Opinion Matthew Nicks: Adelaide's Coach (Part 2) - Full Support of the Board

[Mr_Moogle]

Star Wars quotes are becoming insidious

Darth Sidious?

Seriously though, Nicks is Jar Jar.

 

[FR0GGY]

Sith lord

 

[AFC979810]

Nicks is like a Jedi Knight who approaches the Jedi Council asking to be immediately promoted to the rank of Master, and when he's permitted to sit on the Council but not be promoted to Master, decides to turn to the Dark Side and enacts a decades long reign of terror

Nicks is Jar Jar Binks.

 

[relapse]

Well, technically nicks did make finals its just the AFL stole it away from us last year so last year always has an asterisk against it as far as i am concerned. That was and forever will be a complete and utter disgrace what hapened to us V Sydney from not just the game day officiating but what went down after that to prevent it from being properly redressed in our favor

I don't agree that the AFL "stole it away", it was an umpiring error.

The reality is that the AFL were never going to go back after the fact and change the result when there was still time left in the game.

It's the same as the Maynard blocking free that wasn't paid in the 2018 Grand Final, ultimately it cost Collingwood a premiership.

I definitely wouldn't want to see the AFL setting precedents where they begin changing the results of games as they see fit. Instead they need to focus on getting their systems and processes right to stop these types of errors and have things in place to ensure that they're identified and corrected at the time they happen.

 

[relapse]

Here's one for the real Star Wars nerds.

Nicks is more like Haja Estree than an actual Jedi

 

[kirky]

I don't agree that the AFL "stole it away", it was an umpiring error.

The reality is that the AFL were never going to go back after the fact and change the result when there was still time left in the game.

It's the same as the Maynard blocking free that wasn't paid in the 2018 Grand Final, ultimately it cost Collingwood a premiership.

I definitely wouldn't want to see the AFL setting precedents where they begin changing the results of games as they see fit. Instead they need to focus on getting their systems and processes right to stop these types of errors and have things in place to ensure that they're identified and corrected at the time they happen.

Not only that but there was still another round to play.

Sydney may well have defeated Melbourne in Sydney if there place in finals depended on it and as it was it took us 3/4 to beat a bottom West Coast on their home deck. The expectation on us to win may have seen us lose - lets he honest whenever we have had expectations placed on us under Nicks it has ended in tears.

 

[relapse]

Not only that but there was still another round to play.

Sydney may well have defeated Melbourne in Sydney if there place in finals depended on it and as it was it took us 3/4 to beat a bottom West Coast on their home deck. The expectation on us to win may have seen us lose - lets he honest whenever we have had expectations placed on us under Nicks it has ended in tears.

Also too whether we won or lost the game doesn't change the fact that Nicks this year has been exposed as a dud coach.

Looking back now the only reason we even got close to the eight last year was due to playing West Coast and North twice and Tex having a career best season.

In a way it's most probably better now that we didn't make it because it makes the push to get rid of him easier than if we made the finals.

 

[crows dude]

Robert Shaws winning % at the Crows is better than Nicks

Shaw also had twice the talent on the list

 

[Crow till I die]

I don't agree that the AFL "stole it away", it was an umpiring error.

The reality is that the AFL were never going to go back after the fact and change the result when there was still time left in the game.

It's the same as the Maynard blocking free that wasn't paid in the 2018 Grand Final, ultimately it cost Collingwood a premiership.

I definitely wouldn't want to see the AFL setting precedents where they begin changing the results of games as they see fit. Instead they need to focus on getting their systems and processes right so to stop these types of errors and having things in place to ensure that they're identified and corrected at the time they happen.

It was such an egregious error and they had technology in place to correct it there and then when it was flagged. That they chose to not do anything and they could have was a total disgrace. I would have settled for a replay - they have done that before in Europe with Soccer where there were match defining errors committed by the referee pre VAR in Germany. It was just such a massive season wrecking error that it should not have been allowed to stand imo

 

[George Kramer]

Also too whether we won or lost the game doesn't change the fact that Nicks this year has been exposed a dud coach.

Looking back now the only reason we even got close to the eight last year was due to playing West Coast and North twice and Tex having a career best season.

In a way it's most probably better now that we didn't make it because it makes the push to get rid of him easier than if we made the finals.

And we had an extra home game

 

[texanmike]

Shaw also had twice the talent on the list

The club have come out multiple times this year and publicly stated we have the list. DELUSIONAL.
So by right, whats the excuse for poor results if they see this list as contending?
A club on the road to nowhere.

 

[TubbsFarquhar]

There was no guarantee we would've beaten the Swans. If the ball went through as the final siren sounded, then there would've been grounds to overturn the result, but there was still over a minute to play which is plenty of time for the Swans to kick a match-winner. Yes, we dominated the last quarter and the odds would've been in our favour, but nothing was a certainty.

Our other close losses that season, diabolical efforts against the Bulldogs and Essendon and collapsed against the Giants (especially round 1) were far more costly.

 

[CrowBloke]

"Ultimately, winning is the metric by which success is judged."
(from an ABC article about the Simpson sacking).

By that metric alone (never mind the inner intricacies of the AFC), it's astonishing that Nicks has not been sacked.
NO finals appearances in 5 years and 34-64-1, ffs.

 

[Crow till I die]

There were no guarantees we would've beaten the Swans. If the ball went through as the final siren sounded, then there would've been grounds to overturn the result, but there was still over a minute to play which is plenty of time for the Swans to kick a match-winner. Yes, we dominated the last quarter and the odds would've been in our favour, but nothing was a certainty.

Our other close losses that season, diabolical efforts against the Bulldogs and Essendon and collapsed against the Giants (especially round 1) were far more costly.

I think people here are completely missing the point. The 'error' that occurred was one that had specific technology in place to have allowed it to be overturned there and then. All it needed was the umpires to use a modicum of common sense when they realised something was seriously wrong with the call. We should have been awarded a goal and then it was up to Sydney to try and win the game in the last 48 seconds. Whether they would have or not is the unknown but it should have been them having to win it from there not us. Then others say well, they might have beaten Melbourne had they needed to win. They also might not have and knowing we were playing WCE in the last game, the pressure to win on them would have ramped up massively. WCE were always a good chance to lose to us in that last game being a despondent bottom placed side getting beaten heavily week in week out.

If it was an onfield umpiring decision not going our way in the last minute of the game (there have been more of them that I care to list) that cost us, different story as there is no technology specifically to review onfield calls like HTB, push in the back etc like there is set up to determine if its a goal or a point. It was a reversible error and we should have been afforded the opportunity either in game or they needed to work a replay and there was a bye week before finals they could have done it in. We were absolutely f****D by the AFL over this and it cost us our season...not to mention Geelong who would have still been in contention with a Sydney loss going into the last round of the season for finals.

 

[CrowBloke]

I think people here are completely missing the point.

I've read with interest your posts on this and the replies by relapse, kirky and TubbsFarquhar the latter of whom gave the best response, imo:

There was no guarantee we would've beaten the Swans. If the ball went through as the final siren sounded, then there would've been grounds to overturn the result, but there was still over a minute to play which is plenty of time for the Swans to kick a match-winner. Yes, we dominated the last quarter and the odds would've been in our favour, but nothing was a certainty.

Our other close losses that season, diabolical efforts against the Bulldogs and Essendon and collapsed against the Giants (especially round 1) were far more costly.

It's clear that you're still upset. Please believe me that I was upset too and crazy-keen for the Crows to make Finals in 2023. However, with respect for your posting record, I don't think you've really taken into account their counter-arguments.
As bad as the Goal Umpire's decision was it was a human error of which we've all been guilty at some time or another. There are just too many sliding doors possibilities to consider to be certain what m-i-g-h-t have happened:
--- time left for Sydney to score a goal from the CB if the goal was given.
--- no guarantee that we'd beat WC the following week
--- the possibility that Sydney might have beaten Melbourne the next week, anyway
--- the possibility that a goal review, had it been taken, might have been called "Umpire's call", and so on.

The 'error' that occurred was one that had specific technology in place to have allowed it to be overturned there and then.

This is true. The technology was there, but were there rules in place to act? Why the Umpires did not call for a review at such a crucial moment on such a close call is worth considering. I know all goals are reviewed as a matter of course, but can Central Umpires ask for a point to be reviewed?
Even so, the technology is often not definitive. Several replays were not clear at all. I was watching live and could not tell from the many replays they showed if it was a point or not. I think only one of them showed the gap, a while later. J-u-s-t.
Anyway, the point called might have been upheld; we just don't know. We can only deal with what happened and the result of that, whether we like it or not.

All it needed was the umpires to use a modicum of common sense when they realised something was seriously wrong with the call.

I can only say that it must have been that they did not realise that.
Having said that, could one of them have stepped in and said, "Hang on, that's close, let's have another look"?
... I dunno.
Tbh, I'm more upset about the free that Dawson was denied vs. Collingwood and that obvious Draper-flop that should have been called htb, but then again, who's to say that either free kick would have definitely resulted in a goal and a Crows win? I've seen blokes miss from 15m out, straight in front; there are no guarantees.
All I can do ahead is hope for a better Coach, a better midfield, better results and another Flag (or more! ) before I kick off .
Cheers.

 

[TubbsFarquhar]

I think people here are completely missing the point. The 'error' that occurred was one that had specific technology in place to have allowed it to be overturned there and then. All it needed was the umpires to use a modicum of common sense when they realised something was seriously wrong with the call. We should have been awarded a goal and then it was up to Sydney to try and win the game in the last 48 seconds. Whether they would have or not is the unknown but it should have been them having to win it from there not us. Then others say well, they might have beaten Melbourne had they needed to win. They also might not have and knowing we were playing WCE in the last game, the pressure to win on them would have ramped up massively. WCE were always a good chance to lose to us in that last game being a despondent bottom placed side getting beaten heavily week in week out.

If it was an onfield umpiring decision not going our way in the last minute of the game (there have been more of them that I care to list) that cost us, different story as there is no technology specifically to review onfield calls like HTB, push in the back etc like there is set up to determine if its a goal or a point. It was a reversible error and we should have been afforded the opportunity either in game or they needed to work a replay and there was a bye week before finals they could have done it in. We were absolutely f****D by the AFL over this and it cost us our season...not to mention Geelong who would have still been in contention with a Sydney loss going into the last round of the season for finals.

I don't think it was the AFL that screwed us, it was an error from an arrogant goal umpire who seemed so confident in his decision, he didn't bother going upstairs. It wasn't helped by the Swans playing on immediately (can't hold that against them). As far as I'm aware, every goal gets reviewed, but not behinds, so once the goal umpire didn't want to check his decision, nothing could be done.

You can't replay an entire game based on one dodgy umpiring decision towards the end of a match, otherwise, how many would've been replayed this year alone?

 

[Brett Cummings]

"Ultimately, winning is the metric by which success is judged."
(from an ABC article about the Simpson sacking).

By that metric alone (never mind the inner intricacies of the AFC), it's astonishing that Nicks has not been sacked.
NO finals appearances in 5 years and 34-64-1, ffs.

They made the wrong decision and don't wanna own up to it.

 

[rabidcrow]

Has Nicks made finals?

Has Nicks won a GF and know less against a MCG tenant?

Until Covid, Simpson had an excellent winning %, one that Nicks could only dream of.

Before Covid my kids were in primary school. Now they are both driving!
The relevance - none

Once again - good lists make good coaches. Swiss cheese lists make average to poor coaches

Simpson, Clarkson classic examples - the footy world is shocked when they win a game


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[119others]

Not only that but there was still another round to play.

Sydney may well have defeated Melbourne in Sydney if there place in finals depended on it and as it was it took us 3/4 to beat a bottom West Coast on their home deck. The expectation on us to win may have seen us lose - lets he honest whenever we have had expectations placed on us under Nicks it has ended in tears.

Surely they had the same motivation to win to get a home final though?

 

[119others]

I don't agree that the AFL "stole it away", it was an umpiring error.

The reality is that the AFL were never going to go back after the fact and change the result when there was still time left in the game.

It's the same as the Maynard blocking free that wasn't paid in the 2018 Grand Final, ultimately it cost Collingwood a premiership.

I definitely wouldn't want to see the AFL setting precedents where they begin changing the results of games as they see fit. Instead they need to focus on getting their systems and processes right to stop these types of errors and have things in place to ensure that they're identified and corrected at the time they happen.

Not necessarily disagreeing with your core premise but did you agree with this game result being overturned?



Swans hadn’t scored a goal in the last quarter and clearly very unlikely to have scored a goal in the last minute but clearly they theoretically could have

 

[MrBarry]

Not necessarily disagreeing with your core premise but did you agree with this game result being overturned?



Swans hadn’t scored a goal in the last quarter and clearly very unlikely to have scored a goal in the last minute but clearly they theoretically could have

If Keays had kicked that goal after the siren, I think the league would have overturned the result.

Realistically there hands were tied and they were never going to award us the 4 points, however I don't think the club ever went hard enough at the league.

 

[arrowman]

Not necessarily disagreeing with your core premise but did you agree with this game result being overturned?



Swans hadn’t scored a goal in the last quarter and clearly very unlikely to have scored a goal in the last minute but clearly they theoretically could have

The difference is that with Sirengate the AFL determined that it was the fault of the timekeeper (not blowing the siren for long enough / assuming the umpire(s) had heard it), not umpire error. There's no precedent for overturning a result because of an in-game error by an on-field official.

Errors by on-field officials come under the category of "stuff happens" and sporting bodies are loath to undermine the authority of those officials. The Court of Arbitration for Sport has applied this principle in other cases overseas.

There's a followup video to the one you posted that explains this quite well, but I can't find it again.

Edit: found it, unfortunately it's preceded by a couple of long ads.

 

[Crow till I die]

If Keays had kicked that goal after the siren, I think the league would have overturned the result.

Realistically there hands were tied and they were never going to award us the 4 points, however I don't think the club ever went hard enough at the league.

The other nuclear option would have been to award no AFL points for the game so Sydney didn't benefit from it either. The AFL could have made that call in the aftermath.

 

[arrowman]

If Keays had kicked that goal after the siren, I think the league would have overturned the result.

Not sure about that, see my post above.

 

[GreyCrow]

We should also challenge the Sam Draper game

And the game where the umpires missed a free kick in the 1st quarter - horrendous