Rumour GFC 2021 Player Trading, Drafting FA, Rumours and Wish lists

[geelong_crazy26]

Stanley two years is absolutely unreal, not a single reason he should be on more than a one year minimum wage deal.

Its a good move when you consider there are no quality rucks available and he is insurance.

The club has made it very clear they only value skilled athletic rucks who can contribute outside of the hitouts, which is why they went hard after goldstein and drafted neale. The problem is these rucks dont grow on trees and are rare

 

[Art Vandelay_]

I would have thought that lamenting picking up 30+ year old players who are near spent, would have indicated the need for other options like the draft, or at least picking up players who are around the 25-27 mark.

I agree that the game plan cannot compete with the run and attack of the Dogs and Dees. But maybe the slow game plan is the best fit for (and the result of having) an aging midfield that simply does not have the ability to run and gun with the best young midfields anyway.

I can understand why the club recruited these older players. We appeared to be in the flag window.

And yes, I agree, I don't think this current list will take us any further.
The ruck has been an issue since Ottens' retirement/aging midfield/ no run and carry from defense/2 good KPF but all other forwards don't really impress me (maybe Close).

On the positive side, DeKoning, Holmes and Stevens look like they will be players. But Covid also has not been a help for the development of players in the VFL the last few years.

This to me appears to be a conversation breaching multiple separate topics and is somewhat across purposes.

If you're arguing we take what we have to the draft. Totally agree.
That we can't go with the Dees and Dogs. Mostly agree. We match up well v The Dogs and have for some time.
That the ruck consistently is a letdown. Agree again.

But the initial premise was to discredit the observation that like Geelong the Demons had acquired talent from elsewhere by placing a DoB on the discussion, when the majority of our acquired recruits have been under 30 not over. Just seemed an odd take to me.

 

[Two Planks]

Is there an injury riddled talented kid that briabane are trying to fix up we can poach for a crap pick?

Go for Ely Smith

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Go for Ely Smith

Honestly if the rumour re Brisbane wanting Fort is true it could work. They have 35 players contracted (inclduding smith) and 2 first rounders they need t use so they have a numbers squeeze so while they could just trade a 50s/60s pick for fort they might rather swap him for a player at the bottom of their list to create an extra list spot. In that scenario ely or joyce or even brock smith might be realistic. Id love harry sharp but that they wont do.

 

[grum]

It looks obvious that the way forward is young good mids, get it in quick in finals, probably same as it ever was.

Footy hasn't changed that much, with oliver and petracca we must get on our bike, like how many goals out of guts,
it was same against us, there is a time for slow play, but not unless you have control on scoreboard too.

There will be arguments with coaching staff on this subject, but finals is basically good play on football, and you get found out
if you do otherwise, if all players on same page it appears that it is only every teams midfield that effects the result, hopefully we can get some guys in there
that can get it down to our dangerous forwards quickly, and they can play in front, pet hate of mine, if it goes over the back and doesnt work out ,i can live with, i actually think we have as dangerous forwards as anyone.

 

[jnrburger]

From the HS just now:


Geelong wants a draft pick somewhere in between Fremantle’s first and second-round selections to release contracted speedster Jordan Clark

6

Jordan Clark

Age

24

Ht

185cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.7

4star

K

9.4

4star

HB

4.3

3star

M

4.2

4star

T

2.6

4star

MG

172.0

3star

D

12.5

3star

K

8.5

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.5

2star

MG

172.0

3star

D

12.2

3star

K

10.4

4star

HB

1.8

2star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.4

4star

back home to Western Australia.

Currently, Fremantle has picks 8 and 27 but the Cats are unlikely to accept pick 27 in return for a player originally recruited with pick 15 in 2018.

It means the Dockers, who look set to receive pick 6 from Carlton for Adam Cerra, will have to shuffle some of their choices to satisfy the Cats with either a late first-round or early second-round draft choice for Clark

Would rather just give them pick 30 as well and then take pick 8 off their hands instead.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Would rather just give them pick 30 as well and then take pick 8 off their hands instead.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

We are not getting a top 10 pick for clark no matter what we add in. Our only hope would be if freo downgraded 8-e.g. to brisbane for 14 and 18 and then passed us 18. But i doubt freo will agree to dilute 6 or 8 i think they will offer 27 and we will either take it or keep clark.

 

[gaz love x]

We are not getting a top 10 pick for clark no matter what we add in. Our only hope would be if freo downgraded 8-e.g. to brisbane for 14 and 18 and then passed us 18. But i doubt freo will agree to dilute 6 or 8 i think they will offer 27 and we will either take it or keep clark.

The hypothetical 8 for Clark + 30 values Clark at a little better than pick 20 by the AFL's points system so it doesn't sound totally outlandish

 

[MacStradbroke]

Its a good move when you consider there are no quality rucks available and he is insurance.

The club has made it very clear they only value skilled athletic rucks who can contribute outside of the hitouts, which is why they went hard after goldstein and drafted neale. The problem is these rucks dont grow on trees and are rare

Yes I think people are forgetting that we actually need him.

 

[jnrburger]

We are not getting a top 10 pick for clark no matter what we add in. Our only hope would be if freo downgraded 8-e.g. to brisbane for 14 and 18 and then passed us 18. But i doubt freo will agree to dilute 6 or 8 i think they will offer 27 and we will either take it or keep clark.

Understand the sentiment, and don’t necessarily disagree that might be the actual outcome, but, if they want to do it quickly and be able to move on with getting Cerra sorted, etc - 8 will push back at least to 10, so the optics wouldn’t be as bad for them and could always smooth it further with future pick swaps to give them an upgrade, etc.

Where there’s a will there’s a way, and we have proven our willingness to hold the line on players wanting trades out like Kelly, as well as demonstrating that you need to pay up to get what you want like Cameron. (And I’m not remotely comparing Clark to either of them, just the principle).


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[catempire]

The last 5 or so pages that I've bothered to read, with an undercurrent that we should take the "Melbourne approach" reminds me of this post from 2017.

Teams in the top 4 will never ever choose to spend half a decade in the bottom four by choice.

I'm going to break my opus on this topic into chunks. Here's Part I:

Why it is reasonable Geelong hasn't undertaken a 'conventional' rebuild

Here’s the central premise of my thesis: a club will never make the decision to undertake a decisive rebuild while it still feels it can win a flag with the core of its current group.

This thesis explains, to me, why Geelong has never undertaken the conventional rebuild so many here seem to crave. Ask yourself, should we have started the rebuild in:

2011? No, still had stacks of premiership stars and it was quite likely a new coach could inject much needed enthusiasm and new ideas. Worth seeing what a new coach could deliver. And deliver he did.

2012? Finished 6th after H&A. The pundits all said “if anyone can win a flag from here it’s Geelong”. Sadly didn’t happen but it looked like with a decent ruckman (took a very bad gamble on McIntosh at this point) a flag was within reach. No.

2013? Finished 2nd after H&A, having only lost 4 games by an aggregate of 23 points. A really humiliating loss at home in the first final, nearly straight sets in the 2nd week and bundled out by the arch nemesis in the prelim after being in a winning position at three quarter time. Ruckman aside, still no real reason why a flag unattainable.

2014? Finished 3rd winning 17 games in the H&A. Straight sets finals exit. Plenty of questions asked. Have we overachieved with the list we have? Midfield starting to look very thin. A gaping hole is opening up in the 23-26 year old age bracket. But Christensen walks out opening the door to get another ruckman (Stanley). Mitch Clark falls in our lap and looks a great pairing (on paper) with Hawkins. Critically, those in charge know one thing for certain most people don’t: in 12 months’ time Patrick Dangerfield is about to walk through the door.

2015? Absent the Dangerfield factor it would be the obvious candidate, a shocker of a season and our worst result for a decade. Something had to change. But again the opportunity to improve the list, not only with Dangerfield but with Henderson and Scott Selwood means a rebuild is not even given a passing thought.

2016? Flag favourites going into the finals. A coin toss win first up followed by the worst possible performance on the big stage in week 3. Yet again, far too close to be talking rebuilds.

I think many people use hindsight and say that given we didn’t win in those years we might as well have undertaken a rebuild and we erred in not doing so. Decision makers don’t have the benefit of hindsight. They have to judge in the moment whether they are within reach or not and act accordingly. There was never anything to suggest in those years that a clearer path to success was a conventional rebuild rather than grabbing the players we could to fill obvious holes and to get us closer to the ultimate goal. Did the club make mistakes? Absolutely! I shouted from the rooftops that McIntosh was a mistake before we did the deal. Others were mistakes with the benefit of hindsight (Clark) or were hard to explain to the public for various reasons (Johnson, Chapman).

So did Geelong err in not undertaking a decisive rebuild in the past five years? I can’t see any basis for that claim putting myself in the shoes of the decision makers at the time. A flag was always justifiably perceived to be within reach even if we didn’t end up winning it.

Next up: Part II - are we approaching "The Cliff"?

 

[catempire]

This thread will be the biggest fizzer in a long time for us. Very straightforward offseason with no retirements and no salary cap room.

Gone:

- Jenkins
- Jarvis
- Taheny

Going:

- Clark
- Fort

Rookies going/gone:

- Brownless
- Okunbor

Potential rookie upgrades:

- Atkins
- Close

Gives us 3+ ND selections and 2+ rookie selections (depending on rookie upgrades). Hopefully move up the draft order using bundles of picks. Take best available mids.

The end of 2022 is looming as much more interesting.

 

[iameviljez]

Its a good move when you consider there are no quality rucks available and he is insurance.

The club has made it very clear they only value skilled athletic rucks who can contribute outside of the hitouts, which is why they went hard after goldstein and drafted neale. The problem is these rucks dont grow on trees and are rare

Would be nice to just get a big tap-winning brute like Preuss, Draper or Darcy and not have to rely on such a big midfield to win the clearances.

 

[iameviljez]

This thread will be the biggest fizzer in a long time for us. Very straightforward offseason with no retirements and no salary cap room.

Gone:

- Jenkins
- Jarvis
- Taheny

Going:

- Clark
- Fort

Rookies going/gone:

- Brownless
- Okunbor

Potential rookie upgrades:

- Atkins
- Close

Gives us 3+ ND selections and 2+ rookie selections (depending on rookie upgrades). Hopefully move up the draft order using bundles of picks. Take best available mids.

The end of 2022 is looming as much more interesting.

Kreuger

 

[catempire]

Kreuger

A bit to play out there but likely, yes.

 

[The rabbi]

But the initial premise was to discredit the observation that like Geelong the Demons had acquired talent from elsewhere by placing a DoB on the discussion, when the majority of our acquired recruits have been under 30 not over. Just seemed an odd take to me.

Ok, but in the last few years, who have been our recent recruits from other clubs under 30?
The only ones under 30 that I recall was Dahlhaus, Rohan and of course Jeremy Cameron.
Higgins, Smith, Jenkins, Jack Stevens, Gary Ablett were all 30/30+ and with the exception of Jenkins were midfielders. And the midfield to me seems to be the big issue.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

We are not getting a top 10 pick for clark no matter what we add in. Our only hope would be if freo downgraded 8-e.g. to brisbane for 14 and 18 and then passed us 18. But i doubt freo will agree to dilute 6 or 8 i think they will offer 27 and we will either take it or keep clark.

i love the hard nut stance they are prepared to take on players wanting to leave early into their careers on contracts. We are in no position to hand over talented young kids for peanuts, as everyone knows how talented he is, and will want to try and do a robbery job and run laughing.

i wonder how keen fremantle would be if they didnt feel they could do a snatch and steal for cheap?? if clark had a great season and demanded a top ten pick, do you think fremantle would be keen to hand over top compensation? probably not. hence why i think they are keen to try and get him in the door now instead of wait until his contract expires, they feel if he has a good year next season they will have to pay premiums they dont want to fork out.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Would be nice to just get a big tap-winning brute like Preuss, Draper or Darcy and not have to rely on such a big midfield to win the clearances.

they have made it clear for whatever preference of their own they have, that they do not rate these type of rucks.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

This thread will be the biggest fizzer in a long time for us. Very straightforward offseason with no retirements and no salary cap room.

Gone:

- Jenkins
- Jarvis
- Taheny

Going:

- Clark
- Fort

Rookies going/gone:

- Brownless
- Okunbor

Potential rookie upgrades:

- Atkins
- Close

Gives us 3+ ND selections and 2+ rookie selections (depending on rookie upgrades). Hopefully move up the draft order using bundles of picks. Take best available mids.

The end of 2022 is looming as much more interesting.

Kreuger is going and hendo might retire but the rest i agree.

Disagree on cap room we are going to have lots of cap through retirements at end 2022 (same as we did in 2015 and brought players in so we could trade in a player now we just backend their deal for when we will have stacks of cap space in 23/24.
That said we probably wont bring in any big ticket players til next year but thats simply because next years pool of free agents is much better than this year's, not because of cap issues.

I think we will bring in a ruck to replace fort via trade but otherwise it will be a quiet period for us.

Narkle and CC only survive because next years draft is better than this years..both are lucky (CC might be a delist and re rookie option if we need a spot).

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Yes I think people are forgetting that we actually need him.

exactly.

people need to remember everytime they want to throw the baby out with the bathwater, thats fine and all.. but you need to have someone to replace them with. We certainly don't have a quality ruck to replace stanley with unless you want to throw tsapa or neale into the ruck next year with sav/blicavs backup.

I don't think anyone wants to see that

 

[Tackle_happy]

Not sure Dunkley is disgruntled considering he'll be signing a contract extension to stay with the Bulldogs

Coniglio is on stupid money which seems to be a key reason why GWS may be willing to move him on - not sure if we really want to take on his salary and if we expect GWS to pay a good portion of his salary we'd need to find at least 1 top 10 pick

Collingwood would laugh at that trade proposal as would any team likely to not play finals - if Collingwood ended up with pick 10 next year it would value Kreuger at pick 31, if Collingwood had pick 5 it would value Kreuger at pick 16. Collingwood would wanted at least 3 picks from us, something like 30, 32 & 52 to even consider it

Anyone taking on Coniglio would be looking to pay maybe 60 percent max of his ongoing salary.

With that in mind it might make him more appealing.

No club would take on his entire salary as it stands now.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Ok, but in the last few years, who have been our recent recruits from other clubs under 30?
The only ones under 30 that I recall was Dahlhaus, Rohan and of course Jeremy Cameron.
Higgins, Smith, Jenkins, Jack Stevens, Gary Ablett were all 30/30+ and with the exception of Jenkins were midfielders. And the midfield to me seems to be the big issue.

if Constable, Clark, Narkle, Parfitt weren't utter crap then maybe we wouldn't need to recruit people in their twilights.
Same with the links to Talia. If SDK wasn't being groomed for two needs (Ruck/KPD) and Kreuger had some ability maybe we wouldn't be linked to a Crows reject.

In the same way that the Selwood is cooked crowd must realise no one is pushing him out. Our mid youth is pretty abject.
Parfitt is the 'jewel in the crown'

 

[iameviljez]

they have made it clear for whatever preference of their own they have, that they do not rate these type of rucks.

Well they damn well should.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

This thread will be the biggest fizzer in a long time for us. Very straightforward offseason with no retirements and no salary cap room.

Gone:

- Jenkins
- Jarvis
- Taheny

Going:

- Clark
- Fort

Rookies going/gone:

- Brownless
- Okunbor

Potential rookie upgrades:

- Atkins
- Close

Gives us 3+ ND selections and 2+ rookie selections (depending on rookie upgrades). Hopefully move up the draft order using bundles of picks. Take best available mids.

The end of 2022 is looming as much more interesting.

Side point but next year looks very interesting.

I imagine sel hendo dahl and higgins all retire then..fort clark narkle and CC all likely go end 2022 if they arent best 22 (same for OB and okunbor if they dont go this year) and all of hawkins smith stanley tuohy and rohan are possible retirements depending on form and fitness. Obviously not all of those players go but we could easily turn over 10 spots next year and you cant fill that many in one draft so we will almost have to bring in some free agents and we will have the cap space to do it.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

they have made it clear for whatever preference of their own they have, that they do not rate these type of rucks.

Agree but thats why i would like ladhams or lynch as both are very good movers for their size..its essential we trade in a ruck of some sort this year..the darcy type of ruck is also very valuable FWIW.