Preview Draft Pick #18

[BlueGibbs2011]

Nope, that would be the ignorant posters who sooked about not getting Talia last year. I am prepared to be disappointed if we don't get who I view as good selections at out picks but not outraged if we do not pick a KPP like some on this board.

Ignorant and bloody sooks is a bit harsh. Last year 10 percent wanted a KPP for structural reasons/insurance. Ok, maybe 10% was a bit high given it was myself and jimthegreat championing this cause mostly. Got shouted down by the old boys school on here who wanted to back in a couple of posters out of team defence mentality.

Funnily enough, the need for a quality tall proved pretty high, and maybe, just maybe shows how a couple of posters were just 1-2 years ahead of the group think curve on here. Would be nice to have a quality tall with 1 years exp in the system right now coming into 2011. But no, we'll draft one this year and have to wait through another year or 2 of flimsy talls and poor structure in 2011/12. Well, unless my dreams come true and austin stands up!

And for the record, the debate was based around not Talia vs Lucas, but a tall vs a mid from picks 10-15 based on best availabe within reason. Every ignorant person on here turns it into extremes. Will be very interesting this year to see if WHs adopts best available but with a 1-5 position pull to fill a need.

From planning perspective alone, and excluding Lucas fanboy mentality, 1 year too late Mr WHs!

PS
Just starting to fire up in readiness

 

[Dramoth]

I desperately hope we get Watson, we need a ready-made, tall, solidly built defender, and Watson fits that criteria, his raking left foot can't be underrated either, as we lack some serious penetration by foot from defense, will be interesting to see who we go for

Obviously WH's policy is to select the best available and not necessarily in terms of our needs, so my head tells me we won't select Watson

This year, I think that Needs meets Best

If Watson is available, we will take him.

 

[thylacine60]

Good luck tomorrow night whoever you are. Damn, I hope you are worth all of TG's input the last month.

 

[Sharks On A Plane]

Order of preference:

1. Isaac Smith
2. Pat McCarthy/Jack Darling
3. Sliding mid
4. Matthew Watson

Smith could provide a heap of killer run down a wing. I think we are falsely regarded as a 'quick' side, and Smith's pace would be an invaluable addition to our midfield mix.

McCarthy just oozes class for a tall. Very composed. Want.

Darling could be anything, and is worth taking the risk with what is essentially a speculative pick in most drafts. Obviously has attitude issues but should be put on notice the minute he sets foot in the door.

Watson is highly rated for obvious reasons, but I still have my reservations given his man-child build. Not writing him off for a second though, and would fully support his recruitment.

All said and done though, I would still be happy with a sliding mid at #18, as long as we can procure Chalwell with #34. And I know everyone thinks Chalwell is massively over-hyped, but the bloke can seriously play. Plays a bit like Ben Stratton, and seems a fairly balanced package (for a tall) who would improve ten-fold in an AFL environment.

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

Good luck tomorrow night whoever you are. Damn, I hope you are worth all of TG's input the last month.

Seconded

TG for Carlton Bigfooty Draft President.

 

[Blueboys7]

Ignorant and bloody sooks is a bit harsh. Last year 10 percent wanted a KPP for structural reasons/insurance. Ok, maybe 10% was a bit high given it was myself and jimthegreat championing this cause mostly. Got shouted down by the old boys school on here who wanted to back in a couple of posters out of team defence mentality.

I don't recall saying 'bloody sooks'. I was one who wanted a KPP but when Lucas fell we had no choice, he was just too good to pass up and the KPP weren't good enough to overlook KL.

For posters to be up in arms about the decision is ignorant and I stand by that.

Funnily enough, the need for a quality tall proved pretty high, and maybe, just maybe shows how a couple of posters were just 1-2 years ahead of the group think curve on here. Would be nice to have a quality tall with 1 years exp in the system right now coming into 2011. But no, we'll draft one this year and have to wait through another year or 2 of flimsy talls and poor structure in 2011/12. Well, unless my dreams come true and austin stands up!

Things change, last year we were hoping Bower could make the step up to take CHB as well as Austin being able to string some games together and make an influence. We still need a defender but if someone of better quality comes along then I would rather take them and punt on someone later in the draft.

FWIW I would be happy with Watson or Darling, so in some way I agree with you.

And for the record, the debate was based around not Talia vs Lucas, but a tall vs a mid from picks 10-15 based on best availabe within reason. Every ignorant person on here turns it into extremes. Will be very interesting this year to see if WHs adopts best available but with a 1-5 position pull to fill a need.

The need vs best available argument has been done to death and it may well appear tomorrow night! We best prepare ourselves but I will back WH to make the best decision for our football club.

You can never have enough quality.

 

[mediumsizered]

Ignorant and bloody sooks is a bit harsh. Last year 10 percent wanted a KPP for structural reasons/insurance. Ok, maybe 10% was a bit high given it was myself and jimthegreat championing this cause mostly. Got shouted down by the old boys school on here who wanted to back in a couple of posters out of team defence mentality.

Funnily enough, the need for a quality tall proved pretty high, and maybe, just maybe shows how a couple of posters were just 1-2 years ahead of the group think curve on here. Would be nice to have a quality tall with 1 years exp in the system right now coming into 2011. But no, we'll draft one this year and have to wait through another year or 2 of flimsy talls and poor structure in 2011/12. Well, unless my dreams come true and austin stands up!

And for the record, the debate was based around not Talia vs Lucas, but a tall vs a mid from picks 10-15 based on best availabe within reason. Every ignorant person on here turns it into extremes. Will be very interesting this year to see if WHs adopts best available but with a 1-5 position pull to fill a need.

From planning perspective alone, and excluding Lucas fanboy mentality, 1 year too late Mr WHs!

PS
Just starting to fire up in readiness

I'll play along. Which tall would you have taken ahead of Lucas, particularly on the basis that Talia is seen more as a Bower type defender than a big lump of a lad like a Watson? When answering the question keep in mind it was Pick 12 we were using so it would have been too much of a stretch to gamble on a Griffiths or a Black.

 

[XXX KINGS]

The difference with some individuals is that they have the ability to disrupt the larger slice of the pie. (not suggesting Darling, here)

Yarran and Garlett for whatever issues you are suggesting have the potential to only knock themselves out.
Some of these "party boys" can do a lot more damage by dragging others into their spell and their ways.

Big difference for mine.

I don't disagree with you either. But how are we supposed to know Darling will go either way without giving him a chance? Fev took his chances and wasted them but we can't be turning our back on quality players because there is only a chance they may be disruptive. Have to draft based on football ability first and foremost and this guy could form a forward line partnership with Henderson that will last 10 years.

 

[Sharks On A Plane]

I also think people need to appreciate the fact that pick 18 is unlikely to fix our woes.

It guarantees nothing.

Last 5 #18's:

2009 - Luke Tapscott (injured but rated)
2008 - Luke Shuey (very promising)
2007 - Alex Rance (borderline spud)
2006 - Leroy Jetta (borderline spud)
2005 - Max Bailey (injured)

 

[XXX KINGS]

I also think people need to appreciate the fact that pick 18 is unlikely to fix our woes.

It guarantees nothing.

Last 5 #18's:

2009 - Luke Tapscott (injured but rated)
2008 - Luke Shuey (very promising)
2007 - Alex Rance (borderline spud)
2006 - Leroy Jetta (borderline spud)
2005 - Max Bailey (injured)

4 of those drafts were uncompromised too

 

[Blueboys7]

I also think people need to appreciate the fact that pick 18 is unlikely to fix our woes.

It guarantees nothing.

Last 5 #18's:

2009 - Luke Tapscott (injured but rated)
2008 - Luke Shuey (very promising)
2007 - Alex Rance (borderline spud)
2006 - Leroy Jetta (borderline spud)
2005 - Max Bailey (injured)

Agreed, but this is a deep draft and there are some good players that are likely to be around at our picks.

 

[mediumsizered]

I also think people need to appreciate the fact that pick 18 is unlikely to fix our woes.

It guarantees nothing.

Last 5 #18's:

2009 - Luke Tapscott (injured but rated)
2008 - Luke Shuey (very promising)
2007 - Alex Rance (borderline spud)
2006 - Leroy Jetta (borderline spud)
2005 - Max Bailey (injured)

Bailey would have been an absolute beaut if he didn't keep destroying his knee/s. On the couple of occasions I have seen him play he has stood out as a quality ruckman, way superior to the other Hawks' rucks.

 

[Sharks On A Plane]

Bailey would have been an absolute beaut if he didn't keep destroying his knee/s. On the couple of occasions I have seen him play he has stood out as a quality ruckman, way superior to the other Hawks' rucks.

Agreed. An absolute tragedy if he never recovers from his injuries.

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

I also think people need to appreciate the fact that pick 18 is unlikely to fix our woes.

It guarantees nothing.

Last 5 #18's:

2009 - Luke Tapscott (injured but rated)
2008 - Luke Shuey (very promising)
2007 - Alex Rance (borderline spud)
2006 - Leroy Jetta (borderline spud)
2005 - Max Bailey (injured)

And plenty of great players have been taken later than pick 18. Just depends who your recruiters are.

 

[GoBlues!]

I also think people need to appreciate the fact that pick 18 is unlikely to fix our woes.

It guarantees nothing.

Last 5 #18's:

2009 - Luke Tapscott (injured but rated)
2008 - Luke Shuey (very promising)
2007 - Alex Rance (borderline spud)
2006 - Leroy Jetta (borderline spud)
2005 - Max Bailey (injured)

I'm sure there were also players who were picked before #18 that turned out to be duds and others after #18 who were gems in those drafts.

At some point it's basically a lottery where you weigh up strengths and weaknesses and hope like fcuk you can improve their strengths and work on their weaknesses. Fingers crossed we pick out a couple of gems.

 

[Blue and Silver]

Ignorant and bloody sooks is a bit harsh. Last year 10 percent wanted a KPP for structural reasons/insurance. Ok, maybe 10% was a bit high given it was myself and jimthegreat championing this cause mostly. Got shouted down by the old boys school on here who wanted to back in a couple of posters out of team defence mentality.

Funnily enough, the need for a quality tall proved pretty high, and maybe, just maybe shows how a couple of posters were just 1-2 years ahead of the group think curve on here. Would be nice to have a quality tall with 1 years exp in the system right now coming into 2011. But no, we'll draft one this year and have to wait through another year or 2 of flimsy talls and poor structure in 2011/12. Well, unless my dreams come true and austin stands up!

And for the record, the debate was based around not Talia vs Lucas, but a tall vs a mid from picks 10-15 based on best availabe within reason. Every ignorant person on here turns it into extremes. Will be very interesting this year to see if WHs adopts best available but with a 1-5 position pull to fill a need.

From planning perspective alone, and excluding Lucas fanboy mentality, 1 year too late Mr WHs!

PS
Just starting to fire up in readiness

The situation has changed though. Last year Thornton was solidly best 22 as were Bower and Jamison. Waite would be squeezed forward but what we really needed was a FF after Fev leaving. As a matter of fact there was a whole page full of threads calling for a tall forward. This time last year we had 5 KPD's not including Setanta, and Fisher and Henderson up front. Now with Austin under suspicion, Thornton on the periphery, Setanta having boomed and busted, Waite and Henderson having struck form forwrad, Bower getting injured, White getting injured Fisher leaving and Kreuze having gone down we are looking for a tall defender, and probably a tall project forward.

I would claim that an inside midfielder is an even more pressing concern. With Hadley and Grigg gone, Mclean, Ellard, Cachia are left to help Judd. Mclean has injury concerns, Ellard is probably to small to be a permenant fixture, Cachia is a rookie, completely untested at AFL level. Picking up a Parker, Hallahan, Green, Conca or Falsolo will help us just as much as Watson or McCarthy IMO.

I will definitely be looking for a tall defender. But I am not so tunnel-visioned that is all I can see we need

 

[Silvagnis]

The future is in their hands

Emma Quayle, The Age's resident expert on the AFL draft, predicts how tonight's opening round may pan out

1. GC - Swallow
2. GC - Bennell
3. GC- Day
4. WC - Gaff
5. Bris - Polec
6. Rich - Conca
7. GC - Caddy
8. Ess - Prestia
9. GC -Gorringe
10. GC - Lynch
11. GC - Pitt
12. Melb - Heppell
13. GC - Tape
14. Adel - Cripps
15. Geel - Isaac Smith
16. Port - Atley
17. North - Brodie Smith
18. CARLTON MATTHEW WATSON

Vital information: 18, from the Calder Cannons. 195cm, 102kg. Strong key backman with an attacking mindset and huge kick. The rationale: The Blues could do with some young defensive depth. Watson is genuine key-position size and would allow Paul Bower, Marcus Davies and co. to take on second and third opposition forwards.

Best-laid plans: Pat McCarthy will appeal, for similar reasons. Jack Darling will be hugely tempting, if available. Will Scott Lycett tempt them

19. Hawks - Lamb
20. Freo - McCarthy
21. Swans - Smedts
22. Dogs - Wallis
23. Geel - Cook
24. Saints - Guthrie
25. Bris - Lycett

The future is in their hands

It would be rather bemusing if Essendon picked another midget midfielder to go with Jetta, Colyer, Howlett and Davey. Stanton, Melksham, Winderlich, Prismall and Zaharakis aren't exactly great inside players as well.

A lot might depend on Myers getting fit.

Darling wasn't even drafted in Quayle's first 25.

 

[krayfesh]

Smedts! Smedts! Smedts!

Although I liked Emma's draft. Definitely wouldn't mind it working out like that.

 

[Silvagnis]

With all the childish whining and rhetoric about our need for KPP, why wasn't McCarthy penciled in for Hawthorn at pick 19?

They need a big KPD as much, if not more than we do.

Gilham, Stratton, Birchall, Gibson, Schoenmakers and Lisle aren't going to stop the gun power forwards of the AFL.

They could find a ground level forward with a later pick.

St Kilda has Tom Lynch, yet Darling could be a good fit for the Saints who need a Hamill-type forward.

Will be interesting if it goes that way.

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

I'll play along. Which tall would you have taken ahead of Lucas, particularly on the basis that Talia is seen more as a Bower type defender than a big lump of a lad like a Watson? When answering the question keep in mind it was Pick 12 we were using so it would have been too much of a stretch to gamble on a Griffiths or a Black.

Just for fun sake then, and note up front, I was a fan of picking a 10-15 best availabe rated tall over a pick 12 mid...not a fan of Talia specifically, same this year. Macarthy, Darling (means Waite can swing back) or Watson would be great. Leave it to WHs between the 3 if they are all available.

For the argument, only Talia was in range of the 12 pick as franked by Adelaide. PS I know Talia might or might not have been in WHs top 20. We will never know despite some fanboys on here stating it as fact he wasnt rated. No other tall was in a small reach range of 3-5 picks.

I'm not sure why you void Talia playing KKP when we have Bower being drafted as a 3rd tall type but playing KPP CHB. You void Talia as a third tall at the ripe of age of 17/18, and say he cant make it. That is a little naive... same as it would be saying Bower could never play KPP. He can develop same as Bower can. If we were this harsh on players at 17, where would Russell be...delisted after his first 3 seasons. He was an athlete who learned to play HBF.

With the Talia thing, KPP is one thing, but spending quality picks on talls down back is important too. We have Bower, Collingwood have Brown/Reid. Given some of our weaknesses in defence, I just saw the opportunity to add QUALITY to our backs with Talia, not draft a defender with pick 90 and say our backs are set..similar to what WHs did with our rookie picks, talls!

Talia may or may not be able to play KPP CHB, but he hasca better chance than Bower given he is taller and heavier and drafted higher. Only time will tell.

Other will call Talia a spud but I checked and he was doing ok in the SANFL without lighting up the world but then got injured. Adelaide tend not to play talls in their first season if they can help it.

I like Lucas as well.

But the argument is, if their is a pick 18 mid in the mould of Lucas this year and a tall defender rated pick 21 lin the mould of Talia, I know who I want the team to get for structural and overall benefits.

A no brainer to me...needs drafting is on the rise no doubt, and it is impacting ever higher picks.

 

[Sharks On A Plane]

I'm sure there were also players who were picked before #18 that turned out to be duds and others after #18 who were gems in those drafts.

At some point it's basically a lottery where you weigh up strengths and weaknesses and hope like fcuk you can improve their strengths and work on their weaknesses. Fingers crossed we pick out a couple of gems.

I'm aware of that. That's the nature of the draft.

I'm just pointing out that according to recent history, pick 18 is more than likely to be a bust.

Unless Hughes picks McCarthy.

Or Chalwell with #34. *wink wink nudge nudge*

 

[GoBlues!]

Emma Quayle, The Age's resident expert on the AFL draft, predicts how tonight's opening round may pan out

18. CARLTON MATTHEW WATSON
19. Hawks - Lamb
20. Freo - McCarthy
21. Swans - Smedts
22. Dogs - Wallis
23. Geel - Cook
24. Saints - Guthrie
25. Bris - Lycett

Darling wasn't even drafted in Quayle's first 25.

According to Paul Daffey:

18. CARLTON - Matthew Watson
19. HAWTHORN - Jed Lamb
20. FREMANTLE - Reece Conca
21. SYDNEY SWANS - Ben Jacobs
22. WESTERN BULLDOGS - Mitch Wallis
23. GEELONG - Pat McCarthy
24. ST KILDA - Cameron Guthrie
25. BRISBANE LIONS - Kieran Harper
26. WEST COAST - Jack Darling
27. NORTH MELBOURNE - Lucas Cook (compensation)

HERALD Sun draft expert Jay Clark takes an informed stab at the top 25 in tonight's AFL draft.

1. GOLD COAST - DAVID SWALLOW
2. GOLD COAST - HARLEY BENNELL
3. GOLD COAST - SAM DAY
4. WEST COAST - ANDREW GAFF
5. BRISBANE LIONS - JARED POLEC
6. RICHMOND - REECE CONCA
7. GOLD COAST - JOSH CADDY
8. ESSENDON - SHAUN ATLEY
9. GOLD COAST - TOM LYNCH
10. GOLD COAST - DANIEL GORRINGE
11. GOLD COAST - DION PRESTIA
12. MELBOURNE - DYSON HEPPELL
13. GOLD COAST - SEB TAPE
14. ADELAIDE - BRODIE SMITH
15. GEELONG - BILLIE SMEDTS
16. PORT ADELAIDE - SCOTT LYCETT
17. NORTH MELBOURNE - ISAAC SMITH
18. CARLTON - JACK DARLING
19. HAWTHORN - JED LAMB
20. FREMANTLE - BEN JACOBS
21. SYDNEY - MATT WATSON
22. WESTERN BULLDOGS - MITCH WALLIS (FS)
23. GEELONG - PAT MCCARTHY
24. ST KILDA - JAYDEN PITT
25. BRISBANE LIONS - KIERAN HARPER

Based on the above 3 experts rating of the KPP's in question, it looks like Watson is our likely pick #18, ahead of McCarthy and Darling.

Btw how does one become a draft expert?

 

[Dramoth]

Based on the above 3 experts rating of the KPP's in question, it looks like Watson is our likely pick #18, ahead of McCarthy and Darling.

Btw how does one become a draft expert?

a lot of guesswork I guess...

 

[Malifice]

Basically the same reasons I rated Pendlebury so highly. People focus too much on his lack of speed (but Pendlebury has never been flash quick either) and point to some deficiencies in his kicking (he hasn't been playing AFL his whole life and it has rapidly improved.

What he has are the qualities of the true footballer. Admittedly his physical traits aren't standouts, there's no blistering pace and acceleration. But he has composure and awareness that are unrivalled in this year's draft. He can get the ball in a frenzied pack, and quicker than anyone I have seen spot an option or a potential passage of play and set it up. We're talking a Greg Williams like football brain here. (It might stem from his training in cricket given the reflexes a batsmen needs). He is a unique and special talent who we should take at pick 18 if he is there.

Hows your loverboy Rich going?

 

[Malifice]

Please let us pick Darling.

Please.