List Mgmt. 2024 List Mismanagement and Trading

[Mutineer]

I think the club thought Butters would slip to the McHenry pick. Was reported we liked him.

I think Hamish said that on trade radio subsequently?

 

[1990crow]

I think Hamish said that on trade radio subsequently?

Not sure but remember we were linked to him in the lead up.
Who knows, maybe we nearly did take him at 9.

Hindsight obviously what we should have done.
That or offer up 9 and 16 to Brisbane for the Rozee pick.

 

[George Kramer]

So we've had the youngest & least experienced team all year, yet the Cartel would have us believe that we're not playing the kids enough?

One of the key reasons why we've been so inconsistent is the lack of age & experience in our team. That's not to say that we should have been playing "cooked" players like Brodie Smith. It's saying that we don't have enough experienced AFL-standard players on our list - a problem which is exacerbated by the deterioration of the senior players we do have.

Hmm maybe if younger players were played earlier they’d have more experience…

 

[George Kramer]

You mean not letting the BF Cartel get their hands on shiny new toys, before the toys are ready to be played with?

Putting games into duds - Murphy being the prime (and almost only) example - can be justified on the basis of a lack of alternatives. We simply don't have anyone with whom to replace him. I really wish we did, but the fact is that we don't. This is why the recruitment of ANB is so important (infinitely more important than Luko).

Yes the club has timed their debuts just right, every single one of them, none were ready earlier

 

[Vader]

The issue is Nicks took too long when it was so obvious even Big Footy posters knew it months ago. Better late than never I guess but what if he resort to the same next year.......

The difference is that BF is disrespectful, and very quick to hang. They're the kings of knee-jerk reactions.

These senior players have earned the extra time that the club has given them. The club gave them the extra time, and moved them on when that time expired without signs of improvement.

I'm not saying that the club couldn't/shouldn't have acted quicker, but the knee-jerk Cartel position is no better - and almost certainly worse.

 

[Vader]

Compare Mitchell who started the rebuild to Nicks.

That tells you all you need to know how much having a coach who knows what they are doing makes a difference.

Nicks is still on his learner plates after 5 years making new & repeat mistakes... which won't change in the future, because he really isn't up to it.

The fact our club management don't realise means they need a clean out too as incapable of making good key decisions.

Hawthorn didn't gut their list as extensively as we did ours. They still have quality veterans sprinkled throughout the side, supporting their kids. Our veterans have hit the cliff.

 

[BRL121]

Hawthorn didn't gut their list as extensively as we did ours. They still have quality veterans sprinkled throughout the side, supporting their kids. Our veterans have hit the cliff.

It's interesting. Gunston looked well past it last year, and Bruest looked gone ages ago, yet they have had a real rejuvenation under Mitchell. That's a point in favour of giving them a cahnce, rather than axing them.

Perhaps, we need a new coach?

 

[Danger in Texas]

Hawthorn didn't gut their list as extensively as we did ours. They still have quality veterans sprinkled throughout the side, supporting their kids. Our veterans have hit the cliff.

Reckon Hawthorn knew the right ones to move on, too

Low impact guys like JOM and Mitchell were the right ones to move, so they could prioritise Day, Newk etc. That’s what we should do now with Laird, but won’t

 

[Mutineer]

Not sure but remember we were linked to him in the lead up.
Who knows, maybe we nearly did take him at 9.

Hindsight obviously what we should have done.
That or offer up 9 and 16 to Brisbane for the Rozee pick.

Twomey acting on his intel had us taking Caldwell with our 1st and Butters with our 2nd. Jones he had linked to Geelong.

I wonder how Chayce would have turned out at the Cats?

 

[Redline]

As for those that think you don’t need senior players with a young side look at hawthorn

Plenty of experience scattered around the ground

Difference is they perform their roles and they don’t need to be central roles like we seem to give ours when often not deserved

You always need experienced players but you need good experience. We needed to bring some in from other clubs. It's hurts alot for people to hear but our senior player don't provide good leadership.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Hawthorn didn't gut their list as extensively as we did ours. They still have quality veterans sprinkled throughout the side, supporting their kids. Our veterans have hit the cliff.

What?

Hawks cut harder than us.

Forget the criticism they got for trading out Mitchell & O'Meara?

They have no more veterans than us!

 

[hugecannon]

I said that previously just above

I was agreeing with you

 

[Danger in Texas]

What?

Hawks cut harder than us.

Forget the criticism they got for trading out Mitchell & O'Meara?

They have no more veterans than us!

I suspect Vader’s talking about the 2019/20 exodus

Though we might need to look at doing it again, given the rebuild ain’t over

 

[119others]

I think the club thought Butters would slip to the McHenry pick. Was reported we liked him.

ZAK BUTTERS​

POS: Midfielder
Ht 181cm, Wt 70kg, DOB 8/9/00
From Western Jets/Vic Metro

Most things Butters touches turns into a good piece of play for his side. He's smaller and slight, but he runs with the ball well, hits his targets, makes the play and creates. He will start more as a small forward option and potentially progress onto a wing in time, and Adelaide has been interested in him among their batch of picks. Butters has recovered from his mid-season shoulder surgery and last week completed a 2km time trial under the watchful eyes of recruiters.

If not him? There's a few possibilities, but it'll be interesting to see who is left for the Crows to take. Would Jackson Hately get there or would they try for Riley Collier-Dawkins? There's a slim chance Chayce Jones is still on the board as well.

TOMORROW'S HEROES Cool-headed Jet is an elite ball user

Callum Twomey's 2018 Phantom Draft

Who will your club take in the NAB AFL Draft? Our guru makes the call

www.afl.com.au

 

[Jeffcrowe]

You always need experienced players but you need good experience. We needed to bring some in from other clubs. It's hurts alot of people to hear but our senior player don't provide good leadership.

Agree - Exactly what I’ve said ^!

 

[Jeffcrowe]

What?

Hawks cut harder than us.

Forget the criticism they got for trading out Mitchell & O'Meara?

They have no more veterans than us!

Hawthorn have Gunston who looked washed up at brisbane and Breust who plays peripheral roles and sub

Also guys like frost who would be our 2nd oldest player

It’s the way they use them , they still got them and they’re still important

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Twomey acting on his intel had us taking Caldwell with our 1st and Butters with our 2nd. Jones he had linked to Geelong.

I wonder how Chayce would have turned out at the Cats?

Chayce probably be a star at the cats

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Hawthorn have Gunston who looked washed up at brisbane and Breust who plays peripheral roles and sub

Also guys like frost who would be our 2nd oldest player

It’s the way they use them , they still got them and they’re still important

Sure, but that's similar or less than the experienced players we have. We have Tex, Smith & Laird for starters.

Trying to claim the Hawks have the edge on us because of experienced players is BS.

 

[ABAB]

Sure, but that's similar or less than the experienced players we have. We have Tex, Smith & Laird for starters.

Trying to claim the Hawks have the edge on us because of experienced players is BS.

The Hawks are like us last year when we just missed out on the 8 except none of their senior players are having the season Walker had, Smith was good when he got moved to the wing and Laird wasn't as shit. None have performed this year except for Walker who had an ok season.

 

[ABAB]

What?

Hawks cut harder than us.

Forget the criticism they got for trading out Mitchell & O'Meara?

They have no more veterans than us!

I would be surprise if the Hawks cut as hard as us end of 2019 and 2020 then we loss B.Crouch, Kelly and Atkins to FA.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I would be surprise if the Hawks cut as hard as us end of 2019 and 2020 then we loss B.Crouch, Kelly and Atkins to FA.

They did & were criticised for cutting too far

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Sure, but that's similar or less than the experienced players we have. We have Tex, Smith & Laird for starters.

Trying to claim the Hawks have the edge on us because of experienced players is BS.

Who said that

Wow this board is funny

All I did was say that some senior players in your side are necessary

Basically said ours don’t help us enough

 

[Jeffcrowe]

I think Hamish said that on trade radio subsequently?

I’d say that if I was him too

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Who said that

Wow this board is funny

All I did was say that some senior players in your side are necessary

Basically said ours don’t help us enough

That's how this conversation started...

 

[119others]

The only reason we've been forced to replace senior players with kids is because we didn't plan for the future and have stalled the rebuilt as a result

Here's an example

In 2020 we go into the season with Brodie Smith on 167 games and Josh Worrell on 0 games. What Nicks did was give Smith a further 95 AFL games, and Worrell 29 games. While not a direct replacement, by the time Nicks "retires" Smith, a defensive replacement we have for him hasn't even played 30 games.

If in 2020 we traded Smith and backed in Worrell, now at the end of 2024 our replacement is no longer a kid, but (by my maths, factoring in injuries) a 70 game player.

Let's say at the end of 2021 we go to a Rory Sloane (211 games) or Rory Laird (160 games) and say, thanks mate, you're not required in the midfield moving forward. We just drafted Luke Pedlar with a first round pick and he's a midfielder.

Instead of handing out an extra 44 games to Sloane or 86 games to Laird in the midfield, we develop Pedlar instead. He goes from our current reality of being a 30 game player in 2024, to a 60+ game player. In an alternate reality when Sloane retires (or would have retired if he kept playing) we'd have a 60 game replacement right there, not a kid, or a Billy Dowling or Zac Taylor

Maybe those decisions don't pan out, Pedlar doesn't become the player we want, Worrell doesn't succeed. But going down an alternate route means that in 2024 their replacements are ready to go AFL players.

I seriously think you would be better off not being a Mod here mate. Your resentment (hatred?) and clear bending of the truth would be more palatable that way. Just not healthy and quite unprecedented from any other BF Mod I have ever seen.

This Brodie Smith and Worrell thing is ridiculous - and you know it.

One is a flanker. The other a KPP or third tall at 195cm. Trying to compare them as 'interchangeable' is totally laughable and inappropriate.

Smith finished 4/5/6/7 in the B&F from 2020 onwards. This year he has lost form and lost his place in the team. Wont be in the top 10.

Worrell was drafted as very raw and always reported to take a few years to get up to speed. His own immaturity (do you need the article again?) followed by injuries meant a delayed permanent place in the team. Plus we had Doedee who was a very solid 3rd defensive tall.

Play all the youngsters from day one and be bottom 2 for 4-5 years like Kangas. Is that what you wanted? Then no players would choose to come here - inc Dawson and Rankine - if we are a basket case every year. Not only that but playing Worrell YEARS before he is ready and it would be McAsey all over again. Out of their depth and probably lost to the game, or at least the club for 'inappropriate treatment'

We had dud draft years in 2016, 2018 and 2019 (and no 1st/2nd rounder in 2012 and 2013) meaning 5 years out of 8 we had NOTHING coming in and lost multiple AA players that didnt want to live in Adelaide - Danger, MM, Lever, CC.

You have picked the wrong example in Smith on many levels inc position actually played and his solid performances whilst we underwent our first ever TOTAL rebuild. No sensible conversation about rebuilds doesnt include keeping SOME Snr players to support the young guys going thru - and Smith has done that. Until this year