Analysis The Rebuilds Of Hawthorn and Geelong and their Future Prospects

[Strapping Young Lad]

I’m not sure you’d find many people who agree that Stewart is a generational player.

 

[The 747]

I’m not sure you’d find many people who agree that Stewart is a generational player.

Probably not, but he is underrated for what he has achieved - five seasons, three AA and probably would have had four if not for an injury in 2020. What other players have records like that?

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Probably not, but he is underrated for what he has achieved - five seasons, three AA and probably would have had four if not for an injury in 2020. What other players have records like that?

Corey Enright is someone I would call a generational player/defender.

Stewart is an very very good football and elite football, but simply needs to reproduce it for minimum 3 or 4 more years before he can be discussed in the generational footballer discussion.

In some ways I do agree that he is underrated by a lot of the general football community though. Once he was ruled out late in the home and away season, I knew Geelong couldn't win the flag. He is so so important to your side.

 

[gbatman]

Hawks have invested in the draft a bit recently and maybe it was starting to show some good signs towards the end of last season. Have Geelong begun to rebuild? They have done well bringing in mature players however they have lacked the spark, energy and intensity youth brings. It's going to be interesting to see how both clubs fare over the next couple of seasons. Geelong should have the talent to go pretty far next season and Hawthorn's form towards the end of last season was that of a finals side.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Probably not, but he is underrated for what he has achieved - five seasons, three AA and probably would have had four if not for an injury in 2020. What other players have records like that?

3 AA’s to me suggest he’s somewhat overrated.

 

[The 747]

3 AA’s to me suggest he’s somewhat overrated.

If you think so. Well done on avoiding the question.

 

[The 747]

Sorry edited after your like

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

If you think so. Well done on avoiding the question.

I mean this with the greatest respect, but 3 AA’s is something he should hang his hat on, yet not necessarily something that I think he genuinely deserves.
But that’s the thing about the AA team, it’s a team made up of players that a bunch of media people decide on that is argued about every year.

 

[AlwaysHawks15]

I mean this with the greatest respect, but 3 AA’s is something he should hang his hat on, yet not necessarily something that I think he genuinely deserves.
But that’s the thing about the AA team, it’s a team made up of players that a bunch of media people decide on that is argued about every year.

I actually think he is better than you realise and I hate Geelong. He is certainly top 4 at that club alongside Dangerfield and Cameron in terms of impacting how they perform. We have a guy we rave about (and with good reason as he is a star) in Sicily who literally plays the same way but you want to dismiss Stewart's credentials. Doesn't make sense. I agree he isn't a generational player but he is a very good footballer and I say that through gritted teeth trust me. Also seems like a well respected well spoken guy as well.

 

[Cursed Cat]

I actually think he is better than you realise and I hate Geelong. He is certainly top 4 at that club alongside Dangerfield and Cameron in terms of impacting how they perform. We have a guy we rave about (and with good reason as he is a star) in Sicily who literally plays the same way but you want to dismiss Stewart's credentials. Doesn't make sense. I agree he isn't a generational player but he is a very good footballer and I say that through gritted teeth trust me. Also seems like a well respected well spoken guy as well.

Stewart established himself as our most impactful player during 2021 for sure. I dunno what constitutes a ''generational player'' but he's had a really solid run of A-grade form. Yes we bottled it in the end, but Stewart was BOG at half-time in the 2020 GF before backing up and winning our B+F despite missing the back-end of the season this year - he's been huge. Reminds me more of Scarlett than Enright.

 

[AlwaysHawks15]

Stewart established himself as our most impactful player during 2021 for sure. I dunno what constitutes a ''generational player'' but he's had a really solid run of A-grade form. Yes we bottled it in the end, but Stewart was BOG at half-time in the 2020 GF before backing up and winning our B+F despite missing the back-end of the season this year - he's been huge. Reminds me more of Scarlett than Enright.

Scarlett yes but not as intense. Seems to be a pretty relaxed character in general and well liked throughout the league. Scarlett was and still is a bit polarising regarding his personality. Not disputing his worth as a player.

 

[Jack Green]

This isn't a question is it? Geelong are in a stage atm where they are super old, clearly, by a long way. With little kids, have some good middle (prime aged) players, Stewart, Henry who look (great) and pretty good (Henry). But they likely won't win a flag over the next 2-3 years while they are competitive and will fall off a cliff, or try to continue the same strategy without worrying the flag sheet.

Hawthorn on the other hand, probably start slower, they could be competitive next year and push to just outside or just inside the 8. While staying there over the next 1-2 years and then improving to try build a long sustaining premiership side.

Just can't see how this is really a subject.

Maybe in 2016.

Interesting thread and yes Cats aren't rebuilding - they like the Hawks in 2020 are going to run their list to the very end in trying to snatch a flag, before regenerating. The Hawk CEO Reeves said something like we've squeezed to the last drop- while the Cats have their aging core ,they'll try and have one last dance - as shown by picking up a 31 year old Ceglar.

2016? Not a relevant thread then either Dom, Both sides were heavily into the now . Agree with you on the Cats not worrying the flag sheet now- think too many younger sides have passed them. You use the word 'slower' with Hawthorn. This I agree - this won't be the quick rebound in 2005 and if you look at the stark contrast in the quality of elite young talent on their list between now and then you will find your answer. We will have a far better idea in 12 months obviously .

 

[Sky]

Hawks are in for a long rebuild. Geelong will remain competitive till 2024-25, then face a decade of pain.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Serious question have we ever had a decade of true pain? Our supporters are an entitled bunch so they complain over 2011-2021 that we won 1 premiership from 10 finals series. I’m sure they’d have done the same back in the 60s too.

 

[theiaofseed]

I just don’t see it. Jiath looks good, and I am all in on Ned Reeves, but it’s not an impressive list of guys 23 and under, based purely on exposed form.

Jackson Callow might be a jet though. Can’t help but be impressed with his size, given his age.View attachment 1266554

You don't rate Day and Worpel?

 

[theiaofseed]

Geelong had a young Selwood, and Hawkins to rebuild with and got a Dangerfield cheap via Free Agency threat. Then they cleverly used free agency, and going mature recruits to top up.

Apart for Cameron who is 27, their are no generational players coming through at Geelong.

The same strategy won’t work in future because the cornerstones are not their.

Cameron will be 29 by seasons start, the cliff is coming.

 

[Sttew]

Will their crash be any worse than Carlton/North/Pies?

Cats haven’t been wooden spooners in over half a century. Steve Hocking isn’t scared of the word “rebuild”. Swans have demonstrated you don’t need to languish near the bottom to rebuild.

 

[Juddernaut08]

Cats haven’t been wooden spooners in over half a century. Steve Hocking isn’t scared of the word “rebuild”. Swans have demonstrated you don’t need to languish near the bottom to rebuild.

What's your point?

 

[Sttew]

What's your point?

We will rebuild and not languish

 

[TheUnicorn]

Well considering Geelong are all in and aren't rebuilding you would have to say Hawthorn. Mitchell seemed to indicate that he is focusing more on rebuilding/kids now by trying to shop around some of his older bigger names.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Cats haven’t been wooden spooners in over half a century. Steve Hocking isn’t scared of the word “rebuild”. Swans have demonstrated you don’t need to languish near the bottom to rebuild.

Don't use the swans as an example.

Rebuilds are not so tricky when you can hoard away all the best talent in your state and get them at a discount.

They don't bottom out by design.

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk

 

[Jack Green]

Well considering Geelong are all in and aren't rebuilding you would have to say Hawthorn. Mitchell seemed to indicate that he is focusing more on rebuilding/kids now by trying to shop around some of his older bigger names.

Yeah, interesting that from all reports, the Hawks would have entertained any offer for the right price for their 28+ brigade. Nothing moved, but impact on morale might be a watch this space!

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Yeah, interesting that from all reports, the Hawks would have entertained any offer for the right price for their 28+ brigade. Nothing moved, but impact on morale might be a watch this space!

Easy on the pearl clutching Damo.

Every club has exit interviews for all of its players every year. Clubs in the position we are (and there would be 5-10 in this off season) would have frank discussions about the potential for their name to come up in trade week. Hawthorn would have spoken to a few of its older players and been frank, if the offer came they would entertain it but only after running it by them.

Some offers supposedly came. Hawthorn ran it by the players involved. They decided to stay at the club.

As a supporter I am happy that the players see something they want to stay for.

Thats all there really is to it. The narratives around Hawthorn this off season have been hilariously duplicitous. Hawthorn players must be disgruntled because Mitchell tried to ship them all out. Yet they all wanted to stay?

Cake and eat it and all that.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Cats haven’t been wooden spooners in over half a century. Steve Hocking isn’t scared of the word “rebuild”. Swans have demonstrated you don’t need to languish near the bottom to rebuild.

I mean.... Neither have Hawthorn.

Prior to this year, Norths last spoon was nearly 40 years ago.. Shit, Collingwoods last spoon was over 20 years ago, long enough to have nothing to do with its current culture.

Weird flex.

 

[Jack Green]

Easy on the pearl clutching Damo.

Every club has exit interviews for all of its players every year. Clubs in the position we are (and there would be 5-10 in this off season) would have frank discussions about the potential for their name to come up in trade week. Hawthorn would have spoken to a few of its older players and been frank, if the offer came they would entertain it but only after running it by them.

Some offers supposedly came. Hawthorn ran it by the players involved. They decided to stay at the club.

As a supporter I am happy that the players see something they want to stay for.

Thats all there really is to it. The narratives around Hawthorn this off season have been hilariously duplicitous. Hawthorn players must be disgruntled because Mitchell tried to ship them all out. Yet they all wanted to stay?

Cake and eat it and all that.

Yes , an anti -Hawk element in the media which is not overly subtle and has hanged over from their dynasty .
Clubs in similar positions and frank discussions [ 5-10 clubs ] up to half of the competition. No, don't think so.
President came out to members with warning of some shock calls - not sure if this happened elsewhere
Giants offer to Bruest for an exchange of 13 and 24. Wingard on twitter saying I'm not f** ing going . Agreed on players NOT wanting to go - think the club however would have moved these players on for right price. My understanding was Bruest said NO not the club.
I'm interested that Hawthorn supporters don't think this will be an issue moving forward. IMO it will.

 

[Jack Green]

I mean.... Neither have Hawthorn.

Prior to this year, Norths last spoon was nearly 40 years ago.. sh*t, Collingwoods last spoon was over 20 years ago, long enough to have nothing to do with its current culture.

Weird flex.

Yep, culture is not something set in concrete. Mitchell now will try and instill that winning culture at Hawthorn Clarkson obviously did after over a decade+ of instability and lack of success!!