List Mgmt. 2024 List Mismanagement and Trading

[GreyCrow]

Sorry GC I am unsure what you are asking me

What was wrong with the article and his comments on Tex? I mean thats why you posted it

 

[119others]

What was wrong with the article and his comments on Tex? I mean thats why you posted it

OK thanks, I had responded to another poster saying I agreed with Kanye’s article but pointing out he hates Tex. and that the Tex comment was the most debateable part of the article IMO. He was AA last year after being written off 3 years earlier. He contributes in many ways to the club and I am happy with his one year extension

As already posted:

Agreed. Most of what he said about us and other clubs was spot on. Just pointing out he hates Tex and also a one year Tex extension would probably be the most debateable part of the article IMO. It’s not clear cut and I am glad we have Tex for one more year (different to Smith and 2 more years of Laird).

His point about Bombers giving injury plagued Ridley a 3 year extension ON TOP of existing contract until 2026 is crazy list management. I didn’t realise this but holy ****

 

[1970crow]

We don't like trading players when they want to stay. We need to keep bringing in more talent, but we are reluctant to move anybody on.

Agree we should have moved Berry on, we have plenty of other options who can play a similar role to him. Perfect opportunity to trade him and get something decent in return and free up a list spot to bring in new talent in areas we are lacking.

Plan A should have been to keep Berry and tell both Laird and Crouch that they've played their last AFL game for the club. If that didn't have the desired outcome, I'd have suggested to Berry that he would be treated as depth going forward. 1 or 2 of that 3 need to be gone. Our midfield going forward should be;

Primary: Dawson, Rankine & Soligo
Secondary: Rachele, Dowling, Curtin, Pedlar, Taylor, Pick 4, ANB
Depth: Keays, Schoenberg, Murphy

Dowling and Taylor are on probation, but should get midfield minutes ahead of the depth group. If they end up as depth mids, then they replace Murphy & Schoey.

 

[Crows I Am]

not sure if posted but crows stuff half way down. Kane really does hate Tex

Why the likely Liam Baker trade shows the AFL has gone soft

Why would West Coast give up a top draft pick for Liam Baker when they could easily get him for free? The Eagles should play hard ball and give the Tigers nothing. But like so many other clubs, they seem reluctant to make the tough decisions.

www.theage.com.au

Where is the ruthless edge that once defined the AFL? Clubs are no longer willing to play hardball on trades, contract negotiations, honest feedback to players or even setting strict training standards.

Instead, we are witnessing a wave of softness and appeasement. Clubs are more interested in keeping everyone happy rather than chasing success at all costs. This shift is evident across the league – and there are a few glaring examples.

Why should the Eagles pay anything for Liam Baker?
Why should the Eagles pay anything for Liam Baker?Credit:Getty Images

Take West Coast’s pursuit of Liam Baker. Baker is out of contract and Richmond will demand a first-round draft pick to close the trade.

But why should West Coast give up anything? Richmond wouldn’t redraft Baker and North Melbourne are unlikely to take him, so they could simply claim Baker for free in the pre-season draft and keep their prized first-round pick.

It would acquire a high-quality player at no cost and send a message to the competition: West Coast will not be pushed around. After three seasons at rock bottom, they would finally be flexing their
muscles.

Instead, West Coast, at risk of offending the rival club or Baker’s management group, will cave in to Richmond’s demands.

At Adelaide, coach Matthew Nicks was due to come out of contract at the end of this season.

But the club board was generous in rewarding Nicks with a two-year contract extension at the start of the season because it did not want Nicks to face any scrutiny from the media.

It was another mistake from the underperforming club.


Adelaide started the season with five losses from its first six games and finished the season in the bottom four. It’s the seventh season in a row Adelaide has missed the finals, and Nicks is there for another two years.

Adelaide’s lack of ruthlessness is not limited to its handling of the coach. Former captain Taylor Walker is another beneficiary of the club’s nice approach. As he has done in the past, Walker applied pressure for a contract extension, which was granted and announced last week.

If Adelaide had been truly ruthless, it would have moved on from Walker. At his age, with a deteriorating back, he struggles to meet the demands of today’s game. Forcing him to retire would have allowed Adelaide’s young and dynamic forward line to flourish without his looming presence casting a shadow over the squad.

With a deteriorating back, Taylor Walker is struggling to meet the demands of today’s game.
With a deteriorating back, Taylor Walker is struggling to meet the demands of today’s game.Credit:via Getty Images

The Crows have clearly not learned from their mistakes with Rory Sloane. Despite his obvious physical limitations, they allowed Sloane to remain on the list this year, only for him to suffer an eye
injury and retire without playing a game this year.

It is clear Adelaide are afraid to make tough and sometimes unpopular decisions.

This is a far cry from the ruthless approach Malcolm Blight took when he became Crows coach in 1996. Blight wasted no time making hard calls, cutting club stalwarts, including captain Tony McGuinness, Chris McDermott, and Andrew Jarman.

Those decisions paved the way for Adelaide to win back-to-back premierships in 1997 and 1998.



Essendon were determined to be nice guys this season.

I agree with all of this. We are way too nice and seem to give in to our players demands instead of doing what's best for the club. Sloane and Tex should not have been given the option to go again.

We consistently play the nice guys and it is having a negative impact on our list profile and limiting our options come the end of year.

 

[Crows I Am]

Plan A would have been to keep Berry and tell both Laird and Crouch that they've played their last AFL game for the club. If that didn't have the desired outcome, I'd have suggested to Berry that he would be treated as depth going forward. 1 or 2 of that 3 need to be gone. Our midfield going forward should be;

Primary: Dawson, Rankine & Soligo
Secondary: Rachele, Dowling, Curtin, Pedlar, Taylor, Pick 4, ANB
Depth: Keays, Schoenberg, Murphy

Dowling and Taylor are on probation, but should get midfield minutes ahead of the depth group. If they end up as depth mids, then they replace Murphy & Schoey.

Agree with all of this. We are playing the nice guy to our players and not being ruthless with our list management.

 

[119others]

I agree with all of this. We are way too nice and seem to give in to our players demands instead of doing what's best for the club. Sloane and Tex should not have been given the option to go again.

We consistently play the nice guys and it is having a negative impact on our list profile and limiting our options come the end of year.

OK I won’t keep repeating myself after this last time as it’s too time consuming and makes me less inclined to share articles going forward.

To recap… I shared an article from one of my subscriptions. It was a good article. I have said a number of times I agree with the vast majority of it and Kane was “spot on”. I mentioned Kane hates Tex - this is not for debate - but I am personally happy to keep Tex. this may differ from others views and that’s fine. All good. Opinions differ and to me Tex is an all time legend of our club - possibly pushing top 5 player ever - who was AA last year kicking 75 ish goals. A career best year. This year injuries struck. He may play half the games next year, help mentor our very young and inexperienced team including forward line potential elite players like TT and Rachele being our ex captain and still spiritual leader. He will likely still kick some bags and help win us games.

Ps you didn’t respond to the question re Berry. Happy to be “ruthless” and trade him for pick 40?

 

[1970crow]

We're coming from a long way back when I look at midfields like Swans, Port, GWS, Brisbane and now Hawks

For those suggesting trade Laird, he's contracted for a decent amount and he won't agree to leave Adelaide where his life is nicely set up. He'll see out his contract regardless of whether he's plaing seniors or SANFL. No point suggesting trading him.

If we weren't frontloading the bejejus out of his contract the last 3-4 years then we might as well pack up shop. No way our list value gets close to the minimum 95% from 2020 to present day.

 

[crow2crow]

Plan A would have been to keep Berry and tell both Laird and Crouch that they've played their last AFL game for the club. If that didn't have the desired outcome, I'd have suggested to Berry that he would be treated as depth going forward. 1 or 2 of that 3 need to be gone. Our midfield going forward should be;

Primary: Dawson, Rankine & Soligo
Secondary: Rachele, Dowling, Curtin, Pedlar, Taylor, Pick 4, ANB
Depth: Keays, Schoenberg, Murphy

Dowling and Taylor are on probation, but should get midfield minutes ahead of the depth group. If they end up as depth mids, then they replace Murphy & Schoey.

agree re laird - try to trade. what about a straight swap with parker? both past it but would give both teams some experience where they needs it (parker - mid) and (laird - back). rampe is cooked.

on crouch to be fair, rushed himself back and wasnt as good after shoulder then before. needs a massive preseason

 

[Redline]

not sure if posted but crows stuff half way down. Kane really does hate Tex

Why the likely Liam Baker trade shows the AFL has gone soft

Why would West Coast give up a top draft pick for Liam Baker when they could easily get him for free? The Eagles should play hard ball and give the Tigers nothing. But like so many other clubs, they seem reluctant to make the tough decisions.

www.theage.com.au

Where is the ruthless edge that once defined the AFL? Clubs are no longer willing to play hardball on trades, contract negotiations, honest feedback to players or even setting strict training standards.

Instead, we are witnessing a wave of softness and appeasement. Clubs are more interested in keeping everyone happy rather than chasing success at all costs. This shift is evident across the league – and there are a few glaring examples.

Why should the Eagles pay anything for Liam Baker?
Why should the Eagles pay anything for Liam Baker?Credit:Getty Images

Take West Coast’s pursuit of Liam Baker. Baker is out of contract and Richmond will demand a first-round draft pick to close the trade.

But why should West Coast give up anything? Richmond wouldn’t redraft Baker and North Melbourne are unlikely to take him, so they could simply claim Baker for free in the pre-season draft and keep their prized first-round pick.

It would acquire a high-quality player at no cost and send a message to the competition: West Coast will not be pushed around. After three seasons at rock bottom, they would finally be flexing their
muscles.

Instead, West Coast, at risk of offending the rival club or Baker’s management group, will cave in to Richmond’s demands.

At Adelaide, coach Matthew Nicks was due to come out of contract at the end of this season.

But the club board was generous in rewarding Nicks with a two-year contract extension at the start of the season because it did not want Nicks to face any scrutiny from the media.

It was another mistake from the underperforming club.


Adelaide started the season with five losses from its first six games and finished the season in the bottom four. It’s the seventh season in a row Adelaide has missed the finals, and Nicks is there for another two years.

Adelaide’s lack of ruthlessness is not limited to its handling of the coach. Former captain Taylor Walker is another beneficiary of the club’s nice approach. As he has done in the past, Walker applied pressure for a contract extension, which was granted and announced last week.

If Adelaide had been truly ruthless, it would have moved on from Walker. At his age, with a deteriorating back, he struggles to meet the demands of today’s game. Forcing him to retire would have allowed Adelaide’s young and dynamic forward line to flourish without his looming presence casting a shadow over the squad.

With a deteriorating back, Taylor Walker is struggling to meet the demands of today’s game.
With a deteriorating back, Taylor Walker is struggling to meet the demands of today’s game.Credit:via Getty Images

The Crows have clearly not learned from their mistakes with Rory Sloane. Despite his obvious physical limitations, they allowed Sloane to remain on the list this year, only for him to suffer an eye
injury and retire without playing a game this year.

It is clear Adelaide are afraid to make tough and sometimes unpopular decisions.

This is a far cry from the ruthless approach Malcolm Blight took when he became Crows coach in 1996. Blight wasted no time making hard calls, cutting club stalwarts, including captain Tony McGuinness, Chris McDermott, and Andrew Jarman.

Those decisions paved the way for Adelaide to win back-to-back premierships in 1997 and 1998.



Essendon were determined to be nice guys this season.

He is right on Tex, everyone else is to scared to say it. He will kick goals out the back off turnover but will cost those goals and more by lack of defensive pressure. We have missed the finals for seven years in a row, no one should be getting any rewards.

The whole putting pressure on the club for a contract is classic Tex. He's not as big a team player as he wants everyone to think. He played some really selfish football towards the back end of the year.

Similar to Crouch, supporters count possessions but overall he is a liability in the midfield. There is a reason why no one else really wanted him.

It was time for a fresh approach. Same with Smith and Laird.

 

[GreyCrow]

OK thanks, I had responded to another poster saying I agreed with Kanye’s article but pointing out he hates Tex. and that the Tex comment was the most debateable part of the article IMO. He was AA last year after being written off 3 years earlier. He contributes in many ways to the club and I am happy with his one year extension

As already posted:

Agreed. Most of what he said about us and other clubs was spot on. Just pointing out he hates Tex and also a one year Tex extension would probably be the most debateable part of the article IMO. It’s not clear cut and I am glad we have Tex for one more year (different to Smith and 2 more years of Laird).

His point about Bombers giving injury plagued Ridley a 3 year extension ON TOP of existing contract until 2026 is crazy list management. I didn’t realise this but holy ****

Apologies I missed this

Then we agree to disagree - I'm with Redline and others

Its time for a refresh and I felt this years draft would be a perfect time to gather 1 or 2 players that may take us into the next 10 years

 

[1970crow]

I agree with all of this. We are way too nice and seem to give in to our players demands instead of doing what's best for the club. Sloane and Tex should not have been given the option to go again.

We consistently play the nice guys and it is having a negative impact on our list profile and limiting our options come the end of year.

Even if it's arguable that they should have gotten the extra year, what is unarguable is that they should be delisted and then put on the rookie list. We need list spots and those guys that won't be going to another club, or if they did, good luck to them, should be the guys heading to the rookie list. But we are too weak to do that.

 

[1970crow]

agree re laird - try to trade. what about a straight swap with parker? both past it but would give both teams some experience where they needs it (parker - mid) and (laird - back). rampe is cooked.

on crouch to be fair, rushed himself back and wasnt as good after shoulder then before. needs a massive preseason

I don't think we need Berry and Crouch, only 1 should be in our 22 at any given time. Berry has leg power and breaks out of the contest zone, which is a point of difference that I like. He doesn't accumulate much yet, but I'd back him in to end up averaging in that 23-26 area. We routinely get our arses handed to us by midfields that don't rack up the stats that our guys do, so losing Crouch's 32 disposals is unlikely to matter too much if the 25 that replace it can be more damaging. But if we're going to keep Crouch as depth, then I'd move Berry on and see what the next batch have got.

I do know that both Crouch and Laird will be starting midfielders come round 1 next year. I'm not delusional.

 

[Crows I Am]

OK I won’t keep repeating myself after this last time as it’s too time consuming and makes me less inclined to share articles going forward.

To recap… I shared an article from one of my subscriptions. It was a good article. I have said a number of times I agree with the vast majority of it and Kane was “spot on”. I mentioned Kane hates Tex - this is not for debate - but I am personally happy to keep Tex. this may differ from others views and that’s fine. All good. Opinions differ and to me Tex is an all time legend of our club - possibly pushing top 5 player ever - who was AA last year kicking 75 ish goals. A career best year. This year injuries struck. He may play half the games next year, help mentor our very young and inexperienced team including forward line potential elite players like TT and Rachele being our ex captain and still spiritual leader. He will likely still kick some bags and help win us games.

Ps you didn’t respond to the question re Berry. Happy to be “ruthless” and trade him for pick 40?

in regards to Berry, yes would be happy to move him on for pick 40. As I said, we have multiple other options who can play his role. We also need the list spot to bring in players in other positions which we are short in. We need a developing ruck, we need running defenders, we need small forwards. We are limited on filling these needs as we are short on lists spots. Pick 40 in a strong draft is a good result if we were to get that pick for him.

 

[CDC60]

I would be prepared to finish bottom 4 next year as long as we cleaned out the dead-wood and gave the next generation their opportunity. We are not winning a flag in 2025. Regardless of anyone else's form: Dowling, Taylor, Nankervis, Edwards, Ryan, Curtin, Cook, Bond & Pick 4 must play whenever fit. They have to be fast tracked, not stuck behind, Smith, Laird, Crouch. Walker, Keays, Murphy, Milera, Jones and Schoenberg. If they are not the basis of our next Grand Final team then we are writing off another decade at least.

Of course Nicks can't afford another bottom 4 finish so he will be playing 'experience' whenever he can, which he played this year - and we finished bottom 4.

 

[ams4crows]

It’s starting to become very clear we aren’t mass delisting the ‘dead wood’ because no one wants to come here.

Would rather draft fresh blood then keep list cloggers

 

[ams4crows]

I still don't know why we didn't trade Berry, particularly if pick 4 is good, almost immediately takes his spot.

 

[1990crow]

I still don't know why we didn't trade Berry, particularly if pick 4 is good, almost immediately takes his spot.

Cromunnism

 

[FullyBigKPro]

I still don't know why we didn't trade Berry, particularly if pick 4 is good, almost immediately takes his spot.

Collingwoods pick 32 for Berry - then on traded for Luko or ANB would have been tidy business IMO.....

 

[Vader]

I would be prepared to finish bottom 4 next year as long as we cleaned out the dead-wood and gave the next generation their opportunity. We are not winning a flag in 2025. Regardless of anyone else's form: Dowling, Taylor, Nankervis, Edwards, Ryan, Curtin, Cook, Bond & Pick 4 must play whenever fit. They have to be fast tracked, not stuck behind, Smith, Laird, Crouch. Walker, Keays, Murphy, Milera, Jones and Schoenberg. If they are not the basis of our next Grand Final team then we are writing off another decade at least.

Of course Nicks can't afford another bottom 4 finish so he will be playing 'experience' whenever he can, which he played this year - and we finished bottom 4.

Cook? **** no. Definitely not in that category. He's closer to the delist pile than he is the "must play every game in 2025" category.

 

[crow2crow]

Cook? **** no. Definitely not in that category. He's closer to the delist pile than he is the "must play every game in 2025" category.

hes very hard to read. could be a bust but could also just click. i dont know... what i do know is murphy mchenry will never do AFL level things consistently

 

[ams4crows]

hes very hard to read. could be a bust but could also just click. i dont know... what i do know is murphy mchenry will never do AFL level things consistently

Cook has class and skills that translate to AFL quality the problem is he just doesn't get the ball enough, if Cook was get 16 disposals plus every week that would be great at half forward but he's only been getting like 8 and it's just not damaging enough

 

[jackster83]

How do we get a player like Max Holmes?

 

[Scorpus]

How do we get a player like Max Holmes?

By drafting midfielders at the draft

 

[crow2crow]

How do we get a player like Max Holmes?

by getting geelongs recruitment team

 

[jackster83]

By drafting midfielders at the draft

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