The Age Footy Legend no 7: Gary Ablett Snr

[iameviljez]

Disagree with the non thinking bit. Was a very smart footballer. Just not so smart outside the game.

Yes and no I feel.

On some levels, absolutely - things like his baulk around Paul Hamilton were absolutely premeditated genius.

On the other hand, he didn’t have the kind of intelligence that Diesel or Pendlebury had, with distribution or space. That said, when you have Ablett’s athleticism, do you need to…?

 

[Seeds]

Yes and no I feel.

On some levels, absolutely - things like his baulk around Paul Hamilton were absolutely premeditated genius.

On the other hand, he didn’t have the kind of intelligence that Diesel or Pendlebury had, with distribution or space. That said, when you have Ablett’s athleticism, do you need to…?

What do you mean by distribution of space? Ability to side step an opponent or vision and ability to set up up a team mate. If the later im not having pendlebury near the top of that list. Both sj and ablett jnr vastly better then pendlebury. Darren jarman, voss and others the come to mind.

As for ablett senior, he hardly passed the ball. And yet some of the greatest passess ive even seen came from him.

 

[Vdubs]

It's only an opinion, but how GAs is not higher than 7, at least in the top 3, is astounding. It's got to be based on more than pure footy, which should also limit Carey, Lethal, Nicholls, Cable etc.

 

[you pick one]

It's funny you say that, because in many ways I think Sr was the flawed genius, and Jr was the total package as such.

What Sr did well, he did probably better than anyone else. His high marking and leap was the best we've ever seen in football. He was one of the most powerful athletes we've ever seen in the game, up there with Matthews, Dusty and Dangerfield. He was also a massive, massive kick... and bloody dangerous for opponents, literally dangerous.

But he also had bigger achilles heels than Jr. His endurance wasn't great, his kicking - though brilliant at times - could be wayward. His fitting into the bigger team picture was famously bad, and he didn't have the same consistency as Jr (partially due to playing up forward).

Gary Ablett Jr didn't have the same obvious 1-woods that Sr had (though he is the best one-touch player I have seen). But, possibly with the exception of pack marking, he didn't have obvious shortcomings. Pretty much as close to the total package as you get for a short player.

Reckon had Gary Ablett Jr been a one club player the margin between him and his dad would have been negligible in the eyes of plenty of Geelong supporters.

 

[iameviljez]

Reckon had Gary Ablett Jr been a one club player the margin between him and his dad would have been negligible in the eyes of plenty of Geelong supporters.

I honestly think a large percentage of them will have Jr in front anyway.

 

[iameviljez]

What do you mean by distribution of space? Ability to side step an opponent or vision and ability to set up up a team mate. If the later im not having pendlebury near the top of that list. Both sj and ablett jnr vastly better then pendlebury. Darren jarman, voss and others the come to mind.

As for ablett senior, he hardly passed the ball. And yet some of the greatest passess ive even seen came from him.

Distribution or space. Not distribution of space.

 

[Cataholic]

Reckon had Gary Ablett Jr been a one club player the margin between him and his dad would have been negligible in the eyes of plenty of Geelong supporters.

I don't have much margin between them regardless, but still believe snr was the better of the two.

 

[Partridge]

Yes and no I feel.

On some levels, absolutely - things like his baulk around Paul Hamilton were absolutely premeditated genius.

On the other hand, he didn’t have the kind of intelligence that Diesel or Pendlebury had, with distribution or space. That said, when you have Ablett’s athleticism, do you need to…?

Totally disagree with that. His football intelligence was as good as anyone who has ever played the game.

Pendlebury isn't within a million miles of Ablett senior in any capacity.

 

[My Tilly]

Yes and no I feel.

On some levels, absolutely - things like his baulk around Paul Hamilton were absolutely premeditated genius.

On the other hand, he didn’t have the kind of intelligence that Diesel or Pendlebury had, with distribution or space. That said, when you have Ablett’s athleticism, do you need to…?

Did you actually see him play or are you going by his highlights 1992-1996 from YouTube?

 

[tenderwarrior]

Did you actually see him play or are you going by his highlights 1992-1996 from YouTube?

if so, I will give you the tip that the first season (highlights from 84-91) was much better!

 

[Tony Barber]

Totally disagree with that. His football intelligence was as good as anyone who has ever played the game.

Pendlebury isn't within a million miles of Ablett senior in any capacity.

Remember how he used to get the ball and wait until he was tackled, flung around, and he'd kick the goal?
He did that all of the time.

 

[OzeSparky]

Yablett!!!! Every kid yelled it out trying to take a screamer or kicking a miraculous goal.

 

[My Tilly]

Yablett!!!! Every kid yelled it out trying to take a screamer or kicking a miraculous goal.

And Modra!!!!

 

[Cataholic]

And Modra!!!!

Good, but not as good.

 

[you pick one]

I don't have much margin between them regardless, but still believe snr was the better of the two.

Me too I have him best of all time.

 

[you pick one]

Those who were lucky enough to see him would likely have Peter Hudson as a pure FF pretty high up dead eye dick smart player.

 

[Lunchtime]

Sorry to intrude. Not a Geelong fan as you all know.

But GA Snr at number 7? Has to be top 5 surely??...

Anyway its only an opinion and we've all got one including The Age. But yeah he is in the top 5 in my opinion, where though is where it gets tricky but he is better than at number 7.

Merry Christmas too.

Cheers.

 

[catscratchfever]

I'll go with Greg Williams who said, "It's an insult to even consider anybody else as the greatest player of all time."

 

[Cataholic]

Sorry to intrude. Not a Geelong fan as you all know.

But GA Snr at number 7? Has to be top 5 surely??...

Anyway its only an opinion and we've all got one including The Age. But yeah he is in the top 5 in my opinion, where though is where it gets tricky but he is better than at number 7.

Merry Christmas too.

Cheers.

Even Top 5 is selling him short.

 

[PhatBoy]

I think you will find quite a lot of neutrals have his father on par with Carey, and certainly in the same discussion as Matthews (for some).
Feels like his father copped unfair scrutiny for his lackluster performances in the 94/95 grand finals. And in 1996, he was certainly underwhelming despite looking well and truly over-the-hill by seasons end.

Junior should have won the 2008 Norm Smith medal. He was simply electric that day. Was still busting his gut in the dying seconds of the game.
A little quiet in the other grand final performances (no different to his oldman) but he had a champion team from top to bottom to get the silverware needed.

It's like if you threw Dustin Martin in that Geelong side of the 80's and 90's. The end result would not have been much different. Those teams leaked too many goals in rapid succession and in the blink of an eye, a grand final was all but over.

He was excellent in 2009. Could throw a blanket over him and half a dozen others in the ‘best just behind Chapman, Selwood, Bartel and Taylor’ group I thought. They all played an incredibly important role. 25 touches, 6 tackles, 6 clearances, 11 contested, a goal.

Was quiet in 2007 but it didn’t make a jot of difference, especially after he carried us the week before.

 

[iameviljez]

Did you actually see him play or are you going by his highlights 1992-1996 from YouTube?

Saw him play from 93 onwards. Otherwise, yeah, it’s video.

That said, his Geelong career started 40 years ago this year. On an internet forum - that typically will skew young - most users won’t have seen him play live at all.

 

[iameviljez]

He was excellent in 2009. Could throw a blanket over him and half a dozen others in the ‘best just behind Chapman, Selwood, Bartel and Taylor’ group I thought. They all played an incredibly important role. 25 touches, 6 tackles, 6 clearances, 11 contested, a goal.

Was quiet in 2007 but it didn’t make a jot of difference, especially after he carried us the week before.

If there was a game built to the strengths of Paul Chapman, the 2009 GF was basically it. Win hard ball, deliver from inside a phone box, repeat.

 

[iameviljez]

It's only an opinion, but how GAs is not higher than 7, at least in the top 3, is astounding. It's got to be based on more than pure footy, which should also limit Carey, Lethal, Nicholls, Cable etc.

Probably also a bit of recency anti-bias.

I find there is a chronological “sweet spot” of about thirty to forty years when determining player greatness. When I was growing up in the 90s/2000s, players from the 60s/70s dominated Best Ever conversations - Matthews, Hart, Hudson, Whitten, Barassi, Skilton, et al.

Now it’s Carey, Ablett Sr, Matthews, Lockett who have their time in the spotlight. This article was from just 12 years after Senior’s final season.

There are geniuses who do rise above that rule - Coleman, Ablett Jr, Lethal. But IMO we will, in twenty to thirty years, view Ablett Jr as the GOAT.

 

[Vdubs]

Probably also a bit of recency anti-bias.

I find there is a chronological “sweet spot” of about thirty to forty years when determining player greatness. When I was growing up in the 90s/2000s, players from the 60s/70s dominated Best Ever conversations - Matthews, Hart, Hudson, Whitten, Barassi, Skilton, et al.

Now it’s Carey, Ablett Sr, Matthews, Lockett who have their time in the spotlight. This article was from just 12 years after Senior’s final season.

There are geniuses who do rise above that rule - Coleman, Ablett Jr, Lethal. But IMO we will, in twenty to thirty years, view Ablett Jr as the GOAT.

Maybe, but having lived through ALL those you named, except Coleman, I will always have GAS as GOAT. 3 consecutive seasons of 120+ goals at his age is unsurpassable imho.

 

[My Tilly]

Maybe, but having lived through ALL those you named, except Coleman, I will always have GAS as GOAT. 3 consecutive seasons of 120+ goals at his age is unsurpassable imho.

It was also what he did in State games. He was a brilliant performer in 80's and 90's state of origin. That was when state matches meant something. They were some of the most fiercely contested games of footy. The rivalries between Vic v SA and WA v SA were no different to Carlton v Collingwood.