Welcome Welcome to Hawthorn: Josh Ward. Extends to 2025!

[kirbatron]

Id like him to build towards becoming a Gulden-lite.

Can he get there?

 

[SSSSSS]

Id like him to build towards becoming a Gulden-lite.

Can he get there?

He would have his running capacity but not his hurt factor.

Gulden is close to being the best kick in the comp if not the best.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

He would have his running capacity but not his hurt factor.

Gulden is close to being the best kick in the comp if not the best.

Ward is a superb kick, he is capable and has that level of talent. It’s just about his application and genuinely about his want for it, if he wants it he’ll get it. I wanna see him back in his pace and ability, he’ll be a joy to watch.

This isn’t to say he will but he’s capable.

 

[Suntory Boss Coffee]

He would have his running capacity but not his hurt factor.

Gulden is close to being the best kick in the comp if not the best.

Have seen Ward nail some rippers to be fair. Just doesn't do it enough.

 

[SSSSSS]

Ward is a superb kick, he is capable and has that level of talent. It’s just about his application and genuinely about his want for it, if he wants it he’ll get it. I wanna see him back in his pace and ability, he’ll be a joy to watch.

This isn’t to say he will but he’s capable.

Ward is a neat kick but he doesn't have the same penetration or vision that Gulden has.

Ward's best weapon that I saw as a junior (outside of his relentless running power) is his ability to quickly spot the right decision (especially in tight spaces) and execute ball in hand. That's where he should be trying to separate himself.

We don't need him to nail the Harlem Globetrotter Hollywood passes like Gulden can. We have Frenchy for that.

I'm happier for Ward to nail the 35 metre spot up kick 15 times a game and set up others to do the heavy lifting on offense.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Ward is a neat kick but he doesn't have the same penetration or vision that Gulden has.

Ward's best weapon that I saw as a junior (outside of his relentless running power) is his ability to quickly spot the right decision (especially in tight spaces) and execute ball in hand. That's where he should be trying to separate himself.

We don't need him to nail the Harlem Globetrotter Hollywood passes like Gulden can. We have Frenchy for that.

I'm happier for Ward to nail the 35 metre spot up kick 15 times a game and set up others to do the heavy lifting on offense.

I don’t agree personally, I rate Wards kicking highly, but he’s more of a Merrett kick than a Gulden as you said, Gulden drives and kicks it 40-50 and pulls off some unreal kicks but Merrett and Ward imo are deadly 25-40. Wards vision is great, but yeah I don’t think he’s a long kick like Gulden but his kicking skills are elite 25-40.

Agree with his hand skills, he’s insanely clean, and his creativity with ball and ability in tight, both movement and ability to get hands through traffic is top notch, which is why he’s working on his stoppage craft so he can utilise it more, and I hope he can back himself to drive his legs more because he has so much burst and speed with his foot skills he could be a gun inside/outside hybrid. It’s in his ball park and he decides what happens from here, talent is there.

Also I don’t think Frenchy is even like Gulden, he’s again more mid range but he tends to be a lot better kicking to leads and having a superb touch kick which is perfectly weighted, Sam Mitchell like. Newcombe is the driver of long kicks. Day another good user who seems to be good at both.

I’m happy to see Ward use his inside capacity but also back his breakaway burst and speed to then open the game up for a 35-40 metre kick setting up the entire play forward of centre.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Have seen Ward nail some rippers to be fair. Just doesn't do it enough.

Needs to back himself in, I’ll say it a million times and a million more.

 

[SSSSSS]

I don’t agree personally, I rate Wards kicking highly, but he’s more of a Merrett kick than a Gulden as you said, Gulden drives and kicks it 40-50 and pulls off some unreal kicks but Merrett and Ward imo are deadly 25-40. Wards vision is great, but yeah I don’t think he’s a long kick like Gulden but his kicking skills are elite 25-40.

Agree with his hand skills, he’s insanely clean, and his creativity with ball and ability in tight, both movement and ability to get hands through traffic is top notch, which is why he’s working on his stoppage craft so he can utilise it more, and I hope he can back himself to drive his legs more because he has so much burst and speed with his foot skills he could be a gun inside/outside hybrid. It’s in his ball park and he decides what happens from here, talent is there.

Also I don’t think Frenchy is even like Gulden, he’s again more mid range but he tends to be a lot better kicking to leads and having a superb touch kick which is perfectly weighted, Sam Mitchell like. Newcombe is the driver of long kicks. Day another good user who seems to be good at both.

I’m happy to see Ward use his inside capacity but also back his breakaway burst and speed to then open the game up for a 35-40 metre kick setting up the entire play forward of centre.

Frenchy should go for the long kick more often. He certainly has it in his toolkit. The kid has been pumping 55m shots post high off 2-3 steps. He definitely has it in him and I would love for him to back himself.

It's what can separate him from being an A grade player to an A+.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Frenchy should go for the long kick more often. He certainly has it in his toolkit. The kid has been pumping 55m shots post high off 2-3 steps. He definitely has it in him and I would love for him to back himself.

It's what can separate him from being an A grade player to an A+.

Besides the goals I haven’t seen him do it in terms of a field kick. It would be interesting to see if he can do it and keep it flat enough - demonstrating good penetration like Newcombe does. Because I agree with you, I think the entire side just needs to back themselves and especially those younger newer guys like Ward, Newcombe, Mitchell in particular. You can see there’s a few who already do, Day, Newcombe, Ginnivan, Watson etc.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Both Ward and Mackenzie are quality users of the ball.

Mackenzie in particular is really an elite kick. He can seemingly kick it pretty far fairly effortlessly, based on some of his shots on goal.

But I don't think either of them are able to hit those high-velocity bullets like Sicily, Newcombe or D'Ambrosio.

They both kick with more finesse and place the ball. One of Ward's strengths is placing kicks whilst running at pace.

On a side note, I imagine it's just a matter of time before Mackenzie is confident enough to pull those riskier kicks off though.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Both Ward and Mackenzie are quality users of the ball.

Mackenzie in particular is really an elite kick. He can seemingly kick it pretty far fairly effortlessly, based on some of his shots on goal.

But I don't think either of them are able to hit those high-velocity bullets like Sicily, Newcombe or D'Ambrosio.

They are both kick with more finesse and place the ball. One of Ward's strengths is placing kicks whilst running at pace.

On a side note, I imagine it's just a matter of time before Mackenzie is confident enough to pull those riskier kicks off though.

I think Ward is better suited to being a surgical user but can still hit longer kick when required, being able to open the whole ground with mid range passes like Merrett does who’s probably one of the best kicks in the league. Mackenzie seems capable of both but not a dart type, likes to weight the ball more than Ward and others mentioned. But the midfield group is now full of good users, Ward, Mackenzie, Day and Newcombe and all bring different capacities when kicking.

 

[kirbatron]

Does Ward have the footy IQ of Gulden..?

as in running patterns, accumulation & damage?

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Does Ward have the footy IQ of Gulden..?

as in running patterns, accumulation & damage?

Talent wise **** yes, has shown glimpses of all 3 at AFL level already, but seriously need to release his own shackles.

 

[theiaofseed]

Josh Ward (33 disposals, 12 score involvements, nine marks, seven inside 50s, four tackles) ​

“Josh is continuing to work on his craft inside, which is an area of growth he’s really working hard on, and we’re seeing little wins in that space which is great. To then really showcase his weapons, his ball use and his ability to really access and work hard for his teammates who have the ball and for him to be an option was really pleasing. His contest to contest running was a real highlight.”

 

[Reggie Mombasa]

Ward is a superb kick, he is capable and has that level of talent. It’s just about his application and genuinely about his want for it, if he wants it he’ll get it. I wanna see him back in his pace and ability, he’ll be a joy to watch.

This isn’t to say he will but he’s capable.

Ward was ranked as one of the top 10 in the AFL for kick rating earlier in the season (Herald Sun article:

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/the-facts-proving-tiger-young-gun-tom-brown-is-one-of-afls-best-kicks-four-games-into-his-career/news-story/43a0d958a3b4ea829c37d7d58bbdd3b7).

Top 10 Players for Kick Rating in 2024 (minimum 20 total kicks)​

Player	Matches	Kicks	Expected	Actual	Kick Rating
Kysaiah Pickett	4	24	51.8%	75.0%	+23.2%
Tom Brown	3	25	45.1%	60.0%	+14.9%
Jacob van Rooyen	5	25	43.4%	56.0%	+12.6%
Dan Houston	4	56	48.4%	60.7%	+12.3%
Jake Stringer	4	32	47.2%	59.4%	+12.2%
Toby Greene	4	43	46.1%	58.1%	+12.0%
Zach Guthrie	4	49	47.3%	59.2%	+11.9%
Josh Ward	4	35	49.0%	60.0%	+11.0%
Nick Holman	4	20	34.0%	45.0%	+11.0%
Jordan Clark	4	69	49.2%	59.4%	+10.2%

 

[flinchfree]

Personally think Ward was 'protected' by the coaching staff in terms of his development - to the player's detriment - by looking to grow his game outside first in his time with us thus far. Wing, HB, and outside when attending on ball opportunities.
Reckon he has more than enough nous and quality to be inside and both win the ball and either exit before disposing or pick a quick opportunity to offload to an outside player.

It's more a timing thing for young Josh, as another poster has mentioned, he's just taking that extra split second to assess that he doesn't have because he's not on the move enough after gathering, underestimating HOW quick the opposition will look to grab and wrap you up at the highest level.
Pure instinct and a feel for the hot breath on your neck is what he's looking for, just needs to get his spidey senses a little tinglier.

The more time he gets on-ball at BH the greater his situational awareness will grow, the more confidence he will gain to be a little 'burst'ier' before disposing, and the more natural he'll look as a quality mid.

The vid posted above is a nice sniff of what he can look like, and I personally think he's absolute quality.
Has all the ability and physical development required to be in the team right now, just put him in at the right minute and he'll grab it I reckon.

 

[Mississippi]

Id like him to build towards becoming a Gulden-lite.

Can he get there?

Jeepers, that’s a big ask.
Gulden’s one of the best mids in the AFL.
Ward is running around for Box Hill.

I’d like Mitch Lewis to be another Jason Dunstall, but I’m not overly optimistic.

Ward’s got a long way to go. He’s playing, at best, good servicable footy and that’s mainly in the VFL. He’s not impacting a game and is getting a lot of dinky possessions. I thought he spent a lot of time at the stoppages against a very weak Essendon side being where the ball wasn’t.

Posters have said - yep Essendon was weak but Ward spent a lot of time on Setterfield. Well Setterfield had 29 possessions, kicked 2 goals and was far more influential around the packs - and is probably in a strong Essendon senior side this week.

The coaches seem to be indicating to Josh that, right now, he’s not AFL standard.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Jeepers, that’s a big ask.
Gulden’s one of the best mids in the AFL.
Ward is running around for Box Hill.

I’d like Mitch Lewis to be another Jason Dunstall, but I’m not overly optimistic.

Ward’s got a long way to go. He’s playing, at best, good servicable footy and that’s mainly in the VFL. He’s not impacting a game and is getting a lot of dinky possessions. I thought he spent a lot of time at the stoppages against a very weak Essendon side being where the ball wasn’t.

Posters have said - yep Essendon was weak but Ward spent a lot of time on Setterfield. Well Setterfield had 29 possessions, kicked 2 goals and was far more influential around the packs - and is probably in a strong Essendon senior side this week.

The coaches seem to be indicating to Josh that, right now, he’s not AFL standard.

Not really.
Gulden is a star, Ward I’m quite confident will become one.

Lewis and Dunstall are irrelevant, Dunstall is the size of Jai Newcombe.

At best good serviceable VFL level football? Quite glad you’re here spewing this garbage and not in charge. Dinky possessions hahaha, and not impacting games? Do you watch VFL, ever? Maybe try it.

You are allowed to have an opinion but when it’s this laughable it’s going to catch the wrong attention and your opinion is well, not much relevant.

Setterfield was good, and is a solid afl midfielder. Shiel played too and Hately is strong VFL standard wise. Ward was the best midfielder on the ground and by a fair way. Possessions, damage, impact, class, all of it.

No they seem to indicate he needs to work on a certain aspect of his game to catapult himself from being pretty good or good (B) to an A grader, which is craft and he’s doing it. He’s also likely being told to simplify his game as he’s very meticulous in his planning which means he doesn’t play instinct footy sometimes. IF Hawthorn needed him at AFL level and weren’t worried about developing him into an elite level player he’d be playing good footy still, but development first.

 

[Mississippi]

Read your posts.
Your over-intellectualising in your numerous daily posts about Ward’s game and mental state is absurd. You must be related to him.

I think you were one of the posters, before Josh was dropped, and when other posters were saying his game wasn’t AFL standard, that it was ridiculous to suggest that he would be demoted to the VFL?

My comment about him “playing servicable VFL footy” draws you to say I’m “spewing garbage”??
Your overreaction is also absurd - and childish.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Read your posts.
Your over-intellectualising in your numerous daily posts about Ward’s game and mental state is absurd. You must be related to him.

I think you were one of the posters, before Josh was dropped, and when other posters were saying his game wasn’t AFL standard, that it was ridiculous to suggest that he would be demoted to the VFL?

My comment about him “playing servicable VFL footy” draws you to say I’m “spewing garbage”??
Your overreaction is also absurd - and childish.

Simply replying to poor observation.

From watching him play at all 3 levels (AFL, VFL & U18). Aswell as hawks insiders talking to him during the pre season even further solidifying his meticulous and tedious natures, I’ve built a solid opinion and backed by facts.

I believe he was dropped from the Gold Coast loss first and that was when I said it’s not really about him and more the performance as a team. Playing as a winger you’re almost useless in thrashings like that and if your midfielders can’t win the ball you won’t be receiving it.

The second time was against the Dogs, where he played off half forward, hell he lined up at CHF first bounce. Which makes it tough as someone who wouldn’t of played that role.

But the first time in particular it was quite easy to just drop him over the other underperformed players which was the case, again it’s a no man’s land on the wing some days.

You said and I will quote it.

Ward’s got a long way to go. He’s playing, at best, good servicable footy and that’s mainly in the VFL. He’s not impacting a game and is getting a lot of dinky possessions.

Ward does not have “a long way to go” presuming this is about him playing AFL? If so laughable, if in regards to him reaching his high level potential, perhaps but it isn’t linear.

Good serviceable footy at mainly VFL level is a poor take considering he’d played good serviceable footy at AFL level more often than not the last 2 seasons and has been box hills best most weeks working on his game. “Good serviceable footy” is grossly understating how good he’s been at VFL level. Saying he’s not impacting the game and getting junk or cheap possessions is indeed spewing garbage.

Not childish nor an overreaction.

Might I add he’s also 20..

 

[The Chad and I]

Ward is a neat kick but he doesn't have the same penetration or vision that Gulden has.

Ward's best weapon that I saw as a junior (outside of his relentless running power) is his ability to quickly spot the right decision (especially in tight spaces) and execute ball in hand. That's where he should be trying to separate himself.

We don't need him to nail the Harlem Globetrotter Hollywood passes like Gulden can. We have Frenchy for that.

I'm happier for Ward to nail the 35 metre spot up kick 15 times a game and set up others to do the heavy lifting on offense.

Link-up, distribution and gut running midfielder.
Essentially a Gaff with a bit more inside grunt.

Difficult to understand why we are sending him to Box Hill to work on his stoppage/clearance stff when he is not even asked to perform those duties at senior level, and it will only ever be 15% of his value, if that.

He will never be the inside grunt like Sewell, Worpel, Nash.

 

[Stard Picket]

He plays inside mid and we are totally stacked in that area. Behind Worps, Newc and Nash he will get his chance just needs to get really consistent at Boxhill for now.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Link-up, distribution and gut running midfielder.
Essentially a Gaff with a bit more inside grunt.

Difficult to understand why we are sending him to Box Hill to work on his stoppage/clearance stff when he is not even asked to perform those duties at senior level, and it will only ever be 15% of his value, if that.

He will never be the inside grunt like Sewell, Worpel, Nash.

Gaff was a gun but he’s quite literally Wards floor as a player. As a wingman.

Edit: I believe Wards floor is as a high level winger if he can’t make it on the inside (doubt he won’t make it on the inside) don’t wanna discredit how good Gaff was. Ward as a high accumulating, link up winger with a pretty good inside game is his floor, and I feel that describes the “type” of player Gaff was, hard working, high accumulation, death by a thousand cuts, with a pretty good inside game.

Because it’s an improvement and it is clearly the role he’s best at (hybrid on baller) and will need to get better at to reach an A Grade + level.

No one can say he won’t, you don’t have a crystal ball but that’s not what he’ll end up as a midfielder, he’s again a hybrid type inside/outside classy midfielder.

He plays inside mid and we are totally stacked in that area. Behind Worps, Newc and Nash he will get his chance just needs to get really consistent at Boxhill for now.

Definitely important he keeps turning up week in week out and performing at high levels at box hill which he has been, he’ll get an opportunity and take it and that’ll be the end of it. Until then he continues to work on his game and producing at high levels.

 

[Hot Cheese Rioli]

Dewyyyyy I really really hope you're right about Ward. It would be incredible for this team if he gets anywhere near A grade. I must admit, I have some doubts creeping in, but I think that's just impatience.

Be interested to know your brief thoughts on DGB's trajectory also (maybe in the DGB thread if you can be bothered sharing). He's the other one that if he comes good, we are laughing!

 

[Slysh]

Gaff was a gun but he’s quite literally Wards floor as a player. As a wingman.

Because it’s an improvement and it is clearly the role he’s best at (hybrid on baller) and will need to get better at to reach an A Grade + level.

No one can say he won’t, you don’t have a crystal ball but that’s not what he’ll end up as a midfielder, he’s again a hybrid type inside/outside classy midfielder.



Definitely important he keeps turning up week in week out and performing at high levels at box hill which he has been, he’ll get an opportunity and take it and that’ll be the end of it. Until then he continues to work on his game and producing at high levels.

You can't keep laughing at people and claiming they don't watch Ward when they disagree with you and then say his floor is Andrew Gaff as a player... I can tell you now that is a long way above his floor.

It is fine that you rate him, he is so young i wouldn't rule out anything from him. But he still has a long way to go in his development and nothing is guaranteed.