List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.1

[MOLTEN GANGLANDS]

I reckon one would do. Steele isn't elite but he's very good when fit. Put LDU, Callaghan or any other good mid in the side and we are good enough. Even with Crouch and Steele fit I think we have enough to be competitive. Geelong won a flag with a barely functional midfield but a really good outside running squad to feed out to and a HB line that had a great distribution and run. Their set up looked like us now.

Richmond barely won a clearance in their 3 flags. It's lazy to suggest we can't go anywhere until we have three elite mids and just excusing Lyon's inability to compete with what we have now. We won't get that unless we have a miracle. Anyone that thinks we need to rebuild again would rather back a poor coaching set up than win.

I think if we draft a kid like Jagga, take a bridging player while he develops and make sure there is some depth for Sandy we are fine.

You seem to like arguing and not reading what I write. Don't see how I'm wasting anyone's time unless you think suck arses are the only thing worth reading on here. I strongly encourage you to put me on ignore because I'd rather not waste my time engaging with you. You come across as a dim wit.

hahaha, I come across as a dimwit, you are so dramatic, you spam the forum with your reactionary takes, I push back a little and I'm a dimwit. Nice. No im not going to put you on ignore, I do that with cairnsman (the guy that thinks sharman is a dud) and then half of the posts are all replies to "ignored user".

Honestly mate I've made two posts saying you're being argumentative and you're all "put me on ignore you dimwit, waa", like chill out man, if you can't handle a little pushback on this forum then you shouldn't be posting so much

the problem with your line of thinking and other people's on this forum is that it is wayyy too reactionary, we've finally gotten a proven performer in Lyon, who is actively making decisions for our future (i.e. playing the kids), and people are pissed off we're not top 4 a year and a half into it. And that's not to mention the great work he's doing to campaign for greater equality with academies and father sons which will benefit us in years to come, something our previous coaches couldn't even conceptualise let alone make a case for.

I'm not always pro coach, I started the sack richo thread, I was so so on ratten, but I think it's time now to back in the team for the full 3 years and see how it goes rather than always looking for a better alternative. You on the other hand are always jumping at shadows, you're long term saints supporter PTSD incarnate. People like your posts because you're funny and you can roll out a good metaphor, not because we agree with what you say

"put me on ignore if u can't handle it wa wa waa"

 

[stavro#4]

Fair enough. In the 1990s MJ was inevitable.

I understand. But I couldn’t have given a **** about much sport during until the saints from around 97.

Then soccer…

Then the NBA in the early 2000s - roughly around the time Chris Anstey ran around for the bulls

 

[Joffaboy]

I don't care about anyone else. You can do what you want and have your own hopes and dreams. I'm not able to walk away without them self imploding but they consistently make me unhappy. It's like an abusive relationship that I can't walk away from.

I am a bit further along than you gringo, after reading that from the President, I am out after this year, will cancel my membership.

The way he spoke was that he hoped our performance was better in four years or so (the question was from MR, where will the club be in four years or something like that). I can't cope for that long.

However while I think we have stuffed up over time, I believe that the AFL has stacked the cards against us with F/S and NGA's, stadium deals, the FIXture with us never getting a guaranteed blockbuster.
Lyon articulated the unfairness of the NGA's, Bassatt articulated how FA's just go to the rich and powerful clubs.
I have lost hope we can get the players under this money and business firsts AFL. North stuff up and get a whole bunch of free dps. Why?

The AFL want us to pay for being TV slot fillers and the Washington Generals. I think the admin is in the best hands it could be in but what is the point when we are in some sort of three legged egg and spoon race against clubs who are put into wheelbarrows and pushed by the AFL?

 

[Joffaboy]

Saints.

Leeds United.

Chicago bulls.


Hope. Dreams. Self destruction. Capitulation.

Rinse and repeat.

Saints

Leeds

At least Canterbury has given me five premierships since 1980

 

[Rogue Warrior]

Howard is certainly flawed however:
A)We will get less back for him in a trade than he’s worth to us
B) We will likely be able to slash his contract in half to resign him
C) we won’t be able to attract an A grade key back to replace him and we wouldn’t want to burn the draft capital even if we could.
D) it would seem absurd to lose both him and battle (if he leaves) in the same off-season. We’d be destined for bottom 4 next year.
E) if we do replace him I can’t see us upgrading. Likely pick up another similar to Cordy.

That being said I’d keep him and try to simplify his role/reduce his responsibility

 

[StCicatriz]

Does everyone feel that LDU to St Kilda is just a bit of a pipe dream? It just doesn't make sense, if he was to leave why would he go to a club that is so similar?

He's obviously what we need and I'm very happy for us to dangle cash but I just don't really get why he would make that move.

Maybe Brayshaw is a more realistic target, has the Lyon relationship already.

Correct. It's not happening

 

[kernelT]

Big Doogs severely underrated in here for mine.

When up and running his defensive acts are rated elite, playing on the best forwards in the comp.

199cm, quick, competitive.

He can have the odd brain fade, but when he keeps it simple is easily in our best defensive unit.

Reckon we're ****ing mad if we push him out.

Butts isn't going to come for free or even cheap.

Tomlinson is a crab.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

I am a bit further along than you gringo, after reading that from the President, I am out after this year, will cancel my membership.

The way he spoke was that he hoped our performance was better in four years or so (the question was from MR, where will the club be in four years or something like that). I can't cope for that long.

However while I think we have stuffed up over time, I believe that the AFL has stacked the cards against us with F/S and NGA's, stadium deals, the FIXture with us never getting a guaranteed blockbuster.
Lyon articulated the unfairness of the NGA's, Bassatt articulated how FA's just go to the rich and powerful clubs.
I have lost hope we can get the players under this money and business firsts AFL. North stuff up and get a whole bunch of free dps. Why?

The AFL want us to pay for being TV slot fillers and the Washington Generals. I think the admin is in the best hands it could be in but what is the point when we are in some sort of three legged egg and spoon race against clubs who are put into wheelbarrows and pushed by the AFL?

Funny thing is, if we could produce a premiership run, our huge behind the scenes fan base, would finally come out of the closet.
Kind of look to the Hawks for that, nearly merged, but when they won premierships, every kid in the land barracked for them. We've rarely had a decent boardroom, that's been our biggest setback.

 

[StCicatriz]

Imagine reading that interview and thinking Matt finnis and Simon Lethlean were capable CEOs.

His statement that he become "hands on" because the board were rubber stamping decisions because they didn't have all the information to make decisions is damning.

The whole corporate structure has been ****ed for a long time and the performance at a executive level very poor.

The chairman of the company has had to step in and do the CEOs role. Pathetic really.

Hopefully this improves. If not we are cooked.

 

[gubby88]

Imagine reading that interview and thinking Matt finnis and Simon Lethlean were capable CEOs.

His statement that he become "hands on" because the board were rubber stamping decisions because they didn't have all the information to make decisions is damning.

The whole corporate structure has been ****ed for a long time and the performance at a executive level very poor.

The chairman of the company has had to step in and do the CEOs role. Pathetic really.

Hopefully this improves. If not we are cooked.

id say with recent appointments it has changed

 

[Saint Watto]

Dougal was very good 2020 and 2021.

A self like there Dougal ???????

Agree........he was very good in those years.

 

[Saint Watto]

Saints.

Leeds United.

Chicago bulls.


Hope. Dreams. Self destruction. Capitulation.

Rinse and repeat.

Saints/Liverpool.

Talk about bitter/sweet.

 

[gringo2011]

Saints.

Leeds United.

Chicago bulls.


Hope. Dreams. Self destruction. Capitulation.

Rinse and repeat.

Saints, Newcastle, Wests Tigers, Bulls. **** them all. They are all a blight on their sports.

 

[StCicatriz]

We live and die by recruiting and list management then. He's let Lyon get a mate in as LM. Selling off your better players for picks is something that rarely works. We went from not getting any players from the national draft in 15 years to deciding to go all in on it.

North, Melbourne, Carlton and Brisbane all bottomed out and built up but not without years in the wilderness. If we start from now it might be another 10 plus years unless we nail every pick before Tassie come in. The danger is the cliff is going to come just as they come in.

I like Bassat because he's willing to spend but he seems like a limp dick cuck to Lyon. He's letting the him take us backwards with no timeline or KPIs. If that was a business that I had shares in I'd be crashing the board-meeting wanting blood.

The idea of a huge war chest but being uncompetitive and limited future is one we know well. No matter how much lipstick goes on a pig, it's a hard sell.

He basically admitted regardless of the cash we have we can't get anything decent.

Also confirmed without outright confirming it that he was being fed shit and had enough so he stepped in.

He are in a very bad spot. Free agency ain't saving us. Trading in players ain't saving us. Plus Ross has confirmed the draft is heavily compromised.

Our best hope here is to get in roads by lobbying the AFL for change.

I don't see a flag happening in Ross time without big AFL driven change.

 

[gringo2011]

hahaha, I come across as a dimwit, you are so dramatic, you spam the forum with your reactionary takes, I push back a little and I'm a dimwit. Nice. No im not going to put you on ignore, I do that with cairnsman (the guy that thinks sharman is a dud) and then half of the posts are all replies to "ignored user".

Honestly mate I've made two posts saying you're being argumentative and you're all "put me on ignore you dimwit, waa", like chill out man, if you can't handle a little pushback on this forum then you shouldn't be posting so much

the problem with your line of thinking and other people's on this forum is that it is wayyy too reactionary, we've finally gotten a proven performer in Lyon, who is actively making decisions for our future (i.e. playing the kids), and people are pissed off we're not top 4 a year and a half into it. And that's not to mention the great work he's doing to campaign for greater equality with academies and father sons which will benefit us in years to come, something our previous coaches couldn't even conceptualise let alone make a case for.

I'm not always pro coach, I started the sack richo thread, I was so so on ratten, but I think it's time now to back in the team for the full 3 years and see how it goes rather than always looking for a better alternative. You on the other hand are always jumping at shadows, you're long term saints supporter PTSD incarnate. People like your posts because you're funny and you can roll out a good metaphor, not because we agree with what you say

"put me on ignore if u can't handle it wa wa waa"

You attack me not my posts so go **** yourself. I can't be bothered with someone that goes the man not the ball. Add something or don't respond. I spam but you whining about my posts is content apparently.

 

[StCicatriz]

The Saints, Bristol Rovers & the England cricket team for mine

Wow you actually said that last part out loud.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Saints, Newcastle, Wests Tigers, Bulls. **** them all. They are all a blight on their sports.

When Sandy weren't affiliated, i did barrack for The Borough, that's been my more fruitive years of barracking.

 

[stavro#4]

I am a bit further along than you gringo, after reading that from the President, I am out after this year, will cancel my membership.

The way he spoke was that he hoped our performance was better in four years or so (the question was from MR, where will the club be in four years or something like that). I can't cope for that long.

I thought he was very clear in direction now and where we will be in 4 years.

It’s disappointing that he confirms we could go back or be in a similar spot this year. It also doesn’t bode well that he outlined the Gresham deal when we have a similar situation this year.

These 3 questions and answers highlight vision. Potential moves at hand.

MR: Despite playing finals in 2023, did the coach declare that the team/list wasn’t as advanced as much as you may have thought it was?
AB: That we have gone a bit backwards this year is probably not how we anticipated things would unfold, but we knew there were gaps. If you look at the commentary last year from Ross, and from everyone involved at the club, no one was getting carried away with our form last year. No one was thinking we were closer than we were. We resisted the temptation to bring in older players and go down the free agency path, to go down the top-up path. The players we brought in were younger. This is no disrespect to Jade Gresham, but there’s no doubt if we kept Jade we would’ve been better this year. We effectively, by allowing Jade to leave because we didn’t want to match the salary, we got a draft pick that we turned into Lance Collard and we got salary cap space. That’s the sort of the decision that takes you backward before it goes forward.

MR: What’s your vision of St Kilda in, say, four years?
AB: I don’t want to put a timeline on it, but I’d be really disappointed if you don’t see us a hell of a lot more competitive by then. Top four, top six. We don’t want to make predictions for next year because we’re really focused on the process. Results will take care of themselves.


MR: It’s testing times for St Kilda supporters. Can you say anything to them other than be patient?
AB: I’m a hardcore fan. The only reason I got involved is because I was impatient and I got convinced I could help a little bit. I completely understand the impatience. Our choice now is to try not to rush, to try to be as good as we can be this year, knowing that won’t get us in the top four. Or we can try to do this properly and cop the noise, and cop the criticism. I think the fans would prefer us to get there a bit later and get there more seriously than just dribble into the eight. Anyone can dribble into the eight and fall out the next year. That’s easy, we’ve done that twice. Now we’re trying to get into the top four and be competitive seriously.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Howard is certainly flawed however:
A)We will get less back for him in a trade than he’s worth to us
B) We will likely be able to slash his contract in half to resign him
C) we won’t be able to attract an A grade key back to replace him and we wouldn’t want to burn the draft capital even if we could.
D) it would seem absurd to lose both him and battle (if he leaves) in the same off-season. We’d be destined for bottom 4 next year.
E) if we do replace him I can’t see us upgrading. Likely pick up another similar to Cordy.

That being said I’d keep him and try to simplify his role/reduce his responsibility

Let's hope Caminiti, Keeler & Van Es can overtake Howard soon then.

 

[stavro#4]

He basically admitted regardless of the cash we have we can't get anything decent.

Also confirmed without outright confirming it that he was being fed shit and had enough so he stepped in.

He are in a very bad spot. Free agency ain't saving us. Trading in players ain't saving us. Plus Ross has confirmed the draft is heavily compromised.

Our best hope here is to get in roads by lobbying the AFL for change.

I don't see a flag happening in Ross time without big AFL driven change.

Or you get infront of the compromised portions of the draft. Where you can.

Like this Year.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Wow you actually said that last part out loud.

Yeah my bad

 

[Saint Hendy]

They are answerable to members. I honestly hope they **** up and fold the club this time. I'm not sure I can put another 10 years into this shit. We seem to be an entity that for what ever reason just can't make ourselves professional. There has been a couple of periods of hope but there is less and less people around that remember the good times. My kids are not that interested any more. My son had a fleeting reengagement last year but they just piss him off for being shit again now. I don't know an organisation that does less to try to keep members happy or engaged than this club.

You know you can stop following at any time?

 

[stavro#4]

I don’t usually apply too much attention to him.

But thought this was an interesting perspective on apparent unhappiness at Moorabbin.

 

[gringo2011]

So what would be your plan at the end of this year? Don't just say "chase younger FAs", need you to name names. And who can we realistically trade our picks for?

FFS you haven't seen me naming players every year on here obviously. There aren't many FAs up this year. I come up with names every year and they usually come on. Heaps of them cheaper options. We would have chased guys like Flanders, Amartey, Jeremy Sharp even Brodie when he left the Suns. I can't just come up with a list on the spot. I'd have to research a few.

Guys like Macrae, Luke Parker types make sense as short term options. If you want kids more like Lazzaro, Fin Macrae, Brayden Campbell, Josh Ward etc but most would require trades. The mature guys hopefully as cheap salary dump options. That's just off the top of my head. I could find us a few cheapies I reckon.

 

[gringo2011]

You know you can stop following at any time?

I can't It's a form of masochism.