Maybe the same mob that can't get the AFL side above half way up the ladder also can't get the SANFL side above halfway up the ladder because they're bloody hopeless.
Rumour 2024 Rumours and Speculation (Rumours total 25, last 28th August)
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He’s having a good season, has been especially noticeable since Gather Round. Clunking more marks (12th for contested marks) and very important in most of our scoring chains. Kept McCartin and Blakey honest the other night too, another thing he’s developed is not allowing his opponent to intercept easily.
Btw, he did have 20 and kicked 2 against the Eagles.
- Jul 14, 2012
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Not sure why you just highlighted that, but that was against two very good AA defenders. Anyway, he’s having a good season and will be better with RT in the side too.
If we were contenders I'd agree but we need to start putting together a forward line that will contend and Tex won't be part of that. We need to find a workable solution now.Tex really is the least of our problems though. If we are talking about the likes of Laird and Smith I totally agree with your first point.
AA last year and without him we literally had to rely on Borlase playing forward...
Fogarty still hasn't stepped up to grab the number 1 KPF role yet and TT is still an unknown quantity coming back from injury. Combine that with EH likely to go and Welsh being extremely raw, we really have nothing else to go with forward.
I agree with Smith and Laird but their roles are less structurally important and can be dropped.
I keep hearing he is important as he directs the forwards but surely it's time someone else does that. Let's face it maybe he is not directing them to the right spots as on the whole the last five years have been poor.
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That was in a game we effectively won by 100~ points, you or me could have kicked a few that day. Since then:
Sydney he had 2 goals and 8 touches,
basket case Richmond he had 3 goals, 14 touches
Hawks he had 2 goals and 9 touches
That is the absolute definition of tease player at 25yo and nearly 100 games....
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But who mate? Assuming EH goes - we will literally have TT (unknown post injury), Welsh (raw draftee), Burgess, and Gollant? T Murray?..... Bueller?
Give me names.
10-15 touches is fairly standard for a key forward, not sure why you’re highlighting that as a negative. Regardless of what your ‘eye test’ says, he’s having a good season.
jackster83
The Feats of Strength
The SANFL is a good competition with a decent standard of football.
However it is not compatible with what we want or need.
(A) They hate us. Even more than Port (if that's possible). I mean it's almost unhinged how much they despise us.
(B) They play under different rules. This is a definite issue for 1st year players, who have to adapt.
(C) They play on (mostly) smaller grounds where the Battersby types dominate. Again not good for our 1st/2nd year players.
(D) If we play in the VFL, our Victorian draftees get more of a chance to connect with their families.
Remaining in the SANFL is a good (financial) result for the SANFL but terrible for us and our player development.
- Jul 14, 2012
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Jake Waterman and Josh Treacy are having better years than him and are of similar age profile.
I'll trust my eye test than meaningless stats he's had against garbage teams.
At 25yo and nearly 100 games, along with being a first round draft pick - fair to say its time we start seeing some huge games.
I don't know but that's the issue. We need to find someone internally and that looks unlikely or get someone in but they need to be in the right age bracket.
We are our own worst enemy as for player development
Will TT be unknown by the end of the season though? What if he returns and kicks 4 per game? And in the end what’s the benefit of a good year from Tex pushing us up to 10th next year when we need to bottom out and get another pick 4-5 into the club.
Wanting him signed now, regardless of how his season concludes is insanity.
GreyCrow
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Great Richmond player - of course I would
He’s not coming as a player, we want him for his expertise off-field…. the stuff he learnt at the Redlegs.
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GreyCrow
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Ha ha ha you just posted my reply to you. Why reply if you wanted to leave it?
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How many times has a player got 20d and 5g all season? And you expect Fog to do it 3 times a year himself? With our delivery to him? No chance.
Sounds like a forward coaches problem.
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Bear in mind that he's been playing in front of Fitzroy quality performances in each of those three games
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I wonder why people want Tex to play on?
Is it the last of the 2009/2010 players and the supporters don't want to feel old
Or is it that they think Tex will teach the new gen before he goes, the new Gen that fight over the scraps after Tex gets his?
Or do they think next year is our year?
The time has come, it sucks, it does but we may still be a few years before finals, Tex next year probably makes it one more year.
Is it the last of the 2009/2010 players and the supporters don't want to feel old
Or is it that they think Tex will teach the new gen before he goes, the new Gen that fight over the scraps after Tex gets his?
Or do they think next year is our year?
The time has come, it sucks, it does but we may still be a few years before finals, Tex next year probably makes it one more year.
I dunno, maybe because he was All Australian last year. Can play.
Also, who's he taking a spot from? Gollant? Burgess? We have a list full of garbage and I need to read page after page of people wanting one of our very few elite players gone.
ffs
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Focusing on the performances of our key forwards this year is just doing it all wrong IMO. The midfield, and those rotating through the midfield, is the problem, every football expert in the country knows this and they’ve all talked about it pretty much non-stop all year.
Charlie Curnow would struggle to get near it being fed by the likes of Laird, Crouch and Berry. Those inside types feeding it out to Chayce on a wing, and having the likes of Murphy, Keays and McHenry as high half forwards to pump it inside 50 is embarrassing.
Rachele is clearly not being utilised correctly at present, but playing him as a full time mid is not even close to being the answer. To put it bluntly, Josh Rachele is never going to be a star in a team with a shit midfield. Put him at half forward for Sydney or Carlton and he’d probably make the All-Australian team in 2025.
Sholl has racked up a lot of possessions on the outside lately. No speed, no kicking penetration, no ability to compete in the air, no tackling ability, very little evasive ability or agility = this is not a long term answer. Depth only or a trade chip if we’re being serious.
Dowling, Taylor and Edwards all need to be trialled at senior level and developed (lol, development), but none appear to be the messiah. Balance of probability suggests that one of those 3 completely fails, one becomes an average AFL player who “might” play 100 games, and one becomes a “good” player who approaches 150-200 games.
Pedlar is clearly going to get more senior games after the bye, but he’s a super low production pinch hitter at best, and honestly, his kicking is just horrendous. Combine that with a rich injury history that dates back to his childhood days, and the chances of Pedlar reaching 150 games for us, or ever playing as a full-time mid, are slim to none.
Sure, Dawson and Soligo are genuinely good players. Rankine is really good too. They’re not super high production guys YET though. The best mids in the comp are the guys with the ability to hit targets with aggressive and penetrating kicks, AND the ability to rack up 30 possession games regularly. Rankine (still inexperienced as a mid and struggles to reach 20 touches, let alone 30) and Soligo (avg 22.4) aren’t there yet, and Dawson (avg 24.9) is not a regular 30 touch guy either. These 3 all have scope to improve pretty dramatically as they’re very inexperienced at AFL level in their respective roles.
Laird can’t hit the side of a house by foot, but the coaches are probably too scared to drop him because now that Crouch is injured, nobody else can actually get the ball enough for us to compete as a team. What they don’t seem to appreciate is that a lot of Laird’s touches not only miss targets, but he’s taking completely the wrong option. One thing that isn’t talked about enough with Laird is his absolutely terrible decision making BY HAND. This is why Crouch is still an important player - he’s a great handballer, and makes very good decisions WITH his handballs too. Laird’s handballing is at least 50% utter nonsense.
Make no mistake, this is currently the worst midfield in the AFL, bar none. I’ve said it before, but the last time we actually spent a first round pick on someone who turned out to be an AFL standard midfielder was Patrick Dangerfield, 17 years ago. I’m not talking about superstars, I’m just talking about drafting guys in the first round who actually ended up getting regular AFL games, as actual midfielders.
That level of ineptitude in either / both of drafting and development will fcuk a list right up.
What percentage of the problem is the drafting and what percentage is the development? Nobody really knows because there are 0 examples of us drafting mids in the first round who failed as mids here, and then went to another club and succeeded.
The problem is clearly both of those things though. The entire list is currently being held together by the following:
1) Trade acquisition Dawson, who started playing inside mid out of sheer desperation. Let’s face it, he was brought to the club as a utility, and the first two options were to play him at half back or on a wing. The inside mid stuff has evolved from having a terrible list around him.
2) Trade acquisition Rankine, who has only played a handful of games with a highish percentage of game time in the midfield, but that handful of games has shown us that he’s probably the future in there. Let’s face it, he was brought to the club as a forward who could have spurts through the midfield. Not the other way around. Not even 50/50.
3) 2nd round pick Soligo. Just imagine if he went to Richmond a few picks before us, as was heavily rumoured. May have saved Hamish’s job. Gotta give credit here though, it’s an absolutely wonderful pick at 36.
4) Father-son Michalanney. Trust Sydney, the best recruiters in the land, to be the one club who recognised Max as worthy of first round selection. This midfield stuff in the last fortnight though - is this ANOTHER example of desperation due to incompetent list management (bear in mind that Laird’s move from defence to the midfield a few years back is also an example of this)? Whats going to happen to our ability to contain small forwards if Max is playing significant midfield minutes? Never fear, 2023 delistee Will Hamill is the future back there now is he?
5) 2nd round pick Worrell - the 5th name here really shouldn’t be a third tall in defence. But it is. Love Worrell, hope he can get a good run at it injury-wise once his arm is healed.
6) mature age rookie out of the wilderness Nick Murray - love Muz, but a mature age rookie beefcake defender who is one game into a comeback from an ACL tear shouldn’t be the 6th name here
7) pre-season draftee (ie overlooked in national draft) Nankervis. What’s he played, like 12-15 games now? Why is this suddenly a top 10 player on our list? Not a good sign.
8) Rachele, who is being tortured in a role he clearly hates and isn’t developing in to the standard expected of a pick 6 who kicked 5 goals on debut (again, imagine being a forward playing in front of the mess we’ve made of the midfield though)
9) Thilthorpe, who can’t get on the park
10) Fogarty, who would probably be leading the Coleman if he played for Sydney or Essendon.
The lack of literally anyone on the entire list who has a strong history through junior footy as a classy, high production, highly ranked GENUINE midfielder (not someone who “could maybe transition to the midfield”, which we are obsessed with), is absolutely staggering, and bordering on negligent.
Chayce Jones is the closest thing we have to this, and if you think he’s an AFL-standard midfielder, I can’t help you.
Oh right, it’s the rumours thread. Um, here’s a rumour: Laird to North Melbourne as a mentor. Source: hope.
Charlie Curnow would struggle to get near it being fed by the likes of Laird, Crouch and Berry. Those inside types feeding it out to Chayce on a wing, and having the likes of Murphy, Keays and McHenry as high half forwards to pump it inside 50 is embarrassing.
Rachele is clearly not being utilised correctly at present, but playing him as a full time mid is not even close to being the answer. To put it bluntly, Josh Rachele is never going to be a star in a team with a shit midfield. Put him at half forward for Sydney or Carlton and he’d probably make the All-Australian team in 2025.
Sholl has racked up a lot of possessions on the outside lately. No speed, no kicking penetration, no ability to compete in the air, no tackling ability, very little evasive ability or agility = this is not a long term answer. Depth only or a trade chip if we’re being serious.
Dowling, Taylor and Edwards all need to be trialled at senior level and developed (lol, development), but none appear to be the messiah. Balance of probability suggests that one of those 3 completely fails, one becomes an average AFL player who “might” play 100 games, and one becomes a “good” player who approaches 150-200 games.
Pedlar is clearly going to get more senior games after the bye, but he’s a super low production pinch hitter at best, and honestly, his kicking is just horrendous. Combine that with a rich injury history that dates back to his childhood days, and the chances of Pedlar reaching 150 games for us, or ever playing as a full-time mid, are slim to none.
Sure, Dawson and Soligo are genuinely good players. Rankine is really good too. They’re not super high production guys YET though. The best mids in the comp are the guys with the ability to hit targets with aggressive and penetrating kicks, AND the ability to rack up 30 possession games regularly. Rankine (still inexperienced as a mid and struggles to reach 20 touches, let alone 30) and Soligo (avg 22.4) aren’t there yet, and Dawson (avg 24.9) is not a regular 30 touch guy either. These 3 all have scope to improve pretty dramatically as they’re very inexperienced at AFL level in their respective roles.
Laird can’t hit the side of a house by foot, but the coaches are probably too scared to drop him because now that Crouch is injured, nobody else can actually get the ball enough for us to compete as a team. What they don’t seem to appreciate is that a lot of Laird’s touches not only miss targets, but he’s taking completely the wrong option. One thing that isn’t talked about enough with Laird is his absolutely terrible decision making BY HAND. This is why Crouch is still an important player - he’s a great handballer, and makes very good decisions WITH his handballs too. Laird’s handballing is at least 50% utter nonsense.
Make no mistake, this is currently the worst midfield in the AFL, bar none. I’ve said it before, but the last time we actually spent a first round pick on someone who turned out to be an AFL standard midfielder was Patrick Dangerfield, 17 years ago. I’m not talking about superstars, I’m just talking about drafting guys in the first round who actually ended up getting regular AFL games, as actual midfielders.
That level of ineptitude in either / both of drafting and development will fcuk a list right up.
What percentage of the problem is the drafting and what percentage is the development? Nobody really knows because there are 0 examples of us drafting mids in the first round who failed as mids here, and then went to another club and succeeded.
The problem is clearly both of those things though. The entire list is currently being held together by the following:
1) Trade acquisition Dawson, who started playing inside mid out of sheer desperation. Let’s face it, he was brought to the club as a utility, and the first two options were to play him at half back or on a wing. The inside mid stuff has evolved from having a terrible list around him.
2) Trade acquisition Rankine, who has only played a handful of games with a highish percentage of game time in the midfield, but that handful of games has shown us that he’s probably the future in there. Let’s face it, he was brought to the club as a forward who could have spurts through the midfield. Not the other way around. Not even 50/50.
3) 2nd round pick Soligo. Just imagine if he went to Richmond a few picks before us, as was heavily rumoured. May have saved Hamish’s job. Gotta give credit here though, it’s an absolutely wonderful pick at 36.
4) Father-son Michalanney. Trust Sydney, the best recruiters in the land, to be the one club who recognised Max as worthy of first round selection. This midfield stuff in the last fortnight though - is this ANOTHER example of desperation due to incompetent list management (bear in mind that Laird’s move from defence to the midfield a few years back is also an example of this)? Whats going to happen to our ability to contain small forwards if Max is playing significant midfield minutes? Never fear, 2023 delistee Will Hamill is the future back there now is he?
5) 2nd round pick Worrell - the 5th name here really shouldn’t be a third tall in defence. But it is. Love Worrell, hope he can get a good run at it injury-wise once his arm is healed.
6) mature age rookie out of the wilderness Nick Murray - love Muz, but a mature age rookie beefcake defender who is one game into a comeback from an ACL tear shouldn’t be the 6th name here
7) pre-season draftee (ie overlooked in national draft) Nankervis. What’s he played, like 12-15 games now? Why is this suddenly a top 10 player on our list? Not a good sign.
8) Rachele, who is being tortured in a role he clearly hates and isn’t developing in to the standard expected of a pick 6 who kicked 5 goals on debut (again, imagine being a forward playing in front of the mess we’ve made of the midfield though)
9) Thilthorpe, who can’t get on the park
10) Fogarty, who would probably be leading the Coleman if he played for Sydney or Essendon.
The lack of literally anyone on the entire list who has a strong history through junior footy as a classy, high production, highly ranked GENUINE midfielder (not someone who “could maybe transition to the midfield”, which we are obsessed with), is absolutely staggering, and bordering on negligent.
Chayce Jones is the closest thing we have to this, and if you think he’s an AFL-standard midfielder, I can’t help you.
Oh right, it’s the rumours thread. Um, here’s a rumour: Laird to North Melbourne as a mentor. Source: hope.
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