Happy to accept fwiw
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VAFA General Discussion 2022-2023-2024
- Thread starter Max Leader
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- Nov 2, 2006
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Agree Jimmy - we had been asking for some 'balance' for some time to support a better chance at competing/survival.
Example: Next year 14 of our Colts kids are intending on going to play at one of Xavier's 4 x 19's (as they attend the school). Unfortunately they will all be split up as they are at different skill level / standard but as the option is available that's where they will head for now. In years gone by with a max of 2 x 19's. Some of those kids fed lower level divisional clubs like ours. Again, I do not begrudge Xavier for all the work they do and the resources they have - well done to them and our club needs to do more to attract that talent. But the VAFA choose not to step in limit the number of sides, whilst other clubs are impacted to some degree. It's just a shift in player distribution I suppose and as such clubs will need to make decisions and changes to facilitate better opportunities for thier clubs to survive in the coming years.
Chump
And remove this “rule” that the same club can’t have two teams in the same division. The divisions need to be structured on merit, not on names.Agree Jimmy - we had been asking for some 'balance' for some time to support a better chance at competing/survival.
Example: Next year 14 of our Colts kids are intending on going to play at one of Xavier's 4 x 19's (as they attend the school). Unfortunately they will all be split up as they are at different skill level / standard but as the option is available that's where they will head for now. In years gone by with a max of 2 x 19's. Some of those kids fed lower level divisional clubs like ours. Again, I do not begrudge Xavier for all the work they do and the resources they have - well done to them and our club needs to do more to attract that talent. But the VAFA choose not to step in limit the number of sides, whilst other clubs are impacted to some degree. It's just a shift in player distribution I suppose and as such clubs will need to make decisions and changes to facilitate better opportunities for thier clubs to survive in the coming years.
Chump
Too many times we’ve seen a Thirds or Under19s dominate when they should have been up a grade or two.
You give clubs 12 months to adjust and say after that 2 teams max , this does help with clubs wanting to leave as there is no way you can compete with clubs like Xavs
Wasn't that long ago it was just the Crocs (green socks). Good bunch of blokes to play against who on their day would have defeated a number of lower divisional senior teams, was certainly a highlight when we knocked them off.
Having all these 3'rds and U/23's is also handy for boosting your overall 'total premierships won' when marketing a club.
And affects the club championship as well , that should be a percentage depending on the amount of teams
Club Championship, another thing the VAFA can get rid of over summer.
About as popular as the 'Heath Ledger' articles from a few years back
Agreed
Like University over here in Perth, who proudly announce that they have won over 100 premierships, but only 17 of them belong to the 1st XVIII. Helps when you field eight teams.
- Jul 29, 2015
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Perhaps the Comp bragging that it is Australia's largest has run its course. The faultless leaders probably now realise that a 5 division competition is probably sufficient, 7 being unwieldy.
We shall soon see.
womack
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Hi ChumpAgree Jimmy - we had been asking for some 'balance' for some time to support a better chance at competing/survival.
Example: Next year 14 of our Colts kids are intending on going to play at one of Xavier's 4 x 19's (as they attend the school). Unfortunately they will all be split up as they are at different skill level / standard but as the option is available that's where they will head for now. In years gone by with a max of 2 x 19's. Some of those kids fed lower level divisional clubs like ours. Again, I do not begrudge Xavier for all the work they do and the resources they have - well done to them and our club needs to do more to attract that talent. But the VAFA choose not to step in limit the number of sides, whilst other clubs are impacted to some degree. It's just a shift in player distribution I suppose and as such clubs will need to make decisions and changes to facilitate better opportunities for thier clubs to survive in the coming years.
Chump
14 xavier kids playing ivanhoe colts ? Something screwy there .. these kids would have no affinity for Ivanhoe is my guess .. and therefore the problem..on the other hand as a comparison parkside colts will have 14 kids flowing through to the under 19s … build it and they will come ….
I believe that they might have to dispense with that claim as I reckon they have actually been overtaken by the Perth Football League (mainly because there was less of a Covid effect - played a half-season with top four instead of five in 2020 and lost only two rounds mid season in 2021).
The figures I could find on the three leagues websites for 2023 are:
Perth FL - 32 grades, 73 clubs and 327 teams.
VAFA - 30 grades, 70 clubs and 300+ teams.
Adelaide FL - 29 grades, 67 clubs, ? teams
The figures I could find on the three leagues websites for 2023 are:
Perth FL - 32 grades, 73 clubs and 327 teams.
VAFA - 30 grades, 70 clubs and 300+ teams.
Adelaide FL - 29 grades, 67 clubs, ? teams
I believe that they might have to dispense with that claim as I reckon they have actually been overtaken by the Perth Football League (mainly because there was less of a Covid effect - played a half-season with top four instead of five in 2020 and lost only two rounds mid season in 2021).
The figures I could find on the three leagues websites for 2023 are:
Perth FL - 32 grades, 73 clubs and 327 teams.
VAFA - 30 grades, 70 clubs and 300+ teams.
Adelaide FL - 29 grades, 67 clubs, ? teams.
From those numbers, you can take out Ivanhoe and its 4 teams now, soon to be followed by Old Paradians and its 4 teams.
Then you can take out two grades (D4 and D4 Reserves) over the summer.
Certainly not the biggest anymore.
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I reckon he said 14 Ivanhoe colts playing at Xavier next year.
womack
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Yes .. that is what I said as well .. they are xavier kids playing at ivanhoe colts .. they aren’t going to hang around at ivanhoe
- Nov 2, 2006
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Completely agree Womack that it is on our club to build it - absolutely. But the availability of extra teams to some clubs like Xavier impacts our club more than it would at Parkside.
I have spoken to / and know parents who have kids at Parkside and the make up of kids in that junior club is a little different to our juniors. I was told in season 2022 that 94% of our 2 x Colts teams ( 1 won the flag and the other was runner up) attended private schools - Xavier, StKev, Old Ivan, Trinity, Carey and Marcellin. Yet at Parkside, I was told that this numbers would be closer to 30% - with good numbers out of Kew High. So whilst we are just a few kilometres apart, the make up of the juniors is a little different.
That said, WE still need to do better as a club to create an environment those players want to be a part of.
Chump
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That said 25+ years ago when clubs could only have 2 x 19's and there was no thirds and under 23's we had about 60% of our senior club come from those private school backgrounds - via our juniors. So whilst it's not a guarantee they would play with us, history suggests they did when larger clubs did not have so many teams. This is all the sort of information our committee gave us as part of their research over the past 12 months AND spoke to the VAFA about before a suggested move.
Chump
Chump,That said 25+ years ago when clubs could only have 2 x 19's and there was no thirds and under 23's we had about 60% of our senior club come from those private school backgrounds - via our juniors. So whilst it's not a guarantee they would play with us, history suggests they did when larger clubs did not have so many teams. This is all the sort of information our committee gave us as part of their research over the past 12 months AND spoke to the VAFA about before a suggested move.
Chump
Did VAFA HQ share their thoughts on this? It seems like they really don't care if the Xavier's and St Kev's of this world have 2 teams or 20. Or, the effect it is having on other football clubs. I would love to know the feedback/response the VAFA gave to the research. Seems like it was tough t***ies...
It seems that the comp has grown in the number of overall teams.
Maybe, that's their metric and not the amount of clubs. Surely, there should be a better balance??
Taking into account HQ's statement when they announced Ivanhoe was leaving and comparing it to the statement about Old Paradians where it was obvious they would prefer they stay, I reckon HQ's response to the point about the effect of school clubs having extra teams on clubs like Ivanhoe would have been ambivalent.
HQ want more teams to enter and it doesn't matter to them how many clubs it takes to field those teams. When another five or six clubs leave, they may start to twig that some clubs aren't happy with being pariahs (but I doubt it).
HQ want more teams to enter and it doesn't matter to them how many clubs it takes to field those teams. When another five or six clubs leave, they may start to twig that some clubs aren't happy with being pariahs (but I doubt it).
- Nov 2, 2006
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Not too sure Mounzer of the detail, but our sub-committee who ran the discussions advised us all that no real changes were immediately foreseeable and that it 'may' actually expand with thoughts on under 23's resuming at some stage.
To be fair, our club is not saying it is right or wrong, we just find ourselves in a position where it impacts us significantly these days due to our geographical position and the high % of juniors that attend those schools. As such our committee had to look at ways to help our club survive.
Chump
The same can be said for U/19s. Old Xavs, St Kevs & St Bedes all have 3 x U/19s yet multiple local clubs in those cluster areas cannot get one started
- Aug 24, 2018
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If people want to play at old xavs or skob etc. then so be it. Imagine forcing someone to play local footy on a weekend for a club they don't want to with people they don't know.
Bizarre. It is what it is. The school communities are large and their nature wants you to hang around and meet friends for life.
Sorry mate, you can't play for you alumni because it isn't great for [insert] club that can't field a side.
Bizarre. It is what it is. The school communities are large and their nature wants you to hang around and meet friends for life.
Sorry mate, you can't play for you alumni because it isn't great for [insert] club that can't field a side.
- Jul 29, 2015
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Can the other clubs apart from the selfish ones vote on how many sides a club can have and if so they should .
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What will end up happening is more and more clubs will choose to leave the competition in order to survive. The comp will become 4-5 divisions of seniors and reserves and the rest a collection of Womens, Thirds, Under 23s and Under 19s teams. Almost all affiliated clubs will be old boys or uni teams with only a couple of district clubs (e.g. Beaumaris, Fitzroy) staying as they have the best chance of competing with the old tie brigade.
HQ cares about teams fielded, not clubs affiliated and more and more of your divisional clubs will become disillusioned over the next few years and - like Ivanhoe and Old Paradians have decided this year - come to the conclusion that that the best way to survive is to go elsewhere.
HQ cares about teams fielded, not clubs affiliated and more and more of your divisional clubs will become disillusioned over the next few years and - like Ivanhoe and Old Paradians have decided this year - come to the conclusion that that the best way to survive is to go elsewhere.
