List Mgmt. 2024 List Mismanagement and Trading

[1990crow]

In case you hadn't noticed, McHenry HAS been dropped - he's only played 1x AFL game since R11.

Is Rory Laird Ned McHenry now?

 

[Vader]

Is Rory Laird Ned McHenry now?

The post you quoted was discussing McHenry.

 

[Bob Neil]

I think it's time to be aggressive with our list management on all fronts - who we delist, who we trade out and who we trade in. Here's some of my initial thoughts:

• Trade Out
  • One of Laird or Crouch - gotta be aggressive on this - I know they're both senior and probably don't want to go but we only need one of them [at most] and they're more valuable to another club right now. Even if it's only second rounder back I think it's prudent to move one on.
  • One of Keane or Butts - see above. They're both AFL quality defenders and KPDs have been a pretty valuable commodity of late. Keane is the obvious one if Collingwood and he are interested in reconnecting and you'd think a good second round should be achievable.
  • Himmelberg - bleeding obvious and presumably GWS will pick him up as a UFA and we'll just take whatever comp we get for him. Let's see if Toby Murray can develop and become solid backup (or better) for TT.
  • We should be shopping McHenry to see if there are any possible takers (unlikely) but if not then he's a straight depth-only and delist at end of contract player.
  • It's a pity that the Tassie side is not coming in next year as I think this would be the perfect time to cash in our chips on Chayce Jones. He's shown AFL qualities in different positions but never performed consistently at a high level and now I think a few others (Taylor, Dowling) have gone past him. If I thought he had reasonable trade value he'd be another that I'd be promoting the value of a new start to.
• Trade In:
  • The emergence of Rankine as a genuine forward-mid has highlighted the need for us to recruit a dangerous pure small forward. Collingwood did it perfectly getting Bobby Hill out of GWS when they did and we need to find a way to do the same.
  • We need to find a promising project ruck in that 20-24 age bracket that is ready for more opportunity and at least has the potential to get to AFL-grade quality.
  • I think the horse has bolted in terms of our ability to recruit a genuine A-grade mid but the crying need we have shouldn't be forgotten. It's a long shot but I hope we went hard at someone like Bailey Smith
    6

    Bailey Smith

    Age

    23

    Ht

    185cm

    Wt

    86kg

    Pos.

    M/F

    Career

    Season

    Last 5

    D

    18.3

    5star

    K

    8.5

    3star

    HB

    9.8

    5star

    M

    2.3

    2star

    T

    3.8

    5star

    CL

    2.7

    4star

    D

    19.8

    5star

    K

    9.6

    4star

    HB

    10.2

    5star

    M

    1.8

    2star

    T

    3.2

    4star

    CL

    3.2

    4star

    D

    14.8

    4star

    K

    7.6

    3star

    HB

    7.2

    5star

    M

    2.0

    3star

    T

    3.4

    5star

    CL

    1.6

    4star

    & LDU who bring the run and dash that we desperately need.
• Delist
  • Smith - putting aside his contract status I think it's obvious that the game has now gone past him and he's taking up games in a position at HBF that should be critical as either the launching pad for most of us rebound attacks or as the entry point for talented new players to get into the 22 and learn their craft (hello Dan Curtin!). At best should be delisted; at worst pure SANFL depth.
  • With Welsh (presumably) joining the squad we only need to keep one of Gollant and Burgess. Burgess would be my preference to delist assuming he's out of contract at the end of this year.
  • Strachan - he's served a purpose over a few years as our insurance policy but I think we've emphatically seen in two games this year that he can't get to AFL level and we're better served by going for a project ruckman who at least has the possibility of becoming a genuine AFL level player.
  • Schoenberg - I think he's been given enough opportunities and I just don't think he makes it as a first-choice midfielder and I don't think he has enough other tricks to play a different role (high half forward, winger, rebound defender). I'd rather delist him and roll the dice with a draft pick
  • Parnell - nuff said

 

[WeeBlake]

Insane that Keane is worth (we hope) pick 30 and Battle is worth pick 5

 

[WeeBlake]

I think it's time to be aggressive with our list management on all fronts - who we delist, who we trade out and who we trade in. Here's some of my initial thoughts:

• Trade Out
  • One of Laird or Crouch - gotta be aggressive on this - I know they're both senior and probably don't want to go but we only need one of them [at most] and they're more valuable to another club right now. Even if it's only second rounder back I think it's prudent to move one on.
  • One of Keane or Butts - see above. They're both AFL quality defenders and KPDs have been a pretty valuable commodity of late. Keane is the obvious one if Collingwood and he are interested in reconnecting and you'd think a good second round should be achievable.
  • Himmelberg - bleeding obvious and presumably GWS will pick him up as a UFA and we'll just take whatever comp we get for him. Let's see if Toby Murray can develop and become solid backup (or better) for TT.
  • We should be shopping McHenry to see if there are any possible takers (unlikely) but if not then he's a straight depth-only and delist at end of contract player.
  • It's a pity that the Tassie side is not coming in next year as I think this would be the perfect time to cash in our chips on Chayce Jones. He's shown AFL qualities in different positions but never performed consistently at a high level and now I think a few others (Taylor, Dowling) have gone past him. If I thought he had reasonable trade value he'd be another that I'd be promoting the value of a new start to.
• Trade In:
  • The emergence of Rankine as a genuine forward-mid has highlighted the need for us to recruit a dangerous pure small forward. Collingwood did it perfectly getting Bobby Hill out of GWS when they did and we need to find a way to do the same.
  • We need to find a promising project ruck in that 20-24 age bracket that is ready for more opportunity and at least has the potential to get to AFL-grade quality.
  • I think the horse has bolted in terms of our ability to recruit a genuine A-grade mid but the crying need we have shouldn't be forgotten. It's a long shot but I hope we went hard at someone like Bailey Smith & LDU who bring the run and dash that we desperately need.
• Delist
  • Smith - putting aside his contract status I think it's obvious that the game has now gone past him and he's taking up games in a position at HBF that should be critical as either the launching pad for most of us rebound attacks or as the entry point for talented new players to get into the 22 and learn their craft (hello Dan Curtin!). At best should be delisted; at worst pure SANFL depth.
  • With Welsh (presumably) joining the squad we only need to keep one of Gollant and Burgess. Burgess would be my preference to delist assuming he's out of contract at the end of this year.
  • Strachan - he's served a purpose over a few years as our insurance policy but I think we've emphatically seen in two games this year that he can't get to AFL level and we're better served by going for a project ruckman who at least has the possibility of becoming a genuine AFL level player.
  • Schoenberg - I think he's been given enough opportunities and I just don't think he makes it as a first-choice midfielder and I don't think he has enough other tricks to play a different role (high half forward, winger, rebound defender). I'd rather delist him and roll the dice with a draft pick
  • Parnell - nuff said

Agree with all of that except Schoenberg, I’d give him another year.

 

[OccamsRazorRay]

I think it's time to be aggressive with our list management on all fronts - who we delist, who we trade out and who we trade in. Here's some of my initial thoughts:

• Trade Out
  • One of Laird or Crouch - gotta be aggressive on this - I know they're both senior and probably don't want to go but we only need one of them [at most] and they're more valuable to another club right now. Even if it's only second rounder back I think it's prudent to move one on.
  • One of Keane or Butts - see above. They're both AFL quality defenders and KPDs have been a pretty valuable commodity of late. Keane is the obvious one if Collingwood and he are interested in reconnecting and you'd think a good second round should be achievable.
  • Himmelberg - bleeding obvious and presumably GWS will pick him up as a UFA and we'll just take whatever comp we get for him. Let's see if Toby Murray can develop and become solid backup (or better) for TT.
  • We should be shopping McHenry to see if there are any possible takers (unlikely) but if not then he's a straight depth-only and delist at end of contract player.
  • It's a pity that the Tassie side is not coming in next year as I think this would be the perfect time to cash in our chips on Chayce Jones. He's shown AFL qualities in different positions but never performed consistently at a high level and now I think a few others (Taylor, Dowling) have gone past him. If I thought he had reasonable trade value he'd be another that I'd be promoting the value of a new start to.
• Trade In:
  • The emergence of Rankine as a genuine forward-mid has highlighted the need for us to recruit a dangerous pure small forward. Collingwood did it perfectly getting Bobby Hill out of GWS when they did and we need to find a way to do the same.
  • We need to find a promising project ruck in that 20-24 age bracket that is ready for more opportunity and at least has the potential to get to AFL-grade quality.
  • I think the horse has bolted in terms of our ability to recruit a genuine A-grade mid but the crying need we have shouldn't be forgotten. It's a long shot but I hope we went hard at someone like Bailey Smith & LDU who bring the run and dash that we desperately need.
• Delist
  • Smith - putting aside his contract status I think it's obvious that the game has now gone past him and he's taking up games in a position at HBF that should be critical as either the launching pad for most of us rebound attacks or as the entry point for talented new players to get into the 22 and learn their craft (hello Dan Curtin!). At best should be delisted; at worst pure SANFL depth.
  • With Welsh (presumably) joining the squad we only need to keep one of Gollant and Burgess. Burgess would be my preference to delist assuming he's out of contract at the end of this year.
  • Strachan - he's served a purpose over a few years as our insurance policy but I think we've emphatically seen in two games this year that he can't get to AFL level and we're better served by going for a project ruckman who at least has the possibility of becoming a genuine AFL level player.
  • Schoenberg - I think he's been given enough opportunities and I just don't think he makes it as a first-choice midfielder and I don't think he has enough other tricks to play a different role (high half forward, winger, rebound defender). I'd rather delist him and roll the dice with a draft pick
  • Parnell - nuff said

- Laird or Crouch being traded makes our already incredibly young list profile even younger.
- It would be between Keane or Borlase in terms of who is traded, because it's 3rd talls where we have a surplus
- Unlikely to be any takers for Jones/Mchenry IMO.
- Smith, Strachan, Schoenberg are no chance to be delisted

 

[Mutineer]

- Laird or Crouch being traded makes our already incredibly young list profile even younger.
- It would be between Keane or Borlase in terms of who is traded, because it's 3rd talls where we have a surplus
- Unlikely to be any takers for Jones/Mchenry IMO.
- Smith, Strachan, Schoenberg are no chance to be delisted

An uncontracted Borlase would likely not have much trade value given his tweener size and genuine lack of pace, good footy I.Q. that said, a contracted Keane given his touted upside however would likely net us a 2nd round pick at least. Also to retain Borlase he nopw will take up a main list spot won't he?

 

[ClaudeCurlsCrow]

I think it's time to be aggressive with our list management on all fronts - who we delist, who we trade out and who we trade in. Here's some of my initial thoughts:

• Trade Out
  • One of Laird or Crouch - gotta be aggressive on this - I know they're both senior and probably don't want to go but we only need one of them [at most] and they're more valuable to another club right now. Even if it's only second rounder back I think it's prudent to move one on.
  • One of Keane or Butts - see above. They're both AFL quality defenders and KPDs have been a pretty valuable commodity of late. Keane is the obvious one if Collingwood and he are interested in reconnecting and you'd think a good second round should be achievable.
  • Himmelberg - bleeding obvious and presumably GWS will pick him up as a UFA and we'll just take whatever comp we get for him. Let's see if Toby Murray can develop and become solid backup (or better) for TT.
  • We should be shopping McHenry to see if there are any possible takers (unlikely) but if not then he's a straight depth-only and delist at end of contract player.
  • It's a pity that the Tassie side is not coming in next year as I think this would be the perfect time to cash in our chips on Chayce Jones. He's shown AFL qualities in different positions but never performed consistently at a high level and now I think a few others (Taylor, Dowling) have gone past him. If I thought he had reasonable trade value he'd be another that I'd be promoting the value of a new start to.
• Trade In:
  • The emergence of Rankine as a genuine forward-mid has highlighted the need for us to recruit a dangerous pure small forward. Collingwood did it perfectly getting Bobby Hill out of GWS when they did and we need to find a way to do the same.
  • We need to find a promising project ruck in that 20-24 age bracket that is ready for more opportunity and at least has the potential to get to AFL-grade quality.
  • I think the horse has bolted in terms of our ability to recruit a genuine A-grade mid but the crying need we have shouldn't be forgotten. It's a long shot but I hope we went hard at someone like Bailey Smith & LDU who bring the run and dash that we desperately need.
• Delist
  • Smith - putting aside his contract status I think it's obvious that the game has now gone past him and he's taking up games in a position at HBF that should be critical as either the launching pad for most of us rebound attacks or as the entry point for talented new players to get into the 22 and learn their craft (hello Dan Curtin!). At best should be delisted; at worst pure SANFL depth.
  • With Welsh (presumably) joining the squad we only need to keep one of Gollant and Burgess. Burgess would be my preference to delist assuming he's out of contract at the end of this year.
  • Strachan - he's served a purpose over a few years as our insurance policy but I think we've emphatically seen in two games this year that he can't get to AFL level and we're better served by going for a project ruckman who at least has the possibility of becoming a genuine AFL level player.
  • Schoenberg - I think he's been given enough opportunities and I just don't think he makes it as a first-choice midfielder and I don't think he has enough other tricks to play a different role (high half forward, winger, rebound defender). I'd rather delist him and roll the dice with a draft pick
  • Parnell - nuff said

2nd rounders for Keane, Butts and Laird???

even though they ain't my favorite players but they are all contracted, with Keane and Butts demanding late first round at least.
Laird is interesting in terms of value.... he is a really good HBF in similarity of Caleb Daniel though with less foot skills....

Smith is still good depth option even though he may not be best 22 so no point in delisting and making our list even younger and les experienced.

Himmelberg is definitely gone as UFA.

delisting for this year would be (realistically)
Himmelberg
Parnell
McHenry
Gollant
bond

trade (possibility)
scholl
berry
keane

retained
cook
borlase
hamill
walker ... maybe

 

[Vader]

An uncontracted Borlase would likely not have much trade value given his tweener size and genuine lack of pace, good footy I.Q. that said, a contracted Keane given his touted upside however would likely net us a 2nd round pick at least. Also to retain Borlase he nopw will take up a main list spot won't he?

Borlase is now on the Cat A rookie list. He was delisted and re-drafted in 2023, which reset the 3-year clock. There's no reason why he would need promoting to the senior list until the end of 2026.

 

[budget]

Might want to edit that post.

Why should he edit the post?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Mutineer]

Borlase is now on the Cat A rookie list. He was delisted and re-drafted in 2023, which reset the 3-year clock. There's no reason why he would need promoting to the senior list until the end of 2026.

Still goes way way before Keane if we're looking to the future, one is a best 22 at most clubs, the other only depth at some clubs. It's no surprise no club has ever come calling even when he was available.

 

[Vader]

Still goes way way before Keane if we're looking to the future, one is a best 22 at most clubs, the other only depth at some clubs. It's no surprise no club has ever come calling even when he was available.

I agree that Keane is a much better player, and a higher priority for retention.

I was mostly responding to the last sentence in your previous post, about Borlase taking up a spot on the main list, which is not the case.

 

[Captain Furious]

2nd rounders for Keane, Butts and Laird???

even though they ain't my favorite players but they are all contracted, with Keane and Butts demanding late first round at least.
Laird is interesting in terms of value.... he is a really good HBF in similarity of Caleb Daniel though with less foot skills....

Smith is still good depth option even though he may not be best 22 so no point in delisting and making our list even younger and les experienced.

Himmelberg is definitely gone as UFA.

delisting for this year would be (realistically)
Himmelberg
Parnell
McHenry
Gollant
bond

trade (possibility)
scholl
berry
keane

retained
cook
borlase
hamill
walker ... maybe

You want to delist Bond? Do you draft this a week ago and forget to edit?

 

[Crows I Am]

McHenry is a very likeable fella. He's great with people, always happy to chat and has a very outgoing/engaging personality. Could be great in the media.
Unfortunately, his football doesn't match.

I can't see Mchenry getting any interest from another side if we do move him on. He may decide he wants to stay in SA now he lives with the Murray boys and has media interest here so wouldn't surprise me if he ends up staying with the SANFL team as their 'marquee' player.

 

[GameofSloanes]

100% agree with all of this.
I'd trade Laird. He will have some currency, he's surplus to requirements and doesn't have a clear position.

A smart and bold club would make the trade.
We won't, but a smart club would.

Doesn't matter if we would or not. He's contracted, and doesn't want to go anywhere.

 

[spenze]

Why should he edit the post?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Word in there BF don’t like to have mentioned.

 

[spenze]

I’d like us to work with Keane and say if he wants out this year and wants to be in Melbourne then happy to trade him to North. Our first and Keane for their first and a second would be ok

 

[hidden]

Doesn't matter if we would or not. He's contracted, and doesn't want to go anywhere.

Maybe he can stay in town. He could be the "missing piece"

 

[1970crow]

Why should he edit the post?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Because

 

[OccamsRazorRay]

An uncontracted Borlase would likely not have much trade value given his tweener size and genuine lack of pace, good footy I.Q. that said, a contracted Keane given his touted upside however would likely net us a 2nd round pick at least. Also to retain Borlase he nopw will take up a main list spot won't he?

Yep. I think Borlase possibly has a 2 year contract offer in front of him as well, not sure regarding Keane but sounds like both Crows and his management are holding off until end of the year. Writing is on the wall there, IMO. Looms as a win-win for all parties if we get him to the Pies I think. The only question is value. Pies looking pretty miserable in the backline with Howe and Murray retirements (doubtful Howe goes again). IMO if Keane improves again next year he could seriously be one of the best 3rd tall options around, some would argue he already is. I think Pies current 2024 2nd round pick tied to Hawthorn is around the mark, but I'd also be asking for Pies 2025 1st round with a future 2nd going back. IMO his current contracted value is somewhere around the late 1st/early 2nd mark.

Apparently it's been confirmed that he does not have Free Agency status next year, so a club would have to trade for him anyway..

 

[Apsaalooke]

Because

He’s our Centrefield (Why is Left Field)

 

[OccamsRazorRay]

I agree that Keane is a much better player, and a higher priority for retention.

I was mostly responding to the last sentence in your previous post, about Borlase taking up a spot on the main list, which is not the case.

Keane is of course the better player.

Butts & Murray will always hold down those KPD positions, so I'd much rather a scenario where Borlase is the backup as either a 3rd tall/KPD than either one of Worrell or Keane... both are far too good to be depth.

IMO Borlase has proven that he's handy depth in both positions, and surely with our salary cap he's had something decent put in front of him. If he's looking for an extra year, or guaranteed game time then he might look elsewhere, in which case you'd doubt that we'd get rid of Keane at all.

I think we're in a good position with the options available in front of us.

 

[Mutineer]

Keane is of course the better player.

Butts & Murray will always hold down those KPD positions, so I'd much rather a scenario where Borlase is the backup as either a 3rd tall/KPD than either one of Worrell or Keane... both are far too good to be depth.

IMO Borlase has proven that he's handy depth in both positions, and surely with our salary cap he's had something decent put in front of him. If he's looking for an extra year, or guaranteed game time then he might look elsewhere, in which case you'd doubt that we'd get rid of Keane at all.

I think we're in a good position with the options available in front of us.

I doubt Borlase would have any takers at all if he wanted guaranteed AFL game time and that most definitely includes us, if he has any sort of offer on the table from us currently he and his management should grab it pronto.

 

[Crow till I die]

I doubt Borlase would have any takers at all if he wanted guaranteed AFL game time and that most definitely includes us, if he has any sort of offer on the table from us currently he and his management should grab it pronto.

Don't discount Port taking him if we let him go. He can play and is quite solid as a defender. They are struggling down back and as a low cost option, its almost a no brainer for them to bring him and an added bonus in that he is the son of a former champion and is SA based already.

I want to hold onto him if we can.

 

[Mutineer]

Don't discount Port taking him if we let him go. He can play and is quite solid as a defender. They are struggling down back and as a low cost option, its almost a no brainer for them to bring him and an added bonus in that he is the son of a former champion and is SA based already.

I want to hold onto him if we can.

I keep hearing this but they've had numerous opportunities and have shown zero interest even when he was delisted last year. Don't see it personally because all evidence points to the opposite.