Autopsy Round 16, 2022: Carlton v St.Kilda

[plugger66]

He is what he is but if he stays an uneven GOP I hope one of the kids pushes him out to depth.

You see him as uneven. I see his average games as good enough to keep his spot and his good games as really helping the side. I think I said yesterday if he is pushed out we must have an unbelievable list.

 

[gringo2011]

It was an error with 20/20 hindsight. It was a good pick with the knowledge known at the time.

Paddy was wrong from the start. We needed Petracca in my opinion.

That was a horrific era. Petracca was self inflicted list vandalism. Billings was the safe bet and coincidentally is a safe player but I guess at least we didn't get Sharenberg or Kade Kolodjashnij.

2013 was a horrible draft, we'd sold McEvoy and then traded up with the Hawks to get 3 picks inside the first round, took Billings, Acres and Dunny and pushed Curren up off the rookie list.

Compare it to West Coast who didn't have a pick until 11 and got Sheed, Barass and McGovern. Blacres is at least looking like a quality player now.

 

[CaptainRisky]

Good win by the boys , not great but still have improvement which is good , a slightly better spread of goal kickers is a positive as is Max finally leaning he can run .
Nas and Windy are going to be fantastic players for a long time as will Owens , finally got the drafting right for once.
Sincs is off the Hook , who would have thought he could get to this level and after hearing him talk he is even more impressive , Captain material .
If they can continue to play with that level of insensitivity we are still a chance to play finals but a 5 % drop off and we wont as we really rely on pressure to win games.
Highmore was good when he came on and even though he doesn't get lots of it Wood was ok and holds his spot

 

[D2D3]

That was a horrific era. Petracca was self inflicted list vandalism. Billings was the safe bet and coincidentally is a safe player but I guess at least we didn't get Sharenberg or Kade Kolodjashnij.

2013 was a horrible draft, we'd sold McEvoy and then traded up with the Hawks to get 3 picks inside the first round, took Billings, Acres and Dunny and pushed Curren up off the rookie list.

Compare it to West Coast who didn't have a pick until 11 and got Sheed, Barass and McGovern. Blacres is at least looking like a quality player now.

Thing that hurts about 2013 is we could have got a very similar or possibly better draft haul without trading McEvoy. We rated the difference between late first and early second to highly.

 

[plugger66]

Good win by the boys , not great but still have improvement which is good , a slightly better spread of goal kickers is a positive as is Max finally leaning he can run .
Nas and Windy are going to be fantastic players for a long time as will Owens , finally got the drafting right for once.
Sincs is off the Hook , who would have thought he could get to this level and after hearing him talk he is even more impressive , Captain material .
If they can continue to play with that level of insensitivity we are still a chance to play finals but a 5 % drop off and we wont as we really rely on pressure to win games.
Highmore was good when he came on and even though he doesn't get lots of it Wood was ok and holds his spot

That 5 block walk would have been worth it.

 

[plugger66]

Thing that hurts about 2013 is we could have got a very similar or possibly better draft haul without trading McEvoy. We rated the difference between late first and early second to highly.

That was all due to that maniac pelchen.

 

[CaptainRisky]

That 5 block walk would have been worth it.

Take some notice would you , it was 4 blocks and a tram ride not a walk

 

[gringo2011]

You see him as uneven. I see his average games as good enough to keep his spot and his good games as really helping the side. I think I said yesterday if he is pushed out we must have an unbelievable list.

I would agree, he's good enough to hold his spot but he's cruising along and that attitude also holds us back. He's safe in every way. DMac is the opposite, he plays like a battler trying to extract everything he's got. He goes in when it's his turn to go, he works to do the things that will make a team mate look better and he sets a standard.

DMac earns his respect through bravery and drive. Billings just has this "I'm doing my job to the minimum standard but I can't wait for knock off to go have a cup of tea and a bikkie" vibe.

 

[plugger66]

Take some notice would you , it was 4 blocks and a tram ride not a walk

Sorry your posts bore me so I just guess what you are saying.

 

[plugger66]

I would agree, he's good enough to hold his spot but he's cruising along and that attitude also holds us back. He's safe in every way. DMac is the opposite, he plays like a battler trying to extract everything he's got. He goes in when it's his turn to go, he works to do the things that will make a team mate look better and he sets a standard.

DMac earns his respect through bravery and drive. Billings just has this "I'm doing my job to the minimum standard but I can't wait for knock off to go have a cup of tea and a bikkie" vibe.

How could you possibly know that. It’s obviously how he plays. He would be trying every single game. Not everyone is built the same. Why doesn’t hill attack the ball like Lenny? Why doesn’t Clark look like he never gets out of second gear? Looks a bloody good player for 400k.

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

Thing that hurts about 2013 is we could have got a very similar or possibly better draft haul without trading McEvoy. We rated the difference between late first and early second to highly.

Eh Macca may have provided some positives over the next few years but would it really have made much difference long term. He's a bit of a weird unit too. With Macca at his peak do we take a gamble on a 21 year old ruck playing in Ballarat in 2016?

The trade was probably the right call and most of us were verrrrry happy getting Dunstan and Acres where we did (go find the draft threads). It didn't work out in the end but that was probably more to do with our development...

2013 has ended up a strange draft. Injury ended up ruining 3 of the top 10s careers. #1 had the strangest career to date. Hits and misses litter the next 20 picks. End of the day I don't think we made any misses - they're all still on a list and looks like Blacres and Billings will get to 200+ games. Dunstan perhaps.

Anyway that's enough digression.

 

[SaintBenny]

WATCH: This could seriously be the worst 'holding the ball' ever paid

Dan Butler couldn't believe it- and neither could the Saints fans!

www.theroar.com.au

This one was an absolute shocker...

 

[lewdogs]

Eh Macca may have provided some positives over the next few years but would it really have made much difference long term. He's a bit of a weird unit too. With Macca at his peak do we take a gamble on a 21 year old ruck playing in Ballarat in 2016?

The trade was probably the right call and most of us were verrrrry happy getting Dunstan and Acres where we did (go find the draft threads). It didn't work out in the end but that was probably more to do with our development...

2013 has ended up a strange draft. Injury ended up ruining 3 of the top 10s careers. #1 had the strangest career to date. Hits and misses litter the next 20 picks. End of the day I don't think we made any misses - they're all still on a list and looks like Blacres and Billings will get to 200+ games. Dunstan perhaps.

Anyway that's enough digression.

I think trading McEvoy was smart as we got decent value for him and we had Tom Hickey on the list. The problem is Richo was too dumb to see how good Hickey was and wasted years playing Billy Longer who was a joke of a footballer.

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

I think trading McEvoy was smart as we got decent value for him and we had Tom Hickey on the list. The problem is Richo was too dumb to see how good Hickey was and wasted years playing Billy Longer who was a joke of a footballer.

I totally forgot about Longer...

Thinking about the time, effort and development we put into Stanley, McEvoy and Hickey (all of whom are still on a list and more than useful....plus Billy) in hindsight is pretty funny. To think we then went and plucked one of the best rucks in the competition from some local league.

Longer had some pretty good games though at least? We'll always have the 'pointing to scoreboard' moment. In the end I don't think his heart was in it.

 

[Sainter1873]

I think trading McEvoy was smart as we got decent value for him and we had Tom Hickey on the list. The problem is Richo was too dumb to see how good Hickey was and wasted years playing Billy Longer who was a joke of a footballer.

Strongly disagree. Trading McEvoy was stupid at the time and even more stupid with hindsight.

 

[Jade Buddha]

Thought Jimmy W was a little suspect on Saturday. Seemed a bit fumbly and second to the ball.
He’s got credits for some very good games but I hope he’s more on next week.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

I refuse to believe that billings was an error at the time. He was rated 2 or 3 in nearly all the write ups. Bont was rated about 8. Don’t get me started on paddy though.

Billings was the right choice at number 3 but Billings is just one of those players who just has not taken that next step.

 

[lewdogs]

WATCH: This could seriously be the worst 'holding the ball' ever paid

Dan Butler couldn't believe it- and neither could the Saints fans!

www.theroar.com.au

This one was an absolute shocker...

insanely bad decision

 

[D2D3]

I think trading McEvoy was smart as we got decent value for him and we had Tom Hickey on the list. The problem is Richo was too dumb to see how good Hickey was and wasted years playing Billy Longer who was a joke of a footballer.

The problem we didn't get the bang for our buck in the end. pick 18, 19 and Savage for McEvoy, pick 24 and 59 essentially. Almost isn't to bad. But then we spent pick 25 (Dal Santo?) to get Longer, essentially negating the value we did get out of trading McEvoy. Could of just taken 24 and 25 for a similar result in the draft except we would of still had McEvoy instead of Longer and Savage. ( I am conscious we're getting a bit off topic though and it's irrelivant now).

 

[Ads734]

Billings has become the whipping boy - 24 possessions and 10 marks not bad.

Couldn’t agree more. Honestly thought he played a pretty flawless game. Did a lot of important defensive work, tackles, spoils, etc

 

[g_TRAIN]

Couldn’t agree more. Honestly thought he played a pretty flawless game. Did a lot of important defensive work, tackles, spoils, etc

I thought he was good too but it does frustrate me that he plays such a vanilla brand.

It's the difference between him being a good player and a very good player.

 

[Joffaboy]

Interestingly Merritt and Shiel gets talked up for getting 24 and 20 possessions respectively but Billings gets wholly bagged for a 24 possession game.

As I have said I am no great fan of Billings but credit where it is due, his game was good on Friday.
Bagging him because people don't like the way he disposes the ball is a bit churlish. Let him have a good game, won't be long until he is ineffectual, that is his main problem, consistency.

 

[Mowman]

Of course it’s to do with the pick number. His wage previously is irrelevant now. He is most likely outside the top 10 players in wages. And just because he is an experienced player doesn’t mean he can play better than he is capable. And this game which is more relevant than last weeks game he had 13 possessions in the first half. He has replaced Ross as the whipping boy. He did a good job on Friday.

Is that right ?

Last week V Sydney
Jack Billings
1st quarter 3 Kicks and 2 Hand balls
2nd quarter 1 kick and 0 hand balls
3rd quarter 5 kicks and 3 hand balls
4th quarter 6 kicks and 1 hand ball
Stats provider by the AFL very easy to look up
Keep trying LOL

pretty sure the club - coaches his team mates expect experience players to stand up when the club has its back to wall like it did against Sydney after the Essendon loss,
which was my point in my post which was quite obvious
Also pretty clear I was discussing his form over his career not 1 game , keep trying
Saying he is most likely outside our top 10 players in wages like when you said the other week King was our highest paid player ?

 

[Mowman]

Interestingly Merritt and Shiel gets talked up for getting 24 and 20 possessions respectively but Billings gets wholly bagged for a 24 possession game.

As I have said I am no great fan of Billings but credit where it is due, his game was good on Friday.
Bagging him because people don't like the way he disposes the ball is a bit churlish. Let him have a good game, won't be long until he is ineffectual, that is his main problem, consistency.

Which is the point most people are making

People pumping him up for a good game against the blues and good for him. where was he against Essendon and the Swans

 

[Remboy]

The problem we didn't get the bang for our buck in the end. pick 18, 19 and Savage for McEvoy, pick 24 and 59 essentially. Almost isn't to bad. But then we spent pick 25 (Dal Santo?) to get Longer, essentially negating the value we did get out of trading McEvoy. Could of just taken 24 and 25 for a similar result in the draft except we would of still had McEvoy instead of Longer and Savage. ( I am conscious we're getting a bit off topic though and it's irrelivant now).

We actually gave 25 and 41 to get Longer and 48, which we then used to get Bruce. So if we’d done 25 for Bruce and 41 for Longer it looks more reasonable.