Ultimate Glory 2023 Trade speculation and Shinbeggars discussion

[DrAbs]

Read this below... to understand the worth of us trading into the draft

Oh oops I missed that. Well, I kinda agree with that point and I'll just add the fact that we still have a load of young players on our list that are still developing, so yes, missing out on a F1 could be bad (especially if it's top 3) but we still have a lot of talent we have on the list to actually try and develop further along with whoever we get this year.

 

[TheFourPillars]

Trading into the draft is ok but going to be very hard to do when our F2 is now linked to Collingwood and worth very little. While our F1 has a lot more value than trading in for a pick after 12. Even then I’d want extra if we are going to do that.

Pick 12 was just arbitrary pick mate

 

[Alite]

I don't see the ramifications of taking O'Sullivan over McCabe.

These are the same people who said take O'Sullivan at Pick 7 btw. Now they'd take McCabe over him

Make up your mind mate

My mistake, while you were writing about O’Sullivan for some reason I was thinking you were talking about Ollie Murphy.

 

[Dewnior]

Bonner not Bonar is one of a couple of DFA's we've spoken to.

If we wanted to pick him up as a DFA, I imagine it would be better to after the draft so as not to reduce the number of picks we can use in the draft.

 

[Dewnior]

I can just imagine what would happen on this board if Watson was available at 4 and we swapped for 6 & 11 then Dogs take him at 5.

If we were to trade 4, it would most likely be to a club who wants Watson, so Dogs miss out.

 

[ShoveYourCOLA]

Is trading our F1 for Pick 11 worth it?

 

[Thorgils]

I can just imagine what would happen on this board if Watson was available at 4 and we swapped for 6 & 11 then Dogs take him at 5.

Watson or not, swapping our highest pick since 2005 knowing that the gap in talent between 5-6 is significant?

Can you blame them?

 

[HomerJayS]

The last time we had 3 first round picks they all became premiership players. (I can assure you lightning does strike twice!).

 

[Braidz]

Maybe. Or perhaps we haven’t gone to the draft hard enough yet in terms of volume and we should be open to ways to improve our draft hand this year and next.
So far we have 5 top 30 picks in the last 2 years. 2 pick 7s and 26 (natural ladder position) a r2 upgrade (27-18 for weddle) and an extra r2 (butler). It’s marginally ahead on volume against the natural draft but looks good in quality (we all know they can pick well).
My concern is simply volume of high end talent coming in. Around us looking at sides missing finals
the eagles get Reid, north have 5 first rounders this year alone on top of 9 in the last 3 years, suns get 4 top 30 academy, freo have 3 future firsts, crows have 2 firsts and an early second, dons add free agents and keep picks, dogs have same draft as us coming up (top 5 plus FS first round). I get the draft isn’t the only tool but in rebuild it’s the primary tool and the comparison to those around us concerns me and I don’t want to end up mid table for a decade as most rebuilding clubs have done.

No point having volume if this years draft drops off significantly after the first 7-10 picks. That’s how you get list cloggers. We need to take someone elite at our first pick.
North have extra picks because they are North. A rabble. We are still significantly better than them. Freo traded out of this draft and have picks next year. Most likely late first rounders. Dons spent a truck load of money on very average players.
So far we’ve done the right thing and stuck to the plan. Trading down does nothing

 

[Thorgils]

The last time we had 3 first round picks they all became premiership players. (I can assure you lightning does strike twice!).

To be fair, picks 2, 5 and 7 is pretty hard to mess up.

But if someone wants to trade that for pick 4 I can live with that.

 

[Noel Gallagher]

To be fair, picks 2, 5 and 7 is pretty hard to mess up.

But if someone wants to trade that for pick 4 I can live with that.

Really ? Richmond managed to miss both Roughead and Franklin with picks 1&3 in same draft - they completely botched their other earlier picks in the same draft and their pick 8 the following year

 

[Steven Tyler]

I’m starting to think we should take the best KPD’s we can get. (If we can’t trade for Reid then) Curtin/O’Sullivan and McCabe + best tall defender available and our 3rd pick (and rookie Dear). If we can’t get a decent KPD then KPF at our 3rd pick.

We’re pretty loaded with mids (and forwards with recent trades). We’re pretty desperate to get a A grade KPD. Let’s see if we can find one in this draft. If one (or more) make it we’re well on the way to another premiership list.

Edit: So Demons 6 + 11 for our 1st would get us 3 top 20 KPDs (inc McCabe) plus Dear. Thoughts?

Our forward line is pus
Take either Duursma or Watson at 5

 

[Thorgils]

Really ? Richmond managed to miss both Roughead and Franklin with picks 1&3 in same draft - they completely botched their other earlier picks in the same draft and their pick 8 the following year

They would have snapped up Roughead with their next pick if we didn’t grab him, but any recruiter that refused to draft Buddy because he had “too much confidence” got what they deserve.

 

[hawk65]

I've read that the bulldogs moved up the draft with the intent to draft Watson. So if we take hime at 4, do we offer our F1 to them for 5 and maybe get Dursma/McKercher/Curtain/Caddy?

 

[KeeperLeaguer]

Watson or not, swapping our highest pick since 2005 knowing that the gap in talent between 5-6 is significant?

Can you blame them?

Oh not for a second but this is what amuses me here ... it's been said repeatedly that we're not interested in downgrading four. Mark has said it, Rob has said as much. People here have said it, yet there's some still going on about the Dees & the Dogs and trade scenarios that would be better.

This draft has widely been labelled the 'super six' draft. Reid, Watson, McKercher, Walter, Curtin & Duursma are seen as clear standouts. That's not to say others like Read, Caddy, Sanders, O'Sullivan etc wont be stars but those first six are seen as pretty-much guaranteed A-graders.
We know this, every club knows this. That's why we wont downgrade our pick and that's why clubs behind us (and North & WC) continually ask the question. For the same reason we'll keep talking to WC & North until draft day ... just in case.

And although you can never say anything with 100% certainty in the draft, we're 99% certain WC wont downgrade to us and 99% North wont either for the same reason we're 99% certain we wont downgrade to Dogs, Dees or others.

 

[H00t]

Pick 12 was just arbitrary pick mate

I know it was arbitrary. I was more mentioning we have very little in future picks to trade into this draft if there is someone we want.

Unlike last year where we had a lot of picks to play with.

Even if someone we like slides, I can’t see it happening outside of an overpay of our future first.

 

[TheFourPillars]

I know it was arbitrary. I was more mentioning we have very little in future picks to trade into this draft if there is someone we want.

Unlike last year where we had a lot of picks to play with.

Even if someone we like slides, I can’t see it happening outside of an overpay of our future first.

If we rate that player we will pay the price like we did for weddle

 

[DrAbs]

My mistake, while you were writing about O’Sullivan for some reason I was thinking you were talking about Ollie Murphy.

Haha all good. We're getting McCabe so Ollie Murphy wouldn't make sense to pursue.

 

[killerspud]

Really ? Richmond managed to miss both Roughead and Franklin with picks 1&3 in same draft - they completely botched their other earlier picks in the same draft and their pick 8 the following year

Richmond had picks 1 and 4 - the Dogs took Ryan Griffen with pick 3

 

[DrAbs]

Watson or not, swapping our highest pick since 2005 knowing that the gap in talent between 5-6 is significant?

Can you blame them?

It's not an easy one if you think about it.

If we do the Pick 4 slide to Pick 6 + 11 (will end up being Pick 7 + Pick 13/14), essentially we'll get one of Curtin (i.e. if Dees take Watson at 5 & Dogs take Sanders at 6) OR Sanders (i.e. if Dees take Curtin at 5 & Dog take Watson at 6). So we do kind of come out with one high end prospect even if we slide down two spots?

Then the topper is Pick 13 or 14 (whichever it is), where we'll be able to get one of Wilson, Tholstrup, Collard, Hardeman, Murphy.

 

[killerspud]

I’m starting to think we should take the best KPD’s we can get. (If we can’t trade for Reid then) Curtin/O’Sullivan and McCabe + best tall defender available and our 3rd pick (and rookie Dear). If we can’t get a decent KPD then KPF at our 3rd pick.

We’re pretty loaded with mids (and forwards with recent trades). We’re pretty desperate to get a A grade KPD. Let’s see if we can find one in this draft. If one (or more) make it we’re well on the way to another premiership list.

Edit: So Demons 6 + 11 for our 1st would get us 3 top 20 KPDs (inc McCabe) plus Dear. Thoughts?

McCabe and Dear to go with the developing Serong, DGB, and Blank down back and Lewis, Chol, Gunston and Ramsden up forward

The greater need is for an exciting small forward and Watson fits that bill (yeah I know Ginnivan but I'm not sold)

I don't think you give up pick 4 unless its to get better.

 

[Walshawk]

The last time we had 3 first round picks they all became premiership players. (I can assure you lightning does strike twice!).

We had four in 2005. Plus 22. All besides BIrchall were poor selections.

 

[CHUBBSS]

Anyone else still over the moon we never got Mackay, biggest win of the trade period

 

[hawkinoz]

It's not an easy one if you think about it.

If we do the Pick 4 slide to Pick 6 + 11 (will end up being Pick 7 + Pick 13/14), essentially we'll get one of Curtin (i.e. if Dees take Watson at 5 & Dogs take Sanders at 6) OR Sanders (i.e. if Dees take Curtin at 5 & Dog take Watson at 6). So we do kind of come out with one high end prospect even if we slide down two spots?

Then the topper is Pick 13 or 14 (whichever it is), where we'll be able to get one of Wilson, Tholstrup, Collard, Hardeman, Murphy.

As much as we talk about 4 for 6+11, I am not sure the Dees will do it. They don't seem interested to do it for 3 from North or the below 3 club deal for pick 1 that seems right but only Eagles seem keen.

WCE 1 <-> 2+6
Melb 6+11 <-> 3
Norf 2+3 <-> 1+11

Eagles won't add their 23 as there are some WA prospects in that range. Not sure if their F2 will tilt. If any deal happens for pick 1 better than our 4+F1 offer, this seems to be the one.

So quite likely North or Eagles are the ones holding pick 6 by the start of draft night. One of them may trade pick 6 for our F1 which I think is overs.

Sleepy Mark has just given an update and said

McKenzie said the club was eager to retain its top selection.

“At the moment we’re planning to keep that pick – we’ll finalise our order and then you can do your ‘what if’s’ about what can happen with trading picks and things,” McKenzie said.

“There is still more interviews, psych analysis, reference checks and the likes to do, especially at this point of the year.”

McKenzie on Hawthorn’s draft intentions

Targeting top-end talent over positional needs at the pointy end of the national draft is set to be Hawthorn's priority in this year's selections, according to club’s National List and Recruiting Manager Mark McKenzie.

www.hawthornfc.com.au

 

[kenneje]

I want the Wiz. We need some magic up forward. Would LOVE to watch him live at the G on a Friday night.