The Otherworldly Circus - The America Thread

[Norm De Guerre]

Looks like the individual states & supreme court have the say on abortion rights, and I'm not sure what Biden has done about it? Has he even made much noise?

You've answered your own question.

Meanwhile Trump has been making equivocal statements on the subject on the campaign trail.

Yes. He's talked out of both sides of his mouth by claiming it's a states rights issue. Safe in the knowledge that the Supreme Court that he and Mitch McConnell crookedly had a hand in stacking nullified Roe V Wade and has and will continue to erode the choices of women when it comes to their reproductive rights.

Many Washington insiders quietly accede that the war in Ukraine isn't going anywhere. Its a perpetual stalemate. Of course, war is good for business and the weapons being supplied aren't charitable donations. The Ukrainian people will be paying them off for years. Businessman Trump will have to parley with Lockheed.

What's the alternative? Let the aggressor negotiate from a position of strength and use the current points of contact as the basis of any new border. Coincidentally the stance of both Putin and Trump. All this does is freeze the conflict until Russia can rebuild its military until it's ready for another crack at expanding Russias borders back to Imperial times. Or the US can withdraw its support and allow the same outcome to unfold, just much more rapidly. Combined with the redistribution of Russian overseas assets .Of course the Ukrainian people will pick up the tab for much of the time expired or old equipment that is being sent to them. However I suspect the choice between that and becoming a vassal state to a country that is prepared to use its citizens lives in a meat grinder as Russia so readily does is an easy choice to make.

If I was yer average American Ukraine & Nato would be well down my list of priorities. Just as they are for Aussies. People pretend to care , but most lost interest after the first 20 minutes of thst TV show.

Of course. These are the same people who moan about their taxes being used on anything that isn't of direct benefit to them. Until they need that thing, then they want the gold plated version at any cost.

You know. Unthinking Morons.

Unfortunately the now conservative stacked Supreme Court members have longevity. If 2 of the 6 choked on chicken bones before the election there is some hope. Otherwise the Federal Society is entrenched and immovable is the short to medium term.

Should it happen Justices Alito and Thomas have been making noises about cashing out (in Thomas' case quite literally) soon after Trumps re-election. Opening up the seats to people who will hold them for 40+ years.

Its a dog that cannot be un****ed now.

Hypothetically, if Trump wins, has he then already served the Federalist purpose and also passed his use by date? He who rides on back of tiger can never climb down ... unless someone shoots the tiger...lets say someone who looks like a liberal left reformist and tree hugger.

He doesn't care about nor understand any of this Supreme Court or Governing nonsense. He's interested in the trappings of office and the power that it affords him to enrich himself, his family and his oligarchical friends. Thats why his second term will not be about policy or the American people it'll be about what at the rotten core of his being. Getting retribution on those that haven't shown him the respect that he thinks he alone deserves. He's a very broken and disturbed individual.

Who will Trump's running mate be?Harbour Gold?

He'll repeat the formula that saw Mike Pence selected as VP. It'll be the most anodyne person he can find. He's not one for sharing the spotlight with anybody.

 

[Next Waiting]

View attachment 2036518

Biden is the current President. Trump is a political rival Biden is immune from prosecution

Why stop there though The conservative Supreme Court justices have just given a disorientated Biden free licence to take every one of them out (The SC Justices) with immunity

Revolution will inevitably come. It's just a question of the target, the trigger and the timing (anywhere from 0 to 25 years)

 

[Norm De Guerre]

This is a result of who Trump chose to be Supreme Court judges. The end of Roe vs Wade, resulting in states deciding on women’s rights is likely on Trump and the nutters he picked for the SC.

The same people who said that Roe was confirmed law and that the President wasn't above the law during each of their confirmation hearings.

Yet here we are.

 

[Sentinel]

The same people who said that Roe was confirmed law and that the President wasn't above the law during each of their confirmation hearings.

Yet here we are.

Yeah but they were crossing their fingers when they said it.

 

[Next Waiting]

What's to stop Biden as President placing the entire Supreme Court under house arrest or detention in Guantanamo Bay under a National Security intiative. National Security trumps all and requires little justification or proof in the short term .. if at all.

Both extreme and unlikely but what sh1tshow of a place it is.

 

[King Harold]

This is a result of who Trump chose to be Supreme Court judges. The end of Roe vs Wade, resulting in states deciding on women’s rights is likely on Trump and the nutters he picked for the SC.

They should be charged with perjury.
Lied at their confirmation hearings , overturned Roe when they said it is decided law.
And now “ no one is above the law “

Got to give to the Federalist society, they have their own supreme justices and a useful idiot to hijack the country.

 

[King Harold]

Reading the tea leaves , Biden will be put out to pasture before the end of the week !

 

[Next Waiting]

The doom and gloom scenario is that Trump wins and we're distracted by media saturation coverage of political vengeance on an unprecedented scale while the Federalist Society has its way in the shadows and consolidates then further entrenches its position.

What if the Dems win? It seems unlikely unless the majority of voters have an epiphany between now and then and see it for what it is and will be. In the case of the much hoped for epiphany, Biden or any other candidate would essentially do. But what happens in the shadows of the 4 years that follow. Whatever that might be, there would be a lot shadows and bulldogs under rugs that the public would be largely unaware of but a whole lot better than what we're staring down the barrel of right now.

Dog save America.

 

[Next Waiting]

The lesson for Australia and the electorate at large out of all of this is that you have to pay attention to who or what is influencing the law at all levels (including and especially the drafting of law and legislation). The Americans have a long history of law, law that influences commerce and that empowers or mitigates policy. The Federalists know that power ultimately resides in the law and so that is where the focus has been, is and will continue to be.

The law is an instrument by which the better off minority can control or subdue the growing less well off majority and maintain their privilege and wealth. In a true democracy that cannot be sustained. Influence over the law allows them to sustain it. They well know this.

"The price of democracy is eternal vigilance" Thomas Jefferson said. What he should have added is that those who would influence the law we should pay special attention to.

Alas, the American public at large has not been vigilant. The threat to democracy is and has always been within their own borders.

 

[Freshwater]

Australians look to America for many obvious and not so obvious reasons. What happens in the US is often important to us. So this debate here is very relevant to Australia. The US is still the cultural capital of the world. Whether we personally like that culture sometimes or not. I don’t listen to too much American music or Hollywood movies and I hate their sports especially their sports stars. But I can’t help knowing about them.
The ‘woke’ movement is brought to us from the US, especially their colleges and quickly infiltrates here. We can all remember how we weren’t allowed to socialise but that was thrown out by the BLM protestors in one week. The internet and tech giants are all located there. What happens there matters to us.
But we also get the good from there too. Even though we don’t have those important democratic ideals enshrined in our constitution we still are able to leverage off the ideas of ‘freedom of speech, press, religion, body, association etc’ because they are the highest ideals and we demand them philosophically too.
We actually took ideas from the US constitution when setting up our own. Because we are also a federation of states, we don’t have an inherited House of Lords we have a Senate and each state has the same number of members regardless of their size and then proportional representation in the House of Representatives, even the same names as US use.
As many have mentioned here we don’t seem to have the extremes they have and should use them as a warning. And a wise people have often said it is imperative the ‘left’ call out the far left and all the silly woke nonsense just as the ‘right’ call out the far right. Sometimes people are so entrenched in their politics that anything to one side of them is extreme, but usually the people here in Australia bring that into a real perspective.

 

[LittleG]

I get an inside info on polling things in the US from a friend who is a Texas Democrat. They expect Biden to easily get more votes than he did last time. No change in nominee coming, they are not polling people about it.

Texas is expected to move further towards the Swing state category and Ted Cruz to lose his senate seat. Texas flipping is a competent Democratic Latino nominee away or at least 2 cycles. They know of no Latino who would win the nomination but expect Shapiro gov. of Pennsylvania to be the Democrats next nominee. They don’t like him but Michelle Obama isn’t going to run and Newsome is electorate suicide.

Abortion is the biggest issue in the US this cycle.

 

[BEaston]

How long until the Supreme court can be re-balanced?

 

[Next Waiting]

How long until the Supreme court can be re-balanced?

How long is a piece of string? 2 ways, one voluntary and one involuntary. They choose to retire or they die.

 

[BEaston]

How long is a piece of string? 2 ways, one voluntary and one involuntary. They choose to retire or they die.

far out

that's insane

 

[Next Waiting]

far out

that's insane

Amy Coney Barrett is 52 years old (conservative Member). It's conceivable that she could be on the bench for another 30-40 years. It's beyond insane.

The concept that judges across the spectrum are political appointees is insane. Their entire justice system is insane, yet perfectly sane if you consider who benefits.

Cui bono are the only two Latin words you need to know these days. But you should know these two words. Well three, anilingus too, but that's for another thread.

 

[StringyDog]

far out

that's insane

The two oldest are also the most conservative and in their mid 70s most likely to be next replaced, if they expire or resign in trumps next 4 years there will be a conservative supreme court for a generation to come

 

[BrisDog]

Reading the tea leaves , Biden will be put out to pasture before the end of the week !

Where are you seeing this KH? I cannot find anything displaying that kind of optimism.

 

[Turtleman3]

Amy Coney Barrett is 52 years old (conservative Member). It's conceivable that she could be on the bench for another 30-40 years. It's beyond insane.

The concept that judges across the spectrum are political appointees is insane. Their entire justice system is insane, yet perfectly sane if you consider who benefits.

Cui bono are the only two Latin words you need to know these days. But you should know these two words. Well three, anilingus too, but that's for another thread.

Agreed, well with the first 2 paragraphs anyway.

 

[Pugz89]

They should be charged with perjury.
Lied at their confirmation hearings , overturned Roe when they said it is decided law.
And now “ no one is above the law “

Got to give to the Federalist society, they have their own supreme justices and a useful idiot to hijack the country.

At the time it was decided law, and the law of the land. They changed it after. So they didn't actually commit perjury, technically speaking.

 

[Pugz89]

Amy Coney Barrett is 52 years old (conservative Member). It's conceivable that she could be on the bench for another 30-40 years. It's beyond insane.

The concept that judges across the spectrum are political appointees is insane. Their entire justice system is insane, yet perfectly sane if you consider who benefits.

Cui bono are the only two Latin words you need to know these days. But you should know these two words. Well three, anilingus too, but that's for another thread.

To be fair, RBG was 87 when she died. So it's not just the conservatives who have long tenures.

 

[Next Waiting]

To be fair, RBG was 87 when she died. So it's not just the conservatives who have long tenures.

Agreed it's not. But as SD suggested above, the opportunity exists for a generational stranglehold should the senior conservative SC members put the longevity of the grand plan above their own and choose to resign under a Republican President in favour of a younger candidate who'll be around long enough to wring a few more years out of the advantage they already have.

I don't think the Dems have been that calculating or far thinking .... to this point.

In hindsight, it was bloody inconsiderate of RBG to fall off the perch when she did.

 

[dogwatch]

Crikey this thread is a depressing read.

Should I just stay away from it? It's like watching something grotesque or horrible happening in slow motion ... you just can't stop yourself looking.

Added to that it's such a crucial election for us, for Ukraine, for the Middle East, for Japan, for climate change, for ... well, the whole rest of the world really. I care for the American people who have to go through this and the direct and immediate consequences of it. But I care as much, probably more, for all those people in other countries (including us) who will be affected by the outcome and can only watch helplessly as it unfolds.

 

[King Harold]

At the time it was decided law, and the law of the land. They changed it after. So they didn't actually commit perjury, technically speaking.

They answered a direct question, will you overturn Roe.
They all answered No !
As all the other conservative justices answered directly, no one is above the law , including the President.

Plenty of vision of their answers if you can be bothered to go look for it.

They are corrupt and in the pocket of GOP and their backers.

 

[King Harold]

Where are you seeing this KH? I cannot find anything displaying that kind of optimism.

The first sitting member has called for him to stand down.
Raskin says there is a lot of talk going on.
Nothing more than that , except I like to think most of my thinking is based on common sense and
I just don’t see how Biden survives !

 

[King Harold]

At the time it was decided law, and the law of the land. They changed it after. So they didn't actually commit perjury, technically speaking.

How do you feel about the backflip on the immunity issue ?

Should Biden now have the 6 judges arrested ?

Because I know who would if ever he needs to .