List Mgmt. Contracts, trades, draft - 2022 superstar edition

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players -

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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[CursoryMercenary]

Certainly throws the draft wide open now with Ashcroft confirming he is going to Brisbane. We could potentially still finish last, all really depends on this weekend. Hoping for no.3 pick we have a pretty good record with that particular number.

 

[WCErevival]

Richmond have been very effective at trading out soldiers that may be over rated by other clubs. The likes of Ellis, Markov, Coleman-Jones, Higgins (though probably more than a soldier) and Choi (more a case of the KPF's were blocking him) mean that they have had great draft picks in return. We tend to be more protective as an interstate club and focus on a culture of retention.

Are these club led decisions or the players themselves cashing in on better opportunities offered to them?

 

[06Premiers]

Do we bid for Ashcroft if Norf don't?

Depends how the negotiations for Dev go....

 

[briztoon]

Are these club led decisions or the players themselves cashing in on better opportunities offered to them?

Ellis to Gold Coast was a bit of both.

Markov wanted more playing opportunities.

Tigers wanted to keep CCJ and were prepared to lose Chol.

 

[FKASC]

If Ely Smith becomes a delisted free agent, we might see the return of dankshanks

 

[Doashuey]

Someone on our board mentioned trading for Darling, seeing as we’re losing McStay.

Was quickly shouted down.

JD would make the Lions a much better team in attack IMO. You lack a forward like him.
Still wouldn't do much to arrest their mental frailty but.

 

[mattyc75]

Ely Smith is a certainty to be delisted. Possibly Tom Berry as well.

Zorko is 3 to 15 months from retiring.

And Jarryd Lyons has to be damn close to losing his spot in the senior team after this season.

If he can’t cement a spot in our best 22 next year, we’ve either traded in Jacob Hopper, or Lyons has photos of Fagan.

Hows tunstill been going? He could have more upside than dev

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[mattyc75]

JD would make the Lions a much better team in attack IMO. You lack a forward like him.
Still wouldn't do much to arrest their mental frailty but.

I think jacks been one of our best players for the second half of the season. Showed his mental toughness sticking to his guns despite a whole state being on his back
Came back slowly but is finishing off the season very strongly

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[Ambrose Burnside]

I think jacks been one of our best players for the second half of the season. Showed his mental toughness sticking to his guns despite a whole state being on his back
Came back slowly but is finishing off the season very strongly

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That's not mental toughness, that's just being thick. Old Jack has a skull like Homer's, with a built in gridiron helmet.

 

[eagles rule]

I think jacks been one of our best players for the second half of the season. Showed his mental toughness sticking to his guns despite a whole state being on his back
Came back slowly but is finishing off the season very strongly

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That was his Wife’s mental toughness ..


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[daddy_4_eyes]

That's not mental toughness, that's just being thick. Old Jack has a skull like Homer's, with a built in gridiron helmet.

You seem to get a hard on anytime Darling's vaccination status gets brought up.
Did he cough on your kids or something?

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

You seem to get a hard on anytime Darling's vaccination status gets brought up.
Did he cough on your kids or something?

Yes

 

[Happy Mastenator]

ACL last year. Only came back a few games ago.

Honestly not expecting anything of him until next year.

Fair enough. He’s played 11 games so far but you’re right, this year is a year for just getting back into it.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

Do we bid for Ashcroft if Norf don't?

Yes. Unless brisbane do a sweet heart trade for us.

 

[shooshka]

Do we bid for Ashcroft if Norf don't?

We absolutely must if North don't (the only possible reason not to, is if there is some sort of significant deal in our favour with Brisbane - i.e. Dev for a pick in the 50's).

That said, if the AFL are doing any sort of proper review into Nth, the #1 thing they should look at is their bidding (or not) when it should happen. Daicos was a massive error, and Ashcroft would be an even bigger error (not the better player, just a clearer standout in this pool).


Teams have, 2 years in a row, announced 4 year deals for F/S draftees prior to the season being finished and prior to the draft order being finalised. That should be an absolute guide to teams to bid at #1 for those guys (both have been worthy of it) as clearly it will be matched.

 

[amazingjoshy]

Do we bid for Ashcroft if Norf don't?

As others have said, absolute no brainer unless Brissy do us a massive favour in return

 

[Farang83150]

We absolutely must if North don't (the only possible reason not to, is if there is some sort of significant deal in our favour with Brisbane - i.e. Dev for a pick in the 50's).

That said, if the AFL are doing any sort of proper review into Nth, the #1 thing they should look at is their bidding (or not) when it should happen. Daicos was a massive error, and Ashcroft would be an even bigger error (not the better player, just a clearer standout in this pool).


Teams have, 2 years in a row, announced 4 year deals for F/S draftees prior to the season being finished and prior to the draft order being finalised. That should be an absolute guide to teams to bid at #1 for those guys (both have been worthy of it) as clearly it will be matched.

Not as up on this as much as you guys, what's the outcome of us bidding on MA?

 

[amazingjoshy]

Not as up on this as much as you guys, what's the outcome of us bidding on MA?

Depends where we finish and who else bids etc but using Daicos last year as an example, had he been bid on at pick 1 instead of 4, the Pies would've had to use about 750-800 points more to get him (which is equivalent to about pick 24)

The difference between picks 2 and 3 (minus the F/S discount) is around 230 points or pick 50 odd.

 

[Farang83150]

Using Daicos last year as an example, had he been bid on at pick 1 instead of 4, the Pies would've had to use about 750-800 points more to get him (which is equivalent to about pick 24)

So the only benefit is to squeeze points out of brissy or maybe get the to come to the party re a player deal? (someone we maybe chasing)

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

Daicos sliding to 4th or whatever it was was a joke.

 

[garlic munchers]

So if I take the current list and roll the ages forward 12 months, here is how we would look without any list changes.

I am aware that JK and Strnadica are already out so no need to tell me that
View attachment 1465688

I am then taking out the 9 players leaving and adding changes that seem clear to me (but there may be some others) and have in red added what I think we need to be the 6 we positions we target at the draft. Excluding Sheppard, our list was 45 meaning we need to take 3 more players off the list than we draft. JK and Strnadica are 2.

The outs were

• Retire - JK
• FA - Nelson
• Delist - Strnadica, Trew, Joyce, Naish, West, Dixon, Witherden

I think it will be a difficult decision on Witherden where I believe our ineffective defensive structures has meant he has not got close to being the reason we got him across.

In terms of our 2021 draft class of LEdwards, Winder and Trew, I cannot see clear daylight as to who stays or goes. The injuries to this trio have made it such that there could be nobody left on our list from the massive 2 years impacted by the Kelly trade.

When we heard we were all in with Kelly, our list shows we weren't joking
View attachment 1465689

Our 22 and under would then total 13.

If we want top be more active in the draft, then the likes of Winder and LEdwards are in danger or we look to trade Rotham, pay out Langdon early, etc

Thanks for ruining my day, which was going quite well until now.

22 to 27 age bracket would have to almost be an AFL record when it comes to having a bare cupboard.

20yr old draft results confirms we need to slash and burn our list.

Keep NN, but in no way should great servants of the club Hurn, Shuey and Redden go around again.

If they do, expect to see 37 calf injuries and 29 hammies between them on the injury list over the season.

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

Shep, JK gone.

Hurn should retire, I think it's madness to continue.

I'd keep Nic Nat, Shuey and Redden. With 2 or 3 of them to retire end of next year.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

So 2 key things happening today.

1. Ashcroft to the Lions means their first round pick is up for grabs. I had previously assumed that the Suns would want it given they have 3 R2 picks and 2 R3 picks. Maybe not given what they will get with Rankin.

2. Rankin is being heavily linked to Adelaide. Not a done deal but when a delay in signing continues and the favoured club to take him is being "strongly" linked, then it makes me think it will happen.

How does all of that effect us?

1. Lions will pick up a player before we do. Our current pick 2 will now be pick 3 (if Norf don't bid on Ashcroft then we do). The difference in Sheezel, Phillipou and Wardlaw is minimal to me as we can pair up what we do at 20 and get the balance right then. No real impact.

2. Rankin off to Crows - let us assume that the Crows first pick will be part of the deal which sits at 4 and Suns would want at least that. If I was the Crows list manager, I know he Suns want to bank points for their academy prospects in 2023 hence it makes no sense in their list management to have 3 first rounders in 2022. I also know that for the Crows giving up pick 4 leaves them with picks 22, 76 and 94 this year. It also does not make sense with the Crows list build. I would rather get something this year to add to the list and think that pick 4 or 5 is probably light on. Some pretty good SA prospects at the second round this year. I would look to offer pick 4 and next year's first round pick (assume this is say 6 but could be lower) and get Rankin plus picks 26 and 34 (the Suns and Pies R2). That would value Rankin at about pick 3 which is where he was taken in a strong draft year. A win for Suns in that they get decent value for Rankin and bank around 1,700 points for next year. A win for Crows in that they get their man plus get 2 picks in a year that fits better with their list build and does not kill off their draft this year. Crows left with 22, 26 and 34 this year.

3. Suns post Rankin would sit with picks 4, 8, 31, 44, 52, 67 and 70. Excluding 4 and 8, they have 1,322 points to trade for the Lions R1 which is worth 1,161 with pick 14. Good value but not brilliant. Lions will be searching for more. We could always add in pick 38. More to come.

Suns could go best available at 2 and Holland at 8. I think the Suns will be nervous that Holland will be gone prior to 14. Add to the banking of future draft capital, I think they would be happy.

Brisbane will be happy getting their premium.


Would we then get involved and move back from pick 2 to pick 4? We also give up 38 and get 44 in return.
What would it mean for us to move back to pick 4? We effectively slide form 2 to 4 and slide from 38 to 44 BUT we pick up 14 and lose a future 4th rounder (assume it is 57).A future 4th is roughly 200 more points that Suns get to bank for next year.


The top prospects I see at both 2 and 4 (excluding Ashcroft) are Sheezel, Wadlaw, Phillipou, and Tsatas. So I believe one of these will still be there at 4 and there is not a lot of distance in the value of these 4.

So the question is would I want:

Option A - 2, 20, 25, 38 and 72​

OR​

Option B - 4, 14, 20, 25 and 44?​

I think B. Why?
At 4, we get one of Sheezel, Wadlaw, Phillipou, and Tsatas.
At 14 - the likes of Hewett, Hustwaite, Mackenzie, Hayes (if we want to go tall and assuming Busslinger is off) or Szybkowski and get to balance with who we get at 4.
At 20 - the likes of Hotton, Ryan, Gibney, D'Aloia
At 25 - Barnett
At 44/52 - best available like Jones or Allen

4 picks inside 30 is a great start to the second year of a rebuild.

 

[WCET22]

Shep, JK gone.

Hurn should retire, I think it's madness to continue.

I'd keep Nic Nat, Shuey and Redden. With 2 or 3 of them to retire end of next year.

I think Shuey should also go too.
1 hammy he is done.
I also do not want to see Gaff, Sheed & Redden together.
So keep Redden for 1 more year so long as Gaff is traded.

Kelly, Yeo, Redden & a refreshed Sheed is enough snr mids. Yeo will move back to midfield next season.
As someone stated above a big pre-season for Willie and he will move into midfield.
Inject Culley, Chesser, Rd 1 pick plus whatever we trade in.
Now is time for clean out. Not in a year.
Start making cap room.

 

[eaglespremiers]

Certainly throws the draft wide open now with Ashcroft confirming he is going to Brisbane. We could potentially still finish last, all really depends on this weekend. Hoping for no.3 pick we have a pretty good record with that particular number.

Every chance North reach for Busslinger as they really need a developing key defender.
If this happens it means we can still pick the best midfielder for our needs even though we might have the third selection overall.