Training 2021 Pre-Season Training Discussion

[D Style]

I've not seen O'Connor or Gollant(last year draftees at all) play a game/trial/SANFL for us. Can anyone advise that has seen them, what potential they have. Obviously Covid wasn't good for them.

On CPH1831 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Murray2503]

And our Ruck depth if ROB goes down is what exactly?

We didn't draft Thilthorpe to ruck.

I wouldn't play Strachan regardless who's injured. He's trash. Thilthorpe was drafted to play forward and ruck if needed. If ROB goes down I presume they would play Himmelberg and Fogarty up forward with Thilthorpe in the ruck and interchange him with Himmelberg 30% of the game.

 

[kulak]

Bullish:
Hamill

Optimistic:
Scholl
Schoenberg
McHenry
Gollant

50:50:
McAsey

Pessimistic:
Hately
O'Connor
Jones
Butts

Giving up on:
Worrell

Of the first year players, the ones I like from highlights are Cook, Rowe and Borlase.

 

[Scorpus]

Bullish:
Schoenberg, Hamill, Sholl, McAdam, Thilthorpe, Hately

Optimistic:
Butts, McAsey, Cook, Pedlar, Rowe, Jones

50:50:
McHenry, Worrell, Borlase, Newchurch, Berry

Bit worried:
O'Connor, Hinge, Gollant

Giving up on:
Strachan

There's definitely a group of young players we have already seen have AFL suitable traits. All four of them should continue to develop into strong AFL players. Thilthorpe has the tools to be elite and Hately is exactly what we need

Butts and McAsey have shown some positives at AFL level but need to push on. Really like the look of Cook, Pedlar and Rowe and I hope all can have an impact soon. I think Jones "has it" but will need to be un-Goddened to make it, will drop down a tier if he doesn't crack on.

For the 50:50 category I genuinely think these could go either way. The player of that group I'm most optimistic about is Worrell as I think he has the right athletic profile for modern AFL. I used to have McHenry in the "optimistic" category but so far he's shown very little. Putting Berry here might be a bit harsh but players with few standout traits aside from ball winning have a harder time making it in the AFL than those with extra weapons, and at this stage I'm not sure how vanilla he will be given no exposed form at AFL/SANFL level.

I don't see a solid path to the AFL for O'Connor now that we have Hately and several other upcoming mids. He looks physically ready but didn't get close last year. I also don't see a solid path for Hinge or Gollant, they seem like the sort of role players that ideally you'd want to replace with elite talent quite quickly. Honestly don't know why we targeted Hinge at all. Gollant seems like the classic player that has something to work with, but will take a lot of time, and that may work against him in a side that will have a lot of high draft picks. I see him as the next Ben Davis

40

Ben Davis

Age

27

Ht

189cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.0

1star

K

3.5

1star

HB

2.5

2star

M

2.0

2star

T

1.5

3star

MG

169.0

3star

D

5.0

1star

K

4.0

1star

HB

1.0

1star

M

2.0

2star

T

2.0

3star

MG

169.0

3star

D

6.0

2star

K

3.5

2star

HB

2.5

3star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.5

4star

MG

169.0

3star

, with McAdam already past him and Cook probably soon too in that medium forward role.

Strachan won't make it

 

[Murray2503]

Bullish:
Schoenberg, Hamill, Sholl, McAdam, McPherson, Himmelberg, Milera

Optimistic:
Thilthorpe, Pedlar, Jones, Cook, Hately, Stengle, Berry Worrell Keays

50:50:
Borlase, O'Connor, Rowe, Gollant, McAsey(will likely leave), Newchurch, Butts, Hinge

Bit worried:
McHenry, Davis,

Giving up on:
Strachan, Frampton,

 

[Thetrader15]

I wouldn't play Strachan regardless who's injured. He's trash. Thilthorpe was drafted to play forward and ruck if needed. If ROB goes down I presume they would play Himmelberg and Fogarty up forward with Thilthorpe in the ruck and interchange him with Himmelberg 30% of the game.

I sure hope not.

Imagine your Ford Ranger brakes down. Do you use your brand new Range Rover Evoque R-Dynamic for a day on the tools or do you borrow your little Brother's old Hilux for a couple of weeks knowing it's not going to be great, but you won't damage your expensive new toy?

 

[jackster83]

Bullish: Schoenberg, Hamill, Sholl, Thilthorpe, (McPherson)

Optimistic: Hately, McAdam, McHenry, Pedlar, Cook, Rowe

50/50: Worrell, Gollant, Newchurch, Borlase, Butts, McAsey (think he will be a good player but not for us), Berry

Bit worried: Jones, O'Connor, (Fogarty)

Given up on: Strachan, (Stengle)

 

[Murray2503]

I sure hope not.

Imagine your Ford Ranger brakes down. Do you use your brand new Range Rover Evoque R-Dynamic for a day on the tools or do you borrow your little Brother's old Hilux for a couple of weeks knowing it's not going to be great, but you won't damage your expensive new toy?

Would be good for his development to play some time in the ruck as well as up forward. Likely would only be for half a season if god forbid ROB was injured. He was playing in the ruck last year and weighs 100kg's so I don't see a problem interchanging between forward and ruck.

 

[Cockwomble]

Optimistic:
Fogarty, Hamill, Hately, Himmelberg, Jones, McAdam, Schoenberg, Sholl & McPherson
Not sure:
Davis, Frampton, McAsey, Butts
I'm not good at remote viewing so the likes of the following I have NFI:
Berry, Borlase, Cook, Gollant, Newchurch, O'Connor, Pedlar, Rowe, Thilthorpe & Worrell

 

[Punchy Bassett]

Could Frampton be converted to a kpd? Might be the only way he has a future

 

[Mutineer]

Bullish:
Schoenberg, Hamill, Sholl, McAdam, Thilthorpe, Hately

Optimistic:
Butts, McAsey, Cook, Pedlar, Rowe, Jones

50:50:
McHenry, Worrell, Borlase, Newchurch, Berry

Bit worried:
O'Connor, Hinge, Gollant

Giving up on:
Strachan

There's definitely a group of young players we have already seen have AFL suitable traits. All four of them should continue to develop into strong AFL players. Thilthorpe has the tools to be elite and Hately is exactly what we need

Butts and McAsey have shown some positives at AFL level but need to push on. Really like the look of Cook, Pedlar and Rowe and I hope all can have an impact soon. I think Jones "has it" but will need to be un-Goddened to make it, will drop down a tier if he doesn't crack on.

For the 50:50 category I genuinely think these could go either way. The player of that group I'm most optimistic about is Worrell as I think he has the right athletic profile for modern AFL. I used to have McHenry in the "optimistic" category but so far he's shown very little. Putting Berry here might be a bit harsh but players with few standout traits aside from ball winning have a harder time making it in the AFL than those with extra weapons, and at this stage I'm not sure how vanilla he will be given no exposed form at AFL/SANFL level.

I don't see a solid path to the AFL for O'Connor now that we have Hately and several other upcoming mids. He looks physically ready but didn't get close last year. I also don't see a solid path for Hinge or Gollant, they seem like the sort of role players that ideally you'd want to replace with elite talent quite quickly. Honestly don't know why we targeted Hinge at all. Gollant seems like the classic player that has something to work with, but will take a lot of time, and that may work against him in a side that will have a lot of high draft picks. I see him as the next Ben Davis, with McAdam already past him and Cook probably soon too in that medium forward role.

Strachan won't make it

You've obviously not watched Berry play.

He is exceptional overhead for his size, elite endurance that will see him get to more contests and allow him to have longer spells on ball than a lot of midfielders. He is absolutely a 2 way runner with a good blend of offense and defense to his game.....foot skills are OK also.

I can only believe you're going on his underage year NAB League stats for Gippy Power as your guide where he was playing mostly 4th banana in the midfield behind Caleb Serong, Sam Flanders and Riley Baldi.

I seriously doubt we's have picked him up with our pick if he'd played last season where he would have quite obviously been Gippy Power's Number 1 midfielder and no doubt a starting midfielder for Vic Country at the Championships.

His NAB League stats across his 10 games given he was 4th banana in Gippy Power's midfield were excellent 17.7 disposals, 2.7 marks, 6.5 tacles, 7.3 clearances, 3.8 i50's, 1.3 r50's, 6 goals.

Perhaps wait until you've actually seen him play.

 

[Alwaysacrow]

Could Frampton be converted to a kpd? Might be the only way he has a future

Interesting idea. Worth a shot.

 

[Vader]

Bullish: Schoenberg, Hamill, Sholl, Thilthorpe, McPherson, McAdam

Optimistic: Butts, McAsey

50/50: Hately

Bit worried: Jones, McHenry, Fogarty

Given up on: Strachan, Stengle

Don't Know (haven't seen): Worrell, Gollant, Newchurch, Borlase, Berry, O'Connor, Pedlar, Cook, Rowe

 

[Scorpus]

He is exceptional overhead for his size, elite endurance that will see him get to more contests and allow him to have longer spells on ball than a lot of midfielders. He is absolutely a 2 way runner with a good blend of offense and defense to his game.....foot skills are OK also.

You could be describing a decent AFL player here, but equally you could be describing someone vanilla. Endurance and an elite mark aren't particularly remarkable traits for a modern midfielder, at least not in comparison to burst pace, size, elite skills, goal sense, etc.

We'll have to wait and see how he does in an AFL environment

 

[Mutineer]

You could be describing a decent AFL player here, but equally you could be describing someone vanilla. Endurance and an elite mark aren't particularly remarkable traits for a modern midfielder, at least not in comparison to burst pace, size, elite skills, goal sense, etc.

We'll have to wait and see how he does in an AFL environment

Like I said you've obviously never seen him play....He's a clearance beast with elite hands inside the contest....and btw he has excellent goal sense.

You could count on your hands how many current AFL midfielders have all your "elite" requirements.

Sam Berry has all the tools and character to be a very good AFL midfielder.

 

[Scorpus]

Like I said you've obviously never seen him play....He's a clearance beast with elite hands inside the contest....and btw he has excellent goal sense.

You could count on your hands how many current AFL midfielders have all your "elite" requirements.

Sam Berry has all the tools and character to be a very good AFL midfielder.

You don't need all the traits, just some of them.

Inside ball winning + endurance + marking does not guarantee an AFL career any more. It can if you are good enough, but it's not a given.

 

[Mutineer]

You don't need all the traits, just some of them.

Inside ball winning + endurance + marking does not guarantee an AFL career any more. It can if you are good enough, but it's not a given.

At least Vader has the good sense not to pass judgement on players he's not seen play.

Sam Berry: Powerful, goalkicking mid a draft gem

Gippsland Power midfielder Sam Berry can lay heavy tackles and hit the scoreboard too. Could he be an early pick in this year's NAB AFL Draft?

www.afl.com.au

 

[Scorpus]

At least Vader has the good sense not to pass judgement on players he's not seen play.

Sam Berry: Powerful, goalkicking mid a draft gem

Gippsland Power midfielder Sam Berry can lay heavy tackles and hit the scoreboard too. Could he be an early pick in this year's NAB AFL Draft?

www.afl.com.au

For some reason you think I'm saying he's crap. I'm not. All I'm saying is the jury is out on whether he will be a quality AFL player, which is true of most draftees taken outside the first round

 

[Carmo]

For those who are giving up on Strachanie, who do you think will end up the better ruckman, Strachan or Paul Hunter? Reason I ask is given St Kilda's interest in Hunter, have we (you) all given up too soon on Strachan? I'll be keen to see how he goes in SANFL this year, that should be a good guide, it will also be a good way to check his size and has he put any weight on.

 

[jackster83]

At least Vader has the good sense not to pass judgement on players he's not seen play.

Sam Berry: Powerful, goalkicking mid a draft gem

Gippsland Power midfielder Sam Berry can lay heavy tackles and hit the scoreboard too. Could he be an early pick in this year's NAB AFL Draft?

www.afl.com.au

I've only given him a 50/50 rating, but that's more to do with the selectors and the limited opportunities he will likely get (in his preferred position at least).

Going to be tough for a young inside mid to get picked ahead of Matt, Laird, Sloane and Keays as well as Hately, Schoenberg and Pedlar.

O'Connor is in a similar boat.

 

[deeztreez]

I wouldn't play Strachan regardless who's injured. He's trash. Thilthorpe was drafted to play forward and ruck if needed. If ROB goes down I presume they would play Himmelberg and Fogarty up forward with Thilthorpe in the ruck and interchange him with Himmelberg 30% of the game.

Well if an elite athlete who managed to fight his way onto an afl list is trash...what does that make u?

 

[skam85]

Well if an elite athlete who managed to fight his way onto an afl list is trash...what does that make u?

Ahh yes, the Kane Cornes argument.

 

[WeeBlake]

Bullish - Schoenberg, Sholl, Hammill
Optimistic - all this years draftees
50/50 - Fogarty, last year’s untied draftees
Bit worried - McHenry, Jones, Macasey
Given up on - nil

 

[Crows I Am]

Bullish:
Hamill

Optimistic:
Scholl
Schoenberg
McHenry
Gollant

50:50:
McAsey

Pessimistic:
Hately
O'Connor
Jones
Butts

Giving up on:
Worrell

Of the first year players, the ones I like from highlights are Cook, Rowe and Borlase.

Why are you giving up on Worrell already? Not saying he will definitely make it, but just interesting that you have already written him off after no AFL exposure. From his pre draft write ups and then some of the scratch match reports, it seems as though he has something to work with.

 

[Crows I Am]

For those who are giving up on Strachanie, who do you think will end up the better ruckman, Strachan or Paul Hunter? Reason I ask is given St Kilda's interest in Hunter, have we (you) all given up too soon on Strachan? I'll be keen to see how he goes in SANFL this year, that should be a good guide, it will also be a good way to check his size and has he put any weight on.

I would have rather we delisted Strachan and then put Hunter back on the list as out break glass option.