Rumour 2024 Hypothetical trade and FA Thread

[smish]

We need to look after the club. You need a deep squad to win flags.

I agree, but how deep does it need to be before highly talented players get sick of playing twos?

Ward is behind Nash, Worpel, Newcombe, Day, Mackenzie, and arguably Hustwaite for mid rotations. Add Smith if he wants to join and Moore also runs through there. There's also a chance we have a crack at LDU next year with the Dingley project and his connection with the Mornington Peninsula.

Unless Worpel leaves end of next year I think he's really going to struggle to break in the side unless there's injuries. I also think if anyone is going to displace Nash it will be Hustwaite.

He might spend years in and out of the side, relying on injuries to get a run, where he could walk into midfield at Geelong, Adelaide, St Kilda, Richmond, even Collingwood and the Dogs in a couple of years.

As Tops said, it's a list management issue and it's not fair on the kid. The club needs to be pragmatic about this.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I agree, but how deep does it need to be before highly talented players get sick of playing twos?

Ward is behind Nash, Worpel, Newcombe, Day, Mackenzie, and arguably Hustwaite for mid rotations. Add Smith if he wants to join and Moore also runs through there. There's also a chance we have a crack at LDU next year with the Dingley project and his connection with the Mornington Peninsula.

Unless Worpel leaves end of next year I think he's really going to struggle to break in the side unless there's injuries. I also think if anyone is going to displace Nash it will be Hustwaite.

He might spend years in and out of the side, relying on injuries to get a run, where he could walk into midfield at Geelong, Adelaide, St Kilda, Richmond, even Collingwood in a couple of years.

As Tops said, it's a list management issue and it's not fair on the kid. The club needs to be pragmatic about this.

It’s not a list management issue at all.

He loves the club and he’ll back himself in to get into the side, just like every other player on the list or he won’t.

He’s 20 years old so let’s stop pretending that just because he’s not in the side now that he won’t be in the future, as that’s akin to the “we will never win/lose another game” meme.

 

[Brucie Buffer]

I agree, but how deep does it need to be before highly talented players get sick of playing twos?

Ward is behind Nash, Worpel, Newcombe, Day, Mackenzie, and arguably Hustwaite for mid rotations. Add Smith if he wants to join and Moore also runs through there. There's also a chance we have a crack at LDU next year with the Dingley project and his connection with the Mornington Peninsula.

Unless Worpel leaves end of next year I think he's really going to struggle to break in the side unless there's injuries. I also think if anyone is going to displace Nash it will be Hustwaite.

He might spend years in and out of the side, relying on injuries to get a run, where he could walk into midfield at Geelong, Adelaide, St Kilda, Richmond, even Collingwood and the Dogs in a couple of years.

As Tops said, it's a list management issue and it's not fair on the kid. The club needs to be pragmatic about this.

Could’ve stated the exact same argument for Meek last year. If he’s talented enough he will make the side. If he proves beyond doubt that he waay too good for that level in a couple of years and for what ever reason still can’t make the side, he will land us a better pick in a trade also.

 

[Hawkers Hero]

Ummm No is the answer. He is a 550-600k player.

I think people don't actually realise how much player salaries are going up and are stuck in a mid 2010s mindset

The cap was $10m in 2015, $13.5m in 2022 and will be $17.7m in 2025 with no change in list sizes. It will keep going up by around 5% per annum as well due to the new TV deal.

Based on a 40 man list, the average player will be on $442k each year. Given players earn around $150k for the first three years after the draft and rookies on less than that there will be around a quarter of your list on less than $200k a year. That puts the average at closer to $550k or $650k by the end of a 5yr deal

Perryman is a proven talent with more than 100 games experience clubs are trying to lure away from a club he is reportedly not unhappy at....he will be worth every bit of $800k per annum.

 

[Topiary]

Not sure if Perryman is worth 800k + but that's the number floating around. GWS is much lower , around 650k. Big gap in $.

Personally, he is worth $800k to our List. Offers or enhances flexibility AND depth in the List.

 

[smish]

It’s not a list management issue at all.

He loves the club and he’ll back himself in to get into the side, just like every other player on the list or he won’t.

He’s 20 years old so let’s stop pretending that just because he’s not in the side now that he won’t be in the future, as that’s akin to the “we will never win/lose another game” meme.

All the same, if we look at it pragmatically he is behind a few in the pecking order and may be pushed back again next year. I think that's a valid concern.

Again, I want him to make it, but I remain concerned about his ability to break into our midfield.

 

[smish]

Could’ve stated the exact same argument for Meek last year. If he’s talented enough he will make the side. If he proves beyond doubt that he waay too good for that level in a couple of years and for what ever reason still can’t make the side, he will land us a better pick in a trade also.

Meek was competing against one other player - a ruckman who frankly, was coming from a long way back.

I think it's a false equivalence to compare this to competing with three or four other highly rated young players.

 

[nelk boys]

All the same, if we look at it pragmatically he is behind a few in the pecking order and may be pushed back again next year. I think that's a valid concern.

Again, I want him to make it, but I remain concerned about his ability to break into our midfield.

He's played less than 50 games of AFL/VFL football, let's just let him improve his craft.

If he's still playing VFL in 2026, then this conversation becomes more valid. If we want to win premierships we need a deep midfield. If he's playing VFL, it's a positive sign for how strong our midfield is becoming. I see this as a positive.

The club knows his value and the potential player he can become.

 

[TylerDurden]

Personally, he is worth $800k to our List. Offers or enhances flexibility AND depth in the List.

Agree. Pay it and lock him in.

 

[TylerDurden]

Claz to the Cats is doing the rounds.

Perhaps they already know Baz is coming to us.

 

[smish]

Claz to the Cats is doing the rounds.

Perhaps they already know Baz is coming to us.

I've heard that too.

Tricky trade to value with all the baggage he carries. Could MFC get a first and future first?

 

[PenAndPaper]

Claz to the Cats is doing the rounds.

Perhaps they already know Baz is coming to us.

Was very much on from last year as well, apparently was quite close to happening but just the trade value was off between the two.

 

[Slysh]

I've heard that too.

Tricky trade to value with all the baggage he carries. Could MFC get a first and future first?

His value is much lower than that now I think

 

[wahawk]

Meek was competing against one other player - a ruckman who frankly, was coming from a long way back.

I think it's a false equivalence to compare this to competing with three or four other highly rated young players.

Meek was competing with 1 other player for the only spot in team either of them can play.

Hes competing with 6/7 players for 1 of 4/5 positions.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

All the same, if we look at it pragmatically he is behind a few in the pecking order and may be pushed back again next year. I think that's a valid concern.

Again, I want him to make it, but I remain concerned about his ability to break into our midfield.

He’s behind a few IN THIS MOMENT, just like Finn, Watson and others.
There is no need for pragmatism as you call it, because there is no issue.

We are in the mode of collecting talent and adding to the list to build depth, because depth wins flags.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

His value is much lower than that now I think

even beyond his extracurricular activities his on-field performance has been fairly mediocre this season

 

[Brucie Buffer]

Meek was competing against one other player - a ruckman who frankly, was coming from a long way back.

I think it's a false equivalence to compare this to competing with three or four other highly rated young players.

Not at all, how many positions can a midfielder play as possible options?
Three midfield positions, five with bench rotations, 2 wings and four flanks.
Thats 11 possibilities that Wards profile and skill set can adapt to if he is good enough.
I reckon that’s an easier path than Meeks opportunities.

 

[Hawkspot]

I think people don't actually realise how much player salaries are going up and are stuck in a mid 2010s mindset

The cap was $10m in 2015, $13.5m in 2022 and will be $17.7m in 2025 with no change in list sizes. It will keep going up by around 5% per annum as well due to the new TV deal.

Based on a 40 man list, the average player will be on $442k each year. Given players earn around $150k for the first three years after the draft and rookies on less than that there will be around a quarter of your list on less than $200k a year. That puts the average at closer to $550k or $650k by the end of a 5yr deal

Perryman is a proven talent with more than 100 games experience clubs are trying to lure away from a club he is reportedly not unhappy at....he will be worth every bit of $800k per annum.

Just following up on this, the benefit of having so much cap space, as we do over the next couple of years, is that we can pay him more initially so it doesn’t kill us down the line.

If we signed him for 6 years averaging $800k, totals around $4.8m. We would likely knock half off in the first 2 years.

We then have a very good player in his peak on an average salary for 4 years while we’re competing to win flags.

Getting Perryman and/or Battle on $800k each will not stop us from signing other players in any way, I have no idea why anyone would be against signing immediate improvements to our team for nothing.

 

[Bugs1977]

Yeah he had a good game.

Would love to see him have a break out game in the seniors and give the fans some excitement for the future.

He actually reminds me a little of Rick Ladson with the way he moves, runs and receives with overlap etc.

I think he needs it probably more so for his own confidence. For some reason at AFL level he has just seemed a split second behind in mind. Reaction timing is something he can train to get faster at and I'm confident he will as long as he want's it bad enough.

 

[HoldingThe Ball]

Speaking of strange stuff, what on earth happened to Will Phillips?

Outstanding player at the Chargers - alongside Rowell and Anderson if you don't mind - and now looking to be delisted by all accounts.

What on earth happened to this former Pick 3 with such a reportedly high ceiling?

I know he had Glandular Fever, but that should be well and truly behind him surely.

The concensus on the Norf board is that he is unmotivated, unfit and really hasn't had a fair shot under Clarkson - not getting a run of games.

That does sound a bit familiar - Clarkson and his favourites - but delisting the guy seems a bit extreme.

That's the word though.

Not suggesting we pick him up, but this seems a stratospheric fall from grace for a guy touted as a genuine star mid at one point.

Thoughts?

 

[Bugs1977]

It’s not a list management issue at all.

He loves the club and he’ll back himself in to get into the side, just like every other player on the list or he won’t.

He’s 20 years old so let’s stop pretending that just because he’s not in the side now that he won’t be in the future, as that’s akin to the “we will never win/lose another game” meme.

I'll also add further that where Ward finds himself atm (the outside looking in) is exactly the same as where Meek was. The key for him like any player in the reserves is to just be ready for when your number is called and when it is take the opportunity with both hands and make it impossible for the selection committee to drop you back to the reserves. This time last year some in here were calling for us to trade Meek for whatever we could get.

 

[Lickmesocks]

I think he needs it probably more so for his own confidence. For some reason at AFL level he has just seemed a split second behind in mind. Reaction timing is something he can train to get faster at and I'm confident he will as long as he want's it bad enough.

Yep you have nailed it. Gets to the right spots but always a split second too long with the decision making or getting the ball moving on.

 

[number23]

Worps loves it at hawthorn and home is not that far away

If, and I say IF, Worpel was up for trade (he and the club agree), this is the year that you would do it. As a pre agent the club has more leverage. If he wants to leave for a better deal (club further up the ladder, house and land package..whatever) the club can do a trade. If he leaves as a RFA we are up to the mercy of the secret herbs and spices comp and no one wants that. If he was traded and the other club trades a first rounder, that could be used in trade for another player e.g. Bailey Smith who offers something different in our midfield ie pace and acceleration.

Not saying that it would happen but just doing a hypothetical...

 

[Lickmesocks]

He’s behind a few IN THIS MOMENT, just like Finn, Watson and others.
There is no need for pragmatism as you call it, because there is no issue.

We are in the mode of collecting talent and adding to the list to build depth, because depth wins flags.

People forget Shiels Hodge Sewell Lewis Hill Burgoyne Smith Rioli Mitchell and even a young Punky all played in our GF winning side to start our 3 peat and all at some stage could run through the middle for patches.

Anyone worrying that Ward may not break in or be given a chance in the middle need to relax.

 

[eldorado]

All the same, if we look at it pragmatically he is behind a few in the pecking order and may be pushed back again next year.

Or he may jump ahead of a few in the pecking order?

The future isn't written.

He was pick 6 for a reason, and only 20...we don't need to be hasty at all.