Autopsy Sydney defeats Geelong by 38 points at KP

[jimmy.h]

2nd best list? Maybe 2nd best top 6 players, definitely middle of the line bottom 6 at best and that's the killer, I think we are overrating some of our guys. I'm not a doomsday shouter but 2nd best list is way over rating our list.

We have the best player in the league. We have another who would be inside the top 10.

We then have a pretty solid next tier I'm my opinion with a pretty deep b grade group. We then fall off a cliff.

 

[Cursed Cat]

In the cold light of day, with a decent hangover, there's not a lot we can take away from that game at all.

The one thing I will say; there's a lot on this thread saying that Player A has gone backwards and Player B is no good.

To me the entire team looks down on form and inspiration.

Motlop's the main one in the gun - and rightly so as he has been awful for a few weeks now - but earlier in the year he produced 2 or 3 cracking games. He's nowhere near it at the moment, but I would be surprised and disappointed if he *never* regained touch.

Guthrie's position in the midfield is being questioned; and maybe we would be better served with him down back - but earlier in the year he was playing career-best football against quality teams. Not that long ago some of us were talking AA form (Matthew Lloyd had an eye on him too at one stage fwiw, so it's not just gerbil-faced optimistic Geelong supporters who thought he was in good touch).

Blicavs' role as a midfielder is being challenged, but he was rock solid earlier in the year. I know I gave him votes in multiple games on the MVP threads for typically diligent performances. He can look awkward and indecisive; when the team is playing well he can often buy himself a second and weigh up his options; last night and against the Saints those options never presented themselves.

So for mine; it's not that these players have 'gone backwards' in 2016; they were instrumental in us going on a run that saw us atop the ladder at one point.

But when they - and the rest of the team - are below their best, they look 2nd rate, that I agree with.

We're stuck with the list that we've got for the rest of this year; no use in writing off half the team, we just don't have that many replacements.

Scott Selwood can theoretically come back in around 3 weeks and provide something; Sam Menegola is building, and we know what Kersten and Stanley can provide. Horlin-Smith can hopefully press his case yet again.

But if that's just re-arranging deck chairs on the Titanic, then we've got to work out how to avoid the Iceberg of bad form and diminished confidence ..

Chris Scott and co have their work cut out for them because we are a pale reflection of the side that knocked off Hawthorn, North, Footscray and GWS at the moment.
And there are no guarantees that the team can re-capture that early-season form.

 

[catempire]

Those preaching for Guthrie in the guts have certainly gone quiet or simply become turncoats. He is and will always play his best football as a small rebounding defender. He could be an AA defender, but will never be nothing more than a B grade midfielder. He simply isn't strong enough to be playing as an inside midfielder or tagger.

IMO our biggest problems are a lack of run from defence and the lack of quality strong bodied midfielders to support Dangerwood. When we fail in these two areas our forward line is made to look extremely ordinary. Throwing Guthrie down back would effectively kill two birds with one stone but it isn't the only answer. Hopefully the addition of Caddy, S.Selwood and Menegola over the coming weeks can go along way to addressing the problems of the midfield group.

Whilst we have some issues at the moment, they can and hopefully will be addressed. Some people on here need to take a deep breathe, the sky hasn't fallen in just yet.

Not at all. #guthintheguts 'til I die.

Any suggestion that a team smashed in the midfield should weaken it further by removing its third best midfielder is, quite frankly, insane.

 

[winty]

Mate! He was let go by the Fremantle Dockers because he couldn't stay on the park. They are a wealthy club who invest in the best physio and medicos money can buy.
You really think our team are working wonders and have managed to fix Menegola for good?

Scooter was also average to say the least when he came back for West Coast. Now after another year out on the sidelines, is that the same player we get or a slightly weaker version again?
Can he get back to what he was in 2012/2013?

I really think some of you need to get back to reality and come to the realization that those teams let go of these players for a valid reason. We didn't win any bidding wars.

Yeah, it's not like there haven't been incidences of players who were on the periphery at one club thriving once they change clubs. Players like Jack Gunston, Eddie Betts and Jeremy Laidler come to mind.

As for Scott Selwood, I remember there being howls of protest from across the Nullarbor that the compensation they got from losing him via free agency was nowhere near adequate. I doubt that would've been the case if he was as average as you to tend to believe he is.

 

[ATSAM]

Did anyone hear Duncan on 774 after the game?

His interview was delayed for a while because the players were in a long meeting.

When they finally got a hold of him they asked him what Scott's message was after the game.

Duncan replied it was mainly a player driven meeting, with players challenging each other.

He sounded very flat.

Shouldn't wonder he sounded flat we just blew a top 2 spot. Hopefully Scott kept his mouth shut because he obviously has nothing to say that will win games.
Wonder if the 30 hr a week at the club policy is working and whether the week off should have been spent picnicking in the training rooms.
As for Duncan guess he wonders what is role is , last year before the injury he was in Brownlow form now Dangerfield is the midfielder- bit like working your guts out at a job for several years and the new wonder kid gets the promotion in front of you.

 

[thegerman]

Did anyone hear Duncan on 774 after the game?

His interview was delayed for a while because the players were in a long meeting.

When they finally got a hold of him they asked him what Scott's message was after the game.

Duncan replied it was mainly a player driven meeting, with players challenging each other.

He sounded very flat.

So he should. He's challenged himself a few weeks ago, he's been very average since.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

Gee Danger is an honest bugger.

Whats your view of Clark now - everybody is entitled to their opinion - but yours was that Clark is so talented - he has to come in for anybody !!

Also that Motlop was undroppable - you going a bit cold on that one as well

 

[thegerman]

Shouldn't wonder he sounded flat we just blew a top 2 spot. Hopefully Scott kept his mouth shut because he obviously has nothing to say that will win games.
Wonder if the 30 hr a week at the club policy is working and whether the week off should have been spent picnicking in the training rooms.
As for Duncan guess he wonders what is role is , last year before the injury he was in Brownlow form now Dangerfield is the midfielder- bit like working your guts out at a job for several years and the new wonder kid gets the promotion in front of you.

But he wasn't an inside mid anyway, he should be on the outside using his fantastic kicking skills.

 

[PatrickBateman]

Those preaching for Guthrie in the guts have certainly gone quiet or simply become turncoats. He is and will always play his best football as a small rebounding defender. He could be an AA defender, but will never be nothing more than a B grade midfielder. He simply isn't strong enough to be playing as an inside midfielder or tagger.

IMO our biggest problems are a lack of run from defence and the lack of quality strong bodied midfielders to support Dangerwood. When we fail in these two areas our forward line is made to look extremely ordinary.

They've all gone quiet. Guthrie is obviously not a midfielder to me, idiot Scott starts him in the center again, and once again he looked totally out of his depth against the best. Then gets moved out of there, he had 1 touch in the first quarter, 1 tackle for the game.

The most over-hyped Geelong player in recent memory, called out by me for years. Only really effective when things are on his terms. Soft, non-physical, intensity at the contest is rubbish, not express pace wise, not a ball winner, fluffy disposals.

No better example than last night of just how poor our midfield is minus the 2 guns. We were dismantled.

 

[PatrickBateman]

So he should. He's challenged himself a few weeks ago, he's been very average since.

His tackle count was up (7 I think), which is encouraging, but against hard ball winners, he's only ever going to be waiting out the back along with Guthrie and Motlop for someone else to win it for him.

 

[vinum coupe]

Whats your view of Clark now - everybody is entitled to their opinion - but yours was that Clark is so talented - he has to come in for anybody !!

Also that Motlop was undroppable - you going a bit cold on that one as well

Do you have me confused for someone else?

 

[vinum coupe]

And the reason for my question is;

I've always thought they'd bring Clark in after he got fitness.
And I've previously asked for Motlop to be dropped. But didn't expect him to be.

Motlop showed last night just how important he is to the team. But he isn't executing.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

Do you have me confused for someone else?

No way - a couple of weeks ago you were adamant that Clark has to come in - i replied that it would make Geelong too top heavy - you even posted that Geelong could play Hawkins Clark and Kersten in the one team/forward line

 

[vinum coupe]

What's he saying on SEN?

It should be up on sen.

But he just didn't dodge questions.
Said the mids aren't in sync (or words to that effect)
Said he and Selwood dropped off for two quarters.
Was asked about Motlop, Blicavs, guthries form being down. And straight out said 'they aren't the only ones'

Just lots of direct answers.

 

[jimmy.h]

So he should. He's challenged himself a few weeks ago, he's been very average since.

He has had 20 possessions in every game he has played except the one he left injured. Only player other than Danger to get to 20 every week. Was also rated by Champion Data as the best kick in the league halfway through the season so I think he's going OK. Is also top 4 at the club for tackles which is impressive for an outside player.

 

[vinum coupe]

No way - a couple of weeks ago you were adamant that Clark has to come in - i replied that it would make Geelong too top heavy - you even posted that Geelong could play Hawkins Clark and Kersten in the one team/forward line

I still agree I would have played that forward line and dropped kolo.

But can you quote me. The way you're putting it forward just isn't the way I speak.
Love to see the Motlop quote too.

 

[thegerman]

He has had 20 possessions in every game he has played except the one he left injured. Only player other than Danger to get to 20 every week. Was also rated by Champion Data as the best kick in the league halfway through the season so I think he's going OK. Is also top 4 at the club for tackles which is impressive for an outside player.

He said it himself. There's no doubt he can collect the ball, but in his own words, his effectiveness is not as good.

 

[jimmy.h]

He said it himself. There's no doubt he can collect the ball, but in his own words, his effectiveness is not as good.

Yet Champion Data consistently rate him as close to the best in the league in this category

 

[vinum coupe]

Yet Champion Data consistently rate him as close to the best in the league in this category

His kicking is great.
But I agree, he is nowhere near as effective.


You know those 'commeth the moment, commeth the man' occasions?
Yeah well he isn't turning up to them.

 

[TheJimmyCartel]

saying scoot and menecola will be our saviors is akin to saying clark was gonna come back and instanly kick 8 last night and vardy will return and come back to his 2011 potential

sometimes reality isnt real for some peeps, but god bless them for having a opinion

I don't think anyone is saying they will be saviours but would you not agree that we lack some tough bodies that can win the ball in the midfield outside of the obvious two? They will hopefully help and provide a bit of balance instead of the reliance on Danger and Sel to extract it all the time because Guthrie, Duncan and Blitz don't seem up to it and don't step up if the other two aren't on point.

Fact is, they are only the options. The only other harder player we had was Caddy and funnily we've lost both games since he's been out.

 

[JUBJUB]

Your need to attack people personally shows a distinct lack posting skills, and we've had to endure 61000 of them.
I imagine you to have a very lonely existence. More than 10,000 posts a year at 900 a month, at 30 a day, that's of Bosk and Lethality proportions.

Just LULZ!

 

[thegerman]

Yet Champion Data consistently rate him as close to the best in the league in this category

How many goals has he kicked this year? How many 30 possession games has he had?

Champion data is not the be all measurement. You've got to get that thought into your head.

He's definitely gone backwards this year.

 

[jimmy.h]

His kicking is great.
But I agree, he is nowhere near as effective.


You know those 'commeth the moment, commeth the man' occasions?
Yeah well he isn't turning up to them.

I'm not sure what you are referring to by effectiveness. CD rate each kick based on the pressure/difficulty and had him number one in the league. His kicks into forward 50 result in the 2nd highest possession retention rate in the AFL. I would consider both of those to be effective.

He also had currently been involved in more score chains than all bar 3 midfielders in the league. Again I would consider being able to set up scoring opportunities to be effective

 

[Goggin Our Best]

The most effective thing Mitch Duncan has done all year - is break Luke Hodges arm ( and that was an accident )

Off topic - but god Hodge is a dirty sod - sticking his knee into Boaks chest - that was John Nicholls type stuff

 

[vinum coupe]

I'm not sure what you are referring to by effectiveness. CD rate each kick based on the pressure/difficulty and had him number one in the league. His kicks into forward 50 result in the 2nd highest possession retention rate in the AFL. I would consider both of those to be effective.

He also had currently been involved in more score chains than all bar 3 midfielders in the league. Again I would consider being able to set up scoring opportunities to be effective

Ok. Change of terminology.

He's not as influential.