List Mgmt. 2019 Trade Thread - Part II

[plugger66]

so you would turn down getting a guy who actually nominates us who has oodles of talent to be something special who has actually shown this in the AFL against quality AFL opponents for the sake of two picks that could turn out to be duds ??

What if they want 2 first 5 picks. Of course you can turn anything down especially if it’s likely we get the same player for less the following year.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Well we are all guessing so I will guess for a very good mid.

we are not guessing we are discussing a scenario where Ben King nominates St Kilda as his prefered club in that situation you turn him down do you ??

 

[MOLTEN GANGLANDS]

Why would we get him on the cheap?

He's a number 6 pick that has exceeded expectations for a KPP in his first year.

because if he wants to leave, he's a young kid, says he's unhappy up there, gold coast aren't going to play too 'hard ball'. Especially given that no one thinks they should stealing away young victorian players to play in the middle of no where as it is.

'Cheap' for me is a future first

 

[Snailspace13]

This feels like the Lachie Weller stuff all over again.

“Let’s get him this year even though he’s under contract.”

“No, he and Mav have a strong bond. Wait till next year.”

Lachie Weller: I’ll go play for the Suns, thanks.

Not saying Ben King won’t come to us but I refuse to get my hopes up until he nominates us. Once bitten twice shy I suppose.

Ben Kings next AFL team will be 100% St.Kilda

 

[triggering bro]

No he won’t be the best mid tgen but he could be a bloody good third or fourth mid.

His go might be spending more time in the forward line switching with Gresham. Similar to what’s happened with GAJ.

 

[plugger66]

we are not guessing we are discussing a scenario where Ben King nominates St Kilda as his prefered club in that situation you turn him down do you ??

Well I’m suggesting he won’t so it’s a guess. And I’ve given my response to that.

 

[atlaser]

its not about targeting King ... we certainly would see targeting King as the priority but if he says he wants to come you go get him you dont sit on your hands hoping maybe Brayshaw would/could/maybe consider coming to us..

My point is, King is at the moment as likely a prospect of being at the saints next year as Brayshaw. I.e. very slim, unless you are close to him and have different or better mail. So unless something changes that, I would prefer to go after players like Brayshaw over players like King, the former are a more urgent need

 

[Gosaints12]

So how do we get Crouch and Hill? Are we giving up on them for Bing?

No, step one spilt our first for GWS two first

Trade one:
Pick 12 and Acres to Freo for Hill and Darcy

Trade two:
Dustan and Pick 16 for Crouch and pick 29

Trade three:
Steven and pick 69 for Pick 23, Parfitt and Constable

Trade four;
Pick 29 for Greenwood

Trade 5:
Carsile and 23 for Pick 9 and 45

Trade 6:
Ross and a furture 1st to Freo for 7 and a furture 1st

Trade 7:
King and Martin to STK for 7 and 9

You’re Welcome

 

[Joffaboy]

we are not guessing we are discussing a scenario where Ben King nominates St Kilda as his prefered club in that situation you turn him down do you ??

I agree with P66 in the sense that if GC demanded two top 5 picks.

We say to Ben , we tried but they are being unreasonable. Ben would hold the GC to blame and almost certainly would walk after 2020

 

[Virgin Dog]

No way you'd turn down King if he wanted to come to the Saints, regardless of how many talls you guys have. If there's concern over too many talls in the same forward line, play Ben down back and get rid of Carlisle. If you want both to be forwards, get rid of Bruce or Membrey (probably Bruce). Both of those situations go a long way towards paying for Ben in the first place, while also allowing a pair of potentially generational talents to play together, instead of passing him off so you can instead bring in a run of the mill mid that features at least 10 times in every draft

 

[mighty_sainters]

Agree with most that there’s no way Gold Coast are letting Ben King go this year, we are better off waiting the following year and even start stockpiling draft picks for a trade.

What I would 100% put all our time and effort into more than anyone else is Brad Hill. Since ballsing up our Andrew Lovett trade I’ve wanted nothing more than a speedy winger and at the age of 26 he would suit us perfectly for where we are at. Stephen Hill would be a bonus if we could package the two up together but if anyone is thinking he’s an A grader still then I would try and water down your expectation. Great to have and definitely a place for him in the 22 but won’t be anything close to what Brad will offer.

 

[Snailspace13]

exactly ... who cares how we get quality in the list as long as we get it ... people get all bent out of shape over draft picks but drafting is more of a gamble than trading ever is

Use our 1st Rounder and get the best
possible Mid in the Trade period along with FA players.
Biggy Nuoyn and our Father Son picks can be the latter picks.
Only need to use 3 picks in Draft i think,

 

[plugger66]

No way you'd turn down King if he wanted to come to the Saints, regardless of how many talls you guys have. If there's concern over too many talls in the same forward line, play Ben down back and get rid of Carlisle. If you want both to be forwards, get rid of Bruce or Membrey (probably Bruce). Both of those situations go a long way towards paying for Ben in the first place, while also allowing a pair of potentially generational talents to play together, instead of passing him off so you can instead bring in a run of the mill mid that features at least 10 times in every draft

Obviously if you say we are getting a run of the mill mid you take king but what if you would it and say you get a star mid like bont. And what if you say you have a poor midfield so the backs are already under pressure and the forwards can’t reach full potential due to a crap midfield.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

yeah so why would you try and fix that by trying different talls? Why not address the probelm directly by getting better midfielders? Any bunch of gypsies can get it inside 50 at an ok rate, what makes good sides great is turning that into shots on goal instead of turnovers. The biggest catalyst on making that jump is usually the quality/development of your midfield, not the talls. Something has to change in the make-up of that group from its current state to make the whole team finals quality, just not good enough at the moment

You can't peg your hopes on winning games on your backs and forwards being so good that they are able to clean up the ordinary mids' mess by taking 20 contested marks per game. not a winning strategy.

again im not saying we dont look to improve the midfield ... that certainly is the main aim to target... but as we are talking hypothetically if King wants to come to us then do you turn him down just because we have a weak midfield ? what happens if you turn him down but no better midfielder comes around ??

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

What if they want 2 first 5 picks. Of course you can turn anything down especially if it’s likely we get the same player for less the following year.

how is it for less the next year ? if he comes out and kicks 40 goals the next year and leads their B&F it will cost more ... obviously we cant pay what we dont have but if we can pay we will pay and we will get him in .. Gold Coast will go hard and expect a in their favor trade (as you would expect) but they wont ask for something we can give

 

[mightymalaka]

No way you'd turn down King if he wanted to come to the Saints, regardless of how many talls you guys have. If there's concern over too many talls in the same forward line, play Ben down back and get rid of Carlisle. If you want both to be forwards, get rid of Bruce or Membrey (probably Bruce). Both of those situations go a long way towards paying for Ben in the first place, while also allowing a pair of potentially generational talents to play together, instead of passing him off so you can instead bring in a run of the mill mid that features at least 10 times in every draft

Well with the possible trades done for Carlisle and Steven, this may well present us with the opportunity to snag Ben this year!
And still be able to get a quality mid in! He looks bloody good from what i have seen of him this year does Ben
Plus he will always be good to punch one of our mids right smack in the face if they are underperforming!

I like the cut of his jib! So if he is desperate to return home this year and we can still address our need for midfield class
Then sure why not, get him in! Something tells me our next premiership tilt will be built around the Bing and Ming show!

The twin towers it is then!
What could possibly go wrong?

 

[bird_man]

because if he wants to leave, he's a young kid, says he's unhappy up there, gold coast aren't going to play too 'hard ball'. Especially given that no one thinks they should stealing away young victorian players to play in the middle of no where as it is.

'Cheap' for me is a future first

Bit like the Giants traded Boyd for cheap?

They are a struggling club, they have no reason to be doing us favours. He looks like an absolute gun. If we want him we'll have to pay up.

He went 6 in what looks like one a of the strongest drafts we've seen and he's more than living up to that. Next years pick could be anywhere and the draft could be no where near as strong.

I think it's wishful thinking more than anything.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

Well I’m suggesting he won’t so it’s a guess. And I’ve given my response to that.

then dont discuss it ... im talking in a situation where Ben chooses us thats not saying he will thats not saying any of it will happen but in a hypothetical situation if he nominates us you make it happen ... just like if in the unlikely chance Dusty wants to come play for us you dont fap about you make it friggin happen

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

My point is, King is at the moment as likely a prospect of being at the saints next year as Brayshaw. I.e. very slim, unless you are close to him and have different or better mail. So unless something changes that, I would prefer to go after players like Brayshaw over players like King, the former are a more urgent need

we could easily be enquiring about both .. in fact i hope to hell the team are enquiring about multiple players from multiple clubs for a far range of positions ... we cant be single focused on one target otherwise you end up with an empty basket

 

[stfan]

Trade three:
Steven and pick 69 for Pick 23, Parfitt and Constable

All of your trades were way in our favour, but this one is particularly fanciful.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

No, step one spilt our first for GWS two first

Trade one:
Pick 12 and Acres to Freo for Hill and Darcy

Trade two:
Dustan and Pick 16 for Crouch and pick 29

Trade three:
Steven and pick 69 for Pick 23, Parfitt and Constable

Trade four;
Pick 29 for Greenwood

Trade 5:
Carsile and 23 for Pick 9 and 45

Trade 6:
Ross and a furture 1st to Freo for 7 and a furture 1st

Trade 7:
King and Martin to STK for 7 and 9

You’re Welcome

that is some fine fantasy right there

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

I agree with P66 in the sense that if GC demanded two top 5 picks.

We say to Ben , we tried but they are being unreasonable. Ben would hold the GC to blame and almost certainly would walk after 2020

exactly the case ... we can only trade with what we have .. if GC dont accept that then its on them and they look the bad guy ... but if GC say they want our first this year and next years then you say yep sure and get the deal done

 

[VDS66]

I like this but the problem is they need outside speed and so do we so I'm not sure what we can offer. Pick ~5 - 7 is too much imo.

they would use their first or ours for Hill and we'd ask for their 2nd.

 

[VDS66]

What are the differences between Max and Ben King that made Max King go slightly higher in the draft? Ben has looked pretty impressive so far.

Max is better looking...

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Would do our pick for Brayshaw in an instant tbh. Very small chance of anyone that good being available at that point in the draft and if there is, you are better off trading down to maximise the chance of snagging him, whoever he turns out to be.

Melbourne likely say no for a pick 6 straight swap, but that's far better value for a bigger (and better proved) need - quality mid - than King, who the suns will hold on a lot tighter than Brayshaw if there's any smoke. Suspect there isnt any, but regardless, the club should be targeting types such as Brayshaw over King. I know it's a fluffy story that they are twins and therefore there is a chance that a player would actually request to be at the Saints, but the chance of a trade happening this offseason is very low, even if he requests one, which he hasn't. There would be a dozen current potential better options than King at this stage, taking into account that the biggest indication of him wanting to leave is no more significant than him having a twin at a different club.

Brayshaw has been very average this season. He’s a bit of a ball butcher from the games I’ve watched.

It may be an outlier & his 2018 is his real standard...

Or 2018 was the one out of the box.

No way known I’d give up pick 5 straight for him.


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