List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.1

[saintbill]

Aside from the fact that it's absolutely moot as the club has already stated he is going to re-sign a long term deal soon, don't you think it would be kind of stupid to trade out one of the best young forwards in the league without seeing what he can do with a good midfield? How many young forwards have kicked as many bags as him? He has made the best defenders int he comp look amateur at times throughout his career, has been ****ed about by injury over the last two years so we just trade him out? It would be insanity.

The Hawks and Swans that you mention would bite our hands off if we offered him up for trade.

You are right, will never happen. I am coming at it from the perspective, I think the game is trending away from your big forwards being the most impactful players in your side.

Also, I have real doubts King gets much better than what he currently is, which is a very inconsistent footballer. His body language is awful.

 

[g_TRAIN]

You are right, will never happen. I am coming at it from the perspective, I think the game is trending away from your big forwards being the most impactful players in your side.

Also, I have real doubts King gets much better than what he currently is, which is a very inconsistent footballer. His body language is awful.

Name a single key forward that peaked at 23 years of age and didn't improve? (Actually 21 because his best year was 2 years ago before his recent injury issues)

Not many recently I'll tell you.

He may not end up being generational player but hard to imagine he doesn't significantly improve still.

 

[stfan]

You are right, will never happen. I am coming at it from the perspective, I think the game is trending away from your big forwards being the most impactful players in your side.

When have gun mids not be the most impactful players in a team?

Big forwards have always had the glamour of goals boosting their perceived value. And yes those bursts attract attention. But a gun mid is in in the action a lot more.

 

[Joffaboy]

We can't we trade him? Sounds like no-one is off limits and there is no plan to move forward next year. By the time we are playing finals again he'll probably be late 20s.... he's a year younger than Battle. It's not like he's 20.

We need to either decide to bottom out hard or go hard at a finals push. If we bottom out we might as well offer up every one with value over 22 and start to build around the kids.

It sounds like a lot want another bottom out on here.

If teams like the two flag favourites Brisbane (beat us by 13 goals) and Bulldogs ( beat us by ten goals) keep getting Ashcrofts and Darcy's for free, if the Northern state teams keep getting free top ten players, and if Tassie compromise the draft from 2026 onwards, what choice do we have.
We have tried to do it the proper way, we have tried to do our best, and what did that get us?
Unless we load up on dp's now and next season, we will be consigned to mediocrity for 15 years.

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[Diehard Saint]

I think they gave us the Monday that the Battle news would be announced

 

[Joffaboy]

Trading King would be the worst move in the history of the club.

Lost Lockett, two years later we were in a Grand Final. You really saying losing King is worse than losing Lockett?

Taryn Thomas hey. Well the AFL allowing premiership contenders get the best player for free in the draft has forced us to look at s.hit like this.
They have turned us into beggers looking in the garbage for a diamond someone has dropped.
How does it make you feel as a supporter to know your club has to resort to this because of the AFL favouring other teams by compromising the draft.

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[Joffaboy]

What is cooked is we have been rebuilding for 13 years and have 1 elite mid prospect.

We have an opportunity to potentially be good in 2-3 years when Sincs, Marshall and Wilkie are still just in there prime.

We have got to get 3-4 mids in now, otherwise we lose prime of our 3 best players and start to fall back down.

If it blows up, who cares. We are irrelevant already.

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[The Boar]

Name a single key forward that peaked at 23 years of age and didn't improve? (Actually 21 because his best year was 2 years ago before his recent injury issues)

Not many recently I'll tell you.

He may not end up being generational player but hard to imagine he doesn't significantly improve still.

Paddy McCartin hit his peak about then!

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[Diehard Saint]

It's no more stupid than most of the stuff we debate here. If we wanted to gamble it's a way to bring in a lot of currency.

There’s gambling (Battle) and there’s stupidity.
The kid hasn’t even had a chance to play with a decent midfield or even a decent partner in crime. He’s been solo number one forward for his entire career.

The first will hopefully start to happen after this draft, and with Pou, NAS and Windy on an upward trajectory, the second also more likely with Sharman and even Caminiti possibly finally settling down forward and starting to hit their straps.

 

[Sully111]

There’s gambling (Battle) and there’s stupidity.
The kid hasn’t even had a chance to play with a decent midfield or even a decent partner in crime. He’s been solo number one forward for his entire career.

The first will hopefully start to happen after this draft, and with Pou, NAS and Windy on an upward trajectory, the second also more likely with Sharman and even Caminiti possibly finally settling down forward and starting to hit their straps.

Coaches need to get the forward line functioning properly.

I know it happened against the bombers but that was an anomaly.

Get our forward structure sorted and improve delivery and Max will be fine.

 

[Teflon]

You do understand you have made a sweeping statement and just applied it to us.

So let’s be factual. Yes the competition is even.

We - however are currently 4 wins out from 8th position. This is likely to become 5 wins from 8th by seasons end.

So we need to find 5 more wins - with the likelihood we aren’t trading a first round pick.

What scenario seems the smarter play here.

A) doubling down on what we have and trading our f1 for a mid like Tim Taranto and hoping that’s a +5 win addition or draft with our sole first rounder and hope we win the lottery with this pick & retain everyone else. Who is now a year older and worth less.

Or

B) trading out a player, letting Battle leave or both to take a step back. Load up on kids before Tassie comes.

Correct
The only thing worse than “gambling” is sitting on a shit hand ….pretending you’re a winner and finishing 8-10 again
That’s dumb
We’ve been doing that for a decade

 

[Teflon]

Yep

Because here's the thing..... go the other way and get the picks wrong and you're f*cked. Plain and simple.

Get those picks right you may just set your midfield up for a decade
Treading water hoping to pick up discarded bargains with 1 top lock at a time leaves us in no man’s land for another decade
You have to pick well - we’ve brought in one of the best to do it is let him and judge him on outcome

 

[True Believer]

Paddy McCartin hit his peak about then!

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Paddy McCartin hit a lot of things, mainly with his head from what I saw....

 

[Captain Paddy]

We are the masters of bad decisions. Why stop now?

Lyon needs to be held to account and if the club goes further backwards next year we need to cut him as soon as possible before he fully Malthouses us.

Even you dont believe this

 

[Captain Paddy]

When all the older guys step out in 3 to 4 years we will probably tumble down. I'd rather remain competitive while attracting in players. Until you create momentum, no-one wants to come to us.

This is literally the playbook we have tried for the last 10 years

 

[tomjoad]

If teams like the two flag favourites Brisbane (beat us by 13 goals) and Bulldogs ( beat us by ten goals) keep getting Ashcrofts and Darcy's for free, if the Northern state teams keep getting free top ten players, and if Tassie compromise the draft from 2026 onwards, what choice do we have.
We have tried to do it the proper way, we have tried to do our best, and what did that get us?
Unless we load up on dp's now and next season, we will be consigned to mediocrity for 15 years.

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Which will be 30 years in total...we've already been consigned to irrelevancy for 15 years.

 

[Sarcoidevo]

Exactly.

The same people advocating that are probably making serious plans for straight after their wedding to Margot Robbie!!

I just told Margot what you wrote and she nearly fell off the couch laughing

 

[PoppedCorn]

Margot is metal head
What a legend



We aren't drafting in Tarryn Thomas

26

Tarryn Thomas

Age

24

Ht

190cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.0

3star

K

5.3

2star

HB

5.7

4star

M

2.1

2star

T

3.3

5star

CL

0.9

3star

D

7.8

2star

K

4.0

1star

HB

3.8

3star

M

1.3

1star

T

3.2

4star

CL

0.2

2star

D

12.8

4star

K

6.2

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

2.8

3star

T

3.8

5star

CL

0.4

3star

ffs

 

[Yawkey way]

Margot is metal head
What a legend



We aren't drafting in Tarryn Thomas ffs

Court case in November I think.

 

[gringo2011]

We have really never reached the ultimate since '66, though close enough seems to satisfy some Sainters sadly. We need to do whatever it takes to get a premiership-worthy team on the track, no matter how ruthless in trades it might seem. We need the players and the coach to do it, and the ingredients are not there at the moment, so it could be a long while.

The problem with that is we've been gambling since Lyon left last time. They have **** all to show from gambling, flip flopping on plans, drafting, trading, even sticking to one plan before running off in a different direction.

What we need to do is just be stable and sensible with the best staff available in place and an absolute concrete plan with a set of markers that need to be met. Doing the basics well have worked for as long as the draft has been in place.

 

[True Believer]

Margot is metal head
What a legend

Well that locks in my plans for after the wedding then, we'll go to some gigs and listen to some kick arse metal !!

 

[gubby88]

Correct
The only thing worse than “gambling” is sitting on a shit hand ….pretending you’re a winner and finishing 8-10 again
That’s dumb
We’ve been doing that for a decade

richmond did that for a decade then won 3 flags

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[gringo2011]

If teams like the two flag favourites Brisbane (beat us by 13 goals) and Bulldogs ( beat us by ten goals) keep getting Ashcrofts and Darcy's for free, if the Northern state teams keep getting free top ten players, and if Tassie compromise the draft from 2026 onwards, what choice do we have.
We have tried to do it the proper way, we have tried to do our best, and what did that get us?
Unless we load up on dp's now and next season, we will be consigned to mediocrity for 15 years.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

You don't need a million draft picks to win a flag. Melbourne are the last club that has had access to masses of draft picks, it's looking like an outlier. Collingwood and Geelong won the last 2 flags. Both are sides with a huge amount of old players with incredible cohesion and experience. Both have had very few high draft picks in the last decade.

Richmond were literally where we were sitting just off the good sides finishing ninth every year but building cohesion and experience.

Interesting conversation I heard on SEN recently, didn't hear who the guy was but he was saying that sides are choosing to try to overpay now for FAs and experienced trades because when Tasmania comes in you want a good solid core to stay up. Sides just off the pack won't be able to use drafting to move forward and thin lists will struggle to make up ground.

Mediocrity for 15 years isn't going to be fixed by selling good players to get picks. We've done that and got nothing from it except more mediocrity. When they say this draft is even it means guys taken at 15 won't be that different from guys taken at 5. It doesn't have a top 10 that are seriously better than the guys later in the draft. To me it sounds like a foolhardy plan.

To me we are mediocre now because we have a really thin group between 22 and 26 yo, because we failed to draft 4 to 8 years ago. Culling the better players from that age group is exactly how you make more holes down the track. In 4 years we won't have Hill, wood, Sinclair, Wilkie, Howard, Marshall, Steele, Ross, Membrey, Webster etc. They'll either have finished up or at the end.

Our group that will be our older core are Cordy, Hunter Clark, King, Battle, Higgins, Stocker, Dow, Paton, Bonner, Sharman, Allison and Hall. King, Battle and Higgins are the only ones that look like above average talent and Sharman is pushing towards it.

 

[gringo2011]

This is literally the playbook we have tried for the last 10 years

No it's not. I was telling people at the time we were ****ing it up. We tried to build a core through trades before drafting.

We also kept a guy that was legitimately the worst recruiter in the AFL. We had the least AA, least 22 under 22, the least rising star noms, least Brownlow votes, least player awards etc on his watch.

The club failed to employ good staff or a footy department and kept changing plans on the run. We traded for guys like Hill when we had very few kids coming through and an ordinary list. We were hiding from the stuffed up rebuilds.

We now have a very large youth group. We have 19 under 22 year olds and will add a few more this year. This like training is the point you want to start honing it and taper off the bulk amount of kids coming through. You want to be starting to trade your picks up to the good picks and identifying the ones to persist with and develop.

At some point if too many kids make up the bulk of the best 22 you lose competitiveness like North.

 

[stavro#4]

richmond did that for a decade then won 3 flags

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They also had arguably the greatest player in the modern era.

A midfielder who ALWAYS showed up on the big stage. Won every award etc.

Just a tiny little detail that needs to be added