The Good, the Bad & the Ugly - Melb v WCE

[LITTLE STINGA]

Luke Ball?

Wow, just wow. Luke Ball would add very little to our side, all he'd do is stop a kid from receiving much needed game time.

I disagree, he's better than Moloney, Jones and McDonald so really one of those 3 would be keeping a kid out of the side. With the way our side has performed over the past 3 years I find it hard to believe that if a kid shows even the slightest little thing that they won't get game time.

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

Pretty sure we can't get PPs this year anyway?

Yes we can. read the herald sun article - tanking is dead.

 

[lose]

ok well im guessing you have no idea about football at all because everything you have said here is shit... i was actually not overly disappointed with our performance against the eagles considering the side we put out there... we were well in the game for 3 and half quarters without grimes sylvia jurruh morton aussie rivers and davey hardly played any game time... was very impressed with bennel and not sure why everyone is bashing miller because he was our only foward who presented and looked likely... thought moloney was very good and loved his hit on kerr right in front of the bench and bruce was very impressive considering it was his first game back... also thought bail was fairly handy,

however maric is terrible and didnt offer a shot, he just offered nothing... as did spencer... we are looking better and get off the negatives guys, the season hasnt started so chill and just look foward to the season...

 

[Andy_Mac]

ok well im guessing you have no idea about football at all because everything you have said here is shit... i was actually not overly disappointed with our performance against the eagles considering the side we put out there... we were well in the game for 3 and half quarters without grimes sylvia jurruh morton aussie rivers and davey hardly played any game time... was very impressed with bennel and not sure why everyone is bashing miller because he was our only foward who presented and looked likely... thought moloney was very good and loved his hit on kerr right in front of the bench and bruce was very impressive considering it was his first game back... also thought bail was fairly handy,

however maric is terrible and didnt offer a shot, he just offered nothing... as did spencer... we are looking better and get off the negatives guys, the season hasnt started so chill and just look foward to the season...

Finally someone else saw the game I was watching!!

I loved it when he dropped Kerr got up and nutted someone else. That’s the type of footy I want Scully watching; good, clean, hard footy. Controlled aggression.

Luke Ball... Stupid comment.

Also MFCforever I’ve had run in with WCE supporters before so didn't bring my wife and son. I think its a WA thing. F**k is not an adjective!

 

[Forrest Gimp]

Millwall, Cardiff and Chelsea have nothing on us big bad Eagles supporters

 

[omit]

We unfortunately still need to continue to tank, we can't afford not to. Bailey's plan has been to improve through the draft, we couldn't possibly be done yet. If we are doing this they must realise that Scully, Trengove and Watts are 18 and Morton and Jarrah are 20 and 21 with 18 year old bodies. Realistically once these kids turn 22 then we should start challenging for a flag. That is still 2 to 4 years away so we are still in for a lot more pain until then. We just have to stick with the club and hope that some kids can improve and that we can finally find some leaders with pick 4 and 6 in hand and be glad when 2010 is over so we can look forward to hopefully an injury free 2011.

Scully
Trengove
Gysberts
Watts
(Blease)
Morton
Grimes
Frawley
Jones
Bate
Dunn

that's 11 first round picks in our squad over the past 6 years. A key forward, Key defender a plethora of midfielders and a utility. we don't need more high picks. we just need time to develop these players as a group. not to mention all the other players we've picked up in these drafts (Garland, Strauss, Tapscott, Maric, Petterd)

how is winning 8 or so games a waste? it's showing improvement and it's what we want for our team. but you want us to tank unless we can make the finals. HOW ARE WE EVER GOING TO KNOW IF WE CAN MAKE THE FINALS IF WE DON'T WIN ANY ****ING GAMES.

and what do you mean we should find some leaders? we've got Jones and Petterd who constantly put their bodies on the line, a la Mcdonald. we've go Grimes who lives and breathes for the red and blue, a la Moloney. Jurrah is already a leader of his indigenous community and will be incredibly important going forwards helping other indigenous boys adapt to city life, a la Davey.

now I realise this is going to be a long year, the injuries to Morton and Jurrah are very big blows and if Sylvia is out for as long as early reports indicate then we may struggle to get out of the bottom 3. BUT, if we do manage to get a few wins together and say come 12th, I will be ****ing extatic

 

[Ando727]

^ totally agree. The time has come for us to start working on developing a winning culture. We will never do that if we are intent on stocking up on draft picks until we think we have the cattle. No team has ever won a premiership by tanking their way to the top. It always comes from moulding a tight, tough unit from the people you have. You can bring in new players, but you need a hard working core that has been drilled well and is accountable, a few stars and a good game-plan. It's been so long since I've even seen a game-plan from Melbourne, I wouldn't have a clue what Bailey has in mind. He needs to step up his game this year or he'll be gone. It's a pity Leigh Matthews is a bit old now, I would trust him to build a tough, disciplined team at Melbourne. We just never seem to land the first class coaches. Could be a big part of our problem.

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

Luke Ball... Stupid comment.

True the last thing that we want is a palyer who can get a clearance. It could stop us from getting a prioity pick.

 

[Andy_Mac]

True the last thing that we want is a palyer who can get a clearance. It could stop us from getting a prioity pick.

Although another slow inside midfielder that can kick 30m is just what we needed to replace Brock McLean.

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

Although another slow inside midfielder that can kick 30m is just what we needed to replace Brock McLean.

At least he can get a clearance unlike the others we have in there.

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

Scully
Trengove
Gysberts
Watts
(Blease)
Morton
Grimes
Frawley
Jones
Bate
Dunn

that's 11 first round picks in our squad over the past 6 years. A key forward, Key defender a plethora of midfielders and a utility. we don't need more high picks. we just need time to develop these players as a group. not to mention all the other players we've picked up in these drafts (Garland, Strauss, Tapscott, Maric, Petterd)

how is winning 8 or so games a waste? it's showing improvement and it's what we want for our team. but you want us to tank unless we can make the finals. HOW ARE WE EVER GOING TO KNOW IF WE CAN MAKE THE FINALS IF WE DON'T WIN ANY ****ING GAMES.

and what do you mean we should find some leaders? we've got Jones and Petterd who constantly put their bodies on the line, a la Mcdonald. we've go Grimes who lives and breathes for the red and blue, a la Moloney. Jurrah is already a leader of his indigenous community and will be incredibly important going forwards helping other indigenous boys adapt to city life, a la Davey.

now I realise this is going to be a long year, the injuries to Morton and Jurrah are very big blows and if Sylvia is out for as long as early reports indicate then we may struggle to get out of the bottom 3. BUT, if we do manage to get a few wins together and say come 12th, I will be ****ing extatic

Nowhere near enough especially considering we have hardly any 24 - 28 year olds. The first 4 are 18 year old probably won't make a major impact for at least 4 years. Morton has a body of an 18 year old, Grimes is injury prone and has only played just over 10 games. Jones is a battler, Bate is a handy player but he is not really a KPP player and Dunn well he'll be lucky to stay on the list he hasn't improved at all. Your naming players with too many if's,buts and maybe's. We have been through too much pain not to continue the get better through the draft, tanking, list mangement whatever you want to call it plan.
What you are suggesting is a Richmond, Kangaroos, Fremantle resurgence that has got them nowhere and will get us nowhere as well. There is only 1 way to do reasonably well next year in the draft and that is finish dead last. Finishing 12th won't even get us a top 10 pick.

 

[Dez!]

Nowhere near enough especially considering we have hardly any 24 - 28 year olds. The first 4 are 18 year old probably won't make a major impact for at least 4 years. Morton has a body of an 18 year old, Grimes is injury prone and has only played just over 10 games. Jones is a battler, Bate is a handy player but he is not really a KPP player and Dunn well he'll be lucky to stay on the list he hasn't improved at all. Your naming players with too many if's,buts and maybe's. We have been through too much pain not to continue the get better through the draft, tanking, list mangement whatever you want to call it plan.
What you are suggesting is a Richmond, Kangaroos, Fremantle resurgence that has got them nowhere and will get us nowhere as well. There is only 1 way to do reasonably well next year in the draft and that is finish dead last. Finishing 12th won't even get us a top 10 pick.

- Age has little to no bearing on the impact of a player, they are good enough to have a big impact this season.

- We don't need more draft picks, we just need to develop the talent we have.

- You need to stop comparing us to Richmond because our case is completely different to theirs, we have turned over our entire list over the past couple of seasons and are not working to a 5 year plan like Richmond were under Wallace.

- You're making far too many judgments on a list that has hardly played together, once they get games into their legs and play together as a team you will see where this club is headed and it's to the top.

- Also I see you are being critical of people having faith in the players we've drafted saying there's too many "if's, buts and maybe's" yet you seem to be putting a lot of faith in this upcoming compromised draft which is doesn't make much sense to me.

- Last thing, please don't call this season a write off before we've even got to round 1 it's just an absolute shit assessment.

 

[tornsword]

- Age has little to no bearing on the impact of a player, they are good enough to have a big impact this season.

- We don't need more draft picks, we just need to develop the talent we have.

- You need to stop comparing us to Richmond because our case is completely different to theirs, we have turned over our entire list over the past couple of seasons and are not working to a 5 year plan like Richmond were under Wallace.

- You're making far too many judgments on a list that has hardly played together, once they get games into their legs and play together as a team you will see where this club is headed and it's to the top.

- Also I see you are being critical of people having faith in the players we've drafted saying there's too many "if's, buts and maybe's" yet you seem to be putting a lot of faith in this upcoming compromised draft which is doesn't make much sense to me.

- Last thing, please don't call this season a write off before we've even got to round 1 it's just an absolute shit assessment.

Thankyou Dez!

I dont want to be rude but i think Little Stinga must be joking because i've never heard more rubbish spoken in my entire thread reading life. Your expectation that automatically every draft pick will be ready in one year is ridiculous. Its 9 years years on since Western Bulldogs and StKilda had their big drafts and now they are fighting for the GF finally. Every second person here is expecting a premiership in 2012 and its ridiculous. We need to look at the bigger picture. Wins are the goal this year, and to notch as many as we can with the currently depleted list. I think we will struggle to get out of the bottom 3 this year given our setbacks but before all the trouble i thought we were a 12-14 team.

Two years after we'll be top 8 material.
Then we can worry about the rest of the shit.

Get your head out of your a*s Stinga and end this tanking bullshit. Your the reason our club looks like a f****ing joke to anyone who gives a shit about this game and i personally think if thats the way you feel i'd prefer you to get your membership money back this year and choose a new club

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

- Age has little to no bearing on the impact of a player, they are good enough to have a big impact this season.

- We don't need more draft picks, we just need to develop the talent we have.

- You need to stop comparing us to Richmond because our case is completely different to theirs, we have turned over our entire list over the past couple of seasons and are not working to a 5 year plan like Richmond were under Wallace.

- You're making far too many judgments on a list that has hardly played together, once they get games into their legs and play together as a team you will see where this club is headed and it's to the top.

- Also I see you are being critical of people having faith in the players we've drafted saying there's too many "if's, buts and maybe's" yet you seem to be putting a lot of faith in this upcoming compromised draft which is doesn't make much sense to me.

- Last thing, please don't call this season a write off before we've even got to round 1 it's just an absolute shit assessment.

- Having hardly any good experienced players around when our young guns start make a impact isn't a concern.

- Are you saying that Bailey doesn't have plan? I don't get your point on that one.

- This is my point the more quality kids we get to play together the better off we will be. I can't see winning a few more games and losing our priority will help that.

- I have to admit I don't know how compromised the draft is yet. If pick 4 and 6 are really not top 10 picks then we really are in trouble.

- Last thing, it's an obvious call. If Geelong had our run with injuries they would struggle to make the 8. Considering we are a poor team it's a certainty that we will finish bottom 2. The Kangas are better, Port and Freo will win enough home games to finish above us, only Richmond can stop us from winning the spoon. If it's a choice between being the best poor team and a priority I would pick the priority every time.

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

Thankyou Dez!

I dont want to be rude but i think Little Stinga must be joking because i've never heard more rubbish spoken in my entire thread reading life. Your expectation that automatically every draft pick will be ready in one year is ridiculous. Its 9 years years on since Western Bulldogs and StKilda had their big drafts and now they are fighting for the GF finally. Every second person here is expecting a premiership in 2012 and its ridiculous. We need to look at the bigger picture. Wins are the goal this year, and to notch as many as we can with the currently depleted list. I think we will struggle to get out of the bottom 3 this year given our setbacks but before all the trouble i thought we were a 12-14 team.

Two years after we'll be top 8 material.
Then we can worry about the rest of the shit.

Get your head out of your a*s Stinga and end this tanking bullshit. Your the reason our club looks like a f****ing joke to anyone who gives a shit about this game and i personally think if thats the way you feel i'd prefer you to get your membership money back this year and choose a new club

I bet you were hoping that we would beat Richmond last year. Forget about Hawthorn, St.Kilda and the Bulldogs. They never tanked as badly as we have and they had some very good experienced players at the club. We have nothing but draft picks. If we over achieve it will come at a cost. We are not ready, when we are ready, when ever that is then we should make a move.

You don't want me as a member because you don't agree with me. Who are you? Hitler. Agree or disagree with me, I don't care but there is no need for that crap. We are a poor club with a low membership base. We should be wanting everybody to join Melbourne wether we agree with what they say or not, not continually abuse each other or say we don't want you here or I want to ban you just be we disagree like what's happening on Demonland and Ology.

 

[Dez!]

I bet you were hoping that we would beat Richmond last year. Forget about Hawthorn, St.Kilda and the Bulldogs. They never tanked as badly as we have and they had some very good experienced players at the club. We have nothing but draft picks. If we over achieve it will come at a cost. We are not ready, when we are ready, when ever that is then we should make a move.

You don't want me as a member because you don't agree with me. Who are you? Hitler. Agree or disagree with me, I don't care but there is no need for that crap. We are a poor club with a low membership base. We should be wanting everybody to join Melbourne wether we agree with what they say or not, not continually abuse each other or say we don't want you here or I want to ban you just be we disagree like what's happening on Demonland and Ology.

We don't need to tank anymore get that through your head.

The difference between our rebuilds and that of other teams is that we didn't keep as many experienced players which is why our decline and rise is a lot more prolonged than say Hawthorn, however that has little bearing on how far this group of young talent can go.

The benefit of this is that these young kids that we have drafted have only 1 and 3 years between them in age difference, hence they will reach their primes together and we will have a sublime crop of talent in the same age bracket.

 

[Andy_Mac]

If as you say we tank and get P4&6 or whatever this year, load up on more good quality youngsters it is going to have come at the expense of the few senior listed players we have left. This being the case we are going to be almost 100% reliant on players in seasons 1-4 of their careers to win us games which is just not feasible in the short term. Sure long term it would be great, but...

The reality is the MFC will get belted week in week out until Trengove, Watts and Scully have their 24th birthdays, by which time by your logic they should be in fact be delisted as out and out potatoes to be replaced with the next latest and greatest kid available via the draft and our endless supply of priority picks.

We need a balance of youth and experience. Have a look at the bests from the weekend, usual suspects Bruce Green Miller Jones etc.

 

[Spirit of 39]

We unfortunately still need to continue to tank, we can't afford not to. Bailey's plan has been to improve through the draft, we couldn't possibly be done yet. If we are doing this they must realise that Scully, Trengove and Watts are 18 and Morton and Jarrah are 20 and 21 with 18 year old bodies. Realistically once these kids turn 22 then we should start challenging for a flag. That is still 2 to 4 years away so we are still in for a lot more pain until then. We just have to stick with the club and hope that some kids can improve and that we can finally find some leaders with pick 4 and 6 in hand and be glad when 2010 is over so we can look forward to hopefully an injury free 2011.[/quote]

I can't read anymore of your posts after this comment. It made me feel physically ill.

I'm not sure that Carlton would even welcome your support.

 

[Spirit of 39]

No one is proud of what our footy department did in the last 6 to 8 rounds of 2010. (That is not doing everything humanly possible to win games of football.) But we could all see the bigger picture and thus, wore it on the chin.

To suggest that we should tank before a ball has been bounced in anger this year just goes against every reason that we go to the footy. I feel really sorry for you if you go to all 22 games hoping that we lose credibly.

Fight like hell in 2010, Demons! Every minute of every game.

 

[Andy_Mac]

No one is proud of what our footy department did in the last 6 to 8 rounds of 2010. (That is not doing everything humanly possible to win games of football.) But we could all see the bigger picture and thus, wore it on the chin.

To suggest that we should tank before a ball has been bounced in anger this year just goes against every reason that we go to the footy. I feel really sorry for you if you go to all 22 games hoping that we lose credibly.

Fight like hell in 2010, Demons! Every minute of every game.

X2

The time has come to begin the march back up the ladder!! Get excited people!!!

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

Fight like hell in 2010, Demons! Every minute of every game.

Yes. As long as we win only 4 or them.
C'mon Bailey perfect the art of tanking because let's face it, he's not gonna perfect the art of winning. Remember to use those catch cries "competitive ", "patience", "wait for a couple of years", "wait until we get games into these kids".
I'm sure he's well ahead of on this issue. How else can you explain Miller still being on the list.

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

X2

Get excited people!!!

For 2011

 

[LITTLE STINGA]

I can't read anymore of your posts after this comment. It made me feel physically ill.

Please read my posts. I'm not sure what I would do if you didn't.

 

[Dez!]

For 2011

Seriously get a grip, we haven't even started season 2010.

 

[omit]

Nowhere near enough especially considering we have hardly any 24 - 28 year olds. The first 4 are 18 year old probably won't make a major impact for at least 4 years. Morton has a body of an 18 year old, Grimes is injury prone and has only played just over 10 games. Jones is a battler, Bate is a handy player but he is not really a KPP player and Dunn well he'll be lucky to stay on the list he hasn't improved at all. Your naming players with too many if's,buts and maybe's. We have been through too much pain not to continue the get better through the draft, tanking, list mangement whatever you want to call it plan.
What you are suggesting is a Richmond, Kangaroos, Fremantle resurgence that has got them nowhere and will get us nowhere as well. There is only 1 way to do reasonably well next year in the draft and that is finish dead last. Finishing 12th won't even get us a top 10 pick.

how is it not near enough. we nearly have a starting squad made up entirely of top rated young kids.

yes we don't have many players currently in their prime but in a few years our current kids will hit their peak. winning games isn't going to stop them aging and hinder their development. in fact it will probably do the opposite (with regards to the development. not the aging)

perhaps i'm suggesting we've gone for a Geelong type rebuild. they hit the drafts hard in 99 and 01. picking up 22 players in those drafts. Ling, Corey, Enright, Chapman, Bartell, Kelly, S Johnson, Ablett are the players to come from these two drafts. and they didn't have nearly as many high selections as we did... Bartel and Corey at 8 were the highest. and don't give me that "They got Ablett for free crap". Ablett was rated as an early 2nd rounder at best. they gave up their 3rd round pick for him.

with the exception of Scarlett and Mooney. Geelong got the basis of their multi premiership team with a bunch of second and third round players... Christ we have heaps of those

Hawthorn did the same in 03, 04, 05 - selecting 31 players over those 3 drafts. many of them were part of the 2008 grand final team

we have picked up 19 players in the last 2 drafts (plus 9 in 2007 and 5 in 2006). In the last 4 drafts we have selected 34 players. 31 are still on our list

31 of the 46 players on our list (inc rookies) were selected in the last 4 drafts. We have the quality young players. we don't need to tank to get more players. we just need to let the players we have develop. what don't you get about that?

It's impossible for me to suggest we are going the Freo or Richmond route. Freo and Richmond both thought they were close to a flag traded to fill holes in their list to make the final step. it didn't work out for them and as a result just kind of hovered around for a few years.

Melbourne have not done this. during 2007 the club realised that we were not close to a flag and so we began to turn over our list. we have reached the point where the majority of our list is made up of very young players. it has reached the point where we need to develop this list as a team and start wining games.

one quick question. how are we ever going to know if we have the players to take us all the way if we don't start trying to win games? I mean if we only win 4 games this year then we can't possibly have the cattle required to get us a premiership so should probably tank 2011 as well to get us the players we need... but if we can only win 4 games in 2011 then we clearly don't have the players we need so we should probably tank 2012 to get the players we need... but if we can only win 4 games in 2012...etc etc etc

if we tank this year will we suddenly have the players we need, is it that arbitrary