Europe War in Ukraine - Thread 3

[CD Xbow]

Legacy hornets cannot carry a lot of the more recent more capable munitions though. There is a reason we do not use them.

On moto g(6) plus using BigFooty.com mobile app

They have been well upgraded and Ukrainian resourcefulness being what it is, I think they will be made to carry what is needed. They have been a great aircraft for the RAAF, 4 losses out of 75 airframes over 35+ years. Compared to their predecessor, the Mirage, which the Wiki tells me we lost the horrifying number of 46 aircraft out of a fleet of 116. That figure came from here

McDonnell Douglas F/A-18 Hornet in Australian service - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Visions]

I haven't seen this posted, but it appears the Nova Karkhova dam has been destroyed, presumably by the Russians to impede the Ukrainian counter offensive.



Perhaps a sign the Russians may pursue a scorched earth retreat. Lock up your washing machines.

Definitely the Russians are to blame for this. They have either panicked jumping at shadows and blown it up on purpose or it has collapsed on itself due to negligence on their part as they allowed the water levels to increase to record levels.

Also a sure sign is that the fckwit self appointed governor of the Russian region first claimed nothing was happening, before the terrorists came out and said it was “due to damage.”

The kickback of this major own goal is that the majority of the flooding will happen on the Russian held side of the river, and the canal will now stop feeding fresh water into Crimea.

Goes to prove Russia is nothing but a terrorist state that really needs to be annihilated.

 

[Visions]

Russians blew up a dam to flood a region they occupy and disrupt water supply to Crimea (which they also believe is theirs). Sorry that seems illogical. More likely Ukraine did this.

1. Russia had control of the dam from their side.

2. Russia are the ones that rigged it with explosives the first time around during the last retreat.

3. Ukraine couldn’t destroy the dam bridge using state of the art HIMARS previously yet they magically destroyed a 100ft section in an instant now? With what?

Nah, as mentioned above, either Russia did it using previously laid explosives or due to their negligence it collapsed on itself.

 

[Wce17]

1. Russia had control of the dam from their side.

2. Russia are the ones that rigged it with explosives the first time around during the last retreat.

3. Ukraine couldn’t destroy the dam bridge using state of the art HIMARS previously yet they magically destroyed a 100ft section in an instant now? With what?

Nah, as mentioned above, either Russia did it using previously laid explosives or due to their negligence it collapsed on itself.

There’s video footage floating around of the moment the damage was caused by an explosion.

 

[Baldur]

Russians blew up a dam to flood a region they occupy and disrupt water supply to Crimea (which they also believe is theirs). Sorry that seems illogical. More likely Ukraine did this.

Ukraine who has made it clear they intend to take back Crimea, blow up a vital part of the of the infrastructure of Ukraine just before launching the attack they hope will free Crimea. Sorry seems illogical, more likely the Russians fearing they will lose, did what they have shown they are willing to do, blow up Ukrainian infrastructure for no good reason at all but the petty tantrum of a murderous despot.

Furthermore, how did Ukraine blow up the dam, it was controlled by Russia. There are no bouncing bombs anymore, to blow up a dam requires large amounts of explosives onsite.

 

[Al Heimer]

Russians blew up a dam to flood a region they occupy and disrupt water supply to Crimea (which they also believe is theirs). Sorry that seems illogical. More likely Ukraine did this.

Try again

On SM-J250F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Frank Grimes]

Ukraine who has made it clear they intend to take back Crimea, blow up a vital part of the of the infrastructure of Ukraine just before launching the attack they hope will free Crimea. Sorry seems illogical, more likely the Russians fearing they will lose, did what they have shown they are willing to do, blow up Ukrainian infrastructure for no good reason at all but the petty tantrum of a murderous despot.

Furthermore, how did Ukraine blow up the dam, it was controlled by Russia. There are no bouncing bombs anymore, to blow up a dam requires large amounts of explosives onsite.

I agree with most your post, but despite the ethics of it they did have a reason, and it is to make it much harder for Ukraine to cross the Dnipo river blocking off a potential front in the West.

I agree it doesn't make much sense for Ukraine because the better strategy would have been to take control of the East bank of the river and manually deny water Crimea if that was their aim rather than blow up expensive infrastructure they could use when liberating the regions.

It's a moot point anyway because it is clearly Russia who are responsible because as you pointed out they had control of the dam. They were the only ones capable.

 

[Visions]

There’s video footage floating around of the moment the damage was caused by an explosion.

I think that footage you are referring to is actually landmines being swept by the flooding water onto retaining walls along the shoreline and detonating.

Unless its something different to what l’ve seen.

 

[Wce17]

I think that footage you are referring to is actually landmines being swept by the flooding water onto retaining walls along the shoreline and detonating.

Unless its something different to what l’ve seen.

My apologies what I’ve seen is footage of the explosion at the dam from last November. It’s been taken & is being circulated as new footage from this morning.

 

[Cap]

the fact this terrorism will go unpunished is despicable.

 

[Visions]

Former Russian controlled Nova Kakhovka now a lake with swans swimming in it.

For those with a knowledge of Soviet history, the symbolism is apt.

 

[mighty tiges]

 

[EagleMan87]

Russians blew up a dam to flood a region they occupy and disrupt water supply to Crimea (which they also believe is theirs). Sorry that seems illogical. More likely Ukraine did this.

Flooding regions you control is actually a common tactic to stem an offensive:

Floods as war weapons – Humans caused a third of floods in past 500 years in SW Netherlands

A new study shows that, from 1500 until 2000, about a third of floods in southwestern Netherlands were deliberately caused by humans during wartimes. Some of these inundations resulted in significant changes to the landscape, being as damaging as floods caused by heavy rainfall or storm surges...

www.egu.eu

A new study shows that, from 1500 until 2000, about a third of floods in southwestern Netherlands were deliberately caused by humans during wartimes.

 

[Hornberger]

Flooding regions you control is actually a common tactic to stem an offensive:

Which is exactly what Ukraine did at the start of the war, flooding the fields on the approach to Kyiv and forcing Russia to advance only over a handful of roads.

 

[Hornberger]

Definitely the Russians are to blame for this. They have either panicked jumping at shadows and blown it up on purpose or it has collapsed on itself due to negligence on their part as they allowed the water levels to increase to record levels.

Another possibility is that Russia wants to re-deploy forces from the Kherson region to the Zaporizhzhia front. Blowing the dams make it much harder for the Ukrainian to launch an amphibious assault across the river. The Russian controlled river bank will be turned into a swamp making completely impassible for heavy vehicles.

 

[Hornberger]

Ukraine who has made it clear they intend to take back Crimea, blow up a vital part of the of the infrastructure of Ukraine just before launching the attack they hope will free Crimea. Sorry seems illogical.

I would disagree with that analysis. Ukraine has shown that they have no issues destroying their own infrastructure if they think it will provide a military advantage. Infrastructure can be rebuilt and the cost of rebuilding is a fraction the cost of fighting the war.

The stronger reason for saying that it wasn't Ukraine is that doesn't appear to serve any military purpose for them.

 

[Mobbs]

Flooding regions you control is actually a common tactic to stem an offensive:

Floods as war weapons – Humans caused a third of floods in past 500 years in SW Netherlands

A new study shows that, from 1500 until 2000, about a third of floods in southwestern Netherlands were deliberately caused by humans during wartimes. Some of these inundations resulted in significant changes to the landscape, being as damaging as floods caused by heavy rainfall or storm surges...

www.egu.eu

Case in point within the first few days of the invasion: Demydiv, north of Kyiv, was flooded to make the roads less easily traversible - playing a part in the RF column being obliterated in the traffic jam.

Edit: Or I could have just read the subsequent post!

Which is exactly what Ukraine did at the start of the war, flooding the fields on the approach to Kyiv and forcing Russia to advance only over a handful of roads.

 

[Cap]

I would disagree with that analysis. Ukraine has shown that they have no issues destroying their own infrastructure if they think it will provide a military advantage. Infrastructure can be rebuilt and the cost of rebuilding is a fraction the cost of fighting the war.

The stronger reason for saying that it wasn't Ukraine is that doesn't appear to serve any military purpose for them.

I think the size of what was blown up needs to come into the calculation.

It's not just a train station or a small dam like they did. It's a huge and extremely important piece of infrastructure

 

[Visions]

Another possibility is that Russia wants to re-deploy forces from the Kherson region to the Zaporizhzhia front. Blowing the dams make it much harder for the Ukrainian to launch an amphibious assault across the river. The Russian controlled river bank will be turned into a swamp making completely impassible for heavy vehicles.

Also means that Ukraine can send any troops that might have been planned for a assault across from Kherson can now be moved to a full on assault at Zaporizhzhia, strengthening that offensive.

Here's some more propaganda from a mouthpiece of the terrorists that did this, self appointed head orc of Kherson Volodymyr Saldo (who himself needs to endure a painful death). Standing in front of a flood affected area, he wants us to believe people are going about their daily commute walking around in the dirty flood affected streets with businesses running as per normal. Are they getting about using diving gear?

 

[Visions]

What's taken months to claim is lost within days. Its the Russian way.

UAF looking to make a play to regain Bakhmut after Wagner left the scene leaving the regular muppet mobik army in charge.

 

[Saint]

Also means that Ukraine can send any troops that might have been planned for a assault across from Kherson can now be moved to a full on assault at Zaporizhzhia, strengthening that offensive.

Here's some more propaganda from a mouthpiece of the terrorists that did this, self appointed head orc of Kherson Volodymyr Saldo (who himself needs to endure a painful death). Standing in front of a flood affected area, he wants us to believe people are going about their daily commute walking around in the dirty flood affected streets with businesses running as per normal. Are they getting about using diving gear?

I guess we can stop pretending Ukraine might have done this. When the Russians say everything is fine, you know something completely stuffed up is going on. At least in this case you can see the problem right over the guy's shoulder.

 

[CD Xbow]

The Russians have finally got their strategy right, they are going after Ukrainian farm machinery

Russia Blows Up Farm Equipment, Claims They're Leopard Tanks

Russia's bogus 'Leopard hunt' in Ukraine is the latest in a long line of easily disproven propaganda claims.

www.thedrive.com

It is pretty sloppy propaganda, which has been a feature of the Russian campaign.

 

[Power Raid]

I think the size of what was blown up needs to come into the calculation.

It's not just a train station or a small dam like they did. It's a huge and extremely important piece of infrastructure

I would suggest there are other considerations:

Article 56 - Protection of works and installations containing dangerous forces​

1. Works or installations containing dangerous forces, namely dams, dykes and nuclear electrical generating stations, shall not be made the object of attack, even where these objects are military objectives, if such attack may cause the release of dangerous forces and consequent severe losses among the civilian population. Other military objectives located at or in the vicinity of these works or installations shall not be made the object of attack if such attack may cause the
release of dangerous forces from the works or installations and consequent severe losses among
the civilian population.
2. The special protection against attack provided by paragraph 1 shall cease:
(a) for a dam or a dyke only if it is used for other than its normal function and in regular, significant and direct support of military operations and if such attack is the only feasible way to terminate such support;

(b) for a nuclear electrical generating station only if it provides electric power in regular, significant and direct support of military operations and if such attack is the only feasible way to terminate such support;

(c) for other military objectives located at or in the vicinity of these works or installations only if they are used in regular, significant and direct support of military operations and if such attack is the only feasible way to terminate such support.

3. In all cases, the civilian population and individual civilians shall remain entitled to all the protection accorded them by international law, including the protection of the precautionary measures provided for in Article 57 . If the protection ceases and any of the works, installations or military objectives mentioned in paragraph 1 is attacked, all practical precautions

shall be taken to avoid the release of the dangerous forces.

4. It is prohibited to make any of the works, installations or military objectives mentioned in paragraph 1 the object of reprisals.

5. The Parties to the conflict shall endeavour to avoid locating any military objectives in the vicinity of the works or installations mentioned in paragraph 1. Nevertheless, installations erected for the sole purpose of defending the protected works or installations from attack are permissible and shall not themselves be made the object of attack, provided that they are not used in hostilities except for defensive actions necessary to respond to attacks against the protected works or installations and that their armament is limited to weapons capable only of repelling hostile action against the protected works or installations.

6. The High Contracting Parties and the Parties to the conflict are urged to conclude further agreements among themselves to provide additional protection for objects containing dangerous forces.

7. In order to facilitate the identification of the objects protected by this article, the Parties to the conflict may mark them with a special sign consisting of a group of three bright orange circles placed on the same axis, as specified in Article 16 of Annex I to this Protocol [Article 17 of Amended Annex]. The absence of such marking in no way relieves any Party to the conflict of its obligations under

this Article.

 

[Visions]

I guess we can stop pretending Ukraine might have done this. When the Russians say everything is fine, you know something completely stuffed up is going on. At least in this case you can see the problem right over the guy's shoulder.

Also Russian TG channels were straight after the explosion posting about “controlled flooding” to get rid of the UAF on the islands in the Dnipro river. So they were admitting their own actions.

Once these idiots realised that Russia and competent don’t belong in the same sentence and saw how fcuked up their actions were, there was a mix of Ukrainian did it/the dam collapsed itself/controlled explosion, until everyone got the memo to stick to the same narrative where Russia wasnt involved.

The cat was out of the bag however.

 

[Cap]

The only condition here needs to be we want videos of Russian stuff blowing up.