List Mgmt. 2022 Trade and Free Agency Thread

[Jivlain]

 

[martinson]

Our loyalty to players is as good as anybody and has cost us on occasions . We resigned Matho when he couldn't get a game. A misstep in hindsight.

We didn't sook and moan when Neale was 'exploring his options' .

We took a punt on McCarthy and Adams with long contracts . Lately Cockatoo.

Resigned Rayner when he did his knee did we not ? Or when he wasn't going too hot at least.

Given Zorks extra years . Daniher has 5.

Countless examples .

Haven't even started yet.

 

[mattsmob]

Our loyalty to players is as good as anybody and has cost us on occasions . We resigned Matho when he couldn't get a game. A misstep in hindsight.

We didn't sook and moan when Neale was 'exploring his options' .

We took a punt on McCarthy and Adams with long contracts . Lately Cockatoo.

Resigned Rayner when he did his knee did we not ? Or when he wasn't going too hot at least.

Given Zorks extra years . Daniher has 5.

Countless examples .

Haven't even started yet.

While I don’t disagree I’m pretty sure we still know it’s a business. None of the deals you’ve mentioned have affected the club negatively in order to please players. Witho is probably the most obvious example the other way where we needed the cap and I’m sure he would’ve been happy to stay, yet was moved on.

 

[morsie]

...and you believe the club is not trying to keep our best 22 and is trying to dispose players who have shown loyalty?

Of course they are,but I get the impression some posters are not quite as committed

 

[martinson]

While I don’t disagree I’m pretty sure we still know it’s a business. None of the deals you’ve mentioned have affected the club negatively in order to please players. Witho is probably the most obvious example the other way where we needed the cap and I’m sure he would’ve been happy to stay, yet was moved on.

Sure. But Witho wasn't good enough to get a game . It was understandable.

 

[BangyBangy]

Player management is a tough gig, so many variables & things to consider. I reckon we've been doing a stellar job these last few years. No club is going to get everything right, but we've pulled the right reign more than most in recent times.

 

[Sproj]

Player management is a tough gig, so many variables & things to consider. I reckon we've been doing a stellar job these last few years. No club is going to get everything right, but we've pulled the right reign more than most in recent times.

Hits:
McCluggage, Neale, Cameron, Daniher, McCarthy, Adams, Coleman, Bailey, Robinson, Fort, Big O, Lyons

Misses:
E.Smith, A.Smith, CEY, Schache, Keays, Cox

Jury is Still Out:
Rayner (harsh), Robertson, J.Berry (harsh), Cockatoo

Given some of those jury is still out are harsh, far more hits than misses.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Our loyalty to players is as good as anybody and has cost us on occasions . We resigned Matho when he couldn't get a game. A misstep in hindsight.

At the time I was confused why we had given him a two year contract. I don't have anything against Rhys but he shouldn't be getting opportunities at senior level ahead of Dev and TBerry. Just a break glass in case of emergency player.

 

[mpal6]

Our loyalty to players is as good as anybody and has cost us on occasions . We resigned Matho when he couldn't get a game. A misstep in hindsight.

We didn't sook and moan when Neale was 'exploring his options' .

We took a punt on McCarthy and Adams with long contracts . Lately Cockatoo.

Resigned Rayner when he did his knee did we not ? Or when he wasn't going too hot at least.

Given Zorks extra years . Daniher has 5.

Countless examples .

Haven't even started yet.

If Matho was happy to stay and be that mature body / depth player / leader in 2s (I'm sure the salary is going to reflect that), then that's a big win for us. It's shrewd business for both sides considering Ely/Deven/Prior etc are all out of contract this year.

Matho is available as cover for 2023 as well which is good depth for our list.

 

[davemc_lions]

You cannot also have a bunch of kids as your depth when you are in a window.
Matho did a great job when called upon last year to cover for Neale. We already had Dev getting games to cover for J Berry.
We prob hoping by end of next year Dev, T Berry etc take over.

 

[Nuggo]

Premiership teams generally have good depth. Depth is usually a mix of youth and older fringe best 22 players whether they are great clubmen or champions at the end of their career.

 

[martinson]

If Matho was happy to stay and be that mature body / depth player / leader in 2s (I'm sure the salary is going to reflect that), then that's a big win for us. It's shrewd business for both sides considering Ely/Deven/Prior etc are all out of contract this year.

Matho is available as cover for 2023 as well which is good depth for our list.

It was more that we kept Mato and offloaded Ben.

 

[davemc_lions]

It was more that we kept Mato and offloaded Ben.

Even if Keays stayed he be in the 2nds, Matho might be playing firsts elsewhere in a lower team
I think sometimes guys are pushed and sometimes it is the best for their careers
Walker, Hinge, Keays, Cutler playing firsts this week where Squizzy still in the seconds at the swans.

 

[Dalions]

Ben wasn’t contracted at the time, Matho was.
But we know that list decisions go a little deeper than that.

It was more that we kept Mato and offloaded Ben.

 

[Royboy1961]

Ben wasn’t contracted at the time, Matho was.
But we know that list decisions go a little deeper than that.

From memory Ben was offered a 2 year contract but decided to leave for greater opportunities. He was doing well in the reserves and was clearly a level above. He was mainly playing as a half forward but since moving to the midfield has been a revelation. Unfortunately you can’t keep all your players as some need a greater opportunity to show their ability.

 

[McIvor]

From memory Ben was offered a 2 year contract but decided to leave for greater opportunities. He was doing well in the reserves and was clearly a level above. He was mainly playing as a half forward but since moving to the midfield has been a revelation. Unfortunately you can’t keep all your players as some need a greater opportunity to show their ability.

Im not sure thats the case. I thought he was delisted which is why he started doing preseason tarining and committed to one of the VFL teams. Surely he would have stayed had he contarct on table otherwise couldn't he have signed directly with another AFL team instead of going VFL first.. I thought Crows came quite late in the piece.

 

[Lions1024]

From memory Ben was offered a 2 year contract but decided to leave for greater opportunities. He was doing well in the reserves and was clearly a level above. He was mainly playing as a half forward but since moving to the midfield has been a revelation. Unfortunately you can’t keep all your players as some need a greater opportunity to show their ability.

This was Mitch Hinge

 

[Lazza16]

Im not sure thats the case. I thought he was delisted which is why he started doing preseason tarining and committed to one of the VFL teams. Surely he would have stayed had he contarct on table otherwise couldn't he have signed directly with another AFL team instead of going VFL first.. I thought Crows came quite late in the piece.

I think Witho was offered a contract he c/would only refuse. The writing was on the wall.

 

[dlanod]

I think Witho was offered a contract he c/would only refuse. The writing was on the wall.

For Witho we had to pay some of his contract for him to go. We really wanted to clear the rest of that cap.

 

[M Malice]

All good decisions, Witherden, Hinge and Keays would be nowhere near our best 22 if they had stayed.

 

[martinson]

All good decisions, Witherden, Hinge and Keays would be nowhere near our best 22 if they had stayed.

Don't agree at all in the entirety of that.

But I was surprised we ever had Witho in there when we did in the first place. Mitch is a really good 2nds player.

 

[lionraven]

Keays would absolutely not be playing and would be a candidate for delisting if he was here at the Lions. I don't know how many watched his first year at the Crows but he was just as much of a clanger merchant as he was in his NEAFL days. Credit all goes to Keays for building his game up through the AFL and credit to the Crows for taking the time to let him get to the next level with time in the centre. No way would Keays be given the 20 odd games he needed to build up to AFL level, least of all as a sole inside mid, whilst we are contending for a flag. No offense to Keays but I would much rather Neale and Lyons than Keays in the middle even now. In 2-3 years time Keays will still be in his prime whilst Neale and Lyons will be declining but we are not playing for a 2025 flag. I would argue we should have had a flag by now with the way we have been performing (and 2020 was a real lost opportunity with a home grand final and having learnt to handle Richmond). Im tired of the self flagellating over Keays. The Keays we delisted and the Keays playing inside mid at the Crows are different creatures. Credit should go to Crows and Keays for investing a whole year in the middle and building this new AFL player out of the NEAFL Keays we delisted.

Its the same with Brodie. Everyone is fawning over his inside contested game but his kicking is still limited. I would much rather have Rowell or Miller in the inside (with the extra cash going to King) than have clanger king Brodie playing mediocre on the outside. Will be interesting to see what they do with Brodie when Fyfe returns. Its clear Fyfe's best football is on the inside, Brayshaw is the same. Cerra was clearly brilliant as that inside/outside link. Will be interesting to see how Brodie copes with that role (or Brayshaw having his game neutered to play the Cerra role).

 

[Zhesty]

The Keays rhetoric is annoying. There wasn't a huge amount of support around here for Keays in his final year with us. Sure everyone liked his character but not many people rated him as a footballer that would add to our 22.

I was a big supporter of Keays and watched him closely at ressie level and thought he was our most improved player at that level in his final year. I really rated his development in his final year with us and was also impressed when he was given a chance at senior level that year. You could see an AFL player there.

However, I always felt it was the best decision for both Ben and the club to part ways. He would get more opportunity elsewhere and we already had similar players to him in our best 22. It's just annoying to suddenly see people bemoaning our decision to let him go now when that support wasn't overwhelming at the time.

Stoked to see him doing so well and happy we let him go.

 

[martinson]

The Keays rhetoric is annoying. There wasn't a huge amount of support around here for Keays in his final year with us. Sure everyone liked his character but not many people rated him as a footballer that would add to our 22.

I was a big supporter of Keays and watched him closely at ressie level and thought he was our most improved player at that level in his final year. I really rated his development in his final year with us and was also impressed when he was given a chance at senior level that year. You could see an AFL player there.

However, I always felt it was the best decision for both Ben and the club to part ways. He would get more opportunity elsewhere and we already had similar players to him in our best 22. It's just annoying to suddenly see people bemoaning our decision to let him go now when that support wasn't overwhelming at the time.

Stoked to see him doing so well and happy we let him go

I'm certainly not bemoaning our decision to let him go , these things have to happen in footy.

I'm just a fanatic supporter and don't pretend to know a lot about many aspects of the game.

But I do sometimes watch games with guys who have played in a couple of cases 200 plus games and they love him. In fact never heard anything negative except here.

It seems to annoy a lot of people that others might think he's a really good player. But I agree he was never going to be that player here where we had him pegged. I hope he can get a kick or two tonight, but not too many.

 

[Dalions]

I'm certainly not bemoaning our decision to let him go , these things have to happen in footy.

I'm just a fanatic supporter and don't pretend to know a lot about many aspects of the game.

But I do sometimes watch games with guys who have played in a couple of cases 200 plus games and they love him. In fact never heard anything negative except here.

It seems to annoy a lot of people that others might think he's a really good player. But I agree he was never going to be that player here where we had him pegged. I hope he can get a kick or two tonight, but not too many.

Ben wasn’t being played out of position here.
He was being developed.
Without the development he had whilst here he may never have become the player he is today.

 

[martinson]

Ben wasn’t being played out of position here.
He was being developed.
Without the development he had whilst here he may never have come the player he is today.

True.