Toast VS Collingwood review megathread

[Bulldog Banana]

Tutt is proving me wrong, I am impressed with his improvement. I like it when a player proves me wrong. Now he just has to keep it up!
Its funny that when we move the ball forward quickly we have easier shots at goal if it results in a mark inside 50.
Was so stoked about our performance during & after the game, it made my day!!
The younger guys have a bit of mongrel about them, Stringer showed a bit during Saturdays game, same with Honeychurch and yesterday, Bonts, Libba & Hrovat didnt mind stirring up the opposition.
Seems to be poles apart from when Murph & Gia started, a lot of those guys that were drafted in the early 2000's were no where near as aggresive on the field as the a few of the current crop of young players.
Looks like a rosy future....

 

[True Dog]

By the way, Bonts definitely took a step last night. Showed some great signs. But the love from the Ch 7 commentators was way over the top. He missed a lotta lotta targets and showed blinkers plenty of times too.

Not that I'm having a go at him. He played like a promising 5 gamer is expected to - a few good signs, lots of stuff-ups. Now he needs to keep applying himself and improving. Nothing more, nothing less. The way Ch 7 were carrying on, you'd think he dominated the afternoon.

By contrast, I also thought Macrae took another step. A step up from excellent kid to Top 100 player. There were 4 or 5 exquisite passages of play from him. And plenty of solid ones - he is ironing out most of the stuff-ups. And yes, it's true that Ch 7 had a bit of love for him too. But not enough in my book. Unlike Bonts, I DID think Macrae was announcing himself last night. He is improving at such a rapid clip!

I think the love for Bonti will only grow.... There's no doubting he has areas to work on but it's the unteachable stuff that catches your attention and it was on display in mass during the third qtr yesterday. I've watched him very closely since we've selected him and some of things he's done has been amazing... We see him today and imagine him tomorrow and that's where the love fest begins imo......

 

[dogwatch]

We now have the Macrae side step and the Bontosaurus spin.
Both will be trade marks for years to come.

 

[True Dog]

Worst game I have seen from Morris I think ? so agree there.
But are you saying Roughy is no good ? If you are , I am speechless !

I couldn't agree more KH....That's just a WOW from where I sit.

 

[True Dog]

Correct me if I'm wrong but did I hear a Bonti chant coming from the crowd yesterday? If it's true is anyone here responsible?

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

I'm sure I heard that too, True Dog

 

[Ghenghis]

By the way, Bonts definitely took a step last night. Showed some great signs. But the love from the Ch 7 commentators was way over the top. He missed a lotta lotta targets and showed blinkers plenty of times too.

Not that I'm having a go at him. He played like a promising 5 gamer is expected to - a few good signs, lots of stuff-ups. Now he needs to keep applying himself and improving. Nothing more, nothing less. The way Ch 7 were carrying on, you'd think he dominated the afternoon.

By contrast, I also thought Macrae took another step. A step up from excellent kid to Top 100 player. There were 4 or 5 exquisite passages of play from him. And plenty of solid ones - he is ironing out most of the stuff-ups. And yes, it's true that Ch 7 had a bit of love for him too. But not enough in my book. Unlike Bonts, I DID think Macrae was announcing himself last night. He is improving at such a rapid clip!

Hopefully channel 7 will actually learn what Bonts looks like. They were too busy spruiking their love for him whilst he was on the bench to notice it was actually Hrovat the camera was on.

Totally agree about Macrae. His poise and ability to get clear/through/around contests makes up for any deficiencies in his disposal.

 

[Trent85]

Both Macca and Jones have said he needed to work on his fitness especially since he couldn't play for three weeks so the extra week helped him. Jones said the fitness staff smashed him and it was like a mini-preseason so I think yesterday showed it's already paying off.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-06-16/fitness-behind-jones-rise

IT WASN'T all that long ago that the idea of Liam Jones running down an opposition speedster appeared mission impossible.

Rightly or wrongly, there was a perception that the big key forward either didn't want to put in the effort, or he physically couldn't do it.

Jones told AFL.com.au that his turning point was his two-match suspension for rough conduct in the round eight win over Melbourne at the MCG.

With the Dogs to have a bye when Jones' ban had expired, and the likelihood he would return through the VFL, the Bulldogs saw the opportunity to put him through some torturous training sessions that amounted to a mid-season, mini pre-season.

"The fitness staff smashed me - absolutely flogged me every day – with repeat-effort stuff," Jones told AFL.com.au post-match, before Dogs CEO Simon Garlick congratulated him with a warm handshake and a hug.

"Watching the boys from the sidelines I was just dying to get back out there with them and do my job.

"It's good to see some dividends from all the hard work. I ran out the game a lot better than I did before the suspension."

Jones says it was "definitely" his best AFL game because it was one of the few times where the defensive and offensive elements of his game "came together".

He laid six tackles – a personal best.

"Everyone outside the club judges me on goals but inside the club the efforts and spoils and tackles and chases are what we really value. That's what probably got us over the line today," he said.

The high-flyer is determined to keep his feet on the ground. Next week the Dogs take on a rebounding Port Adelaide at Adelaide Oval.

"I'll review my tape. There are obviously quite a few things to tidy up but it's something to build on," he said.

"I've got to back it up now with effort like that every week."

"What he's done in the past – and this is what's landed him in a bit of hot water and had him criticised for it – is big gaps between his best and his worst," McCartney said.

"But even before he got suspended, the gap between them wasn't as significant, it was minimising.

"Some of them just take a bit longer to mature and he's a good kid, the club's important to him and he also wants to be seen a certain way.

"Hopefully we can help him get a bit closer to be the player he wants to be."

 

[Ghenghis]

Libba, Dahl, Macrae and Bont had 42 disposals in that quarter - hopefully a snapshot preview of the next decade.

Add in Hrovat, Tutt and Wallis from yesterday and then throw in Hunter, Smith, etc...

The only problem is that none of them are tall but I would rather have guys who can actually play footy than recruit 6 foot 4 athletes who can run like the wind.

Maybe rather than trying to find another Barry Hall, we should re-invent the game to suit us. Remember Carltons mosquito fleet. We should play to our strengths and get other teams to try and match up against us.

 

[DylanW]

I saw that and thought it was his stats for the game thus far and then looked more closely and said; that is 1 quarter?

I had the same initial thought actually

 

[Dogsman16]

Add in Hrovat, Tutt and Wallis from yesterday and then throw in Hunter, Smith, etc...

The only problem is that none of them are tall but I would rather have guys who can actually play footy than recruit 6 foot 4 athletes who can run like the wind.

Maybe rather than trying to find another Barry Hall, we should re-invent the game to suit us. Remember Carltons mosquito fleet. We should play to our strengths and get other teams to try and match up against us.

Bonts 192cm and Macrae 191cm are ridiculously tall mids

 

[josh the gent]

I think Jones' big improvement is coming from his ability to lead right up the ground as a lead up target (ala St Nick style).

I can remember a few occasions where he provided that 'get out' option and marked between hbf and the wing.

Important for the team, and really important for Jones cos I believe it gives him some confidence.

Generally echo the sentiments overall on here - i'm bloody wrapt!

 

[jmac70]

Well done on a great win. Your boys were too fast and too good. Enjoy.

 

[Hrovat24]

Worst game I have seen from Morris I think ? so agree there.
But are you saying Roughy is no good ? If you are , I am speechless !

Nah mate not at all , just saying a lot of people on here overrate roughead his a good player and will only get better , but roughead could have 5 kicked on him and a lot of people on here will say he was in out best players , against Brisbane he done a good job but in the Ching he was voted our best I am shocked

 

[Dav1d]

Nah mate not at all , just saying a lot of people on here overrate roughead his a good player and will only get better , but roughead could have 5 kicked on him and a lot of people on here will say he was in out best players , against Brisbane he done a good job but in the Ching he was voted our best I am shocked

I thought against Collingwood he struggled a bit on Cloke, because he tried to out muscle him where he should have allowed himself to do what he is best at and run at and spoil the ball

Otherwise with the ball in hand he was really composed and was setting up the defense; Cloke was just nailing them from everywhere

 

[dogwatch]

Nah mate not at all , just saying a lot of people on here overrate roughead his a good player and will only get better , but roughead could have 5 kicked on him and a lot of people on here will say he was in out best players , against Brisbane he done a good job but in the Ching he was voted our best I am shocked

How does a KPD get a vote though? They never get good stats. In the old days a good KPD like Verdun Howell could win a brownlow medal but now people seem to rate a game on how many disposals you get (umpires too) so a midfielder nearly always gets the 3 votes. Exception is if someone kicks 8 goals at FF.

Roughy not only shut down an all-time great (though ageing) KPF in Brown but he provided leadership. He did a similar job on Cloke (though Cloke who was in great form got two late goals). Roughy was never more appreciated than when he was out of the side for 3-4 weeks. If anything I think he's underrated by commentators and even on this board.

I haven't checked but he'd have to be our leading 1%er, at least per game, if not overall. (1%ers are the defenders only real stat - usually a spoil.) He'd also be high up on 1%ers per game in the whole comp I reckon.

 

[Bazza Bulldog]

I thought roughead and Morris were terrible yesterday

Roughy played on Cloke for 2.5 quarters ... during this time he kicked 2. You need to watch the first half again. Some of Roughies clearance work from the contest was elite for a man his size. Not Mozza's best game, but he did some important things. Terrible (from Roughy in particular) NO.

 

[Hrovat24]

Roughy played on Cloke for 2.5 quarters ... during this time he kicked 2. You need to watch the first half again. Some of Roughies clearance work from the contest was elite for a man his size. Not Mozza's best game, but he did some important things. Terrible (from Roughy in particular) NO.

Rougheads disposal and decision making was poor

 

[GetDimmaBack]

Tutt is proving me wrong, I am impressed with his improvement. I like it when a player proves me wrong. Now he just has to keep it up!
Its funny that when we move the ball forward quickly we have easier shots at goal if it results in a mark inside 50.
Was so stoked about our performance during & after the game, it made my day!!
The younger guys have a bit of mongrel about them, Stringer showed a bit during Saturdays game, same with Honeychurch and yesterday, Bonts, Libba & Hrovat didnt mind stirring up the opposition.
Seems to be poles apart from when Murph & Gia started, a lot of those guys that were drafted in the early 2000's were no where near as aggresive on the field as the a few of the current crop of young players.
Looks like a rosy future....

I think Ryan Hargrave was our "nasty" from that draft.

Often mixed it up with other sides. Didn't look to be the aggressive type, but he was apparently a black belt in
one of the martial arts (not that this necessarily makes anyone aggressive) and he always backed himself in blues.
Got suspended a couple of times, too.

Anyone remember him smacking out a few Saints in 2003? I loved that!

 

[fronkalicious]

Jones played quite deep yesterday and I think that suits him. He's lost when he gets the pill up the ground and obviously his tank isn't ideal either.

Which is why I think a mobile beast like Tomlinson might even suit us better than a Patton type.

 

[Dogsman16]

Jones played quite deep yesterday and I think that suits him. He's lost when he gets the pill up the ground and obviously his tank isn't ideal either.

Which is why I think a mobile beast like Tomlinson might even suit us better than a Patton type.

Been thinking about that too, is there a way we can trade our first rounder (plus something else) for the GC two later first rounders and trade one of them for Tomlinson, particularly if McCartin, Wright, Durdin look unavailable for our first rounder? That still gives us the opportunity to take a KPF/KPD in Keitel or Marchbank with our other first rounder or even better some outside pace and skills.

 

[dogwatch]

Was going to wait until I'd watched the whole game again before making a few comments but it might take me a while to see the lot. Have re-watched the first quarter and a half so far.

• Won't be too popular here but Macrae was pretty quiet early and not very influential. Started to come into it mid-way through the second quarter. On the flipside, to finish with 28 disposals shows what a good second half he had. His disposal wasn't great either, especially handball. Sold a few players into trouble. Still thought he played well on the day overall and rapt to have him at the WB.
• LOL at Pendleton wearing yellow boots. Manager must have said to him you need something eye-catching to get more brownlow votes. It's either yellow boots or peroxide hair (like Scott West and others used to do 15 years ago). That said, Pendleton really is a classy player. He still got 30 possessions and some of them quite influential. That said, I thought Wallis (with his ORANGE boots/laces!) did a pretty fair job.
• Wallis was very involved. Should have had two goal assists before half time (Tutt and Crameri) but Crameri missed an easy set shot. You can whinge about his disposal but he has great vision and can be very creative. Fearless in a pack as well.
• After watching the replay I DON'T take back my comment at the time that if MRP was consistent both Swan and Pendles would be rubbed out. Well a good chance of it anyway. They won't be rubbed out of course, probably won't even get a mention. Part of the reason was obvious in the Ch 7 call. Not sure which commentator it was but he said quickly (and sotto voce so as not to draw any extra attention) something like "nothing there - we won't be seeing (hearing??) any more of that one". This to me sounded like a running direction to the video crew not to play it over and over. Guess what? No repeated replays. Media attention is often what gets MRP involved. What actually happened was Pendles hip collided with Grant's head. Not a deliberate head shot, but neither was Jones's when he got rubbed out. Grant was stunned but not injured. Could have easily been a very nasty neck injury. In the other, Swan in shepherding, collected Wallis's jaw about 4-5 metres off the ball. It wasn't in close, it was an arm right across his body. Wallis's head was rocked back but he wasn't injured.
• I've commented on Roughy elsewhere. Thought he was quite good in helping shut down a rampant and unusually accurate Cloke. Make no mistake about Cloke he is a very good footballer and he was in great form yesterday. Two comments on his game though: his first goal should have been a free to Morris. Some would say that would be soft, but defenders get those paid against them every week. Later, he gave away a free with face contact to Austin (commentators tried to downplay it). We took it up the other end and goaled. This happened when a Pies player had a set shot about 50m out so Cloke's indiscretion could have been a 12 point play and that's the whole match right there. It's also why you don't get suckered in when you have a set shot within range (remember the Grant incident last week?)
• Does Libba ever get beaten in a one-on-one?

Will save other comments for later when I've re-watched a bit more of the game.

 

[Bulldog Banana]

I think Ryan Hargrave was our "nasty" from that draft.

Often mixed it up with other sides. Didn't look to be the aggressive type, but he was apparently a black belt in
one of the martial arts (not that this necessarily makes anyone aggressive) and he always backed himself in blues.
Got suspended a couple of times, too.

Anyone remember him smacking out a few Saints in 2003? I loved that!

Yeah, it was Heath Black who played for Freo & St Kilda, it was a beautiful clean punch!
Black always fancied himself as a bit of a tough guy, I still remember cracking up when I saw quiet Ryan Hargrave knocked that blow hard fat head on his arse.
He did get suspended though!

 

[fronkalicious]

Been thinking about that too, is there a way we can trade our first rounder (plus something else) for the GC two later first rounders and trade one of them for Tomlinson, particularly if McCartin, Wright, Durdin look unavailable for our first rounder? That still gives us the opportunity to take a KPF/KPD in Keitel or Marchbank with our other first rounder or even better some outside pace and skills.

Tomlinson would cost more than that I reckon. Feel like he's more important to gws than Patton/Boyd and will probably have less trade value, so not sure I can see him being traded unfortunately.

 

[dogwatch]

Forgot to mention Swan's game. Very good player but was well held or subdued yesterday. Only 23 disposals (not counting nearly disposing of Wallis's teeth). Not sure who had the job on him if anyone. He had a couple of bursts of brilliance (his forte) including a great end-to-end goal but in the replay so far I couldn't help noticing him picking up quite a few easy back passes and give and gos a la Ablett.

Keeping Swan quiet is a win any day.