List Mgmt. 2023 List Management

[Arr0w]

Age or ability....here are 10 need to be replaced to win a premiership
Played rnd 1
Owies
Obrien
Mcgovern- age, injuries
Docherty age
Martin- age injuries
Ed Curnow- age
Newman- age

List support players
Plowman
Fogarty
Philp

Without considering age profile
Saad, Cripps.

Don't agree. Every side makes 7-9 changes a year, but that doesn't mean it impacts best 22-28

With players returning guys like Owies LOB, Newman, essentially replace Plow, Fog, Philp

Sure we have covered this before, but our age profile is fine, equal lowest number of 29+ year olds( along with the Hawks), with 3 players

 

[Andypooh23]

Maybe we can nab Liam Ryan

1

Liam Ryan

Age

28

Ht

181cm

Wt

76kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.3

3star

K

8.6

3star

HB

2.7

2star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.0

4star

G

1.3

5star

D

9.9

3star

K

8.0

3star

HB

1.9

1star

M

3.3

3star

T

1.6

3star

G

1.3

5star

D

11.4

3star

K

9.0

4star

HB

2.4

3star

M

3.8

4star

T

1.8

4star

G

1.6

5star

as WC are gonna be rebuilding.

 

[Jeremias]

Maybe we can nab Liam Ryan as WC are gonna be rebuilding.

Wouldn't take him even if he was free.

 

[Beyond Blue]

Agreed. Even if we just added Walsh, Boyd, Williams and Cuningham to the team on Thursday it would’ve looked better.

Sounds great but the problem is none of those blokes will be available until at least round 4-5, one of them won’t be available until this time next year.

 

[Andypooh23]

Wouldn't take him even if he was free.

Why is that?

 

[The Return of the Paf]

Age or ability....here are 10 need to be replaced to win a premiership
Played rnd 1
Owies
Obrien
Mcgovern- age, injuries
Docherty age
Martin- age injuries
Ed Curnow- age
Newman- age

List support players
Plowman
Fogarty
Philp

Without considering age or injury profile. Optimistic on below
Saad, Cripps- age
Cunningham- injury
Marchbank- injury

Yes, I'd agree on that list. I'm beginning to think we are three years away. Even then it might have to be a case like * in 1993.

 

[Jeremias]

Why is that?

Don't rate him particularly highly. Great highlights reel though, and I note he just kicked a good goal.

Have always thought he's a conditional footballer who goes missing way too often, for way too long.

And I'm not sure he's someone who is leaving WA either.

 

[Andypooh23]

Don't rate him particularly highly. Great highlights reel though, and I note he just kicked a good goal.

Have always thought he's a conditional footballer who goes missing way too often, for way too long.

And I'm not sure he's someone who is leaving WA either.

You just described Jack Martin. Haha.

I think Liam Ryan is an upgrade.

 

[thylacine60]

It’s the injury prone players I think he’s referring to as you need a squad of at least 30 players to win a flag. We start every season with Marchy, Cunners, Philp and Boyd unavailable. Then after 4-7 games we add the likes of Gov, Martin, Williams and Pitto to that list. It’s why the likes of Ed, Owies, Plowman, Newnes and Levi have played so many games for us over this painful rebuild.

The reliance on injury prone has to stop this seasons end. We could have got rid of 2 of them last year but instead we rolled the dice with Marchy and Cunners and now we are paying the price this year, not mention we could have to turn over as many as 10 players which is not ideal. What we have done with picking and retaining injury prone without any track record of being capable of rehabilitating them is a very big reason why we are in year 10 of a rebuild without a finals appearance.

Please don't translate for MJ. It's hard enough reading the original stuff.

 

[Michael Jezz]

Don't agree. Every side makes 7-9 changes a year, but that doesn't mean it impacts best 22-28

With players returning guys like Owies LOB, Newman, essentially replace Plow, Fog, Philp

Sure we have covered this before, but our age profile is fine, equal lowest number of 29+ year olds( along with the Hawks), with 3 players

7 of the players played Thursday
Age profile is an average. Newman, Docherty,Martin, Mcgovern, e curnow are most likely too old
It is not list changes per year but the number of additional quality players we need to obtain the usual 30 to win a premiership.
We are a bit further than we think

 

[Jeremias]

You just described Jack Martin. Haha.

I think Liam Ryan is an upgrade.

I wouldn't take the current iteration of Martin either. An upgrade isn't saying all that much at the moment.

 

[Michael Jezz]

It’s the injury prone players I think he’s referring to as you need a squad of at least 30 players to win a flag. We start every season with Marchy, Cunners, Philp and Boyd unavailable. Then after 4-7 games we add the likes of Gov, Martin, Williams and Pitto to that list. It’s why the likes of Ed, Owies, Plowman, Newnes and Levi have played so many games for us over this painful rebuild.

The reliance on injury prone has to stop this seasons end. We could have got rid of 2 of them last year but instead we rolled the dice with Marchy and Cunners and now we are paying the price this year, not mention we could have to turn over as many as 10 players which is not ideal. What we have done with picking and retaining injury prone without any track record of being capable of rehabilitating them is a very big reason why we are in year 10 of a rebuild without a finals appearance.

Spot on and in 2015 we needed to recruit 30 players, as our list was so poor. Even north had 7 or 8 good players when clarko walked in. If you draft 4 players a year and 3 make it takes 10 years to deliver the 30 to win a premiership

 

[Michael Jezz]

Please don't translate for MJ. It's hard enough reading the original stuff.

Don't be too optimistic and smug, you might find yourself waiting another 28 years to see a premiership

 

[thylacine60]

Don't be too optimistic and smug, you might find yourself waiting another 28 years to see a premiership

You're suggesting I shouldn't be optimistic about my club. So glad you live on another planet.

 

[Beyond Blue]

For those interested - Would love to hear others go through our 22 and put in bold who we think the flaws are/need to be upgraded

Green is could be improved but mostly due to being youth.

I'll go first with what I think is our B22:

FB: Newman Weitering Mcgovern
HB: Williams Young Saad
C: Acres Cripps Hollands
HF: Fisher Mckay Martin
FF: Motlop Curnow Durdin
F: TDK Walsh Hewett

I/C: Pitto/JSOS Kennedy Cerra Docherty
Sub: Cuningham/Marchbank

Newman - Only due to age, likely start declining over the next couple of years but if he can maintain this level think he's more than adequate.
Hollands - Young, He'll improve and I have a lot of faith he'll end up a very good player but for now he's an area of improvement.
Fisher - Not fast, not penetrating and disappears for large periods of time. Many better options on the market.
Martin - Clearly had a fling with Katy Perry which inspired her to write the song 'Hot n Cold'. Seen enough, adios.
Motlop - Same as Hollands
TDK - Pretty much same as Hollands. He's young and has a lot of upside but for now still somewhat of a weak spot.
Pitto - Injury prone and very limited as a footballer, I like what he brings but his lack of flexibility causes issues with balance re TDK and JSOS as to whether we run 2 rucks or not.
JSOS - Not great in the air, doesn't hit the scoreboard frequently, pretty slow in general. Tries his guts out and makes good decisions but a quality 3rd option would make an incredible difference to our forward set up. Jack simply isn't that.
Cuningham/Marchy - Permanently injured so who knows what to make of them. I think both are quality and fit our needs, but we may never see it happen.

The issue for me is 5 of our best 22-25 players are Cunners, Marchy, Gov, Martin and Williams and over the past 3 years they have played less than 50% of the available games. You cannot have success when you have 20% of your best 22 playing such little footy. Their unavailability just robs us any chance to objectively assess where the likes of Ed, Fisher, SOS, Owies, Tdk, Pitto etc are really at because we simply have to keep playing these if they are fit because there aren’t any other options especially when Dow, Carroll, Kemp, Honey et al aren’t exactly knocking the door down for selection.

I’d be moving on Marchy, Cunners, Gov, and Philp as they are out of contract and just too injury prone to rely on. Pitto is a watch as well as he has missed a lot of since we got him but may stay if TDK leaves. Boyd stays as he is contracted but his injuries are a huge concern - by the time he is back this season he would have missed 2/3 of the games he has been available for through injury - a lot foot related injuries too. Martin will be difficult to move as he is contracted and based on performances worthless so I’d imagine we are stuck with him. Same goes of Williams. If we get rid of the out of contract injury prone guys then we can probably carry these 2.

Then we have decisions to make on other out of contract guys like the Pitto/Tdk conundrum as mentioned before, and Dow, Akeui, Plowman, Ed, Fog all of whom you’d imagine are squarely in the gun. Even if we sign Tdk, Pitto, Kemp, Carroll, Newman, Honey, SOS, SDurdin, Cincotta and OKeefe we could easily have 10 new players next year and that’s a lot but given where the list is, probably entirely needed.

 

[jpfalvo]

Probably a bit Harsh on Acres fitting into a new team, but the rest I totally agree with. Axe needs to fall on Martin & Fisher for (Cuningham & Durdin if fit - nothing the injuries list)

Point in Acres was he was all we did during trade week, when we clearly had more needs and some players to be moved on

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[Wickzki]

You just described Jack Martin. Haha.

I think Liam Ryan is an upgrade.

Salary demand to output makes Ryan a hard no for me.

I think there's ways to get the best out of Jack Martin in our current setup.

The next few months will complete the tale of Martin's career. He either wants to complete his legacy as one of the most overhyped underperforming players of this generation or he wants to be a solid contributor who can turn games.

Needs an absolute rocket but it almost needs to come from himself.

 

[Michael Jezz]

You're suggesting I shouldn't be optimistic about my club. So glad you live on another planet.

I am suggesting our supporter base needs to confront realities even if they do not accord with our perception. We appear capable of sneaking into the finals and winning week 1. We are 10 players away from premiership

 

[jpfalvo]

I don't agree that we're mentally weak. Huge difference between not knowing how to win and being mentally weak.

We choked last year because we didn't know how to seal the deal and we lost our heads too many times and didn't stick with the fundamentals. We did the same on Thursday night and walked away with a draw instead.

A mentally weak team would've taken every excuse that the injury list gave us last year and absolutely capitulated. We didn't do that.

We need to play smarter both individually and as a collective unit.

Calling the team mentally weak is a cop out. There may be individuals that are but it's not endemic of the team.

I called out individuals. Not team on mass.
Secondly i agree, we dont know how to win.

arrow I am quite positive about our prospects in 2023. Finals i think we still will make. I see 14 wins. I like what Austin did at national draft. The selections all look good.

I was pointing out the hilarity of posters now complaining about certain players or list gaps. When they were obvious 6mths ago, but any discussion raised around it was met with, your too negative etc

I repeat, I am still bullish on our 2023 prospects. However i wasnt enamoured by thursday night

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[Wickzki]

Point in Acres was he was all we did during trade week, when we clearly had more needs and some players to be moved on

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Would love to know what players we magically missed out on that would have fit within the current salary structure of the club without impacting the re-signings we've made to our list.

I argue that looking at Acres alone is heavily under selling our trade period and re-signings. Had we made another trade it very well may have meant an inability to trade picks for Cowan. Further trades may have additionally limited the re-signings that we've already made with TDK to come.

I argue that with the contracts that we have ending after this year gives us scope for list improvement in regards to solidifying depth and replacing injury prone players. This may not have been entirely possible had additional moves been made that further complicated our future salary commitments.

It's a much bigger picture than saying Acres and calling it a day.

 

[thylacine60]

Point in Acres was he was all we did during trade week, when we clearly had more needs and some players to be moved on

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give it a spell ffs...

 

[jpfalvo]

28
29
28
33
30

Someone tell Chris Scott

Chris Scott

Age

48

Ht

182cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.6

4star

K

11.2

4star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.1

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

0.4

3star

No current season stats available

D

13.2

4star

K

10.2

4star

HB

3.0

3star

M

2.2

3star

T

2.8

5star

G

0.4

3star

that you can't win a flag with players that old in your side.

What an absurd post.

Your aware of a couple of Geelong facts, before your lazy post.

Geelong premiership with oldest list ever was unprecedented.

Secondly, Brad Scott in season and track record of getting his team deep in finals, is better than anything we have done with the aging players the poster points out.

You do realise this.

Our window is open now, based off the 2016 rebuild commencement, and some of these guys have been around for 8yrs thus they are senior players, who we should be demanding that its time to deliver on their talent and leadership

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[Arr0w]

7 of the players played Thursday
Age profile is an average. Newman, Docherty,Martin, Mcgovern, e curnow are most likely too old
It is not list changes per year but the number of additional quality players we need to obtain the usual 30 to win a premiership.
We are a bit further than we think

MJ while 7 of those players played, it doesn't mean they will all continue to be regulars and may merely be depth in time

Again, compare to the competition as a whole, our age profile is not average at all, this year is the start of our prime years

 

[jpfalvo]

Would love to know what players we magically missed out on that would have fit within the current salary structure of the club without impacting the re-signings we've made to our list.

I argue that looking at Acres alone is heavily under selling our trade period and re-signings. Had we made another trade it very well may have meant an inability to trade picks for Cowan. Further trades may have additionally limited the re-signings that we've already made with TDK to come.

I argue that with the contracts that we have ending after this year gives us scope for list improvement in regards to solidifying depth and replacing injury prone players. This may not have been entirely possible had additional moves been made that further complicated our future salary commitments.

It's a much bigger picture than saying Acres and calling it a day.

Fisher is 1 guy I would have traded back to a rebuilding west coast or freo.

Seeing him go wouldn't have hurt us.

We would have got a second back or swapped for another need.

Salary cap point is valid. However any comment on that has been rubbished in this group has media alarmism. So can't have it both ways.

The boys from the Prendercast have pointed that we should have gone hard for Goldstein. That I agree.

TDK i would have placed on the table and if you get a juicy offer, why not. I cant see us matching Sydney's 8yrs or $$ offer.


Point was, it was clear to me we had gaps. Austin did excellent in drafting, but he could have got creative. We dont need more superstars- so high dollars, picks etc - just role players in key defiency areas.

What else did Austin do at trade week. Moved on setterfield for a packet of chips. When it turns out according to reports, we wanted to keep him, but couldnt afford it.

We needed a Ruck, small fwd and winger. We got the winger not the other 2

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[jpfalvo]

give it a spell ffs...

Stating a fact mate. Give what a spell.

Do you actually read my posts.

Cant get any more positive. Happy with Acres. We will play finals. Most likely finish 5th.

But gaps still to fill.
Injury prone players that need decisions made on.

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