How will we go Rounds 14-24 ?

[Jhye Clark 13]

One of the biggest factors is we've got about three blokes in the 23-27 age range, where players peak as footballers. There is no way we can compete with teams who have most of their elite players in this range.

We currently have 7 players in this range and a few just either side.

It didn't stop us from dominating last season.

 

[SJ]

We currently have 7 players in this range and a few just either side.

It didn't stop us from dominating last season.

Most of our guns are yet another year further from their peak this year.

It's a slippery slope down the other side.

 

[blue_bear1]

14-8. Lose to West Coast, Coll and probably Bombers.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

One of the biggest factors is we've got about three blokes in the 23-27 age range, where players peak as footballers. There is no way we can compete with teams who have most of their elite players in this range.

Correct, the list does top and tail a lot and it leaves a lot of load on Selwood on the middle. And it stretches both the old who are slowing down a bit, and the young who are not quite ready to take over yet. That will change in time as the profile of our list changes, but it is where we are now and it's one reason why we have to be realistic about our expectations for this year.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Most of our guns are yet another year further from their peak this year.

It's a slippery slope down the other side.

I understand what you're saying in logic but most of our guns who are out of their peak range have been our best performed players this season. What we havn't been able to replace are Ling and Ottens who were still playing at their peak when they retired and being without our best line-up for the majority of the season.

We'll be ok.

 

[SJ]

I understand what you're saying in logic but most of our guns who are out of their peak range have been our best performed players this season. What we havn't been able to replace are Ling and Ottens who were still playing at their peak when they retired and being without our best line-up for the majority of the season.

We'll be ok.

Exactly, if your 28- to 30-year-olds are your best players you will more often than not be worse than teams who have younger players as their best.

To me that is even more of a worry.

Selwood is clearly our best player and has entered the peak age range.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

The difference is we aren't using a sustained press where EVERYBODY on the field is corralling their man continually like last season.

Fitness.

You would be mad to try and do that at this stage of the year, off a shorter PS than everyone else, you'll burn your troops out. That's why I'm not as concerned that I haven't seen our full defensive pressing work constantly, I am confident we will see it brought out down the stretch when it is needed. I am more concerned about our seeming inability to rectify our contested ball issues, specifically not getting first hands on the footy enough, as well as our spread.

 

[footscore]

You know all about it bobie?

but in 1993 the coach only had like, 1 assistant and his job was to get the man his food and drink as well as carry the little whiteboard thingy.

In 2012, we have around 6+ coaching staff, one is the midfield coach, defensive coach and forward coach.
If the players were to do this '1993 Blight-intervention' that you speak of...can we assume Scott's coaching assistants have not been doing their jobs and perhaps just been twiddling their thumbs all week long for the past 13 weeks?

And you do realize in 1993 the game didn't have anywhere near as many changes in game style as it does today?
If the players confront the coach and suggest we hate playing conservatively and wanna incorporate more of our famous 07 style, what happens when they caught out in 12 weeks time against a team that has figured out this game style?

Chris ain't silly man, he's trying different things just like the rest of the competition and some games we are getting it to work and some games it's breaking down.
Trying to find the balance is what they are after and as we have seen so far...it's obviously a pretty tough gig to try and get right.

 

[footscore]

Exactly, if your 28- to 30-year-olds are your best players you will more often than not be worse than teams who have younger players as their best.

To me that is even more of a worry.

Selwood is clearly our best player and has entered the peak age range.

but it also works both ways as the young players are improving and taking more of the load away from these older players.
Corey has already got supporters asking for his head because they know that Christensen is capable of filling his role (to some degree).

Chapman needs to keep performing as Menzel would be his likely replacement and obviously won't be back until next season.
Josh Hunt has some supporters questioning his spot in the best 22 as Guthrie looks to be improving on a weekly basis.

So while some fade, we also have some that are improving which tends to even things out.

Kelly is a champion and an All-Australian, he's 28 in the peak of his career but hasn't produced anything close to what we were use to seeing from him last year.
When he starts to find that form, Bundy, Selwood, Corey will be having a much easier time of getting the footy than they are currently.

 

[SJ]

but it also works both ways as the young players are improving and taking more of the load away from these older players.
Corey has already got supporters asking for his head because they know that Christensen is capable of filling his role (to some degree).

Chapman needs to keep performing as Menzel would be his likely replacement and obviously won't be back until next season.
Josh Hunt has some supporters questioning his spot in the best 22 as Guthrie looks to be improving on a weekly basis.

So while some fade, we also have some that are improving which tends to even things out.

Kelly is a champion and an All-Australian, he's 28 in the peak of his career but hasn't produced anything close to what we were use to seeing from him last year.
When he starts to find that form, Bundy, Selwood, Corey will be having a much easier time of getting the footy than they are currently.

What I am trying to say is we are going to get worse before we are going to get better.

The odds were that this year we were going to be worse than last, and are that next we will be worse than this. There is no way that 18- to 20-year-old players can even get close to the level of All-Australian-class players at the peak of their careers.

Anything else (eg. Selwood) is a massive bonus.

 

[footscore]

true but Christensen is a gun. He could be copping a tag by the end of the year if he keeps improving like he is.

We have also got our number 1 ruckman back. Something we have sorely missed for a number of years as Ottens was very injury prone in latter years.
Simpson now has the rest of the year to build up his fitness and he should be fairly use to how the midfielders work heading into September.

I agree that players like Enright, Scarlett, Wojcinski, Podsiadly, Chapman and Corey are now starting to feel it but if we find ourselves luring a quality defender as well as another midfielder and we continue to see the upside in the youngsters, we aren't going to drop as far as some would think.
But hey', that's just my opinion of course

 

[Poetic Justice]

Got our number 1 ruck back?

Ottens injured?

Sorry, but even in Ottens worst years he was offering better than what we are currently getting.

 

[vinum coupe]

That's what I reckon too Chaos. All we have 'back' at the minute is our biggest player.
Would he be number one ruck at any other club?
I doubt it.

He needs a good 2 years yet.

 

[Poetic Justice]

Otto and the club would be kicking themselves that Otto didn't push on for one more year. Would be making a big difference to our team atm.

Hindsight is a bitch.

 

[footscore]

yeh, he's our no.1 ruck alright.

He's just spent the last 6 months out of the game with a problematic back injury and made his return to senior footy on Friday night.
Usually takes most players 2-3 weeks before they find their touch but ruckman can take a little longer.

Yep...Otto played a total of 56 games in his final 4 seasons of footy, basically 2 seasons so he was injured quite a lot of the time but thankfully produced when he returned time and time again.
He left the game at the right time as I doubt he would have got through another season if he went again.
And if he did go again he would have stopped either West or Simpson gaining valuable match time and with GWS reportedly asking about West, not sure West would wish to put up with spending time in and out of the magoo's all over again.

 

[Poetic Justice]

West would have played every game to date regardless of Otto in or out.

If Otto was in, Stephenson wouldn't have been drafted. So how could West have not played?

 

[SJ]

yeh, he's our no.1 ruck alright.

He's just spent the last 6 months out of the game with a problematic back injury and made his return to senior footy on Friday night.
Usually takes most players 2-3 weeks before they find their touch but ruckman can take a little longer.

Yep...Otto played a total of 56 games in his final 4 seasons of footy, basically 2 seasons so he was injured quite a lot of the time but thankfully produced when he returned time and time again.
He left the game at the right time as I doubt he would have got through another season if he went again.
And if he did go again he would have stopped either West or Simpson gaining valuable match time and with GWS reportedly asking about West, not sure West would wish to put up with spending time in and out of the magoo's all over again.

He might be our number one ruck but again this doesn't mean we are on the brink of a miraculous recovery up the ladder. Indeed I'd expect the opposite.

 

[Deeskys]

Can see us going 14-8, losing to the Collingwood, Essendon (We're very average @ Etihad) and West Coast. Very tough though, anything can happen really..

 

[candiehappy]

Otto and the club would be kicking themselves that Otto didn't push on for one more year. Would be making a big difference to our team atm.

Hindsight is a bitch.

I doubt Otto was pushed, he knew that his body was done and we are assuming that he could have performed this year at the same level that he did last year. I'd say that he didn't think that he could, so he went out on a high.

maybe he was worried that if he'd played on but wasn't playing to the same standard, that posters on BF would call for him to be playing in the two's ......

 

[footscore]

He might be our number one ruck but again this doesn't mean we are on the brink of a miraculous recovery up the ladder. Indeed I'd expect the opposite.

I never said we would be on the brink of a miraculous recovery.
Having our main ruckman back in the team and able to continue his development as a player from where he left off early last year is a considerable positive for the footy club.

We may indeed drop away, I personally don't believe so as players like Selwood, Taylor, Hawkins, Christensen, Varcoe, Menzel, West etc are good enough to build a team around and with Dawson back, it helps to alleviate some of the pressure on West who can now play his more appropriate role as 2nd ruck pushing forward.

 

[SJ]

I never said we would be on the brink of a miraculous recovery.
Having our main ruckman back in the team and able to continue his development as a player from where he left off early last year is a considerable positive for the footy club.

We may indeed drop away, I personally don't believe so as players like Selwood, Taylor, Hawkins, Christensen, Varcoe, Menzel, West etc are good enough to build a team around and with Dawson back, it helps to alleviate some of the pressure on West who can now play his more appropriate role as 2nd ruck pushing forward.

Yeah it's a definite positive.

On the underlined, you've named seven players between A+ and B grade. Now that is a good thing but most clubs could probably name double that figure from the same age range.

 

[Partridge]

Round 18.

I think we will drop this. KP has been a bit bad for us this year with the stand ripped down, but I expect it to be close.

Adelaide by 14.

We're undefeated at home this season. Unlike interstate, Etihad or the MCG.

 

[Partridge]

Loool.

Another Cats supporter assuming we won't improve past round 13. Hahhaah.

We've been through this way too many times to do that. Anyone who says otherwise is an idiot.

Anyone who thinks results from the past somehow influence results in the future is also an idiot.

 

[footscore]

Now that is a good thing but most clubs could probably name double that figure from the same age range.

but they wouldn't be B to A graders, they would be players who are on the brink of taking the next step and because we still have veterans performing at the highest level, we haven't been able to play many other youngsters like Richmond, North, Essendon or Collingwood would.

If we really wanted to go young, and play for the future from this week onwards...Scott could very well field this team http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/games/2011/010920110626.html and they would be doing as well as the other teams around the 8 but why do that when we can continue playing champions like Scarlett, Enright, Chapman and they continually deliver for us in big games.
Scott is doing the right thing by constantly rotating the team around on a weekly basis. It's the only way we can ensure the youth get games as well as stay competitive enough to have a shot at winning another premiership.

 

[Partridge]

What I am trying to say is we are going to get worse before we are going to get better.

The odds were that this year we were going to be worse than last, and are that next we will be worse than this. There is no way that 18- to 20-year-old players can even get close to the level of All-Australian-class players at the peak of their careers.

Anything else (eg. Selwood) is a massive bonus.

Absolute bullseye. That's the elephant in the room. The peak years as you said - 23-27 - how many players right now can we build the team around in that bracket? I'd say three - Selwood, Taylor and Hawkins (could have missed someone).

Although the average age of the team is younger this year, unfortunately the output of the older players has lowered too much. Which can happen and shouldn't be ignored just because it's uncomfortable.