"Questions that don't warrant a thread" thread

[FisherHawk]

Re: Best 22

The best 22 next week or our best 22? This is the team I think we should aim for around the second half of the season.

B Guerra Gilham Ladson
HB Gibson Schoe Birchall
C Lewis Mitchell Young
HF Burgoyne Franklin Rioli
F Brown Rough Bateman

R Bailey Hodge Sewell

INT Renouf Osborne Ellis JKT

EMG Peterson Hooper Sheils Murphy

Osborne with all his brain fades would be lucky to stay in ahead of Peterson or Hooper. Bailey if fit will be our #1 Ruckman and Renouf is clearly better than Taylor. I'm hopeful Ellis, Bateman and Ladson will get back to their best with a full side on the park.

This list can take us through finals.

 

[Hawksgirl4eva]

Re: Best 22

FB Gibson Gilham Brown
HB Guerra Murphy Birchall
C Burgoyne Mitchell Sewell
HFCyril Buddy Lewis
FF Roughead Bateman Osbourne
FOLL Hodge Baily Young
IC Renouf ellis JKT Stratton
EMER Sheils Peterson shoenmakers Taylor Hooper

Ladson is not in our best 22, Murphy is.
Brown must play back, no matter how good he is playing up forward and yes he is playing fantastic up there, he is needed down back.
The emergency's are unluky.
Roughead can play Back or Forward maybe him Hodge and Brown can do like a rotating thing.

p.s i dont no why this is all in bold. it wouldnt come off it.

 

[Dewwwww]

Croady....how is your foot going??

Anyone know how Trent is going? Is there a chance his foot has miracilously improved to the point he could run again?? I have an idea which is a long shot but if his foot has slightly improved I believe every disgruntled member (im guessing that would be 53,000 people at the moment) should send in $10-$20 to the Hawthorn Football Club. This would set up a fund of $530,000-1,000,000l! We could use this to send Trent to a 'Operation get Trent back' camp where we could provide a physio/training/strengthening program for the next 6 months in a bid to get him right for a return next yr!! With this sort of funds we could employ a full time physio/personal trainer/dietitian/Doctor to care for Trent!!



Even if this didnt work out it would be worth a shot!! I dont think any of us would miss $10-$20 and all I know is that im sick of an undersized defence and needing to 'rely' on a rolling zone to win a match!!

Thoughts??

 

[Hawksgirl4eva]

Re: Croady....how is your foot going??

lol i actually said to my dad yesterday,i wonder how crady foot is going, he could help us

 

[Watsclarkosmob]

Re: Best 22

Hard to do a best 22 with so many out but we'll pretend it is a perfict world and all players are fit:

B: Gibsons Gilham Guerra
HB: Murphy Skipper JKT
C: Lewis Mitchell Bateman
HF: Burgoyne Roughhead Rioli
F: Hooper Franklin Brown
Foll: Bailey Hodge Sewell
INT:Renouf Ellis Peterson Dowler

EMG: Stratton Birchall Sheils Young

- Had it with Ladson and Osbourne as senior team members they are not pulling their weight.

-Never really rated Murphy but he is doing well this year, think is more deserving of a half back spot in the side than Birchall and Ladson.

-Young could fit in the side but JKT looking the goods in that roll.

-Skipper I believe is the tall defender problem.

-Sheils has been doing alright, but I just think he's alittle bit off best 22.

-Hooper hasn't really done much but I believe he is the crumbing forward we need ATM.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[CHUBBSS]

Re: Croady....how is your foot going??

he is playing a game for De La Salle against xiavs this weekend, im pretty sure, so his foot would still be reasonable but nowhere near AFL standards

 

[Hawksgirl4eva]

Re: Croady....how is your foot going??

he is playing a game for De La Salle against xiavs this weekend, im pretty sure, so his foot would still be reasonable but nowhere near AFL standards

Croad with a reasonable foot is better than a backline with no croad

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Don't panic

We are shot.

Thanks and goodnight.

 

[demondavey]

Re: Croady....how is your foot going??

he is playing a game for De La Salle against xiavs this weekend, im pretty sure, so his foot would still be reasonable but nowhere near AFL standards

Back to his old school roots at De la. Go croady! Yeah but he has packed on the kg's, is a big boy but still moving around ok! would dominate the ammos

 

[Flamin Joe]

Re: Don't panic

Typical BF poster's keyboard.....

 

[eldorado]

Re: Don't panic

We are only missing a second ruckman. Just wait until Burgoyne comes into the squad. Gibson will be back in the second half of the year!

 

[Off The Couch]

Re: Stuart Dew

So is it stupid to ask why the Hawks didn't hold on to Dew for use as assistant coach? Sounds silly to let him go, sure we could have held on to him.

Because his fiance is from Sydney and he was always going to NSW to live. Had nothing to do with not being offered a job in Melbourne

 

[Hotham Hawk]

Re: Don't panic

Not just yet...

 

[Consumed]

Re: Don't panic

....

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

We are 10 and 17 since the 2008 GF.

And anybody that thinks that injuries excuse that level of performance is kidding themselves.

For the majority of these games we have had a nucleus of Franklin, Roughead, Mitchell, Sewell, Hodge, Rioli, Osborne, Bateman, Lewis, Ellis and Birchall. Admittedly some of these guys have missed games but our performance since the 2008 GF, notwithstanding this has been diabolical. With that core group of players we are entitled to be in the firing line, not fighting for our season in round 6.

I am not here to drive an anti-Clarkson agenda, far from it. However, the buck stops with the senior coach and right now the game plan is a joke and the players, barring Luke Hodge and one or two others do not seem interested. I would almost go as far as to say that Clarkson has lost the players. At the very least I would suggest that his playbook is bare. His coaching is inflexible and reactive. We are a very predictable football side and Clarkson does not seem to be able to right the ship at the moment. Whether he can or not going forward is open to debate right now.

Changes, whether it be personnel, game plan or attitude need to be made NOW. Next week will be too late.

 

[Paul Kersey]

Re: We are 10 and 17 since the 2008 GF.

Yep, just not good enough. If this season conitinues the way it is heading, it looks like perhaps the biggest and most pathetic fall from grace in history will belong to the current playing group.

 

[Flukey!]

Re: We are 10 and 17 since the 2008 GF.

I would like to see the club offer up some sort of explanation because it is seriously difficult to understand.

They would know why.

 

[Arkadia]

Re: Don't panic

There is no need to panic. We should listen and follow the rhetoric, from President of the world.
YES WE CAN!

 

[FisherHawk]

Re: We are 10 and 17 since the 2008 GF.

I agree with some of what the OP states but let’s put this in to perspective and not have another thread based around hysteria. I'm as pissed as the next supporter at our losses and our overall poor game plan and skill eras but there are always reasons and rational. Some more relevant than others.

Trawling through the various doom and gloom threads, no one can seem to come up with a reasonable answer as to why we are in the position we are at. Sure we have the player....is crap, sack the coach, season over, overrated bla bla bla, but one thing we do know is the state of our list over this GF to now period.

Hawthorn has used 44, that’s right, 44 different players, and no Croad since the GF with approx 300 games lost through injury or suspension and most being from our best 25. No team in the history of the game can be competitive with that sort of lost game time and forced list rotation. No one. It can't and won't happen. Add to that the state of some of our players, whether it be lack of pre season, post op surgery or the over expectation while carrying injuries and we were lucky to be challenging for a final berth. St Kilda lost around 18 games from their list till round 20 in 09 and only a handful this year (Riewoldt being the obvious one) so manages to stay competitive.

I'm not denying they haven’t been woeful at times but as a whole, they seem to lack cohesion and the confidence in themselves and each other as they are not the same side that play week in week out. They certainly lack confidence with their kicking. Good sides keep their best players on the park, week in, week out and maybe manage 1 or 2 out's.

I thought about this tonight when the Carlton Geelong game was being discussed during On the Couch. Mike said, spare a thought for Geelong as they were missing Scarlett and Corey. Apparently with those two out, the Cats couldn't contain a raging Carlton forward line and boot 10 goals themselves. FFS, is he for real? We have averaged a lot more and regularly different players missing from our best 22 every week since the GF! We are only up to round 5 but already we have missed, Burgoyne 5, Taylor 5, Sewell 4, Young 3, Hooper 3, Franklin 2, Gibson 2, Mitchell 1, Rioli 1, Osborne 1. That’s already 27 games from our (for arguments sake) best 22

Roos game....Missing 2 ruckman of Renouf, Taylor or Bailey, A grader in Mitch, A grader in Burgoyne, our CHB (in an undersized defence) and possibly Hooper.

I'm not saying this is the sole reason for our demise, but I'm pretty certain that if we had a dream injury run similar to that of the Saints, we would have played finals last year and would be top 4 right now.

Don't just look at the car wreck and come to a conclusion about our current state. Look at the causes, the driver, skid marks and conditions leading up to the crash and it gives a bit more of a balanced view point IMO.

 

[50metres]

Re: We are 10 and 17 since the 2008 GF.

I agree with some of what the OP states but let’s put this in to perspective and not have another thread based around hysteria.

+2

Our defense is bad. was looking a little better with Gibson there but ...

No ruckman vs Nth was always going to be an uphill battle. One ruckman against everyone else was only going to break even.

We need both Franklin and Roughead forward.

Midfield against good teams, we always need two of Mitchell, Sewell, Lewis/Burgoyne.

To beat top teams need a fit Hodge, Rioli, Foward Pressure.

We need run from Bateman, Young, Rioli.

None of the above has been in place since GF 2008. thats why we are out of the 8.

 

[Ram-Man]

Re: We are 10 and 17 since the 2008 GF.

And anybody that thinks that injuries excuse that level of performance is kidding themselves.

For the majority of these games we have had a nucleus of Franklin, Roughead, Mitchell, Sewell, Hodge, Rioli, Osborne, Bateman, Lewis, Ellis and Birchall. Admittedly some of these guys have missed games but our performance since the 2008 GF, notwithstanding this has been diabolical. With that core group of players we are entitled to be in the firing line, not fighting for our season in round 6.

I am not here to drive an anti-Clarkson agenda, far from it. However, the buck stops with the senior coach and right now the game plan is a joke and the players, barring Luke Hodge and one or two others do not seem interested. I would almost go as far as to say that Clarkson has lost the players. At the very least I would suggest that his playbook is bare. His coaching is inflexible and reactive. We are a very predictable football side and Clarkson does not seem to be able to right the ship at the moment. Whether he can or not going forward is open to debate right now.

Changes, whether it be personnel, game plan or attitude need to be made NOW. Next week will be too late.

... good post CK.


Has anyone come out and taken responsibility for the loss ? The lack of a ruckman? The injury toll ?

Clarkson doesn't seem as if he would. It seems from the outside he is stubborn and unreasonable when it comes to receiving criticism or advice. This may or may not be the case however this is what I have heard from internal sources.

Too many excuses and not enough ownership. Part of the skill of running a football club is to have your best players playing consistently. The club and Clarkson, the coach, are failing.

Has the football club given him too much power ? If so it is time to rein it in.

If I wanted to watch a scramble crapfest then I would go and watch my nephews in the under 10's. The Box Hill match had more system.

The effort is there but there is little or no direction. When the gameplan becomes unstuck we do not have a plan B, C or D.

Becoming more and more obvious that Clarkson is a one trick pony.

 

[tommyk72]

Question - what did Clarko say after the game?

I don't know if I missed it, or maybe it hasn't been written about as much due to it being a long weekend, but what did Clarko have to say in his press conference?

Was it more of the same "we've got injuries, playing well but losing", or did he actually show a bit of fire.

Since he's toned back his attitude in press conferences, we've started losing. Coincidence? (Actually, I think it is, but maybe he's toned it down so much that he's lost a little fire in the belly/passion, which in turn goes through to the team...)

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Re: We are 10 and 17 since the 2008 GF.

... good post CK.


Has anyone come out and taken responsibility for the loss ? The lack of a ruckman? The injury toll ?

Clarkson doesn't seem as if he would. It seems from the outside he is stubborn and unreasonable when it comes to receiving criticism or advice. This may or may not be the case however this is what I have heard from internal sources.

Too many excuses and not enough ownership. Part of the skill of running a football club is to have your best players playing consistently. The club and Clarkson, the coach, are failing.

Has the football club given him too much power ? If so it is time to rein it in.

If I wanted to watch a scramble crapfest then I would go and watch my nephews in the under 10's. The Box Hill match had more system.

The effort is there but there is little or no direction. When the gameplan becomes unstuck we do not have a plan B, C or D.

Becoming more and more obvious that Clarkson is a one trick pony.

Everybody should read this and take notice because that is exactly the issue.

 

[Woodside Hawk]

Re: Question - what did Clarko say after the game?

Hey Tommy, you can get a pretty good idea in this article:
http://www.hawthornfc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/4742/newsid/93027/default.aspx

Key part is: "We had our chances to win the game irrespective of rucks and we’re disappointed we lost. We put ourselves in the position to win the game and we didn’t finish it well. We didn’t start well. In our first 10 minutes and our last 10 minutes they kicked six goals in that period of the game and full credit to them."

Pretty hard to argue with that, I'd have thought.

I only saw snippets of it on TV but there certainly didn't seem to be any fire & brimstone.

 

[Gary Shadforth]

Re: Question - what did Clarko say after the game?

.

I'm a supporter of Clarko. What else can he say but what we already know.

Maybe it would have been better to say we'll need to work on our lack of rucks depth, harden our brittle defence, have confidence in taking risks by crisp handballing with links through the corridor. When kicking out after a behind rather than a short little risky chip to a player barely 15m away - kick to a contested situation well away from the opposition scoring zone and have confidence that marks can be taken or knock and crumb down-field.

Say something like that rather than bringing out a broken record.