Traded Jason Horne-Francis [to Port Adelaide in multi-club trade]

[philthy05]

Are GWS looking to use picks 3, 12, 15, 18 and 19 purely for the draft? Or do they want to get some players in via trade?

Maybe we could upgrade pick 33 or 43 for one those later picks and offer up Byrne-Jones or Bonner?

We genuinely need to trade away a player for 2nd round. Can't see it happening another way.

Hayes, Drew, Bonner, DBJ, Farrell. DBJ with most value in that lot perhaps as an All-Australian and club BnF although he was off it best this year. I know he just resigned but yeah either him or Drew

In all seriousness North have actually done fine out of this deal. So have West Coast. GWS showed up, bent over and handed over the lube to make it work for everyone else, and I salute them for it.

Yeah I think north have done well. What more can you hope for to get for a player that wants out than a similar pick + a future 1st on top. That’s a good deal.

Also west coast, despite people knocking them to get out of pick 2 and the private school vic boys and into hewett territory , whose not far behind, if at all those vic boys plus get another pick. That’s good for them.

Ports given up a lot, but the fact we get future 2nds and 3rds back helps a lot,

In the end rozee butters jhf Bergman sinn to look forward too in our midfield.

I really rate that group of players as a future midfield. High end young talent there.

 

[CrowToon]

I've posted it several times, but will again.

Letting a draftee go out the door sends the message to future draftees that it's ok to ignore the 2 year contract and seek an out if you aren't happy.

Letting a draftee with the high value out the door for unders (and to be honest we constantly have been pretty limp at the trade for some time) that we'll happily accept unders in the future and managers will take advantage of that.

Draftees compared to established players are unknown quantities. They're aren't any available in the proposed trades that aren't fringe players or of considerable value.

Yes, probably still likely to go home in 12 months, but to me all of the above, is far riskier than having another 12 months with JHF.

No one can predict what will happen in 12 months. And no-one know what has been discussed between JHF, the players and coaching staff at North.

People need to stop pointing at 'take what you can get/s**t attitude' as a reason for accepting unders. Not enough IMO.

We may very well bend over and accept unders but would irresponsible IMO.

I acknowledge Kangas are in a shite position but I think the whole 'message to future draftees' thing is more of a league issue rather than a club one and to that end Kangaroos shouldn't potentially pass up a deal for the sake of principle.

They already passed on a couple of good offers last year. They shouldn't compound it by passing again and costing themselves more good prospects because ultimately people won't remember the moral stand they made, they will remember it's Year 5 of a rebuild and we are still rooted to the bottom

 

[Kangas_11]

I've posted it several times, but will again.

Letting a draftee go out the door sends the message to future draftees that it's ok to ignore the 2 year contract and seek an out if you aren't happy.

Letting a draftee with the high value out the door for unders (and to be honest we constantly have been pretty limp at the trade for some time) that we'll happily accept unders in the future and managers will take advantage of that.

Draftees compared to established players are unknown quantities. They're aren't any available in the proposed trades that aren't fringe players or of considerable value.

Yes, probably still likely to go home in 12 months, but to me all of the above, is far riskier than having another 12 months with JHF.

No one can predict what will happen in 12 months. And no-one know what has been discussed between JHF, the players and coaching staff at North.

People need to stop pointing at 'take what you can get/s**t attitude' as a reason for accepting unders. Not enough IMO.

We may very well bend over and accept unders but would irresponsible IMO.

The other point to this is if you set this environment where draftees are free to walk all over the club just one year into the contract, you end up paying insane wages to all draftees just to keep them at the club.

Then, you end up in a situation like GC/GWS where your salary cap is ruined and there's a never ending cycle of trading your young players for draft picks.

 

[Ry009]

I acknowledge Kangas are in a shite position but I think the whole 'message to future draftees' thing is more of a league issue rather than a club one and to that end Kangaroos shouldn't potentially pass up a deal for the sake of principle.

They already passed on a couple of good offers last year. They shouldn't compound it by passing again and costing themselves more good prospects because ultimately people won't remember the moral stand they made, they will remember it's Year 5 of a rebuild and we are still rooted to the bottom

Think you haven't read or understood the post in full, so happy to leave it there.

 

[Ry009]

The other point to this is if you set this environment where draftees are free to walk all over the club just one year into the contract, you end up paying insane wages to all draftees just to keep them at the club.

Then, you end up in a situation like GC/GWS where your salary cap is ruined and there's a never ending cycle of trading your young players for draft picks.

Yep. Principle isn't the driving issue, it's a list management issue.

Under Scott and his FD, we continually re-signed players on decent coin and length, when it wasn't probably justified. We were then left with a list full of deadwood and where we find ourselves right now.

 

[sexyhunk]

so i was just thinking if North accepted Adelaide 3 pick offer last year and Crows drafted JHF, what would be his excuse be to go to port? or would he have just stayed at the crows

 

[killtaker1993]

Port better stop playing silly buggers with North and pony up for the lad. North hold all the cards and won't blink with Viney and Clarko at the helm. All this dorky posturing is embarrassing. Pay up and stop wasting everyone's time

 

[Del191229]

Port better stop playing silly buggers with North and pony up for the lad. North hold all the cards and won't blink with Viney and Clarko at the helm. All this dorky posturing is embarrassing. Pay up and stop wasting everyone's time

It is telling that they weren't trying to trade for pick 1 last year. They've been planning this a long long time.

 

[FourthTimeAround]

Of course it is. You had your chance of getting Adelaide's offer last year. You should have taken it. Most Crows fans are relieved that you didn't. It's gone now and it's never coming back. And if you don't trade JHF this year, his value will fall further still.

out of everything from both sides that has been borderline delusional, incl some of my work, this point needs to be emphasised.

Worth 3 first round picks with a couple of later ones coming back last year.
When JHF wanted to go to North.

Now he doesn’t want to stay. But contracted.
And already North acknowledge that by reducing what they’ll accept. Playing hardball of course and good on them for doing so.

I can’t work out the rationale of thinking his value will hold for 12 more months, after which he’ll be out of contract.

 

[theouthouse]

The other point to this is if you set this environment where draftees are free to walk all over the club just one year into the contract, you end up paying insane wages to all draftees just to keep them at the club.

Then, you end up in a situation like GC/GWS where your salary cap is ruined and there's a never ending cycle of trading your young players for draft picks.

So its been ok for Vic clubs to pilfer all the top end talent back to Victoria for peanuts after years of professional development, but no other state can do it, despite paying massively for it, and in this particular case, with very little professional development?

 

[PowerBaz]

It has to. I think too much water has gone under the bridge for it not to happen and besides, whatever North get this year is more than they will get next year. Have to remember if it doesn't go through you've got an unhappy kid who has shown himself to be well short of the professionalism and maturity required at the level. Can be detrimental to a club that.

So I do see it getting done but the utter arrogance of Port to not offer up a player of quality should be enough for other clubs to take note for future trades that Port is a club that doesn't act in good faith.

Not our fault unlike North players are happy to walk.

Also, who knows what’s been left unmentioned just yet, they’d have something up there sleeve.

 

[Del191229]

So its been ok for Vic clubs to pilfer all the top end talent back to Victoria for peanuts after years of professional development, but no other state can do it, despite paying massively for it, and in this particular case, with very little professional development?

You mean how like Byron Pickett went back to Port from North?

You were better run and then and could conduct yourselves like a proper club then though.

 

[Del191229]

Not our fault unlike North players are happy to walk.

Also, who knows what’s been left unmentioned just yet, they’d have something up there sleeve.

The only North player to walk in recent memory is little Chicken Salt himself.

You guys should be very wary about what you're getting.

Seems to me like he's happy to head back home, coast by on his talent, be a big fish in a little pond and act like kicking the winner in a Showdown is the same as winning a Grand Final.

That Clarkson and Viney ... who have a few more footy achievement on the board than Riverboat Ken ... are letting him walk is absolutely telling.

 

[PowerBaz]

The only North player to walk in recent memory is little Chicken Salt himself.

You guys should be very wary about what you're getting.

Seems to me like he's happy to head back home, coast by on his talent, be a big fish in a little pond and act like kicking the winner in a Showdown is the same as winning a Grand Final.

That Clarkson and Viney ... who have a few more footy achievement on the board than Riverboat Ken ... are letting him walk is absolutely telling.

So Clarkson is cleared to coach?

 

[PowerBaz]

The only North player to walk in recent memory is little Chicken Salt himself.

You guys should be very wary about what you're getting.

Seems to me like he's happy to head back home, coast by on his talent, be a big fish in a little pond and act like kicking the winner in a Showdown is the same as winning a Grand Final.

That Clarkson and Viney ... who have a few more footy achievement on the board than Riverboat Ken ... are letting him walk is absolutely telling.

Also how many players and coaches have been moved on in recent years? It’s not hard to wonder why is it? Great environment.

 

[FourthTimeAround]

The only North player to walk in recent memory is little Chicken Salt himself.

You guys should be very wary about what you're getting.

Seems to me like he's happy to head back home, coast by on his talent, be a big fish in a little pond and act like kicking the winner in a Showdown is the same as winning a Grand Final.

That Clarkson and Viney ... who have a few more footy achievement on the board than Riverboat Ken ... are letting him walk is absolutely telling.

Lucky you or I or anyone on here is not associated with the deals.

Because your view of the AFL industry is remarkably salty itself.

 

[SnowRoo]

So Clarkson is cleared to coach?

Clarko has no ban from coaching!

His current leave of absence is self requested, as is Fagan's.

Only limitation right now is his obligation to the Hawks until Nov 1.

By his choice he could walk in Nov 1 and go full throttle, nothing legally or AFL enforced to stop this.

 

[PowerBaz]

Clarko has no ban from coaching!

His current leave of absence is self requested, as is Fagan's.

Only limitation right now is his obligation to the Hawks until Nov 1.

By his choice he could walk in Nov 1 and go full throttle, nothing legally or AFL enforced to stop this.

All going under the rug!

 

[Del191229]

So Clarkson is cleared to coach?

Nice avoidance of the rather unpleasant reality that you're going hell for leather to recruit a kid who wouldn't do his ice baths at exactly the same time Ben Cunnington was busting a gut to get back out there.

Ask yourself how that went down with the rest of the squad.

I get that Fabian Francis is terrified the golden goose might fly away and wants him back in Adelaide where he can stay firmly under control, and you guys think that's helping you, but you should really be thinking about this one.

(And yes, Clarkson will be coaching us. Viney is running the footy dept now anyway and seems more than happy to let Chicken Salt walk too.)

 

[HinkleysHeroes]

The only North player to walk in recent memory is little Chicken Salt himself.

You guys should be very wary about what you're getting.

Seems to me like he's happy to head back home, coast by on his talent, be a big fish in a little pond and act like kicking the winner in a Showdown is the same as winning a Grand Final.

That Clarkson and Viney ... who have a few more footy achievement on the board than Riverboat Ken ... are letting him walk is absolutely telling.

Sounds like he isn't worth much on the trade table then

 

[Del191229]

Also how many players and coaches have been moved on in recent years? It’s not hard to wonder why is it? Great environment.

Yeah man, Rhyce Shaw's mental illness flaring and Ben Jacobs having career ending concussion says heaps.

Fact is we haven't lost any players we wanted to keep until Chicken Salt here had his tanty because Fabian told him to.

Its all immaterial though - he's contracted and you have to pay accordingly.

Time for Port to grow up and deal like a proper club.

 

[Brian McGee]

What is this chicken salt thing?

 

[Del191229]

Lucky you or I or anyone on here is not associated with the deals.

Because your view of the AFL industry is remarkably salty itself.

???

Look if Chicken Salt was genuinely homesick and had conducted himself like a professional all year, I'd say hey, these things happen. Kid has had a pretty rough trot in life, he put in his best for us, we move on.

He didn't though. He sooked, he paid out on teammates with far more credit in the bank, he acted like a spoilt little brat. And now he wants out.

As I said, he didn't do an ice bath and sooked when Ben Cunnington was working his guts out to make his return.

That says a whole lot about Chicken Salt's character imo.

You can see why Clarkson and Viney are happy to let him go.

I'm happy to let him and go too, and I was part of a group that sponsored him too, he signed a jumper for my son.

Seeya Jayse - enjoy being back home, hope it all works out for you.

 

[Lore]

???

Look if Chicken Salt was genuinely homesick and had conducted himself like a professional all year, I'd say hey, these things happen. Kid has had a pretty rough trot in life, he put in his best for us, we move on.

He didn't though. He sooked, he paid out on teammates with far more credit in the bank, he acted like a spoilt little brat. And now he wants out.

As I said, he didn't do an ice bath and sooked when Ben Cunnington was working his guts out to make his return.

That says a whole lot about Chicken Salt's character imo.

You can see why Clarkson and Viney are happy to let him go.

I'm happy to let him and go too, and I was part of a group that sponsored him too, he signed a jumper for my son.

Seeya Jayse - enjoy being back home, hope it all works out for you.

Chicken Salt?

 

[Del191229]

Sounds like he isn't worth much on the trade table then

No, he's a contracted pick 1 with immense footy ability.

We'll back ourselves to get the best out of him if Port can't act like professionals.

Clarkson will work with him like he did Hodge.

Fabian is probably terrified of that, will lose his pension.

 

[Del191229]

What is this chicken salt thing?

Jason.

He's chicken of hard work at a real club, he's a salty little sook who didn't like being called out on his not doing the work, and he's fundamentally a weird thing that's occasionally really good that's come out of South Australia, like chicken salt itself.

Lore