to know if marshall is a good tall forward. If he isn’t it’s to late then. We know Bruce is close to good if not good. Imagine if we trade him and Marshall is going out to be average. Sad.

I don’t think trade Bruce. I highly doubt King plays every game next year anyway. At least we have options and depth to our list. What would Bruce get in a trade anyway? Second round? I’d keep him at that and we’re not getting a first for him..

 

[Moral Decay]

Interesting few pages talking about Goldy. What I find interesting is all the back and forth about how specific players will or wont fit into our forward structure.

Considering our current forward structure is completely and utterly dysfunctional, I am more than happy to bin what we have and experiment with something new. I genuinely don't understand the determination to persist with moving player x or y in or out of our current setup, when what we have is clearly below AFL standard.

Moving forward I personally want Billings and Gresh up around the ball. And Battle looks a 10 year defender so why f**k that up. Paddy sadly I will leave out of this convo.

That leaves Membery as the ONLY forward lock we have. Everything else is up for grabs as far as I am concerned.

Personally I have no problem with any of Winx, Bruce, Mayo, Kent, Long, Young and / or Parker doing stints in the VFL over the next 12/24 months. They are all either inexperienced kids or players who have produced recent AFL form that renders them droppable.

Hell our gameplan is already based around hitting 9 irons into the forwardline all day long. So if we want to play around with 2x200cm+ forwards (Winx and Marshall) and play another ruckman (Goldy) then why not? Its not as though our inside 50 efficiency could possibly get any worse!

Most importantly, Goldy would cost nothing in terms of picks. Plus Marshall, while excellent around the ground / winning clearances, is a very average ruckman (we played the 'ruckman that cant ruck' game with McEvoy for years). So it wont hurt Marshall to have someone like Goldy to school him for a year or 2 on how to actually ruck (because our current ruck coach seems about as useful as our current goal-kicking coach).

For me all options are on the table. Marshall does a knee next week, then a basketballer with a handful of VFL games is our ruckman next week. Bruce breaks his leg then we don't have another tall forward option with any AFL experience or more than 4 games VFL experience (outside of Sam Rowe FFS). Anyone thinking Goldy doesn't make our list stronger (and at a cost of only $$) is getting waaay ahead of themselves. Lets also not forget Marshall is OOC. What if the Hawks make him an offer and he walks?

I have no idea if we will get Goldy or not. But I don't understand why we wouldn't seriously consider the option (in fact I think we are negligent if we don't consider all options at this stage). Especially since we have absolutely no idea what will or wont work around Winx in terms of a forward setup. He is a complete unknown, and we haven't had a player like him to experiment with since Kozy won a rising star and CHB. Plus one team with 2 ruckman just won the flag, while another just schooled us by 12 goals. Would it work? I have no idea. Nobody can know that. But I see no harm in trying something different ...

 

[pebblesofsand]

Mayo has played one vfl game and did ok.. Not sure we can classify him a star just yet.. although I love your enthusiasm.

Members is critical to the structure.. we don't really have a replacement for what he offers as that 3rd tall. Bruce being the key target we do have options though.. I actually don't want to trade Bruce btw.. just not sure i'm comfortable with him playing vfl.. I have no idea of his trade value either - doubt we'd get anything that would make it worthwhile.

I was having a bit of a lend but seriously the talk about trading Bruce on the basis of the performance of a bloke who's got three whole games of VFL under his belt is equally 'enthusiastic". I like dreaming like everyone else but I prefer a lot more realism and a little less "mayo".

Max King will be a once in a lifetime player if he can come in and dominate as a KPF in his first full season in AFL. The stats show its extremely unlikely and he will definitely not be a forward second ruck next year unless of course we are looking to hobble him.

204 cm and 90 kgs - he's a stick figure at the moment so looking for support for Marshall is important unless we are happy to run with Longer. Current form says no way!!!

As for Mayo - 19 yo 194 cm, 2.95 20 metre sprint (elite), 84 cm running jump (elite).

First game of of VFL 11 possessions and 7 marks and goal after a week that involved getting drafted on Monday, flying to Melbourne to meet his team mates and train on Tuesday, flying back to Perth Wednesday and then back to Melb for Friday training. Hardly ideal preparation.

Get on board!!!

 

[MrFoster]

Exactly right. So perhaps the club strategy for improving our ruck position should be to focus on a free agent who costs us nothing draft pick and is

A - available
B - better than Longer or Pierce

Alternatively we could use a late draft pick, wait for a few years to see if they can play and hope like hell that Marshall doesn't get injured.

I don’t really get all the angst at the club trying to get a better ruck division.. teams improve through competition.. we have 2 deadwood in Pierce and Longer, that’s why Marshall is playing now.. and he is playing ok for someone who just started rucking full time this year.. We need to delist Pierce and Longer, but who will challenge Marshall? a 18 year old kid? another hack we trade in from other teams? both will cost picks and are unknown quantities.. if we can get a much higher quality ruck in Goldstein for free(no picks involved), and tell Marshall and Goldstein to fight it out.. it will make Marshall a better ruckman in the long term and improve us as a team..

 

[gringo2011]

How do you see it operating if we get Goldy?

Marshall and Goldy would share the ruck and forward.. Bruce loses out, yes. I love Bruce.. Great club-man and can clunk a mark. He is very inconsistent though. Had the one good year and patches of form from then.. Would we really lose that much if say Marshall was down there 60% and Goldy the other 40% for 12 months while King develops in the seniors with big bodies around him?

How does Goldy and Marshall go as a forward though, they actually have to be an upgrade on Bruce or I agree with Plugger. You get one of your few winners by position and move him, then take out your best tall forward for two guys who are ruckmen to try to be as good as he was. It may work but you would think you would try it with Longer first and see how he goes forward.

 

[gringo2011]

Possibly include Membrey - much better trade value than Bruce - may struggle next year because Jack Mayo looks like a star.

Parker Steele Hannebery

Mayo Bruce Billings

Lonie King/Marshall Gresham

Marshall/Goldy Ross Steven

I hope to god we don't sell off Membrey for a guy who's played one VFL game. Remember when we were sure Hugh Goddard and Freeman were going to be stars.

 

[gringo2011]

Depends where the club see him playing.

Kid has massive upside.

Don't see the problem having him up forward for a couple of years then taking over as first ruck

A lot of this is just spit balling and killing time until we lose our next game and migrate to the Richo thread for further hostilities.

I like thinking laterally and don't like pigeon holing players into set positions.

Reality is that Paddy is 99.9% finished. Battle settled as a CHB. Jake to replace Brown.

Bruce? Have defended him but inconsistent.

Then again anyone would struggle with our inside 50 entries.

If the club sees an alternative use for Roma, then I can see the logic behind getting Goldy.

Would be mad to trade Roma.

I'm pretty sure you were one that was ripping into me for saying Dal Santo had suggested it and people took it as my opinion. I think a few justifying it now jumped me for mentioning it.