Transgender - Part 2

[Gethelred]

Please be aware that the tolerance of anti-trans language on BF is at an all-time low. Jokes and insults that are trans-related, as well as anti-trans and bigoted rhetoric will be met with infractions, threadbans etc as required. It's a sensitive (and important) topic, so behave like well-mannered adults when discussing it, PARTICULARLY when disagreeing. This equally applies across the whole site.

 

[10571z]

Awesome new Transgender Ads released. It’s really hard to understand why right wing politicians are doing so well around the world.

 

[the_interloper]

That was my immediate take as well, although would appear to have gone unnoticed by burge/interloper/gralin. Just seems a clickbait headline with the conservative tabloids, and an own goal for those who link/share without closer inspection.

That's fair, I struggle to understand these descriptions anyway. Would be a weird thing to make an issue of as you say.

I said a few posts ago that journos are looking out for transgender athletes to write about, I guess they have to be inventive sometimes.

 

[Roobs321]

Just when you think you get a grip on this subject it gets more and more absurd. This is utter lunacy, sorry

sharing news.com.au anything, and obviously something you barely read at that, is certifiably ‘utter lunacy’ to me. I’m doubtful the lesson will be learnt, the mistake doomed to be repeated.

 

[Gruffles]

But why should they be reporting biological female in the article?

Same as you saying its ok because Hiltz is competing in the field that matches their biology so its not relevant to this thread

They are trans, there should not be a little asterix saying its ok they're really a woman, that also is not respecting their identity

The comment I was making was due to the fact that the news article made a huge point of labelling their gender identity in the title. What was the purpose of that? If they wanted to do that, then I think they should have included their biology in the article.

OR... now hear me out here... they could've just not bothered mentioning any of it and just said, 'Nikki Hiltz qualifies for the Olympics'.

 

[burge13]

The comment I was making was due to the fact that the news article made a huge point of labelling their gender identity in the title. What was the purpose of that? If they wanted to do that, then I think they should have included their biology in the article.

OR... now hear me out here... they could've just not bothered mentioning any of it and just said, 'Nikki Hiltz qualifies for the Olympics'.

That would have less clicks

 

[10571z]

Just when you think you get a grip on this subject it gets more and more absurd. This is utter lunacy, sorry

It’s beyond belief how we got here

 

[Gruffles]

That would have less clicks

Of course it would... and it's designed to suck people in and create controversy. It's why media just completely sucks.

You spoke of society jumping the shark before because someone who is non-binary has decided to go with transgender for their gender identity. I'd argue that the state of the media is a more significant example of societal shark jumping.

Again... this is really a nothing burger.

 

[the_interloper]

Canadian Boxer Withdraws From Championship After Discovering Opponent Is Transgender

Ms Walmsley secured victory by default as officials were unable to locate another boxer in the corresponding weight class.

www.ndtv.com

I found this article, I personally don’t blame this boxer for pulling out of the fight. Shame she only discovered this an hour before they were meant to compete, that really should be known.

 

[Chief]

What made her withdraw? Thought she might get transed?

 

[Gralin]

What made her withdraw? Thought she might get transed?

What did I miss?

 

[the_interloper]

What made her withdraw? Thought she might get transed?

She didn't want to fight someone born as a man it appears. I would say all female boxers have sparred men at one point or another, and I don't think many want to actually compete against one. Blokes generally just hit harder and can take a punch better, and yeah I've held pads for plenty of men and women and there's generally a vast difference in power.

"According to a study, a male blow has 163% more impact than a woman's, even adjusted for weight," Bissonnette said.

Article doesn't say which study (just "a" study), would be interested to look at it

 

[burge13]

She didn't want to fight someone born as a man it appears. I would say all female boxers have sparred men at one point or another, and I don't think many want to actually compete against one. Blokes generally just hit harder and can take a punch better, and yeah I've held pads for plenty of men and women and there's generally a vast difference in power.

"According to a study, a male blow has 163% more impact than a woman's, even adjusted for weight," Bissonnette said.

Article doesn't say which study (just "a" study), would be interested to look at it

Don't waste your time. Chief is a complete cooker if he doesn't understand she would pull out of the fight. Very poor from the athletic commission and promoter to not disclose the opponent was transgender too

 

[Chief]

So they are comparing cis men to cis women when talking about an individual cis woman vs an individual trans woman?

It doesn't sound like a good comparison.

 

[Chief]

Don't waste your time. Chief is a complete cooker if he doesn't understand she would pull out of the fight. Very poor from the athletic commission and promoter to not disclose the opponent was transgender too

I wonder how keen on fairness in women's sport you'd be if you knew the best path to fairness would be social equality. Equal access to training staff and facilities. Equal educational access.

I wonder why conservatives are shouting at everyone to look over there at trans people...

 

[Gralin]

I like how she found out an hour before her match and was able to cite a study about cis men to inform her decision

How did you find this article lopes? Amazing how an amateur local boxing competition in Canada has made the news...

Its great how it misgenders the the boxer, uses the term biological male, calls Walmsleya man etc

this is not what you would called neutral reporting of the issue

 

[Chief]

She didn't want to fight someone born as a man it appears.

Reading through it, she's misgendering her opponent as well.

Kind of gives the game away.

 

[burge13]

I wonder how keen on fairness in women's sport you'd be if you knew the best path to fairness would be social equality. Equal access to training staff and facilities. Equal educational access.

I wonder why conservatives are shouting at everyone to look over there at trans people...

Whatever

Boxers beat the piss out of each other. You're willing to risk serious injury to someone (who didn't even know what they're getting into) in the name of inclusiveness. It's wrong. Genuine cooker shit here of a different end of the extreme

 

[Beerfish]

A bit more information that wasn't in the first article posted.

According to Boxing Canada, a trans fighter's identity should not be disclosed if a transition was undertaken before puberty to prevent discrimination.

Female boxer withdraws after learning rival is trans

Canadian boxer Katia Bissonette withdrew from a tournament after being told her rival Mya Walmsley is transgender amid concerns for her safety.

www.dailymail.co.uk

So is it fair to assume that Walmsley transitioned before puberty and that's why it wasn't disclosed?

Is it also fair to assume that Bissonette had seen Walmsley before the fight, like you know, for research against an upcoming opponent and had no concerns until Walmsley was outed as trans via txt an hour before the fight?

We're not talking about Mike Tyson in a wig here which is what the usual suspects want to rant about.

 

[Chief]

Whatever

Boxers beat the piss out of each other. You're willing to risk serious injury to someone (who didn't even know what they're getting into) in the name of inclusiveness. It's wrong. Genuine cooker shit here of a different end of the extreme

If she had withdrawn and cited her own uncertainty and intention to find out more, instead of coming up with some irrelevant stat and misgendering her opponent, you'd have an argument.

Instead you're white knighting an obvious bigot.

 

[the_interloper]

Reading through it, she's misgendering her opponent as well.

Kind of gives the game away.

Game? She doesn't want to punch on with someone who most likely has a physical advantage over her, I don't blame her.

 

[burge13]

Society is so unbelievably broken when 'misgendering' is more of a worry to the cookers than a girl not wanting to box someone born a man. This isn't just a race, it's a fist fight ffs

 

[Chief]

Society is so unbelievably broken when 'misgendering' is more of a worry to the cookers than a girl not wanting to box someone born a man. This isn't just a race, it's a fist fight ffs

Funny attempt to flip the cooker title. It's why you're my favourite one!

You know the refusal is only a part of it, yeah? It's the political project behind the refusal and the follow up statements that show the bigotry.

But stay angry. It's working for your cause.

 

[Chief]

Game?

Political game. That's what this is.

She doesn't want to punch on with someone who most likely has a physical advantage over her, I don't blame her.

"Most likely" - based on what? She talked about one study that doesn't even apply here.

"Physical advantage" - isn't that what sport is about?

Again, the misgendering gives us all the clues we need to work out what is really behind this.

 

[Chief]

I like how she found out an hour before her match and was able to cite a study about cis men to inform her decision

She's a fast reader.

 

[the_interloper]

A bit more information that wasn't in the first article posted.

Female boxer withdraws after learning rival is trans

Canadian boxer Katia Bissonette withdrew from a tournament after being told her rival Mya Walmsley is transgender amid concerns for her safety.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Geez, well that's ordinary if they're not meant to disclose it.

Political game. That's what this is.


"Most likely" - based on what? She talked about one study that doesn't even apply here.

"Physical advantage" - isn't that what sport is about?

Again, the misgendering gives us all the clues we need to work out what is really behind this.

You should find a female boxer and make this point to her and see how it goes.

You've seriously got your tin foil hat on here, I don't believe she's making a political point here, she's worried about her safety which is fair enough.