Saints - window officially shut

[L_W_P]

Luckily for them Neeld was already taken and they had to go for "second best"....Watters

I would actually like to hear from Pies fans their thoughts on Neeld vs Watters.

What roles did they play at the club? Who was more important to the way you guys played?

It seemed at the time we were getting the 'left overs' because we were so late to the party but Watters style has been a breath of fresh air at the club. Would we be getting this from Neeld?

Is one coach rated better internally by the Pies or is it just a case of Scotty taking over a much better list?

 

[mysainters]

Pretty confident that Watters didn't put himself forward for any of the other coaching jobs, except for when St Kilda became available.

Perhaps he saw a good fit, or saw potential in the list that wasn't (in his opinion) being taken advantage of, hope the media asks him one day.

 

[aussierulesrules]

From what I've seen from him so far, I don't think Neeld would have been what we needed. I think we'd had enough from Lyon and I think Neeld would have been more of the same sort of thing.

 

[Plugger35]

From what I've seen from him so far, I don't think Neeld would have been what we needed. I think we'd had enough from Lyon and I think Neeld would have been more of the same sort of thing.

Yeah I think Watters was the perfect coaching candidate for us given our situation. He has brought a much more positive, open, cheerful vibe to the club which is what we needed after Lyon who was very demanding in terms of structures and creating the bubble to shut out the media and public.

The change is being shown with our style of play which is much more positive and high scoring under Watters as opposed to the negative defensive style under Lyon and the players look like they are enjoying their football a lot more as a result. With Neeld you get the feeling he is similar to Lyon in playing a very disciplined structured style of footy and just his demeanour seems quite serious and glum compared to Watters who is more upbeat and cheerful.

Probably too early to judge who out of Watters and Neeld is the better coach but at this stage I'm glad we got Watters and not Neeld.

 

[Falchoon]

Luckily for them Neeld was already taken and they had to go for "second best"....Watters

no prizes for guessing who got the "third best"

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

no prizes for guessing who got the "third best"

I wasnt taking a dig at StKilda, only noting ironically how Neeld is not turning out to be as good as everybody expected. No hindsight in this, he was hot property and rated highly by everybody.

StKilda and quite a few other clubs dodged a massive bullet. Watters on the other hand is becoming everything people were expecting, and more.

 

[Ron The Bear]

From what I've seen from him so far, I don't think Neeld would have been what we needed. I think we'd had enough from Lyon and I think Neeld would have been more of the same sort of thing.

Way too early. But if Melbourne isn't ahead of St.Kilda at the end of 2013, Neeld will be failing.

 

[Falchoon]

I wasnt taking a dig at StKilda,

Perish the thought.

only noting ironically how Neeld is not turning out to be as good as everybody expected. No hindsight in this, he was hot property and rated highly by everybody.

StKilda and quite a few other clubs dodged a massive bullet. Watters on the other hand is becoming everything people were expecting, and more.

Watters' cattle is a tad better than Neeld's

 

[Richter]

Perish the thought.



Watters' cattle is a tad better than Neeld's

True, however, compare the team's trajectories over the last couple of years....

Saints - 2009: 20 wins
............2010: 15.5 wins
............2011: 12.5 wins
............2012: trend prediction... 8.5 wins
(average decrease of 3.75 fewer wins per year over previous 2 years)

Dees - 2009: 4 wins
..........2010: 8.5 wins
..........2011: 8.5 wins
..........2012: trend prediction: 10.5 wins
(average increase of 2.25 wins per year over previous 2 years)

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Watters' cattle is a tad better than Neeld's

Thats without question but doesnt quite explain yet why Melbourne have gone backwards when they have spent the last four years rebuilding.

Early days, Clarkson copped a lot of crap early too, but at the moment it seems Watters>>>>>>>Neeld

 

[stfan]

Before Monday night I think most (including me) thought Saints would be outside 8 and in a 3 year re-build.

After Monday night I think we are probably a chance to make the 8 and with another year iinto Cripps, Sippos, Stanley, Steven, Saad, Milera, Simpkins etc be challenging again sooner rather than later.

It is amazing what the injection of a couple of players with real pace can do to the look of the team. With Saad and Milera the Saints have gone from looking ponderous to quite pacey....something we have not been able to say for many years.

.

Steven and Stanley both have the makings of elite players.
Armo has been on the slow boil, but is now starting to produce good consistent football. His Blues game was a cracker. Not sure he well reach the level that I believe Steven will, but he will be a nice foil. Isa tackle machine that knows how to kick goals.

Cripps and Ledger (both not in the team) show great promise of being at least handy AFL players.

The "smokie" is the rookie Dunnell who has come out of nowhere this year. IMO will be a very classy player for us once he gains a few kilos. watch him start to arrive in 2013.

Ferguson at only 19 and former NSW scholorship player is blooming nicely, and from next year should start getting games as a key defender.

With other youngsters like Ross, Newnes looking likely the Saints have plenty of upside.

For 2013:

• Looking good. Hayes has come back brilliantly and so will still be playing. As will Roo. With our young crop pushing up the 2013 Saints will be a strong unit. Milne may or may not be past it...but with Saad, Milera and Schneider small forwards should not be a problem.

For this year:

• Schneider has yet to play a game. Isa great goal assist player for us and will come back in
• Sam = automatic pick and a star
• Gwilt = his kicking and strength is a real asset
• Raph= much maligned, but has always been a very good running footballer and so with Watters more attacking game plan he may well become the right player at the right time
• Ben = our main ruck and so will most likely come back in.
• If the above all get match fit selection will be a nightmare!!!

Formwise I expect us to be up and down a bit as the Saints will continue to blood youth. However Watters will get more used to his players, and they to playing his gameplan. So I am hopeful of a late season charge.

 

[Blue1980]

As I have said previously, still have a senior core good enough to trouble anyone. But Watters coached fantastically on Monday night, and employed tactics no one would of thought of with the small forwards running riot.

 

[underthestars]

all I know is, right now, in this most fickle of fickle seasons, I'm gonna enjoy supporting the best team in the comp. the clear premiership favorite ('theage' poll) and all round excitement machine. Life is grand.
Next week it'll probably suck again, but there you go...

 

[Superduperouzel]

Gee I hope we are getting ahead of ourselves. One week at a time please.
If we get thumped by the Eagles we are gonna come back down to earth with a thud.
I´m on a high from monday´s match, it was like all the pieces came together. The pre season expectations of a new coach , new game plan , injection of youth all hit the spot on monday. It´s one game though and we have 3 hard games coming up with a hungry and optimistic Richmond team like us eyeing another big scalp. We are not gonna beat West Coast at Pattersons, they are too good to lose to a team that is at the moment battling to stay in touch with the 8. However a competitive effort against West coast will set us in good seed to beat a top 8 Sydney team and really pumped Tigers side. We have a long way to go before we can consistently gell every week like last monday but The Saints are in a hell of a lot better position than this time last year when we looked a rabble. No one would disagree we are pretty interesting to watch so far this year. I´m looking forward to how this very unpredictable year pans out for us.

 

[Plugger35]

Why can't we beat West Coast at Subi? They just got belted by Essendon and are still missing a number of their best forwards with injury. Priddis, Kerr and Naitanui are still under injury clouds as well who are all important players.

West Coast are never easy to beat at home but we have to be a real chance of winning if we can replicate the form we showed on Monday night and we have had a good record at Subi in recent years.

 

[Forward Press]

Kerr is 100% and Priddis and Naitanui are both expected to play. We also get back Will Schofield (a vital cog in our defence) from suspension and Ash Smith (another useful backman) may also return along with Adam Selwood (although he's still doubtful)

That is four first 22 players that could return along with Kerr and Priddis being expected to play. On that alone, on top of the Fortress Subi syndrome and the six vs eight day breaks, Eagles may start favourites - but it certainly won't be by very much and I expect a close one.

 

[Plugger35]

West Coast will definitely start favourites. The 6 day vs 8 day break could be a factor, not great scheduling to have us play Monday night and then have to travel to Perth a few days later. I'd imagine our players will be having a light week on the track this week and will be focusing mainly on rest and recovery to try and be as fresh as possible for Sunday.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Why can't we beat West Coast at Subi? They just got belted by Essendon and are still missing a number of their best forwards with injury. Priddis, Kerr and Naitanui are still under injury clouds as well who are all important players.

West Coast are never easy to beat at home but we have to be a real chance of winning if we can replicate the form we showed on Monday night and we have had a good record at Subi in recent years.

Beat West Coast at home and I will take St.Kilda seriously again in the short term. But having fielded the six oldest teams of 2012, the crunch is coming.

 

[PTizzle]

As I have said previously, still have a senior core good enough to trouble anyone. But Watters coached fantastically on Monday night, and employed tactics no one would of thought of with the small forwards running riot.

Agreed, I thought the Blues small forwards would tear them up. But he fought fire with fire and pulled it off.

 

[Falchoon]

Beat West Coast at home and I will take St.Kilda seriously again in the short term.

me too

But having fielded the six oldest teams of 2012, the crunch is coming.

So is the bye, correct me if I am wrong, none of St Kilda's teams this year have been as old as last years premiers during their finals series.

 

[Plugger35]

Agreed, I thought the Blues small forwards would tear them up. But he fought fire with fire and pulled it off.

Under Lyon our tactics against a team like Carlton the past couple of years mainly involved just trying to stop their brigade of quick small forwards which didn't work too well. On Monday night we chose to attack them more with our own brigade of quick small forwards which put the onus back on to them to try and stop us rather than vice versa. A much better tactic and much better to watch too.

 

[LiterallyNobody]

Under Lyon our tactics against a team like Carlton the past couple of years mainly involved just trying to stop their brigade of quick small forwards which didn't work too well. On Monday night we chose to attack them more with our own brigade of quick small forwards which put the onus back on to them to try and stop us rather than vice versa. A much better tactic and much better to watch too.

That's what I thought too.

I think Watters was a better match day coach against Ratten than Lyon was - hard to say because we've only played the one match under Watters but Lyon just didn't have the initiative that Watters showed. he made some good moves and was very clever - add to that the style we played with and as you said, makes for a better spectacle.

One crucial point of reference was with less than a minute before half time, we were two goals up and only just stopping them with momentum with a late goal. Someone (I think Gram) had the ball at half back with forty seconds or less on the clock and rather than kick it safely and try and lock it up to go in at half time with a handy two goal buffer, he kicks it long to set up an attacking flurry which results in another goal on the siren to give us a comfy three goal lead.

I'm struggling to remember once under Lyon when we had a similar situation with a similar outcome (narrowly in front, attack to increase lead instead of defend to preserve it)

From a neutral perspective, I know that self-preservation tactics are not attractive, however I don't mind it myself. But I do much prefer this new style.

 

[Ron The Bear]

So is the bye, correct me if I am wrong, none of St Kilda's teams this year have been as old as last years premiers during their finals series.

Or as good.

 

[Falchoon]

Or as good.

Correct is the word you are looking for.

 

[The Punter]

OES66

I think the players sometimes come close to reverting to old habits regarding the practice you observed, but eventually they remembered the new plan and it paid dividends. Especially in the first two quarters, we put good play into scoreboard pressure in time-on. It can be very demoralising to give away late goals.