Autopsy Cats lose to Demons by 8 points

[Vdubs]

Carlton have a lot of injuries yes (and they have some elites at the top end) but at their best they are still not better than us.
Nor is anyone bar maybe gws.
Its a very open year and we are a real chance. Every team has lots of flaws this year.

Swans and Demons and Pies are more complete MIDFIELD and Rucking teams, not much in it, but we need stellar efforts from JC, Danger and Hawk many times to have wins, and with Tom not firing, we struggle a bit. Neal and Conway are going to help our plight, and it's tricky for the MC navigating that transition period, and I see that Clark, Bruhn, Bowes, Parfitt, MOC, and Atkins will be a handy midfield.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

You’d think Duncan will be rested with Stanley next week. He is one though whose position for the first time in about 13 years is no longer a lock. His movement as you say is of someone who’s at the end struggling to keep up. He’s also not getting down to the footy anywhere near like he has.

Duncan is still class by foot (and we need it at times) but they need to find a way to hide his lack of legspeed in defensive transition if hes staying in). We will rotate and wont pick the side until close til finals but for that reason i think if duncan stays in tuohy has to go out..both are very slow for legspeed now and you can only carry one of them imo. Atkins Moc and bowes are better options at the bottom end of the 22 (as might be clark depending on how he progresses this year) as they give you more ability to break away from the contest.

For this week i would rest stanley duncan and tuohy and bring in conway moc and knevitt (make knevitt the sub and get rohan in the 22 maybe). Parfitt only if bruhn cant play.
No doubt we will heavily rotate for this week and then darwin on a 6 day break a lot of older guys will stay home and get saved for the gws game.

 

[mcwilrob]

View attachment 1979718
Geez that’s a missed opportunity. Feels like the one area we were pre-game exposed we got right and we just flubbed the rest.

What that hit out stat misses is that too many times the next possession was either an effective Melb disposal or an ineffective Geelong disposal

 

[Pollywaffle]

I think the Demons went into that game with a plan and it worked.
I am sure when we meet them again Scott will have a few things up his sleeve. Coached very passively last night. Not sure if that was deliberate or just playing a few cards close to the chest.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Swans and Demons and Pies are more complete teams, not much in it, but we need stellar efforts from JC, Danger and Hawk many times to have wins, and with Tom not firing, we struggle a bit. Neal and Conway are going to help our plight, and it's tricky for the MC navigating that transition period, and I see that Clark, Bruhn, Parfitt, MOC, and Atkins will be a handy midfield.

Swans are more complete structurally now they have grundy but they are still very young and historically those types of teams tend to choke in prelims or GF (i think the swans will go deep but i dont think they win it).
Pies have the wrong age profile in that their best players are older and they dont have the quality aged under 23 that we do. They are going to have to cook guys like pendles and sidey just to get enough wins to make the 8 i doubt they will have much left once they get there.
Our 7-0 allows us to manage older players in a way that their start doesnt.
Melbourne are the biggest threat youve listed (and my tip to win it if we dont along with gws) but they are very dependent on gawn and may. Lose either for any length of time and they are stuffed.

Yes we have some holes (and i agree our ruck and mid aged mids are our weakness) but i also think we are far less dependent on danger and hawk than clubs like melb are on their guns. Danger we saw when he missed half of 22 and now hawkins is in a slump our forward line is still running great (it was only poor ball use and goalkicking that cost us last night not hawk).
Honestly if we dont win it this year its a missed opportunity.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

You wont see that until say the last month before finals if we are certain of top 4 and then heavily resting players.
Conway and stanley will rotate every 2nd or 3rd week but its pretty clear scott will keep backing hawkins in and only minimal rests.

In one sense i get it sav and zerk are the type of players hawkins normally feasts on (so long as someone like henry or rohan can play a defensive role on allir and keep him busy) so it might get him back into form.
But if it was me id rest hawkins more than they are.

We definitely need to manage duncan this week though.

Hawk doesn't need to be able to run a marathon though. If he plays Port > week off > Giants then it's an easy run off no break then a harder run off a break. We get to see both options and he breaks the record.

I have a suspicion that he breaks the record and then we see Neale against Richmond

 

[Vdubs]

I think the Demons went into that game with a plan and it worked.
I am sure when we meet them again Scott will have a few things up his sleeve. Coached very passively last night. Not sure if that was deliberate or just playing a few cards close to the chest.

We were hunted, and it worked

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

Swans and Demons and Pies are more complete teams, not much in it, but we need stellar efforts from JC, Danger and Hawk many times to have wins, and with Tom not firing, we struggle a bit. Neal and Conway are going to help our plight, and it's tricky for the MC navigating that transition period, and I see that Clark, Bruhn, Bowes, Parfitt, MOC, and Atkins will be a handy midfield.

Every team relies on their star players.
How good would Sydney be without Heeney or Gulden?
Melbourne without Gawn or May or Trac?
Pies without Daicos ect.
I actually think this year we the most even by a mile and don’t usually rely heavily on our stars.

I think it’s a silly argument. Don’t forget we beat the blues last week without Stewart and Danger for a half.
We are 7-1 with our only loss so far by 8 points and somehow the pies, Swans and Demons are more complete?

I usually agree with your posts, but this is off the mark imo.

 

[fpm84]

Swans and Demons and Pies are more complete teams, not much in it, but we need stellar efforts from JC, Danger and Hawk many times to have wins.

Sorry dubs, I can’t really agree with that. We are far, far more even than we were in the Dangerwood days even moreso this year with Holmes, Zuthrie and Gryan basically top 5 players for us.

Yes, more of the times when we win, our stars play well, but is that any different to how Heeney and Gulden perform in Swans wins or Gawn, Petracca and May when the Demons play well?

We were 10% off last night, it happens, it has happened in each of our flag years and in fact to each premier essentially forever. As Scott said post-match, despite never really seeming ‘on’ throughout the night we gave ourselves chances to win which is the mark of a good team.

Credit to Melbourne, they’re obviously a top 4-6 team and have been for a few years now. But there was absolutely nothing last night that indicated they’re levels above us or that we won’t get them next time.

If we can navigate a 2-1 result from the next three games - all of which we’ll start favourites in given two of them are at home - we will be in an excellent position mid-season and won’t face Demons, Port or GWS again until, hopefully, September.

 

[Cataholic]

I think the Demons went into that game with a plan and it worked.
I am sure when we meet them again Scott will have a few things up his sleeve. Coached very passively last night. Not sure if that was deliberate or just playing a few cards close to the chest.

If so, why do it against Melbourne specifically?

That would imply he sees them as one of the most dangerous threats come finals. Are they?

He did appear passive, and I wonder if it was done deliberately to assess the players somehow, or is that short-changing Melbourne??

Maybe it was nothing more than a very poor night, and we got rolled by a team who were also poor but marginally better.

 

[Vdubs]

Every team relies on their star players.
How good would Sydney be without Heeney or Gulden?
Melbourne without Gawn or May or Trac?
Pies without Daicos ect.
I actually think this year we the most even by a mile and don’t usually rely heavily on our stars.

I think it’s a silly argument. Don’t forget we beat the blues last week without Stewart and Danger for a half.
We are 7-1 with our only loss so far by 8 points and somehow the pies, Swans and Demons are more complete?

I usually agree with your posts, but this is off the mark imo.

I should have elaborated, I refer to midfield/ruck strength, the engine room of our successful campaigns seems deficient in comparison to Swans>Demons/GWS>Blues>Pies. Until this year, I have always rated Stanley as a strength, but he seems to lack something.

 

[The_Koulouriotis_Fan]

Swans and Demons and Pies are more complete teams, not much in it, but we need stellar efforts from JC, Danger and Hawk many times to have wins, and with Tom not firing, we struggle a bit. Neal and Conway are going to help our plight, and it's tricky for the MC navigating that transition period, and I see that Clark, Bruhn, Bowes, Parfitt, MOC, and Atkins will be a handy midfield.

I don’t think it’s fair to say we need stellar performances from JC Danger and Hawk to win. Last night we needed JC to kick 2 goals he kicks every day of the week. The work was done up the field he (and Duncan) just bottled it.

The most promising thing last night was that we lost by 8 points to a full strength contender with superstars in the middle and defense and it was the older guys that let us down and the youngsters that kept us in it. A far cry from a few years ago when we had battlers like Parsons, Lang, Murdoch and Ruggles playing.

I know you tend to undersell us as a reaction to trauma from back in the day but I think we’re one of the teams to beat. I have Sydney number 1, but we’re in the mix along with GWS, the Blues and the Dees, Pies maybe, but i still think they’re just going, although they do find a way. The reality is, there are no dominant teams this year and everyone has weaknesses, but our best is as good as anyone.

 

[SoYouThink90]

Well done Dees. Gawn, and lever were critical. Maybe Scotty should have put Jezza fwd. The game was blistering quick and we needed him up forward , not blowing hi mself up around the ground

Bit over the hard on for Max Gawn tbh. He was expected to beat Stanley and he did. Should have had an obvous free paid against him in the last but not even considered because hes Max Gawn

 

[Vdubs]

I don’t think it’s fair to say we need stellar performances from JC Danger and Hawk to win. Last night we needed JC to kick 2 goals he kicks every day of the week. The work was done up the field he (and Duncan) just bottled it.

The most promising thing last night was that we lost by 8 points to a full strength contender with superstars in the middle and defense and it was the older guys that let us down and the youngsters that kept us in it. A far cry from a few years ago when we had battlers like Parsons, Lang, Murdoch and Ruggles playing.

I know you tend to undersell us as a reaction to trauma from back in the day but I think we’re one of the teams to beat. I have Sydney number 1, but we’re in the mix along with GWS, the Blues and the Dees, Pies maybe, but i still think they’re just going, although they do find a way. The reality is, there are no dominant teams this year and everyone has weaknesses, but our best is as good as anyone.

Yes, I agree, we are in that mix at present, and 7-0 will help that.
No Danger- Saints probably beat us.
No JC- how many games do we win this year?
BUT, I agree, you can say that about Pies/NDaicos, Blues/Harry&Curnow, but with the Swans, Demons and GWS, they seem to have more widespread contributors to a win.
We are rarely belted even in any quarter.
I just wonder what will transpire as the season goes on, with that MF and our aged list.
We are 1/3 of the way through it, May will be very challenging.

 

[SoYouThink90]

Well done Dees. Gawn, and lever were critical. Maybe Scotty should have put Jezza fwd. The game was blistering quick and we needed him up forward , not blowing hi mself up around the ground

Which is why he missed those shots at the end. Try taking a 50 metre set shot after running for 2 hours.

 

[Generalissimo]

We’re you guys complaint about the 50 metre penalty against Harry McKay last week?

Those are two very different things. Cameron was taken down after marking the footy by a bloke who wasn't even in the marking contest, and it's exactly the sort of thing 50s are supposed to be paid for. But when it's an infringement that would give us a shot on goal the umps always swallow their whistles and look the other way.

 

[SoYouThink90]

Did Rohan have a touch in the last term? He did well to spark us in the 3rd term after he came on, but I can't recall seeing him in the last quarter.

Wrong choice as sub IMO. Needs to be an impact player. Would have been better playing him from the start as his forward pressure would have been valuable. Also keeping Jezza in the forward line more may have been better so he wasnt gassed by the end as Hawkins confidence is shot kicking for goal atm. But he always takes the best defender i suppose that allowed Henry to kick 3.

 

[Vdubs]

If so, why do it against Melbourne specifically?

That would imply he sees them as one of the most dangerous threats come finals. Are they?

He did appear passive, and I wonder if it was done deliberately to assess the players somehow, or is that short-changing Melbourne??

Maybe it was nothing more than a very poor night, and we got rolled by a team who were also poor but marginally better.

It was very dewy and cold last night; that could easily account for the apparent skill errors.
As always, we are guilty, or I am, of overanalysing a loss.
This may have been coming looking at some of our wins, but when it does after a 7-0 start, it hurts even more.
That's what the forum is for, to be able to have a cathartic letting it all out experience, but at times we (I, for sure) can lose sight of what we have achieved and our strengths.

 

[iameviljez]

My son, now 31, remarked to me in early 2000 that he bemoaned the fact we were all committed Cats supporters, and that his best mates were Bombers and Pies fans

When we won our first flag in ages, I may have turned to Dad and told him I forgave him...

 

[iameviljez]

Wrong choice as sub IMO. Needs to be an impact player.

I'm not conflating you with everyone else, but a lot of other posters were called Rohan the "perfect sub" in the lead up to this game because he was considered an impact player.

 

[Chinacats]

I think the Demons went into that game with a plan and it worked.
I am sure when we meet them again Scott will have a few things up his sleeve. Coached very passively last night. Not sure if that was deliberate or just playing a few cards close to the chest.

Hmm a bit early for cards close to his chest theory….. we mightn’t even make top 4 . They mightn’t either….

 

[Vdubs]

I'm not conflating you with everyone else, but a lot of other posters were called Rohan the "perfect sub" in the lead up to this game because he was considered an impact player.

Had Rohan come on and played like he can do, it would have been perfect, he is a ballistic high impact player. It just was not our night.

 

[Chinacats]

I'm not conflating you with everyone else, but a lot of other posters were called Rohan the "perfect sub" in the lead up to this game because he was considered an impact player.

I thought he might go to a wing and show some speed and break lines as we were being denied that… went forward and didn’t get involved much.

 

[Vdubs]

I think CS and many coaches say you can learn more from a loss than varied wins, and last night gives the MC plenty of firepower. That will reset the list and their hunting attitude, and we certainly need to be the instigators of the hunt to win these games imho.

 

[Vdubs]

If so, why do it against Melbourne specifically?

That would imply he sees them as one of the most dangerous threats come finals. Are they?

He did appear passive, and I wonder if it was done deliberately to assess the players somehow, or is that short-changing Melbourne??

Maybe it was nothing more than a very poor night, and we got rolled by a team who were also poor but marginally better.

Demons are of course a top 4 contender with that high end talent.
We got ahead throughout the game and still could have pinched the win, yet Demons seemed to control the tempo; not sure what coaching could do about that.
There is no way at rd 8 he would be thinking about next time we play them during the game.