List Mgmt. 2023 Trade Thread - Part II

[stavro#4]

Safe to say Bailey needs a change of scenery…seems to be struggling on and off the field

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Its not a bad idea but natural tall marking forwards dont fall from trees. Caminiti is a ripper and he will become one of the best key forwards in the game given time. The other huge asset Hammer has when playing forward is his capacity to put on forward pressure - not many key forwards can do that. We have Van Es & Adams developing in the key defensive positions, but if we off load Howard we will need to bring in another ready to play tall defender. I think its a given that Highmore will be delisted at seasons end.

If we cant attract another player as a trade, we may have to look at developing Jack Hayes or Caminiti in the tall defender position. Hayes would be my go to given his maturity, size, strength and marking capacities.

Re Phillipou we just need to show some patience and let him mature and develop an AFL ready physique. He has the drive and wants to play midfield and as his strength grows so will his dynamic movements and inside game. Hopefully as that improves so will his tackling techniques as he is being brushed aside by bigger bodies at present.

Its also nice to read we are actively chasing a number of midfielders. If we can add one or two quality players to our midfield next year it will go a long way to us pushing for a top 4 spot and becoming serious challengers.

I don't see any evidence of this at all.

Scud's tackling has been outstanding for a 1st year player.

 

[saintmike65]

That's why I'm heading back to someone like Matt Crouch. He's an extractor but probably on $450k and zero cost at the trade table. Should be finishing up just as the youth are ready to take over. I'm not sure that those inside mids are worth as much as they were 5 years ago.

I don’t think Matt Crouch is on our radar

 

[Tommy Wigs]

The Essendon wankfest makes me spew up, I’m glad they’re a rabble

100%. I think the same of the Dogs too. Win a game and then they’re winning a flag (for about a decade now). The best weekend of all time.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Its not a bad idea but natural tall marking forwards dont fall from trees. Caminiti is a ripper and he will become one of the best key forwards in the game given time. The other huge asset Hammer has when playing forward is his capacity to put on forward pressure - not many key forwards can do that. We have Van Es & Adams developing in the key defensive positions, but if we off load Howard we will need to bring in another ready to play tall defender. I think its a given that Highmore will be delisted at seasons end.

If we cant attract another player as a trade, we may have to look at developing Jack Hayes or Caminiti in the tall defender position. Hayes would be my go to given his maturity, size, strength and marking capacities.

Re Phillipou we just need to show some patience and let him mature and develop an AFL ready physique. He has the drive and wants to play midfield and as his strength grows so will his dynamic movements and inside game. Hopefully as that improves so will his tackling techniques as he is being brushed aside by bigger bodies at present.

Its also nice to read we are actively chasing a number of midfielders. If we can add one or two quality players to our midfield next year it will go a long way to us pushing for a top 4 spot and becoming serious challengers.

Agree with you here. I actually think Hammer could be a superb CHB, but perhaps he’ll be just as good / better forward and probably harder to find.

I’m not sold on Adams at all. He’s young and still skinny and disrupted year last year, sure. But I’m not seeing it personally.

 

[SteeleSaints]

I don't see any evidence of this at all.

Scud's tackling has been outstanding for a 1st year player.

As far as chase down tackles are concerned you are right, but when players take him front on he attempts to tackle with his arms rather than his shoulders. He doesnt lower his head and is brushed off far too easily. Obviously he is a 1st year player its not that he doesnt have a go, its technique and that will improve with strength and confidence.

 

[RWB4life]

Agree with you here. I actually think Hammer could be a superb CHB, but perhaps he’ll be just as good / better forward and probably harder to find.

I’m not sold on Adams at all. He’s young and still skinny and disrupted year last year, sure. But I’m not seeing it personally.

There's van es as well. I would use a 3rd or forth on another kpp this draft to keep them coming in keep developing them hoping to find one

On SM-S918B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Captain Paddy]

He is a gun inside mid.

Statistically he dominates Steele and crouch with those key stats.

If Essendon have an issue with him. my suggestion would be that they need to go and develop their outside mids.

Imagine Parish getting the ball out to Sincs NWM Pou or even just allowing us to use Owens forward of the centre.

You need to support your side with complimentary pieces.

All the points of Parish being more focused on his stats/poor kicking will get ironed out by Ross. He's all about playing to your strengths and can get anyone to buy in (see Milne starting to chase and tackle)

Best clearance player getting encouraged to play his game and get the ball out to Sincs and Nas sounds pretty damn good to me.

 

[70s sainter]

Pure extractors are a bit out of style these days but not having one is making your own life harder as well. I'm not as into fashion. There is still a place for them and it makes footy less laborious. He's not a bull like Libba and he's got a softness that makes him a bit vanilla but if he comes for no capital and we don't pay too much over what they offer I think he's a good target. Still prefer Crouch just as a low cost similar type with a bit more size to him. Gresham compo makes him a trade though I guess but he'd be cheap as chips still.

They may be but look at our 2nd half v Carlton. Couldn’t get near the ball around clearances . Would make a huge difference.

 

[Captain Paddy]

In the longer term could we turn Caminiti into the Big CHB and trade Doogs keeping Cordy as the shut down defender.

Allows us to go all out mids.

Doogs and Gresh get us early 20 picks in combo with our 2ndrdp and maybe next year's first in combo for

GCS pick 5 and Flanders and/or Hewitt or Robertson 'the rig' from Bris.

On SM-S916B using BigFooty.com mobile app

TBH I reckon Hammer ends up being trade bait

 

[beside the seaside]

TBH I reckon Hammer ends up being trade bait

The club have been pretty coy on him RTB included I don't think they want to moz him but if you compared his stats to most if not all first year key forwards he'd have them all covered. And he's never even done an AFL pre-season.

Honestly I reckon he'd be one of the last players on the list we'd trade.

 

[Joffaboy]

TBH I reckon Hammer ends up being trade bait

Yes true, and 2 firsts for King as well, also trade Owens and Pou

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[jh38]

They may be but look at our 2nd half v Carlton. Couldn’t get near the ball around clearances . Would make a huge difference.

All our mids had an off day that day, bar Owens. When he wasn’t in the midfield, we weren’t winning a clearance.

Crouch and Steele are extractors who’ve added strings to their bow. No need for another inside mid, we need a player who’s an upgrade on Zak Jones.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Veer Right]

The club have been pretty coy on him RTB included I don't think they want to moz him but if you compared his stats to most if not all first year key forwards he'd have them all covered. And he's never even done an AFL pre-season.

Honestly I reckon he'd be one of the last players on the list we'd trade.

Could not agree more.

For a first year KPF he has looked superb and playing like a top 10 pick.

I hope he continues to work his bum off in the preseason and starts the year at CHF, round one next year.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Bailey Smith v Jack Sinclair in a two man competitive 2km in preseason.

Loser shaves the mullet off.

View attachment 1780798

Much as I don't like them - the mullets seem to be working. If we were to get Smith I'd say both should keep them.
(You know what happened when Samson's hair was cut )

 

[Barrels]

Much as I don't like them - the mullets seem to be working. If we were to get Smith I'd say both should keep them.
(You know what happened when Samson's hair was cut )

Got there in the end, though…

 

[Barrels]

The club have been pretty coy on him RTB included I don't think they want to moz him but if you compared his stats to most if not all first year key forwards he'd have them all covered. And he's never even done an AFL pre-season.

Honestly I reckon he'd be one of the last players on the list we'd trade.

Sure stacks up, for mine.

 

[beside the seaside]

View attachment 1781062View attachment 1781063
View attachment 1781069View attachment 1781070
Sure stacks up, for mine.

I just compared him with Ben King and Jamarra at the same age and he has both covered.

 

[stavro#4]

Mowman

https://x.com/superfooty/status/1693473110228619734?s=46&t=PAfL6g6GVlAlOjWQMR7WBw

 

[Mowman]

Mowman

https://x.com/superfooty/status/1693473110228619734?s=46&t=PAfL6g6GVlAlOjWQMR7WBw

Wreck it Ralph: Every free agent — where is your club placed with its players​

Ben McKay is the biggest fish in the free agency pool, but a lot more players remain unsigned. Jon Ralph checks in on every free agent in the AFL and gives an update on their future.

Jon Ralph
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@RalphyHeraldSun

9 min read
August 21, 2023 - 1:50PM
News Corp Australia Sports Newsroom

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01:59
'Suns will win a flag in 4 years'

AFL: The First Crack's David King declares Gold Coast will win a flag by 2027 under the man who's set to become their new coach Damien Hardwick.

AFL​

Don't miss out on the headlines from AFL. Followed categories will be added to My News.
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Alastair Clarkson needs to call in every favour he has ever accumulated over 36 years in the AFL industry.
North Melbourne is close to securing the No.1 draft pick, but whether the Kangaroos also get pick 2 depends on the value of the hottest free agent left, Ben McKay.
Someone has to pay McKay up to $800,000 a season to trigger the first-round free agency compensation that would see that selection follow the No.1 overall pick.
Sydney, Port Adelaide and Essendon are all keen on defenders, but the Dons don’t believe McKay is worth that much.
The AFL has confirmed the Roos cannot top up the McKay salary to trigger first-round compo – clubs can only pay a portion of existing contracts in trades, not future deals.
So Clarkson has to plead and hope and cajole a rival into stumping up the cash.
How much exactly would the contract need to be?
Essendon secured first-round compensation for a three-year $750,000 deal for Joe Daniher in Brisbane, with the key forward then signing a two-year extension only a year later.
The AFL eventually ticked off that subsequent deal (which would have smoothed out the salary over five seasons), so surely there is a club that might follow a similar formula even as it skirts close to the league’s rules.

Which clubs will make a play for Ben McKay? Picture: Michael Willson/AFL Photos via Getty Images
Under the AFL’s formula every player 25 and over has their salaries listed by the AFL, with a contract in the top 5 per cent earning first-round compensation for a free agency move.
Daniher’s deal was signed in 2020, so McKay’s salary might need to be over $800,000 given pay rises since that date.
On the same weekend as the Roos inherited the No.1 pick, Jesse Hogan annihilated Brandon Zerk-Thatcher (who, to be fair, got no help from his midfield) in a nine-goal performance.
Clarkson will have to hope an Essendon side that has given up six goals twice this year to Tom Hawkins might believe McKay’s price is worth it.
Jon Ralph assesses every free agent on the AFL landscape, with all players previously delisted then relisted qualifying for unrestricted free agency status.

ADELAIDE​

Tom Doedee is the main concern with round 24 in coming days and he still hasn’t signed the club’s long-term offer.
Why wouldn’t he stay, given the Crows are going places, he has a nice little radio and TV side gig with Adelaide media and there is a clear role for him in the Crows defence.
Brisbane is the only confirmed suitor right now.
Matt Crouch would ideally stay in Adelaide but has played five excellent games in a row, enough to get a two-year deal at a club desperate for clearance power.
He surely cannot believe he is certain to remain in the first-choice midfield at Adelaide.
Rory Sloane has just signed a one-year deal, while Paul Seedsman has retired with concussion issues.
Tyler Brown has played 17 mostly excellent SANFL games, averaging 97 SuperCoach points and 22 possessions, so will hope for another one-year deal.

Tom Doedee’s future remains up in the air. Picture: Dylan Burns/AFL Photos via Getty Images

BRISBANE LIONS​

Daniel Rich is 33 and likely out of chances as the new breed come through, so will strongly consider retirement, while Dayne Zorko would believe he has another season in him despite turning 35 in February.
He is uncontracted, but his issues are body rather than form-related.
Nakia Cockatoo’s VFL form has been encouraging in 17 games, so he is hopeful of another one-year deal.
Rhys Mathieson missed six games mid-year with a hamstring issue but hasn’t played a single AFL game and hits free agency, so his future might be elsewhere.
Irish defender Darragh Joyce has played only five AFL games and none since round 6.

CARLTON​

There are teams in the AFL who need a clever mid-sized forward who can go into the centre square to relieve a first-choice ruckman.
Carlton just isn’t one of those sides.
So Jack Silvagni’s manager is assessing rival interest although it’s not out of the realms of possibility Carlton would re-sign him on a modest deal.
But if he can find a club like Richmond or Melbourne (if they trade Brodie Grundy) who will play him, it would be clever business to move on.
David Cuningham will be re-signed, Lachie Plowman is in trouble, Ed Curnow was the last man signed last year but has played 17 games (often as the sub), so might get one last year.
There is enough defensive depth that key back Sam Durdin might be nervous.

Jack Silvagni could be set for a fresh start. Picture: Daniel Pockett/Getty Images

COLLINGWOOD​

Oleg Markov is a required player after being overlooked in the summer rookie draft for Oscar Steene then securing a one-year deal when Charlie Dean was injured again.
Despite his strong form it might only be a one-year deal, while Cooper Murley has kicked 13 goals in 18 games in the VFL as a free agent delisted last year then relisted by the Pies.

ESSENDON​

Darcy Parish wants to stay but also wants to get paid.
Which is entirely fair enough as a restricted free agent who has put together two seasons of excellent form.
Geelong’s interest seems to have cooled, so Parish might have to accept excellent rather than outrageous money.
It would be smart business for Essendon to re-sign him if they are truly keen on Ben McKay, given the McKay deal would neutralise any Parish free agency compensation if he departed.
Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti will retire, and three goals in the past eight weeks in the VFL makes it harder to give him a farewell game against the Pies.
Dyson Heppell should sign another one-year deal after 12 weeks of consistently strong form in defence.
Will Snelling only has six goals in 14 AFL games but should be at the Hangar next year.

Dyson Heppell is likely to play on at the Bombers next year. Picture: Dylan Burns/AFL Photos via Getty Images

FREMANTLE​

Joel Hamling is the Dockers’ only free agent, finally fit after a horror injury run and keen to extend his career at a rival club given he is unlikely to win a new deal with the Dockers.
As revealed by the Herald Sun in March, Liam Henry, who is not a free agent, is considering his future, but he is the only real list issue as long as Sean Darcy signs a long-term pre-agency deal over summer.

GEELONG​

Isaac Smith timed his retirement perfectly instead of pushing on for one more year at a Cats outfit that knows it needs to play more kids.
Jon Ceglar’s injury-prone season means his two-year stint could come to a close while Sam Menegola wants to play on after knee issues and has put together six increasingly strong games.
That is likely to be at another club.
Tom Hawkins will sign on for another one-year deal, while Rhys Stanley is also on track to play on unless the Cats shock with a Sean Darcy-style ruck acquisition.

Sam Menegola could continue his career at another club. Picture: Sarah Reed/AFL Photos via Getty Images

GOLD COAST​

Levi Casboult is footy’s great survivor, about to win a third season at the Suns after his strong career at Carlton.
Sam Day is only 30 and has averaged 2.2 goals in the VFL but the Suns might have enough key-position cover to moved gone past him.
Ditto for ex-Giants defender Jake Stein.
Connor Blakely and Charlie Constable were also brought in as cover and given Constable played only two senior games (rounds 1 and 2), Damien Hardwick might move on all of his free agents bar Casboult.

GWS GIANTS​

Daniel Lloyd can feel rightly proud to have eked out a solid AFL career before retiring last week, while Phil Davis was a foundation Giant who did so much to forge this club’s identity and also retired on Monday.
Lachie Keeffe continues to be a valuable role player who adds valuable depth and, while he is 33, the Giants should strongly consider handing him another season.
Matthew Flynn has had his thunder stolen by fellow ruckman Kieren Briggs and will have interest elsewhere, but there are plenty of back-up ruckmen looking for new homes in a crowded landscape.
He is averaging excellent numbers in the VFL – 16 possessions, 109 SuperCoach points, 4.4 clearances.

HAWTHORN​

Just the one free agent for the Hawks – Fergus Greene.
The former Bulldogs-listed player and VFL success story kicked 15 goals in 11 AFL games.
His VFL form is strong and unless they can find a foil for Mitch Lewis (trade target Jake Riccardi just re-signed at GWS) he’s valuable insurance for a young side.

MELBOURNE​

James Jordon is a free agent after being delisted and then relisted, and clubs including Essendon, Gold Coast and Sydney are interested.
The Demons want to re-sign him, but he would get a long-term deal and a more prominent role elsewhere.
Jake Melksham had 15 goals in nine games before a goalless past two games, then bounced back with 3.4 against Hawthorn.
He turns 33 in the next fortnight and would believe he can secure a one-year deal.
Michael Hibberd turns 34 in January, so his age is against him, but in 11 games he is shown he is still a tight-checking defender in an excellent backline, so he’s a chance to play on.

Jake Melksham is likely to sign a one-year deal with the Demons. Picture: Mark Stewart

NORTH MELBOURNE​

If rivals only offer Ben McKay $700,000the Roos will match the bid, so they will be desperate for a bidding war between Sydney, Port Adelaide and Essendon to get his free agency deal to that magical threshold for first-round compensation (which under current ladder position would get them pick 2).
Jack Ziebell has just retired, Kayne Turner’s career would seem likely to come to a close despite 11 senior games, and Todd Goldstein is likely to sign one more single-season deal.
If he isn’t re-signed he will play on elsewhere as ruck cover.
Liam Shiels and Dan Howe are also free agents, so it is a Clarko call on Shiels who has played 16 reasonable games and provided key off-field leadership.

PORT ADELAIDE​

Scott Lycett will likely look elsewhere for a two-year deal as his $650,000 a season five-year deal expires.
Charlie Dixon will play on with a one-year deal yet to be brokered, while Travis Boak wants to play on and will be given the chance on a one-year deal.
Tom Jonas looks more likely to retire, especially if the Power can land another key defender, while Riley Bonner will have to wait for a new deal after 11 games in the AFL as a wingman but excellent SANFL form when he has been demoted to the lower level.

Travis Boak wants to play on next year. Picture: Darrian Traynor/AFL Photos/via Getty Images

RICHMOND​

Kamdyn McIntosh is technically a free agent, but has hit a games-based trigger so will be at Punt Rd in 2024.
Free agents Trent Cotchin and Jack Riewoldt just joined Robbie Tarrant in retirement, so $1 million or more of cap space will be freed up, although much of it will be swallowed up when Shai Bolton’s seven-figure deal kicks in next year.
Bigoa Nyuon is also a free agent after being delisted and relisted. He has played only one AFL game but after strong VFL form as a ruckman and defender he will be confident of another contract.

ST KILDA​

Mason Wood is a free agent, but has hit a games-based trigger that means he will be at RSEA Park for 2024.
Jade Gresham has been strongly linked to Carlton but that deal is not yet done, and if nothing else has last eight weeks of improved form have helped his contract price.
Will another suitor apart from the Blues emerge, with the Saints seemingly happy to take the compo pick and go back to the draft?
Liam Stocker can expect a multi-year deal after climbing off footy’s scrap heap while Jimmy Webster is an automatic selection each week and can also expect a new deal after strong form since returning from a fractured cheekbone.
Dan McKenzie is also an unrestricted free agent but has had a torrid run with injury, so should stay at the club under Ross Lyon.
Tom Campbell’s future depends on finding more ruck insurance for Rowan Marshall. His VFL form is excellent, so he could stay on the list.

Jade Gresham has been linked to Carlton. Picture: Michael Klein

SYDNEY​

Lance Franklin has retired and Sam Reid’s season was decimated by injury.
He is about to turn 32 but did play 18 games last year, so his future depends upon how much John Longmire believes he needs key-position cover.
Defender Lewis Melican has been linked to the Roos and he is an unrestricted free agent. He would be a low-risk, high-reward prospect at Arden St.

WEST COAST​

Luke Shuey and Shannon Hurn have just retired, with Isiah Winder the only other free agent on the list.
Winder has played only five WAFL games this year after a troublesome summer, banished by the club from training with his teammates then avoiding an assault charge after an altercation during a Geelong indigenous players summit.
He would need everything to go right to secure another deal.

WESTERN BULLDOGS​

More Coverage​

Trade buzz: Factors that may hold back Bombers’ McKay pursuit
Robbo: Does Richmond want to be romantic or ruthless?
Bailey Williams is close to a new deal after playing every game this year, but given it’s round 24 rivals will be asking questions.
Other clubs should circle Toby McLean who has produced huge VFL numbers but managed only five AFL games.
Tim O’Brien is hopeful of a one-year deal, and Taylor Duryea is expected to get another one-year deal after 20 solid games as a lock-down defender

 

[stfan]

Blow for Ballincollig and Cork as Liam O'Connell agrees AFL move to St Kilda

Cork U20 O’Connell has attracted interest from Carlton and Melbourne in recent weeks and months, but it’s with St Kilda he has signed the dotted line

www.irishexaminer.com

He lived in Australia between the ages of four and 11 so he has knowledge of the game

Cork’s Liam O’Connell the latest promising footballer to make move Down Under to St Kilda

Another promising Gaelic footballer is set for a career in the AFL with Cork's Liam O'Connell signing for St Kilda.

www.independent.ie

St Kilda reportedly pips rivals to sign 20-year-old Gaelic star

The Saints are understood to have beat out a pair of Victorian clubs to sign the Irishman.

www.zerohanger.com

The Saints, in an exciting development for the club ahead of this year's finals series, are understood to have acquired the services of Irishman Liam O'Connell from the Ballincollig Gaelic Football Club U20s in Cork, Ireland.

 

[St Neil]

He's going to Geelong.

Geelong just don’t have the picks. And the cliff has now arrived. They need to get back to the draft and load up again.

 

[StCicatriz]

theres plenty of veterans on the table, if we are smart we could get a real bargain

 

[St Neil]

So listening to Whately with King.

Fawns over Carlton. Reckon Essendon is better than last year, Suns will win a flag in the next few years
All of them given minutes. Comes to St.Kilda, less than a minute, King says we aren't skilled and somehow made the finals. Reckons bagging us is not a slight.

Really sick of these media idiots. King, Owens, Naz, Pou, Sincs, Steele, Wilks, etc but we aren't skilled.
Us against the world guys, us against the world.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

During the “First Crack” program on Fox Footy King was much more sanguine about Saints.

He drooled about how he loves to watch us play. He said we lack Premiership class at the moment but that there is no greater compliment than being a team that is “difficult to play”. And we are that team in the AFL.

King also went on to say that there needs to be more focus on what we have rather than what we don’t have. He was really bullish. Especially as the best defensive team in the competition.

Sounds like King is saying one thing on TV and another on the radio.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Cork’s Liam O’Connell the latest promising footballer to make move Down Under to St Kilda

Another promising Gaelic footballer is set for a career in the AFL with Cork's Liam O'Connell signing for St Kilda.

www.independent.ie

Key takeaways

• O'Connell is 20 and was a member of the Cork U-20 team this year.
• He lived in Australia between the ages of four and 11 so he has knowledge of the game
• O'Connell's athleticism has apparently drawn St Kilda to him.

How Irish is this sentence

BALLINCOLLIG football manager Podsie O’Mahony has revealed that young player Liam O’Connell has signed an AFL contract with St Kilda and will head over to Australia in the next fortnight.

The club have been pretty coy on him RTB included I don't think they want to moz him but if you compared his stats to most if not all first year key forwards he'd have them all covered. And he's never even done an AFL pre-season.

Honestly I reckon he'd be one of the last players on the list we'd trade.

Jacob Van Rooyen and Anthony Caminiti AFL Stats Comparison

Jacob Van Rooyen and Anthony Caminiti AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

Jye Amiss and Anthony Caminiti AFL Stats Comparison

Jye Amiss and Anthony Caminiti AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com