List Mgmt. 2024 List Management 📃

[teddy-hopkins]

I'd have thought that falls on SOS.

He obviously caused some of the tension that lead to him being sacked but it still should never have happened. What a way to thank a bloke who did what he did for the club - to tell him we're worried you're going to sabotage the upcoming draft/trade period.

Didn't work out well for Liddle either as he spent all his good will with the supporters (and board) in one shot. Made him the most sackable CEO in history - didn't last 12 months.

The whole thing was pathetic.

 

[BlueJet]

He obviously caused some of the tension that lead to him being sacked but it still should never have happened. What a way to thank a bloke who did what he did for the club - to tell him we're worried you're going to sabotage the upcoming draft/trade period.

Didn't work out well for Liddle either as he spent all his good will with the supporters (and board) in one shot. Made him the most sackable CEO in history - didn't last 12 months.

The whole thing was pathetic.

He did a good job but he also couldn't work with others, which ultimately made his position untenable.
It likely could have been navigated more effectively but not without SOS himself buying into it.

 

[teddy-hopkins]

SOS had natural draft selections of 1,1,3,3,5,19,19,21,21,23,37,37,39,39,41
And trade bait in Menzel, Bell, Gibbs, Henderson, Touhy and Yarran.
I think every list manager in the league could build an elite core from that.


I think SOS’s ability will be judged on the job he does at St Kilda. A side stuck in the middle without the top end picks he had at GWS and Carlton.

I'm not sure you've following my argument. SOS only had the picks to get in Curnow / McKay / etc. because of the strategy he pursued: trade out to get more picks in one clump - then only add players in that age bracket.

Culturally we still thought we were in the VFL era. Big Jack / we're Carlton heck the rest and all that. Trading out players to rebuild properly was beneath us.

That is the only reason we are where we are today. He convinced the club to move into the AFL era... finally.

 

[teddy-hopkins]

He did a good job but he also couldn't work with others, which ultimately made his position untenable.
It likely could have been navigated more effectively but not without SOS himself buying into it.

Yep - no argument at all there.

He had a falling out with GWS when they tried to trade high draft picks for Stevie J without his consent. Then Liddle tried to get in Brandon Ellis and Butler. And they offered more money to Eddie than what Simmo was on - without SOS's consent.

SOS is pretty rigid. Let me do my job without interference or sack me. Other list managers are a lot more flexible I guess. Although Wright walked out on Hawthorn when Clarko started running list management.

Regardless our CEO should never have put himself in a position where it looked like he was running a pseudo list management team without the List Manager involved. That is crazy - and is why he should have been fired when it all blew up. Agresta was running a white-ant campaign throughout and Liddle was too happy to play along.

 

[JustOneTime]

SOS had natural draft selections of 1,1,3,3,5,19,19,21,21,23,37,37,39,39,41
And trade bait in Menzel, Bell, Gibbs, Henderson, Touhy and Yarran.
I think every list manager in the league could build an elite core from that.


I think SOS’s ability will be judged on the job he does at St Kilda. A side stuck in the middle without the top end picks he had at GWS and Carlton.

Put that up against Hawthorn and their 3 flags. They had 2,3,5,6,6,7,12,14,16,18,21,22,24,26,29. Didnt they have trade bait in Hay?

They busted with Ellis (Dow), Thorpe (SPS), Dowler(Lob), Schoenmakers, Max Bailey (inj.), Thomas Murphy, Beau Muston, B Renouf. Max Little, and Whitecross wasn't much chop.

It's comparable i'd say. The key thing is the key position players drafted to Hawthorn that set them up.

 

[BlueJet]

Yep - no argument at all there.

He had a falling out with GWS when they tried to trade high draft picks for Stevie J without his consent. Then Liddle tried to get in Brandon Ellis and Butler. And they offered more money to Eddie than what Simmo was on - without SOS's consent.

SOS is pretty rigid. Let me do my job without interference or sack me. Other list managers are a lot more flexible I guess. Although Wright walked out on Hawthorn when Clarko started running list management.

Regardless our CEO should never have put himself in a position where it looked like he was running a pseudo list management team without the List Manager involved. That is crazy - and is why he should have been fired when it all blew up. Agresta was running a white-ant campaign throughout and Liddle was too happy to play along.

That's SOS's version of events.. which, if correct would have seen Liddle & Agresta (who was the LM) moved on instead of him.
Agresta asked Liddle to speak with Butler owing to an existing relationship there.

 

[DEliades]

I’d have a look at Caleb Daniel

35

Caleb Daniel

Age

27

Ht

171cm

Wt

72kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.3

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

19.5

4star

K

11.1

4star

HB

8.4

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

CL

1.0

3star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.2

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.2

2star

if we could get him on the cheap. Omitted again

 

[JustOneTime]

That's SOS's version of events.. which, if correct would have seen Liddle & Agresta moved on instead of him.
Agresta asked Liddle to speak with Butler owing to an existing relationship there.

It seems like this is common. Liddle had a contact from his time at the Tigers, you now see Austin tap up his personal connections at the doggies to get Young and Boyd for a win and a loss.

It's ok for austin has he is the list manager and is accountable if he does poorly. SoS was list manager so is accountable. Liddle is/was a twit; a twit that was trying to help...i'd give him that.

 

[JustOneTime]

I’d have a look at Caleb Daniel if we could get him on the cheap. Omitted again

Would make for better internal practice matches and give durdin/Motlop a chance to take contested marks.

Pass x 10.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Put that up against Hawthorn and their 3 flags. They had 2,3,5,6,6,7,12,14,16,18,21,22,24,26,29. Didnt they have trade bait in Hay?

They busted with Ellis (Dow), Thorpe (SPS), Dowler(Lob), Schoenmakers, Max Bailey (inj.), Thomas Murphy, Beau Muston, B Renouf. Max Little, and Whitecross wasn't much chop.

It's comparable i'd say. The key thing is the key position players drafted to Hawthorn that set them up.

They were built by about three list managers/recruiters so it’s hard to remember who got who in the door.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

I'm not sure you've following my argument. SOS only had the picks to get in Curnow / McKay / etc. because of the strategy he pursued: trade out to get more picks in one clump - then only add players in that age bracket.

Culturally we still thought we were in the VFL era. Big Jack / we're Carlton heck the rest and all that. Trading out players to rebuild properly was beneath us.

That is the only reason we are where we are today. He convinced the club to move into the AFL era... finally.

It’s simply bottoming out. We had done it before and created an elite core (not as good) but couldn’t finish the job off on that list build.

 

[BlueJet]

It seems like this is common. Liddle had a contact from his time at the Tigers, you now see Austin tap up his personal connections at the doggies to get Young and Boyd for a win and a loss.

It's ok for austin has he is the list manager and is accountable if he does poorly. SoS was list manager so is accountable. Liddle is/was a twit; a twit that was trying to help...i'd give him that.

Yep. I'm glad that rubbish is in the past & we're all pulling in the one direction.

 

[teddy-hopkins]

That's SOS's version of events.. which, if correct would have seen Liddle & Agresta (who was the LM) moved on instead of him.
Agresta asked Liddle to speak with Butler owing to an existing relationship there.

Not many think SOS is a liar. I'm not sure why Agresta is still there - but there is a reason he isn't List Manager now.

 

[JustOneTime]

They were built by about three list managers/recruiters so it’s hard to remember who got who in the door.

The key point is they had lots of fails between picks 2-29...lots. But picking Roughead and Franklin in the one draft 'made it possible' more than anything else. Those picks along with Rioli completed the hardest part of the jigsaw puzzle.

Whether you love or hate SoS or are middling towards him, we are heading towards a flag because of that KPP draft. Not so much the other drafts or picks.

 

[teddy-hopkins]

It’s simply bottoming out. We had done it before and created an elite core (not as good) but couldn’t finish the job off on that list build.

We bottomed out but never traded out. The key difference.
(Campo / Murphy / Allan / etc. weren't for significant gains)

 

[teddy-hopkins]

Put that up against Hawthorn and their 3 flags. They had 2,3,5,6,6,7,12,14,16,18,21,22,24,26,29. Didnt they have trade bait in Hay?

They busted with Ellis (Dow), Thorpe (SPS), Dowler(Lob), Schoenmakers, Max Bailey (inj.), Thomas Murphy, Beau Muston, B Renouf. Max Little, and Whitecross wasn't much chop.

It's comparable i'd say. The key thing is the key position players drafted to Hawthorn that set them up.

Hay, Nathan Thompson, Nick Holland, Croad, McPharlin, etc. They were really high profile key position players at the time.

 

[katmanblue]

that 2015 draft was magic for us.

Also TDK's draft year ran pretty deep. Some quality players before and after him but yes that Paddy Dow and LoB turned out to be big misses...

I've gotta say, I wanted Worpel instead at 30.

On SM-F946B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[JJBagger]

I’d have a look at Caleb Daniel if we could get him on the cheap. Omitted again

Wouldn’t make it in our best team. Don’t know why we would pick him up (or why he would come) just to play in the ressies

 

[Benaly28]

I’d have a look at Caleb Daniel

35

Caleb Daniel

Age

27

Ht

171cm

Wt

72kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.3

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

19.5

4star

K

11.1

4star

HB

8.4

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

CL

1.0

3star

D

16.4

4star

K

7.2

3star

HB

9.2

5star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.2

2star

if we could get him on the cheap. Omitted again

Where would he play?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[teddy-hopkins]

Wouldn’t make it in our best team. Don’t know why we would pick him up (or why he would come) just to play in the ressies

Daniel contracted for 2 more years on big money I think. Makes it tough.

 

[jpfalvo]

That first tall draft had a lot of misdirection picks with Schache, Aaron Francis, Sam Weiderman, and Hipwood.

We are now where we are because of Weitering, Curnow and Mckay. Just getting one of those wrong leaves us a big step behind. Mids are soo much easier to correct even though it's hard to go past the LoB/Dow and SPS picks.

I personally let off SoS on the Lob/Dow picks, not SPS. Lob came to the club and they would have asked him about dow or players he rated and he would have spun the story on Dow (his team mate). Tunnelled us towards those two players which is unfortunate (plus we needed speed for Cripps). The entire time Lob was with us, he said all the right things on camera about his weaknesses showing great insight on where he needed to improve. He just didn't show it at AFL level physicality... but his intelligence and words would have sold him as a correct choice. If he didnt come to the club, i doubt we choose him in the draft. I'm guessing just a situation that evolved form him spending time at the club pre-draft.

The comment on LOB is new intel to me.

Can you clarify your info here.
So basically your saying Lob training at the club pre draft, had an influence on SOS choosing Dow at pick 2 ?

We took Lob at pick 10, after we traded Gibbs to bring in that currency...



Sent from my SM-N981B using Tapatalk

 

[JoeyPBLUES]

Where would he play?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

The 2s

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

The key point is they had lots of fails between picks 2-29...lots. But picking Roughead and Franklin in the one draft 'made it possible' more than anything else. Those picks along with Rioli completed the hardest part of the jigsaw puzzle.

Whether you love or hate SoS or are middling towards him, we are heading towards a flag because of that KPP draft. Not so much the other drafts or picks.

Absolutely but I just think if you give any list manager that many high end picks and they will build a core good enough. Since 2016 probably a dozen sides have thought they were a chance to win it at some stage. All have strong core groups.
If we win the flag it will be off the back of those guys but that doesn’t mean it couldn’t have been done better. Had it been done better maybe we would already have one.
Imo SOS done his job, built an elite core to put around Cripps but I’m glad he was moved on because his last 7 first rounders he had in the draft he got us two players.

As I said, his ability will probably be judged on the job he does at St Kilda

 

[bradfisher14]

You can delist players who are under contract, we just did that with O'Brien.

Yeah, you can, but it's extremely rare. I'd say LOB's situation was very unique given his rookie status, being about six years into his career, having a bunch of players ahead of him in his only very specific position at the club, and we also had a list spot crunch last offseason.

Whereas, for example, Binns is still only 19, has more positional versatility than LOB, and he won the VFL b&f in his first year. I just can't see any chance of him being delisted unless he gets charged with something heinous - in which case, no doubt Collingwood, Geelong, or St. Kilda would give him a spot on their list lol.

 

[The Return of the Paf]

LOB and Hollands have similar stats at the same age…

Which one?